The key to winning the second world war was Spain

Think about it. Spain had a foothold in North Africa - Spanish Morocco. Gibraltar is pretty much in Spain. If Spain had allied with Germany, Gibraltar could have been taken and German troops in North Africa could have easily been supplied through Spain and Morocco. That would have allowed Rommel to advance faster and a lot quicker to the East, taking Cairo and then Jerusalem. After that, taking the rest of Africa and the Middle East would have been just a matter of time without much effort.

In 1941, when Germany started the war against the Soviet Union, the sheer amount of manpower, oil and resources from the Middle East and Africa would have been enough to quickly win against the Soviets by also staging a Southern attack front through Kurdistan and through Iran.

After the fall of the Soviets, Germany could have easily pushed further to British India, which was highly sympathetically to Germany over Britain and could have easily been liberated. And from there, Germany could have cut off ties with Japan and supported the Chinese national forces in taking China and push down to South East Asia and North to Korea via Russia.

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en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tangier_International_Zone
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_of_the_Oranges
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Entering gibraltar would trigger immediate tensions between England though, plus, we were fighting a civil war of our own

the key was to not be a complete dumbass and kill the british at Dunkirk

the key was to not be a total retard and refuse an alliance with Russia

the key was not to go to war with the US just because Japan attacks the US

the key was to give Spain whatever it wants and tell the french to go fuck themselves

>staging a Southern attack front through Kurdistan and through Iran.

Not sure how well german soldiers would have fought against russians after a 2 year long campaign in sandy shitholes.

No it was to keep the friendly pact that Russia and Germany had.
France was already over, then there was only Britian that was agains Germany.
If the gooks didn't bomb USA and Germany didn't start to attack the Russians Germany would have probably won

>fighting a civil war of our own
Which we could have helped you with. You did not have to do anything, just allow us safe passage through your country.

>Not sure how well german soldiers would have fought against russians after a 2 year long campaign in sandy shitholes.

Actually, the soldiers who fought for 2 yrs in North Africa were sent to the Eastern Front to fight Russians.

The point is, with Spain in the picture, the whole African and Middle East campaigns might have been over in 6-8 months.

>No it was to keep the friendly pact that Russia and Germany had.

Stalin knew that there could only be him or Germany. That is why he was gearing up for an attack on Europe. Guess why he was fighting the Finns in 1939/1940. He was testing tactics and generals and tried to secure his right flank. Everyone knows the Soviet attack on Germany was supposed to launch in late 1941 or early 1942.

the point is what? Why are you thinking about this garbage? Go make an actual point. Go blame Hitler for these fuckups because that's who was responsible.

how about not invading russia in winter

>Guess why he was fighting the Finns in 1939/1940. He was testing tactics and generals and tried to secure his right flank

yeye complete bullshit, retard. Russians view Finland as historically russian clay. This has nothing to do with any attack on "Europe".
the combined German/Russian attack on Poland can also be seen as a simple matter of getting back some land that was once russian clay.
You just keep talking total and utter shit buddy, one day it will work out for you

Hm, didn't know that. But still full on attacking the soviets was pretty stupid.
They should have just pushed them out of Poland and back into Russia and stopped there.

Russia plays dirty by burning up shelters, cities and food so that invanders will die.
Hitler should have learned that from Napoleon

So fuck you lost and now your country is shit.

Are you sure it wasn't America kicking the shit out of you?

you are literally a child, arent you? holy shit
you dont start a war with a major power and then say "oh hey we just wanted this little land, we cool now k??"
War is war you dumb fuck, all bets are off. This is what germans and apparently swedes do not seem to understand.
Hitler apparently thought that he could just stir up war in Europe and Britain wouldnt get involved. War is war. All bets are off. You cant go shooting up people next door and then complain if I join up.

Hitler was the worst thing to happen to the European people worldwide. He has become the comparison made against every single white person who worries about the current genocide of our race.

Fuck Germany for this.

Austria's pretty cool though.

>the key was to give Spain whatever it wants and tell the french to go fuck themselves
When has that not been the key to happiness?
Pity is we are beyond corrupt at our government and morals.
The war was already over,you simply had to give us french african clay/toys and we would have gone balls deep,luckily we stalled all conversations and compromises,but us entering would have probably meant the portubros would have gone with the brits thus opening another front in a very napoleonic way and there were plenty of spanish commies still fighting in the mountains (in fact a lot of the real resistance fighting in france was done by experienced battle hardened spanish gommies.
So maybe not a great idea afterall,although better than closing the med at suez and more feasible

...

Spain was just an ever worse version of Italy, hundreds of miles of indefensible coastline. Who wants a Spanish Front when the Eastern front is already a massive headache?

I'm not a child.
Just saying that it was pretty fucking retarded to continue to push back the Russians.
The germans didn't win anything on it other than burned soil.
They should have focused more of their troops on the britians.

Franco made a good decision by staying out of that shitshow. Spain had a feeble military that wouldn't have mattered, it has a pretty much nonexistent navy that would be crushed by the RN. Doing this made him rule until his death in the 70's.

He kind of learnt it,you see instead of the capture the capital napoleonic shit,he launched a 3 pronged attack focusing the economical (báltic) resource (south)and political (Moscow)areas thus hopping to make it collapse,he should have just focused south to get the oil and half-assed his way north to liberate the bats thus gaining recruits and linking up with the fins,then as soon as the south was secured go pincer up the centre and seal the deal.

He wasn't learning from napoleon because he already knew about it,the pity is he grew over optimistic due to Finland ass raping them and his all winning streak.
Also he would probably remember germany ass raping russia during ww1 and would have think a reverse of it would happen were all the rusks would see the defeat of gommunism and start to revolt against the gommy oppresion like they had rebelled against the tzar

>Just saying that it was pretty fucking retarded to continue to push back the Russians.

"continue"?
that sentence makes you a child. If you start a war, you have to finish it completely asap.
yes, Hitler should have dealt with Britain. By allying Russia.
If you read transcripts, an alliance with Russia was very much possible. Only when Hitler stopped responding to russian communiques, did Russia get worried and I assume started building up forces because that's what Hitler used as a justification to attack Russia. "muh artillery on our border"
How is that a reason for war? Two major powers will always have tensions on their borders. Hitler was just blowing shit out of his ass at record speed with zero intentions for peaceful resolutions with Russia, all due to his racial ideology I assume. Because logically there was no basis I can research that would justify this behavior towards Russia. For God's sake, they started WW2 together by fighting Poland TOGETHER.

>Think about it.

I did and that is when I realized that even before the war began, the United States during the depression no less, was producing more steel and industrial goods than any European nation.

American industry won the war and nothing would have changed that due to the inability of Axis powers to make a decisive strike on American manufacturing centers.

> they still believe they won the WW2

Just cover the globe in a Nazi war machine, huh? No way. Talk about being spread thin.

Ikr, there were only 2 winners: USA and USSR.

Hitler should have made an agreement with Franco then. He thought Franco asked for too much, so there was no deal.

Hitler was literally a retarded lunatic. The German generals should have thrown him to the wolves after the Polish campaign.

I agree on all points except for the feeble army,while badly equipped it had one of(if not) the most experienced battle hardened military of europe,it was not so badly supplied on infantry supplies and already was using german materiel so they would have been easily supplied if necessary.
But yes it was better for all to let us stay out unless they wanted a napoleonic replay

Spain won ww2 tho

Hybris is never good

Shame he stopped responding to russian communications. He should have tried to ally them.

State ain asked for morocco or dome other north african clay for spains entry, at end if civil war framco had an armyof 1 million veterans, destroying this army would be imposdible for siviet union, but Franco thought Hitler would pull a napoleon and replace him.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tangier_International_Zone

I toyed with the idea of the spanish occupation of Tangiers escalating into a shooting war. At war with the frogs and limeys, Franco has little choice but to sit down in Adolf's lap. Interesting questions are whether Portugal chooses her mainland or colonies.

The effects as I see them are an increased strain on allied logistics, particularly in the Mediterranean area. Africa being pretty worthless save for key ports, aside from the odd U-boat, there's little Axis interest. The Royal Navy would have had a tougher time in the Mediterranean, but the loss of Gibraltar wouldn't be a silver bullet.

After Berlin falls, and the soviets become a real threat to the Allies, Franco gets to turn coats as the yanks prefer to pretend nothing happened. Churchill is grumpy.

That's exactly the reason why Portugal was allowed to stay neutral during WW2, even if we have an alliance with Britain. The allies knew if Portugal entered the war by their side, Spain would enter by the Axis side, tipping the scale in favor of the Axis.

So Portugal sold military bases and food to the allies, while selling tungsten and other rare minerals to Germany...

Just don't even post, you fuck.

And a Muslim lover to boot. Codreanu was the real champion against the impending (((New World Order))). That's why (((they))) assassinated him and not Hitler. The latter was a simple useful pawn; a part of the plan to destroy Europe.

It was hitler's fault, get over it already.

Germany did help Spain against communists in a time of need, Spain should have entered on axis and expand army to atleast 8 million men, then big gains could be won in war, all north africa that is annexed could be annexed by spain, portugal will willingly join union, gibraltar will fall etc..

Germany had 3 million soldiers at start of barbarossa, spain could recruit 8 million totallung 11 million hispano-germ army far outnumbering soviets or allies.

Are you telling me that... Portugays are the real jews??

>t. alberto barbostein

>leaf

8 million infantry could reinforce all german flanks, prevent all ally invasions etc..

There is no invasion point allies could do against spain although the islands may be ceased by allies, spains continental army would be unopposed as well as allowing barbarossa to succeed.

If soviets fall there is no army that can contest axis japan spain germany italy.

Portugal was in a bit of a tight spot, because we were ruled by a dictator, António de Oliveira Salazar (best dictator ever btw) and we identified more with the American and British values than with the Germans, but Salazar knew if the allies won then he would have to step down and we would need to leave our overseas territories, meaning it would be ruinous for our economy. If Germany won they would probably try to annex Portugal, so it wouldn't be very nice either.

So we kind of double-dated both sides, accumulating favors to have some leverage over the powers of the time.

>we wuz aryans n shiet
Fuck off.

They key to winning the second world war was getting rid of Stalin and avoiding war with USSR altogether.

>>>/Auschwitz/

The key to winning was not betraying our own kind for the jews. Think about it.

Salazar would never be killed by franco he would be integrated into spain and still regionsl leader of portugal.

Dude the key was to fuck Russia hard, form a treaty with Poland and wait for the soviets to attack. Then "intervene" to take out the soviets and snatch some of Ukraine and take Danzig back for prizes, setting up a joint vessel of the rest of Russia, he could have used Finland and Japan for multiple fronts. WW2 was so fucking autistic, though I don't blame hitler for thinking he could have taken on Russia seeing his success in France. But in hindsight should have kept to the east and maybe attempt to become what the soviets did for the second half of the 20th century.

Not really... Spain just finished a bloody civil war in which German troops assisted. As well even if, you would have still lost for you lacked the Naval power. The Tripitz and Bismarck wouldn't pull it. Italy had a Navy but not really anything that could go vs the Brits. There were the French, but they sank their fleet before it would fall into the German hands.

What Germany would have needed would have been the Japaneses Fleet. With it England and its allies wouldn't stand a chance.

How ever, I did ignore the US, for I couldn't tell what would have happened if the Japaneses fleet would suddenly appear in the Mediterranean sea.

The German Reich should have never crossed the Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact. With this kind of force, I though it that Germany would have ever lost. I would even go as far and say that the first nuclear bomb would have fallen on New York.

Amerixans invaded in 1944 with 1.3 million against 300k west defenders 8 million franco army would be unopposedand and wipe out any invasions in italy and france, then spain could send 8 million to soviet union bring the largest army in the war and eastern front.

>Southern attack front through Kurdistan and through Iran.

Going through mountainous regions is a nightmare for any military

800 divisions, can supplement germans 300 divisions and supply enough troops to make continous offensives to oil fields, moscow, and end soviet union, new admins of the soviet union will connect madrid, rome, tokyo, moscow, and berlin, this will end the war as britain and the US can not invade the continent.

You cowardice is why Europe lost to jews.

yeah but spain didn't ally with germany because germans are autistic as fuck and annoying as hell.

The key to winning the second world war was the (((Soviet Union))). Everybody knew it after the war was over, but forgot it because how badly the Soviet Union sucked balls after WW2. (((They))) are the main reason Hitler failed to save us all.

SPAIN?

FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU STUPID GERMAN, you are destroying my coutnry.

you deserve the worst SCUM , Filthy kraut

Germany did help Spain with the civil war. Condor legion, guernica.

Because of Adolph "angry virgin" Hitler over 60 million WHITE CHRISTIAN EUROPEAN PEOPLE died.

Because of Adolf "I fired all my generals and USSR loved it" Hitler , NATIONALISM IS ALMOST FORBIDDEN, people now piss and shit on ethnonationalism.

Because of Adolf "I prize mudslimes but slavs are subhuman" Hitler, half of germany got raped.

Because of Adolf "I hate jews, but I'm gonna fuck jewish pussy", Israel has so much clout literally everywhere.

Because of Adolf "I'm gonna preserve german blood by sending it to die in USSR" Hitler, over 40 million people died of Communism thanks to USSR, including East Germany.

Being ethnocentric =/= being some naziboo hitler worshiping drooling stooge

>Because of Adolf "I hate jews, but I'm gonna fuck jewish pussy", Israel has so much clout literally everywhere.
If it wasn't for Hitler, Israel wouldn't exist today, wouldn't be so powerful and jews wouldn't have SO MUCH influence everywhere.

Germans now have immigrant or russian blood via rape and "enrichment".
But nice one, Adumb Lostler.

Burger ignorance...All portuguese would die before becoming Spain's vassal. It would be a Peninsular war 2.0, with the Germans replacing the French

Spain wanted to go at the beggining of the war, after they start lossing we claim more things to join and Germany said no, even with all that we send a couple of chavs to the russian front

Actually you can wage war over a little bit of land. Once you hold and fortify it, your enemy has the choice of conceding the land to you or waging a costly, offensive war to conquer it back.

The concept of a total war is very modern and only really happened in the 20th century.

It's unlikely that Russia would have had the international support to attack Germany. Because that would have meant Russian, thus communist, supremacy in Europe instead of German.

Likewise, after a few years without open hostilities and no threat to the integrity of the UK, the British would likely have made peace as well. War is costly and without Germany either threatening to invade England or spending its army in Russia, there was no way the UK would have managed to win against the Reich.

In fact Germany could have cleaned up a few of the UKs territories in Northern Africa and thus forced the UK to accept peace, least they'd loose even more influence.

That all hinges on the war not being a total war, though. The 18th and 19th century would have made these kinds of peace deals possible. But the World Wards of the 20th century were wars of ideologies.

>all this ignorant idiots says Hitler shouldnt invade Soviet Union.

Dude, read some books. WW2 was all about Eastern Europe. WW2 has nothing with France or Britain. Hitler didnt even think that France and Britain would actually declare war on Germany after all cowardly appeasement policy. Hitler actually think Britain will be ally of Germany.

Hitler's first aim was unite Germans who live in foreign countries with Germany then invade and remove Poland and Russia from German border to Ural mountains (maybe beyond) Germans would colonize Eastern Europe like Americans colonized Middle and Western US.

Hitler's agresive foreign policy alienated UK thus they declare war on Germany when Hitler invaded Poland. It was totally unexpected by Germans. Hitler thought UK would let Soviets and Nazis to eat eachother.

Also you stupid fucks, Soviet Union achived one of greatest industrialization process in very little time. They were definitely waiting for the right time to spead communism.

Now, Spain joining Germany would have been good for the allies. Spain, Ireland and Sweden though neutral, where pro German in attitude. They became espionage and sabotage centres. Gibraltar is a fucking big fortress. Not easy to take, Spain was week after the civil war and unstable. So the allies could have supplied the reformed republican movement. Destabilized Vichy France, and over stretched the Germans.

If Spain joined the Axis, we would have joined the Allies. Germany was delusional talking of taking our colonies, fucking kek. And you know what happens 9 times out of 10 when we and Spain go to war, Axis would have been crushed one way or another.

It's time to come back to reality krautcuck.

Yes, we played them like a fiddle. We lost in the 70s when the CIA pushed a commie coup which resulted in us releasing our colonies because muh poor little nogs or some garbage.

>would have joined the Allies
who cares? totally irrelevant country
>9 times out of 10 when we and Spain go to war
Don't know if you are serius nigga or all your knowledge is the cherripicking battles that you see in 4channel

Not irrelevant since we are an amazing gateway into the peninsula, which would have resulted in another net loss for the Axis.

I'm dead serious btw, invading us never worked out well. Of course we don't have the manpower to invade you, but that'd never be the case.

Times that we reach Lisbon vs times that you reach Madrid? just tell me brave Portunegro

I'm ok if you can find Toledo or Valladolid instead

One for you in our succession crisis in the 1500s and one for us in the Peninsular War. Unless you'd care to enlighten me.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_of_the_Oranges

Spain would have to be ultra cucks to join after the bombing of Guarnica.

You're a retard, Spain would have been just another front that Germany had to defend when the allies eventually attacked.

Spain would be more useless for Germany than Italy.

All you're doing is opening up another front.

Literally everythong you needed is not to attack Danzig.

Ah yes, I had forgotten you got fucked in the ass by the French that time and turned on us afterwards. My claim still remains, you ultimately lost. Your wars against us never end well for you, except the Iberian Union which also resulted in disaster.

What I was saying

got me

anyhow, and the first Lisbon war was before all the sucesion thing

That's a pretty big if. Still not sure it would have made a huge difference. The economic output of and shear manpower of the USA and USSR was overwhelming. Once they joined it was over. It didn't help that a lot of German factories were in range for allied bombers either.

>you ultimately lost
also
>Portugal stronk
Can't retake Olivenza
Can't retake Ceuta
Never has invade Spain