Tsundere

Landon Bennett
Landon Bennett

tsundere
blonde
twintails
flat chested
wealthy
childhood friend
secretly otaku

How does a heroine lose with a combination like this? Have times changed?

Juan Rogers
Juan Rogers

childhood friend
There you go OP.

Also, the twintailed tsundere archetype doesn't win as often as you think.

Nicholas Bell
Nicholas Bell

Deconstruction of the harem genre.

Oliver Cooper
Oliver Cooper

I don't care

Nicholas Garcia
Nicholas Garcia

Eriri is best and she loses because she isn't the main heroine. Simple as that.

Thomas Taylor
Thomas Taylor

Strange, tsundere childhood friend used to win.

Christopher Smith
Christopher Smith

good way to let the gas out so you can shit in the morning

David Lewis
David Lewis

Forgetting ZR

James Gonzalez
James Gonzalez

How many threads like this have you made already?

Kill yourself.

Elijah Harris
Elijah Harris

Eriri needs her breakfast.

Christopher Brown
Christopher Brown

flat chested
There you go OP.

Gabriel Jones
Gabriel Jones

How does a heroine lose with a combination like this?

Because those are all negative traits.

Owen Foster
Owen Foster

Not really. Worst girls tend to win in LNs a lot, so bo change here.

Lucas Nelson
Lucas Nelson

wealthy
negative trait
Poorfag detected

Cameron Diaz
Cameron Diaz

Because those are all perfect traits*

Jayden Gomez
Jayden Gomez

lose
Stop reminding me.

Cameron Gomez
Cameron Gomez

Pretty much this.

Carson Roberts
Carson Roberts

Cliche overdose.

Connor Williams
Connor Williams

childhood friend
best girl
She never had a chance.

Andrew Rodriguez
Andrew Rodriguez

You had me til
flat chested
I guess they had to put some negative trait on her to make it fair.

Luke King
Luke King

Normalfag tier bait
1/10

Anthony Miller
Anthony Miller

if you don't like flat chests you're a normalfag

Austin Collins
Austin Collins

Yes time have changed. I'm so fucking sick of tsundere shit winning a harem. It's the most lazy and uninspired heroine archtype ever.

Joseph Bell
Joseph Bell

wealthy mattering in a harem girl.

Camden Jenkins
Camden Jenkins

Dont give the lolicon any attention user.

Aiden Ramirez
Aiden Ramirez

Confirming normalfag bait.

Cameron Davis
Cameron Davis

Just ignore the retarded dfcfaggot.

Camden Reyes
Camden Reyes

Best girl with perfect traits never wins.

Blake Wood
Blake Wood

Megumi is canonically the perfect heroine.

James Bennett
James Bennett

Mc as usual is a boring faggot so I'd say she actually won by not winding up with him

beautiful girl us secretly otaku
This needs to stop

Hudson Murphy
Hudson Murphy

You're proving him right, loli-hating cowtitsfags. Fuck off and back to facebook.

Nathaniel Watson
Nathaniel Watson

hxh episode ur on?

Jace Anderson
Jace Anderson

But user, the perfect one is going to win this time.

Juan Kelly
Juan Kelly

Sad, but true.

Jose Russell
Jose Russell

You must be new here.

Kevin Hall
Kevin Hall

implying loli hating
implying cow tit loving
Fuck off and stop using buzzwords.

Jack Jenkins
Jack Jenkins

Do all the people who watch this mediocre show have it go over their heads this hard?

The message is not a jigsaw puzzle, it's practically spelled out in the fucking title. It isn't pure chance every bitch in the cartoon save for one has a hundred character traits pulled from the Japanese Animation page of tvtropes.org.

Camden Clark
Camden Clark

Denial and irony

Joseph Hill
Joseph Hill

Inverse Kyon
/thread

Owen Rodriguez
Owen Rodriguez

You must be retarded or new and don't know how things work around here.

Carter Rodriguez
Carter Rodriguez

What is HnG, stupid Lelouch.

Brayden Gray
Brayden Gray

You are overestimating the average IQ of Sup Forums poster.

Asher Cox
Asher Cox

Samefagging.

Leo Sanders
Leo Sanders

2 out of 3. Try again, normalfag.

Angel Sanchez
Angel Sanchez

literal list of the shittiest qualities a girl can have
wonders why she lost

Zachary Long
Zachary Long

Samefagging.

Charles Lopez
Charles Lopez

Megumifag

Zachary Roberts
Zachary Roberts

When they say Eriri and Utaha are the best, they are being ironic.

Henry Roberts
Henry Roberts

Blonde is good, user.

Nicholas Lewis
Nicholas Lewis

fagfag

Jeremiah Flores
Jeremiah Flores

Message being the main girl is yet another worst girl who will win, on top of being boring? Yeah, people got that.

David Foster
David Foster

Try harder retard.
inb4 different webbrowser

Lucas Jenkins
Lucas Jenkins

Seriously, how could OP miss that? Twintails, DFC, and ZR is the most sacred trinity of all trinities.

Brody Lee
Brody Lee

I wonder what season 2 threads are going to be like?

Andrew Carter
Andrew Carter

Megumi
boring

It's like you guys don't even pay attention.

Aiden Ward
Aiden Ward

took 5 mins long to make this
kek.

Lincoln Cook
Lincoln Cook

Only idiots like yourself got that message.

Dylan Hernandez
Dylan Hernandez

Think Yahari threads, but twice the autism. No speculation on who's going to win because the LNs will probably have ended already, but Megumifags will endlessly rub their victory in everyone else's faces.

William Ortiz
William Ortiz

We did. She's incredibly boring. Why is this so hard for you anons to accept?

Jordan Peterson
Jordan Peterson

message
Pic extremely related.

Jeremiah Williams
Jeremiah Williams

Denial

Christopher Moore
Christopher Moore

Because the reasons people give on why she's boring are always incredibly poorly written. You know it's bad when they reference the fucking title as support.

Isaac Sanchez
Isaac Sanchez

It's about dem personality and she's the worst

Jack White
Jack White

Deludes himself to believe the title is entirely wrong
Typical.

Michael Carter
Michael Carter

people actually think the meme girl is better
This picture is a proof that Sup Forums is full ADHD fucks.

One is an actual character with more and more flaws exposed as the series goes on and the other is a one trick pony shit who barely has any character, but somehow the trick pony is better anyway.

Ian Nguyen
Ian Nguyen

DFC fags are so insecure they even make this shit and tainting the original image

Isaac Morris
Isaac Morris

but somehow the trick pony is better anyway
I'm glad you agree.

Robert Turner
Robert Turner

No seriously, how poor does your reading comprehension have to be to not get that the title is supposed to be misleading?

Alexander Cruz
Alexander Cruz

Anal.

Luis Watson
Luis Watson

Megumifags confirmed for extreme shit taste and butthurt at Megumin's superiority.

Sebastian Ward
Sebastian Ward

Take your meme girl back to Konosuba circlejerk.

Isaiah Cooper
Isaiah Cooper

Are you blind? That pic says the meme girl is boring, not better.

Mason Myers
Mason Myers

You forgot:

traitor
twice

Austin Jenkins
Austin Jenkins

Megumin is defined by the meme "dude explosion lmao." What memes does Megumi have? She stands by the strength of her character not some gag that got old episodes ago.

Adrian Sullivan
Adrian Sullivan

poorly written
You say that all the time, even after the countless autism and walls of text that comes your way. Nothing short of a full blown essay is going make you finally accept other people's opinion that differs from yours

Benjamin Edwards
Benjamin Edwards

Are Eririfags just butthurt she's not going to win?

Aiden Thompson
Aiden Thompson

What memes does Megumi have?
Background boring heroine wins the Tbowl.

Lucas Russell
Lucas Russell

strength of her character
You can't be serious.

Parker Davis
Parker Davis

childhood friend

Matthew Stewart
Matthew Stewart

Anyone with good taste would be upset when the best girl will lose again.

Angel Adams
Angel Adams

Because she's ironically the most boring girl.

Ian Lewis
Ian Lewis

eriritard talking about accepting other people's opinion
The irony.

Julian Perez
Julian Perez

Opinions can be poorly supported. You're still bringing up the title as support even though that's been debunked so many times now.

Carson White
Carson White

It does suck Utaha isn't winning but Megumi is almost just as good.

Elijah Robinson
Elijah Robinson

Why else would someone like Megumi?

William Kelly
William Kelly

For her looks. She has nothing else going for her.

Gavin Carter
Gavin Carter

I didn't pay attention
She literally doesn't have anything to rely on besides her character.

I seriously doubt megumifag was a thing before the anime elaborated her character more.

Connor Flores
Connor Flores

Why do people watch if they don't like the main heroine? That's so weird.

Luke Scott
Luke Scott

spending 14mins to make this
Thanks for the free kek.

Colton Jones
Colton Jones

Except Megumin has more character than that and is true to herself from the beginning, never gives up and is proud to walk the path of explosions. She can be said to be stronger in standing by her character.

Luis Cruz
Luis Cruz

Before the anime aired and people got a good grip on their characters it was mainly Utahafags and Eririfags. When people praise Megumi it's usually not because of her looks. In the first place, Megumi is intended to be very plain looks-wise and only looks cute when she dresses up.

Andrew White
Andrew White

Fuck Eiri and everything she stand for.

She shouldn't have been a shit friend.

Nicholas Wood
Nicholas Wood

You serious? That's the first reason she'd be overlooked.

Alexander Torres
Alexander Torres

10/10 bait. Best one so far.

Bentley Peterson
Bentley Peterson

Cute, but Eririfags generally are wiling to accept negative opinoins, unlike Megumifags.

Any opinions worth its weight are subjective. For an opinion to be poor, there has to be objective qualities, but that isn't the case here since it's all subjective when dealing with likability and whether X character is fun/interesting or not.

I didn't yet, but if you're going to bring it up the title then I can only say that the author planned for her Megumi to start out that way, so there are some validity to it. To reject that means rejecting what what the author's intention on that point.

Kayden Fisher
Kayden Fisher

The "saenai" part of the title is ironic, and is meant to accentuate the fact that Megumi's personality is really subdued compared to everyone else in the show. What the first episode wanted to impart on you is the extreme contrast between Megumi and the other two girls, Eriri and Utaha.

Both of the trope girls can have their traits bulleted off with pinpoint precision like in OP's post. Put one next to Megumi and it's like day and night; the one who's not Megumi is instantly identifiable, has a nice little backstory, gets practically everything about her character across with just her appearance. But the key thing here is that if you've seen even one harem show prior to opening this one, you've seen all of this shit before. In contrast Megumi remains a plain stone wall. Nothing about her stands out or conveys anything, at least not immediately.

The irony isn't even fucking subtle here, it hits like a brick as soon as you see the "date" scene. Megumi throws out sarcastic quips like there's no tomorrow and several of these are aimed at the personalities of the other two girls. Literally shit like "those kinds of characters don't exist in real life." So blunt you would have to be a straight goddamn kook not to pick up on it, which is why I feel like I'm getting my leg pulled here.

Megumi's personality develops slowly throughout the show and the intent is to have it come across as somehow deeper and more genuine than those of the trope girl platoon. Whether or not the show succeeds in doing this is up to your judgment, but I'm pretty spot on about the premise here. Arguing about the "best girl" in in this show is funny but you need to understand how you look when you do it.

Ryan Morales
Ryan Morales

her looks
She has the most bland and dull design in the entire cast though.

Jayden Cooper
Jayden Cooper

So then there's literally no reason to like her then.

Angel Morris
Angel Morris

Even as109 has joined the church of Megumin

Can't wait for as109's doujin/CGs.

Juan Lee
Juan Lee

What are they even supposed to be doing?

Cameron Gonzalez
Cameron Gonzalez

because she herself keeps screwing up one way or another

its mostly her own fault

Elijah Rodriguez
Elijah Rodriguez

TL;DR

Oliver Price
Oliver Price

Megumi is a patrician's waifu.

Ian Baker
Ian Baker

Utaha's long black hair is the most dull thing in that picture.

Jason Collins
Jason Collins

/thread

David Wood
David Wood

screwing up
when she's the girl MC still loves despite the ups and downs between them
More like she isn't allowed to win because she isn't the main girl.

Anthony Kelly
Anthony Kelly

That's Eriri.

David Wood
David Wood

She's not allowed to win because her personality won't let her too and she doesn't love Tomoya enough.

Henry Fisher
Henry Fisher

They don't care. Don't invest anything, get nothing in return. So they get a boring girl and most don't.

Samuel Robinson
Samuel Robinson

Eriri is a tsundere you can find in almost any other harem show. She's more like an entry level waifu.

Nathaniel Sanchez
Nathaniel Sanchez

Rationalizing
Implying Megumi doesn't have traits that can listed off
Shilling
Makes her character sound deep and complex when she's not and is actually pretty damn pretentious
Being that autistic

William Scott
William Scott

Name 5 that's just like her in role, personality, and design.

Austin Butler
Austin Butler

Stick to Yahari.

Christian Hughes
Christian Hughes

All wrong. Someone here hasn't read GS2. Megum is going to start advancing on Tomoya soon. Eriri picked up on that (much to her annoyance), so it's inevitable that she will compete seriously. But no matter what she does she can't wait, the story won't allow it and will always be in favor of Megumi no matter what.

Dylan Harris
Dylan Harris

everything perfect
suddenly fang at the end
Fucking disgusting.

Jaxon Lewis
Jaxon Lewis

Eriri doesn't love him enough, she chose drawing over Tomoya. Megumi wouldn't have done that because she loves him too much to abandon him.

Asher Evans
Asher Evans

I'm telling you what the show is trying to tell you, not what I think about the character. You can list off anybody's traits but obviously my point was that the likes of Eriri and Utaha are basically prefab.

I don't want to make Saekano out to be complex because it really fucking isn't. I wouldn't say it's pretentious, since it never really commits to trying to impress with its genius, but in that way, it's mediocre, and so there's nothing I'm in love with about Megumi for me to rationalize. I'm putting it the way it is.

Easton Rogers
Easton Rogers

Inaccurate. Her decision in volume 7 ties into her desire to become #1 for Tomoya. It was not a matter of picking one over the other, they are related. That's mainly why Eriri said it was a matter between Creators, she has hope that Tomoya would understand her feelings.

Colton Thomas
Colton Thomas

Tsunderes are bad.

Jayden Garcia
Jayden Garcia

Eriri could have had Tomoya right then and there but put it off for her career. She has no idea when she'll be ready to get him again, but she knows it'll at least take years.

Joshua Roberts
Joshua Roberts

trying this hard to make it sound dramatic
Nigga, every other harem girl that is not the main heroine is fighting the losing battle, it is simply not their game to win. The important thing is how they play it out and in Eriri's case her personality is proven to be problematic and gets in her way more often than not.

Seriously dude, stop with the dumb rationalization.

Adam Rivera
Adam Rivera

Le "normal presenceless girl" is literally a fucking trope of its own. She's just as cliched and shallow as the others.

Jace Anderson
Jace Anderson

Even male tsunderes?

Anthony Martinez
Anthony Martinez

S2 this autumn, right?

Cameron Russell
Cameron Russell

implying they are near as common and utilized as tsundere and kuudere
Keep deluding yourself though.

Alexander Edwards
Alexander Edwards

How does a heroine lose with a combination like this? Have times changed?

It depends on the audience that the light novel is targeting as customers. There's plenty of LN that have the rich childhood friend blonde girl otaku succeed with the hapless NEET male. That story surely appeals to male buyers. But there can be female buyers who feel inferior to rich girls that have it all their own way in real life. So it would be good for that audience to let such a girl have some success but not all the success with the accomplished male MC.

When anime are made from the LN, the storyline will be tweaked around a bit to try to appeal to the customer base the production committee required in order to greenlight the show.

Brandon Cruz
Brandon Cruz

That would harm Tomoya and Eriri as well. She doesn't want that, she cares too much for Tomoya to jeopardize his progression. She expressed that point to Tomoya, and he didn't disagree after he came to his senses later.

Taking years is expected. She knows that, but that doesn't mean she gave up or anything. Tomoya is just as important.

it is simply not their game to win
So you agree then. No matter what, she won't be able to win.

Asher Sanders
Asher Sanders

She's still a stereotype.

Eli Cook
Eli Cook

That's not his point, retard.

Jacob Sullivan
Jacob Sullivan

That is the fucking point. You can't be as cliche as the other two if you are severely underrepresented. Normal girl is by far the less cliche out of those archetypes in Saekano regardless of what your opinion about Megumi herself.

Alexander Brooks
Alexander Brooks

literal list of the shittiest qualities a girl can have

Almost all the items on the list are what makes a girl jealous if she is competing for the male MC. That blonde girl is a formidable opponent for any insecure girl.

Gavin Davis
Gavin Davis

It's not cliche if it's less cliche by comparison to another cliche that's more popular
That's not how it works, dumbass. And actually, the whole ugly duckling trope is almost as old as dirt in the fictional world.

Liam Parker
Liam Parker

childhood friend
she abandoned him. that's why he is such a huge retard
secretly otaku
4/5

Jose Robinson
Jose Robinson

ugly duckling
Aint that a bit overexagarating?

Asher Morgan
Asher Morgan

Which is why you could argue this show's premise is a little sloppy, yeah, since she is still without a doubt the main focus. But understanding that much is enough for anyone to see that it's not worth making a big deal out of. The show's failures come after it has set up its props.

At least they give her personality a bit of an edge with the ironic quips, for better or worse. I think she's still the character who is hardest to reduce to a package stereotype, which is a good sign for Saekano, but I'm not really staking anything on it.

Easton Cook
Easton Cook

Is there anything that isnt a trope nowadays?

Austin Cooper
Austin Cooper

It's not unless you take that literally at face value due to ignorance.

Luke Carter
Luke Carter

That's how it works because everything is cliche by today's standard, completely new idea is really hard to achieve.

the whole ugly duckling trope is almost as old
Except Megumi is not an ugly duckling, she never was.

Oliver Gray
Oliver Gray

I meant she doesnt exactly fit that trope well enough to even justify its usage.

Anthony Richardson
Anthony Richardson

Almost all the items on the list are what makes a girl jealous if she is competing for the male MC.
You mean the girl who possesses them is jealous of others competing.
tsundere
Jealous by nature.
twintails
Jealous of maturity.
flat chested
Jealous of girls with breasts.
wealthy
Almost always jealous of commoners for some reason.
childhood friend
Jealous of girls who can actually be viewed as viable.
secretly otaku
Jealous of honesty.

That leaves "blonde", which can never compare with the dark haired natural Japanese beauty.

Aaron Brooks
Aaron Brooks

Are yous seriously that retarded? A cliche is still a cliche. Comparing cliche to other more popular cliches does not inadvertently make the less used cliche not cliche.

bland and unnoticeable girl who doesn't blossom until after the MC noticed her and got her development going
She's exactly that.

Because?

Caleb Watson
Caleb Watson

because
Because I think her characteristics are a bit higher than 'required' for that specific trope?
I dont think I have an answer suitable enough for you.

Dylan Sullivan
Dylan Sullivan

Spot-on description of Megumi
But Megumifags will still deny this

Christopher Cruz
Christopher Cruz

"Character with no presence" is just a joke.

Luke Watson
Luke Watson

What nonsense drug are you on?
bland and unnoticeable girl who doesn't blossom until after the MC noticed her and got her development going
It's simple, not complicated, and it can't be more simple that this.

Tyler Wilson
Tyler Wilson

It's joked about, but it itself isn't a joke. Megumi's lack of presence is real. Pay attention to what you read/watch.

James Taylor
James Taylor

Then how come Megumi isn't popular at school?

Jace Murphy
Jace Murphy

And against normalfags.

Adam Lopez
Adam Lopez

Old and busted.

Xavier Nguyen
Xavier Nguyen

what drug
'Real life logics applying to anime' one. I wouldnt call myself an ugly duckling just because I started to work out, being more sociable with more people.
She was unnoticable by mc because he thinks in tropes but so is everyone in the crowd.
So I just dont feel like it suits the single trope very well because her starting conditions werent bad at all.

Connor Roberts
Connor Roberts

Tall about it.
My uncle tried to break up with his current gf for 3 years because of her talking shit. Came back every time she started being softer.

Luke White
Luke White

She's goes by unnoticeable by people in general, not just by the MC. She doesn't stand out, lacked traits that would get her noticed. It was only when the MC noticed her that others started to noticed her too, and from there her developed made her even more noticeable, especially to the MC and it isn't just on a personality level, but appearance too. She changed her hair to make her even more feminine and attractive. The cliche totally applies.

Lincoln Sanchez
Lincoln Sanchez

Get with the times.

Imagine that two families who's friendship began just because they were neighbors or parent's friends before you were born suddenly became part of your family?

That is like a Korean Soap just waiting to happen.

Andrew Young
Andrew Young

That makes it a far less of a cliche.

She's exactly that
Her lack of presence is a product of MC applying his anime ideal to her, not because she is actually that unnoticeable and people look down on her. There is also the fact that the story pointed out multiple times that she is a cute girl in universe.

Cameron Sanders
Cameron Sanders

I'm NOT normal. Take that back!

Samuel Taylor
Samuel Taylor

less of a cliche
Still a cliche. Just deal with it.

product of MC
Except Eriri and Utaha made note of it too, so you're wrong.
cute
Yeah, upon closer examination and after getting to know her.

Cameron Wilson
Cameron Wilson

It's joked about, but it itself isn't a joke.
It is in most series. Her "lack of presence is real" because it's taken seriously in this one rather than the usual "oh wow, didn't notice you there". That's very different from the other girls being cliche.

Bentley Wilson
Bentley Wilson

Megumifags trying hard to make their girl unique and original
Can't accept ugly duckling trope that actually fits to well
This is hilarious and sad.

Christian Thomas
Christian Thomas

Except Utaha and Eriri follow the same logic as the MC. They are not a good judge of her actual in-universe self.

closer examination
The whole point of the their first meeting is that Tomoya got captivated by her beauty. There is no closer examination to be had there.

shitposter trying this hard to start shit
This is hilarious and sad.

Tyler Johnson
Tyler Johnson

It is in most series
What most series? Name five.

taken seriously
Except Saekano does both serious and humor.

Jeremiah Turner
Jeremiah Turner

Megumifag grasping at straws
Fucking kek.

Easton Collins
Easton Collins

That's the thing with Megumifags. At first people say she's perfect. Other anons call her boring because of how perfect she is. Then Megumifags claim that she has flaws. Anons point out a couple of flaws, Megumifags immediately jump on them and tell them how wrong they are. Which brings us back to step 1 of Megumifags calling Megumi perfect and so the cycle continues.

Mason Long
Mason Long

Except Utaha and Eriri follow the same logic as the MC. They are not a good judge of her actual in-universe self.
You're reaching. Eriri and Utaha don't have the same vision goggles Tomoya often sees through. They are more perspective and have better insight, Utaha especially, and would know a pretty girl that could make them jealous/be seen as a threat when they see one.

Leo Ward
Leo Ward

captivated by her beauty
That's nit true. He was taken in by an ideal image of Megumi's character when he first saw her at the hill, leading to an inner otaku trigger of a perfect dating sim scene. It wasn't the real Megumi nor was her appearance the sole real and sole reason.

Angel Perez
Angel Perez

Ugly duckling trope isn't bad, it's actually supposed to be a positive trope born from flaws
But they take it as an affront to their goddess
Seriously.

Josiah Cruz
Josiah Cruz

There is no way to "win" the argument. You try and point out why Megumi is unappealing, Megumifags immediately bumrush you and tell you how you simply don't understand how amazing of a character she is. You try and say that you do and that you still don't like her and all you get is a
lalalalala I can't hear you
type of response.

Jace Foster
Jace Foster

Let's just agree to disagree. I'm too tired to continue this argument.

Brandon Barnes
Brandon Barnes

Okay then.

Bentley Sanchez
Bentley Sanchez

My niggas

Ethan Gutierrez
Ethan Gutierrez

Pretty much this

This series is essentially one big payback for all the times the "normal" girl lost in other harems.

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