ARCHER DID NOTHING WRONG

Thomas Evans
Thomas Evans

he saved more people compared to the people he killed.
ARCHER DID NOTHING WRONG.

All urls found in this thread:
http://strawpoll.me/7273838
Levi Johnson
Levi Johnson

he slaughtered a bunch of violent Afrikaans dundunuffins. Hes a hero.

Ayden Jenkins
Ayden Jenkins

Yeah, but the point is that he didn't want to kill people at all, and the more he killed the more he believed that someday he would reach a point when he wouldn't have to kill anyone and that everybody would be happy, but that never happened.

Like Price explained in Extra, humanity must evolve to survive, and humanity can only evolve through war because that force people to go beyond and surpass their limits, hence, wars would never end as long there's humanity in the world.

Nathan Reyes
Nathan Reyes

He trashed Rin's place during his landing. That's not a good thing, considering her money problems.

Carter Collins
Carter Collins

humanity can only evolve through war
this meme again

Austin Gonzalez
Austin Gonzalez

Of course he did nothing wrong.

Cooper King
Cooper King

he saved more people compared to the people he killed.
But that's simply not true.

Hudson Phillips
Hudson Phillips

He says that he saved thousands by killing 1

Hudson Diaz
Hudson Diaz

He lived his life wrong

Noah Diaz
Noah Diaz

Of course he did nothing wrong. He's the planet's agent.

Jaxon Flores
Jaxon Flores

Yeah, but the point is that he didn't want to kill people at all, and the more he killed the more he believed that someday he would reach a point when he wouldn't have to kill anyone and that everybody would be happy, but that never happened.
This desu. but still, archer dindunuffin.

Hunter Carter
Hunter Carter

Yeah he's right but the hero of justice thing is still fucking cringey.

Dylan Rogers
Dylan Rogers

Archer best girl

Joseph Bell
Joseph Bell

His actions were never wrong. If he'd actually believed in what he was doing instead of clinging to an ideal that was convenient things would be fine.
He thought the right thing to do was something else and he suffered for not seeing that through, no matter how stupid. That is his fate stay night.

Caleb Russell
Caleb Russell

This always bothers me. Aren't counter guardian absolute last line of defense for humanity? Why is he killing random admiral ackbars.

Michael White
Michael White

Fuck Archer what a savage piece of shit.

We Humans can solve our problems without going through violence.

Xavier Myers
Xavier Myers

false flag baiting TM threads
Why such low hanging fruit

Brandon Long
Brandon Long

How many brown people did he end up killing, Sup Forums?

Jonathan Thompson
Jonathan Thompson

How dumb is this guy? People are using violence to kill and injure other people...hmm how about I kill them and insight more violence? Autistic dipshit deserved his fate.

Joseph Jackson
Joseph Jackson

He couldn't save everyone. He failed.

Luis Martinez
Luis Martinez

THIS.

Christian Jackson
Christian Jackson

am I the only one who likes Archer but hates Shirou?

Asher Butler
Asher Butler

War is only ever a transitional phase, desu.

Camden Cook
Camden Cook

am i the only one who holds this wildly popular opinion
yeah, you're the only one

archer the counter-guardian sacrificing his eternity for the planet sucks. a preteen faggot constantly sperging HERO OF JUSTICE HERO OF JUSTICE HERO OF JUSTICE is a much better character

Luis Gutierrez
Luis Gutierrez

Humanity isn't heading that way though. Modern society is now leaning towards socialism and automation. Soon enough the trash of society will die out and the only ones left are the elites and quality members of humanity.

Christian Watson
Christian Watson

lol
swords on the hill stolen from berserk

Lucas Reed
Lucas Reed

Doesn't Fate predate Berserk?

Daniel Jenkins
Daniel Jenkins

Not enough.

Camden Martinez
Camden Martinez

He actually is, though.

Archer is just a facet of Shirou. Shirou, overall is a much more nuanced and interesting character.

I will admit though that the most interesting parts of him are directly connected to Archer.

Mason Price
Mason Price

So did Hitler but only /pol/ says he did nothing wrong.

Austin Bennett
Austin Bennett

Double kek
Under the kek

Oliver Jackson
Oliver Jackson

archer cant even save himself

how can does save anyone if you cannot save yourself

Dominic Morales
Dominic Morales

a preteen faggot constantly sperging HERO OF JUSTICE HERO OF JUSTICE HERO OF JUSTICE is a much better character
kek no, this is what I fucking hate about shirou.

Daniel Robinson
Daniel Robinson

Saving is not algebra, you can only do it properly.

Nathan Clark
Nathan Clark

He doesn't just moan on about wanting to be a hero. He learns about the risks, the dangers, the weight of following his dream, and through the various routes, comes to understand why he should or shouldn't follow it.

Archer is a great character, but he is intrinsically tied to Shirou and his development. He is Shirou, and Shirou is Archer.

Blake Wright
Blake Wright

he keeps saying muh "hero of justice" over and over again it's fucking annoying and basically autism.

Jose Carter
Jose Carter

lol

Adrian Collins
Adrian Collins

Well it's the cornerstone of his character.

The entire point of FSN is basically asking what it means to be a hero.

As well as asking who the best girl is, but we all know that's Rin, so it's more of a non-question.

Nolan Green
Nolan Green

Archer has few regrets about his life. He hated killing people, but he ultimately understood that his actions were "correct". He was pragmatic, but he saw his ideals through to the end.

The problem was his death. Archer was fundamentally misinformed about what becoming a Counter Guardian actually entailed. He believed that being a Counter Guardian would mean he'd be able to save countless people for all of eternity. What actually happened was that he became a mindless slave to the planet, killing endlessly, forever, without reprieve. He was doomed to see pain, suffering, despair and sadness forever and ever. That's when he snapped and started to curse his ideal. You have to understand that this is a literal ETERNITY of misery. It will never end, never stop. For as long as the universe exists, for as long as the Spiral of Origin exists, Archer is forever doomed to his miserable fate.

So you can see, his despair and anger is justified.

Dominic Barnes
Dominic Barnes

Well, it wasn't Archer who sacrificed his eternity, that was Shirou who ended up making that choice. It's through that choice that he became Archer after countless years as a CG.

Cameron Reed
Cameron Reed

And that's why Fate Shirou has it the best. He ends up leading a life that's more or less identical to Archers', but through Saber's example, he learns the folly of giving up his afterlife to his ideal. Fate Shirou follows his ideal through to the end and dies with satisfaction in knowing that he devoted his entire life to a cause he believed in. He doesn't become a Guardian because he knows that he doesn't owe the world that much.

Charles Cook
Charles Cook

Shirou vs Archer fight doesn't make sense for me.
Archer: Imma kill you because in the future you'll turn like me. I'll do anything just to erase my existence.
Shirou: I don't give a shit
couple of flashbacks
Archer lets shirou win
Archer continues being a counter guardian

David Bennett
David Bennett

Well, even Archer knows that there's an extremely low chance that it would work. It's like he said, he was really just venting his frustrations.

In the end, though, none of the Shirous from any of the endings in Fate/stay night become Counter Guardians.

Juan Cook
Juan Cook

Archer didn't just want to kill Shirou, he wanted to make him admit he was wrong. Admit that his dream was faulty. Show that all the anger and frustration he was feeling was completely vindicated.

Shirou though didn't back down. He saw all the death, all the killing he may very well end up doing, and he accepted it. His dream was still not wrong.

And that made Archer realize maybe he was wrong. Maybe, in his age he had simply become jaded, and that he really did live a life of being a hero without regret.

That's why he lost. He realized the choices Shirou could make, the choices he was making, weren't the mistake he thought they were.

He then goes on to accept his duties as a Counter Guardian as to the best of his ability.

Parker Adams
Parker Adams

Read the VN. Archer literally states that Shirou made him realize he made the right choice to be a hero, even after the misery of being a CG. Watching and fighting his past self re solidified his motive and ideal.

Gavin Jackson
Gavin Jackson

shit looks like he's on the moon and wtf with the swords.
lel

Noah White
Noah White

if you kill someone who might kill two people then you saved more lives than you took

Justin Jones
Justin Jones

humanity can only evolve through war
I take issue with this premise of his argument.

Fucking bullshit.

Wyatt Brooks
Wyatt Brooks

archer
uses swords
"i-it's fine because he shoots them out like arrows!"

Damn, this franchise is fucking retarded.

Jacob Jackson
Jacob Jackson

He also uses regular arrows too.

Sometimes.

Blake Sanders
Blake Sanders

But he uses a bow too.

Hunter Jackson
Hunter Jackson

Did you say Hero of Justice? A Hero of Justice is what he wanted to be? I didn't know he wanted to be a Hero of Justice because he barely ever mentioned wanting to be a Hero of Justice. If he did, I must have missed it. Maybe he should have mentioned being Hero of Justice a few more times, because I don't think the show ever really made it all that clear that he wanted to be a Hero of Justice.

Speaking of Hero of Justice, have I told you about Hero of Justice yet. I think that's what that kid wants to be.

P.S.
Hero of Justice
Hero of Justice
Hero of Justice
Hero of Justice
Hero of Justice
Hero of Justice

Lucas Scott
Lucas Scott

My point is Archer went all through hardcore shit and then suddenly flip flop cuz his past self didn't gave up.

It's fucking lame..

James King
James King

He was too mesmerized.

Imagine being really passionate about something, but losing that passion as you age. If you were to meet your past self, you might the passion he exudes to be too blinding. That's why Archer lost. He was distracted by Shirou's sheer passion.

Because ultimately, Shirou and Archer are the same person. There is no way that Archer can't feel what Shirou feels. The origins are the same.

Chase Reyes
Chase Reyes

saber
doesn't use a curved sword

Evan Ramirez
Evan Ramirez

I'll do anything just to erase my existence.
Archer knows that killing shirou won't change archer's existence. He just wants to shirou to say "Okay I was an idiot"/

William Robinson
William Robinson

This always bothers me. Aren't counter guardian absolute last line of defense for humanity?

Those are Grand Servants who are individually powerful. Counter Guardians are just janitors.

Brayden Lopez
Brayden Lopez

Re-read UBW and Extra. He was always bitter. The Counter Guardian shit were a realization of how futile everything was.

Kiritsugu doesn't whine or throw as tantrum as counter guardian. Shirou's just a big baby.

Hunter Diaz
Hunter Diaz

So basically nobody on this site?

Logan Collins
Logan Collins

when will we get a lancer servant that actually uses a lance?

Christian Russell
Christian Russell

The Heroic Spirits who become Grand Servants are the last line of defense. Compare to them, Counter Guardians are like cannon fodder.

Levi Johnson
Levi Johnson

He becomes bitter and cynical, but he himself says that he has no regrets about his life. In Fate/EXTRA, he lacks the cynicism of his Fate/stay night self because as a Servant of the Moon Cell, he doesn't have to spend his eternity killing people endlessly. Archer has no regrets about his actions. He does believe that becoming a Hero of Justice is a silly, childish ideal, but he believe that his actions were ultimately for the best. That being said, if Archer DID have a regret about his life, it's that he wasn't able to truly become a hero like he dreamed. In Fate/EXTRA CCC, he gets an opportunity not just to save the world, but to save a life, no strings attached. It made him happy.

Henry Thomas
Henry Thomas

I know that, but Archer still want to give it a try.

Isaiah Jones
Isaiah Jones

That being said, if Archer DID have a regret about his life, it's that he wasn't able to truly become a hero like he dreamed.
He had other regrets: unable to reach Seiba and save her (he event paused his suicidal mission to try to get her give up her wish) and (in CCC) he wasn't able to save Sakura (or at least he probably left her without knowing her trouble).

Benjamin Roberts
Benjamin Roberts

Eh, those particular regrets aren't particularly tied to his actions as a hero of justice. Neither the one about Ilya.

Noah Diaz
Noah Diaz

Shirou's up there with being one of my favourite characters ever, but I do hate the way he keeps repeating that. I probably wouldn't have a problem with it if they translated it differently.

Isn't there a whole thing about the archer thing being a state of mind or something?

Luis Roberts
Luis Roberts

Hi Archer.

Tyler Howard
Tyler Howard

arturia alter lancer

Liam Hughes
Liam Hughes

From the very start Archer programmed himself to kill shirou and his ideals.

Adrian Powell
Adrian Powell

Imagine being really passionate about something, but losing that passion as you age. If you were to meet your past self, you might the passion he exudes to be too blinding. That's why Archer lost. He was distracted by Shirou's sheer passion.
I think you got it backwards, If my future self told me that I'm wrong I'd probably believe him and move on.

Most would do the same too.

Oliver Morales
Oliver Morales

Or you might find yourself disgusted at what you eventually become. Like an artist who finds out his future self is nothing more than a pragmatic sell-out.

Michael Rivera
Michael Rivera

I'd probably be pretty mad if my future failure of a self came back in time to teen me and told me to just give up whatever it was I wanted to do.

Evan Gonzalez
Evan Gonzalez

mfw you would kill a man to harvest his organs to save 3 accident victims

Nolan Ross
Nolan Ross

enjoy failures then.

Leo Perez
Leo Perez

What is Achaah wearing here?
Did he kill many muslims and fucked every Arabian chick?

Brayden Anderson
Brayden Anderson

SEIGI NO MIKATA

James Campbell
James Campbell

Actually, this is completely true. Archer hasn't done anything wrong, ever. Assuming he acted with the intention of attaining the greatest good for the greatest number, his conscience should be clear.

The problem is that - Like his dad - he doesn't want to accept this as the truth. He wants to make it so that there are no sacrifices. Archer is, to be blunt, throwing a tantrum.

And the thing is, there's no point to what he's doing. I get the feeling that he doesn't really believe his insane plan will work. If he did, he would have just sprinted right for Shirou and cut his head off. Or he'd have blown his house up. It would be easy - There's nothing stopping him from killing Shirou, anyway.

At any rate, he's already sold his soul, so he's already damned. I get the feeling that being constantly teleported to scenes of terror, madness and the worst excesses of humanity would wear down anyone given time. Worse, he's doing it for eternity! He can't even pick and choose, because he'll pop in and out of existence through all of time and space.

Basically, Archer has fucked himself and he cannot unfuck his shit.

Bentley Cook
Bentley Cook

I wanna get in the series because of archer.
But every time I watch the first few episode I get annoyed by the MC and that shitty girl.

Lucas Diaz
Lucas Diaz

In a scale to 0 to cuck, how fucked is Canada?

Caleb Howard
Caleb Howard

But every time I watch the first few episode I get annoyed by the MC and that shitty girl.
same here.

Andrew Torres
Andrew Torres

/pol/
Take your off topic shit there.

Wyatt Moore
Wyatt Moore

Didn't Justin drop the People's Elbow on a bitch?

All of them. All of them, through infinity.

I like to think that the world placed Shirou somewhere in Syria, where all those boats loaded with refugees were about to cast off. He fires again and again, each shot turning a ramshackle boat full of human trash into a titanic fireball.

And then he strides off into the night, already called to his next mission. For us, who slumber under the great aegis of civilization, we sleep sounder knowing that someone like him is abroad. Forever defending us, doing the work that we never admit must be done.

Ryder Foster
Ryder Foster

I swear that board has become an /mlp/ tier virus

Colton Sanchez
Colton Sanchez

Thats why fate is shit
You cannot save everyone, that was the truth archer learned through his battles, so he saved the ones he chose to save.
But then Nasu went full retarded with his HERO OF JUSTICE, and shirou aspulled after aspull like its nothing, got out of every single clumsiest and dumb mistakes (like charging at invincible enemies without thinking) and then when he sees his wounds magically heal because muh sheath of saber asspull without knowing he just does it again without learning anything and gets out alive.
AND THEN HE BEATS GIL,OH WAIT ITS POSSIBLE BECAUSE REALITY MARBLE
He fucking saved everybody with the power of plot armor and asspulls
What the fuck, its just shitty writing
Fuck this game, its like its written by a teenager.
I dropped it after ubw end because it became so insufferable with him being so obnoxious and the same dialogue being played over and over again

Carter Martin
Carter Martin

still annoying he sounds like a fucking retard I can't stand that shit.

What a shit MC so is f/sn routes.

Cooper Phillips
Cooper Phillips

You're missing the point, you know.

The point of Fate is that the world is ultimately benevolent. Events conspire to fight the madmen who seek to destroy all of existence. A higher power is ultimately looking out for us. (In fact, the mere existence of Counter-Guardians prove that.)

And at the same time, another prevailing idea is that Man is still great. Sure, we're not in the time of legends anymore, where men bestrode the narrow world like colossi. But the spark of heroism still lingers, and the right man - in the right place, at the right time - can save the god damn world.

Shirou does all the stuff he can because he always had that potential. The seed of greatness was within him. His youthful idealism is worth more than Archer's world-weary, nihilistic cynicism, because even today, right now, there is still hope for man. No matter how dark things get, the human spirit ultimately shines through.

It doesn't matter if you're fighting the First Tyrant, or something so old and abominable it no longer has a name. You can still win, through the invincible spirit of the human soul on fire.

Jose Thomas
Jose Thomas

Because Miura is a retard who didn't read the VN.

Jose Jackson
Jose Jackson

I just watch f/sn because the side characters are more interesting than the MCs.

Austin Gutierrez
Austin Gutierrez

What the fuck is this bullshit?

Colton Wood
Colton Wood

It's the main theme of the show. I mean, we're not being subtle here, they're beating you over the head with the symbolism. It's ultimately an idealistic message.

Brody Cruz
Brody Cruz

he just does it again without learning anything
You mean finally accepting that you can't save everyone but trying regardless because there's value in the attempt? Pay attention next time.
got out of every single clumsiest and dumb mistakes
4 good endings in 45 scenarios

Jackson Richardson
Jackson Richardson

Then you should read Hollow Ataraxia.

Connor Hernandez
Connor Hernandez

Its pasta right?
Nowhere did I get the idea that Shirou was the 'chosen one' with all the potential, it seemed like the writer just gave him power up after power up so that he could get out of pinch and beat his opponents no matter how powerful they were
No, I mean shit like going to school without your servant and not sleeping beside them because its too embarassing? What the fuck?
And his "ideal" isnt a good ideal, its retarded, you cannot save everybody if you are not a fictious character written by a shitty writer, and attempting to do so without any power and without applying a fragment of your brain and charging in like a bull is called being retarded and attempting suicide

Chase Bailey
Chase Bailey

yeah for some reason ginger kid managed to stab kirei while running like a fucking retard Kiritsugu on the other hand can't slice him not even once.

Shirou = KING OF ASSPULLS and PLOT ARMOR
It's not funny anymore...

Isaiah Carter
Isaiah Carter

Fuck I hate this logic.
No they don't win, as long as you aren't a fucking weak willed pussy who goes 'well I've killed this serial murderer, now I will start shooting up Jaywalkers and litterers'.
There are some people you HAVE to kill.

Ayden Walker
Ayden Walker

and attempting to do so without any power and without applying a fragment of your brain and charging in like a bull is called being retarded and attempting suicide
This
These type of characters always die first if theyre not the mc's

Charles Brooks
Charles Brooks

Shirou = KING OF ASSPULLS and PLOT ARMOR
Thats not how it works, the only reason why it seems like an asspull and plot armor, is because you're reading a VN where you get infinite save points until you reach the outcome.
You are literally reading/watching the only possible circumstance where Shiro managed to reach that outcome.

Julian Sullivan
Julian Sullivan

muh saber's sheath
muh reality marble
One of the first fate scenario-
Shirou and co encounters a near invincible foe
Saber goes to fight
Starts losing
Instead of trying to capture the master, he waits and then lunges towards the foe
Gets smashed to death
Still they all get spared because "muh too boring" aka shitty writing
Gets to taken to house
LOL HE DIDNT DIE ACTULLY HE HAS REGENERATION POWERS (TO BE REVEALED HOW LATER™)

Jonathan Sullivan
Jonathan Sullivan

ITs explained why it would be safe for him to be out in daylight without his servant, and "power ups" in UBW are a result of coming into contact with his future self, read the VN.
you cannot save everybody
Which he knows and accepts.
charging in like a bull is called being retarded and attempting suicide
Exactly. Shirou is lacking in self worth so he charges into situations without regard for his own life, it's pointed out in the text, and he does die in dozens of endings for it.

Shirou does die first, read the VN.

Michael Campbell
Michael Campbell

charging to kotomine while screaming like a fucking retard
kotomine just standing in one place looking at him
got stabbed
a skilled assassin like kerry can't even slice kirei
not plot armor

Noah Nelson
Noah Nelson

I wouldn't call that plot armor, there would literally be no plot without Shiro having Saber's sheath. He wouldn't have been able to even summon any spirit and the story would have been about a high school kid whose town gets fucked.

Hudson Thompson
Hudson Thompson

Still they all get spared because "muh too boring" aka shitty writing
Or because HIS SISTER DECIDED TO SPARE HER BROTHER YOU FUCKING RETARD

LOL HE DIDNT DIE ACTULLY HE HAS REGENERATION POWERS
Avalon having regenerative powers is from the fucking myth, they also explained you need a catalyst to summon a servant, which is how he summoned Arthur. If you could put 2 and 2 together you would be able to follow this VN but alas

never post again

Asher Robinson
Asher Robinson

read the vn,read the vn, read the vn
Is that all you all come up with?
I've only played the vn
Its shit

Bentley Barnes
Bentley Barnes

Exactly. Shirou is lacking in self worth so he charges into situations without regard for his own life, it's pointed out in the text, and he does die in dozens of endings for it.
He should die in all of them considering how he gives no thoughts to his action
This is a kusogame
Admit it

Carter Sanchez
Carter Sanchez

What's the point of this post? reading the vn but being unable to understand it is just as bad as being a secondary.

Ian Walker
Ian Walker

Kerry finding Shirou and bringing him up and then him being able to summon Saber as well as his magic being tuned to swords are all connected and central to the plot. You wouldn't have the story with Shirou having Avalon.

It's not an asspull, it's literally one of the major plot points.

Charles Hernandez
Charles Hernandez

There are six good endings and 40 bad ends.

Noah Thompson
Noah Thompson

Heaven Feel route better morally
muh saving everyone
muh ideals

Tyler Long
Tyler Long

He should die in all of them considering how he gives no thoughts to his action
except that's wrong, he does consider and think about how he approaches a situation, being machine-like is his whole schtick. im guessign you are an anime secondary because the vn shows how in depth his thought process is, calculating steps to escape from lancer for example in the prologue.

As I expected.
If I jumped out the window, he would definitely come after me.
And he would kill me even before I could get up.
That's why I expected the fatal blow and swung at it.
I would have died if it was a second too late or a second too early. But considering the difference in our skill, I could never have been too early.
So all I had to do was get up as fast as possible and swing at what was coming behind me.

Logan Hernandez
Logan Hernandez

So six end where he survives by pure luck
Should have been 46 bad ends

Juan Butler
Juan Butler

They never actually bring up morals. Shirou is always saying that he does it because he wants to. At no point does he say it's the right thing to do, he even admits the opposite multiple times. That's the whole point of him repeatedly saying it's selfish.

He's just selfish in another way in HF.

Christian Mitchell
Christian Mitchell

Implying Kirei was as strong in his prime fighting Shirou. Also, Zero was written AFTER Stay Night.

Ayden Rogers
Ayden Rogers

the only "luck" ending is HF True, maybe, if you didn't read or watch Kara no Kyoukai beforehand to get the puppet concept.

Daniel Campbell
Daniel Campbell

So six end where he survives by pure luck
He survives by making the right choices and loving the right girl.

Luis Ortiz
Luis Ortiz

exactly this. I see people calling shirou a "moralfag" all the time and I'm wondering where the fuck they got that from.

Ryder Russell
Ryder Russell

you must have been a secondary
Its like a defence mechanism fatefags have developed
They cant deal with people pointing out mistakes in fate, so they resort to calling them secondary and thinking their opinion must be wrong because they only watched the anime
I have only read the vn

As I expected.
If I jumped out the window, he would definitely come after me.
And he would kill me even before I could get up.
That's why I expected the fatal blow and swung at it.
I would have died if it was a second too late or a second too early. But considering the difference in our skill, I could never have been too early.
So all I had to do was get up as fast as possible and swing at what was coming behind me.
EXCEPT HE'S A FUCKING LANCER
A lancer stabs, not swing, and considering his lance was as fast as lightening, he should not be able to block it, and even if he did, his sword should have broken and get stabbed anyway.
Also this is not what Im saying about not thinking, this is called reaction, much like spider sense.
What Im talking about is planning out a strategy, what advantages you have, what advantages your opponent has over you, how to proceed, things shirou never does, and always is either aloof, or charges like a madman

Jace White
Jace White

Shirou is just a badly written Vash
And even Vash was insufferable sometimes

Ethan Cox
Ethan Cox

A lancer stabs, not swing
semantics
this is called reaction
and considering his lance was as fast as lightening, he should not be able to block it
except he didn't react to it you moron, that would be impossible. he throws out the shield preemptively because he's aware that he is outmatched in speed. which is "planning out a strategy, what advantages you have, what advantages your opponent".
things shirou never does
things he does throughout the entire vn, which you would know if you read it. anime cuts his thought process out so i understand your confusion.

Chase Nguyen
Chase Nguyen

Kirei just stood in one place and didn't even tried block shirou's very predictable attack.

Isaiah Moore
Isaiah Moore

IT FUCKING PISSES ME OFF.

HOPEFULLY STRANGE FAKE SAVE THIS SHITTY FRANCHISE.

DON'T GO FULL RETARD NARITA

Adrian Lewis
Adrian Lewis

except he didn't react to it you moron, that would be impossible. he throws out the shield preemptively because he's aware that he is outmatched in speed.
What shield? He did it with a sword.
Tell me how do you stop a lightening fast lance with a fucking sword?
The time it would take his sword to move an inch would have him pierced a thousand times.
This is also not called planning, it requires time and patience and thinking over and over again, what shirou does is just reaction
He's too busy with his SoL antics all throughout the vn
Give me an instance when he sits down with her partner, discussing how to find and beat their opponents, how to not get killed while taking a stroll in a war like a retard, how to proceed when identifying or encountering and opponent? His only strategy to find an opponent was "lets just take a stroll and find out"
things he does throughout the entire vn, which you would know if you read it. anime cuts his thought process out so i understand your confusion.
You're back to ad hominem
I've stated before I've only read your shitty vn minus HF end
I wont say that again

Ryan Lopez
Ryan Lopez

How does it make you feel that Narita doesn't share your opinion of the franchise?

Oliver Russell
Oliver Russell

It was explicitly explained Kirei was overestimating himself. Would you take Shirou as seriously as Kiritsugu? He was also a bit shocked at projection abilities.

Nolan Barnes
Nolan Barnes

I respect his opinion BUT F/SN IS FUCKING AWFUL SAME GOES WITH APOCRYPHA.

Asher Collins
Asher Collins

You're implying a professional assassin can be beaten by a semi-competent retard who runs like madman?
Its fucking insane
Thats fanfic tier writing, like kids thinking they can beat wrestlers after watching a wwe fight

Liam Hernandez
Liam Hernandez

Give me an instance when he sits down with her partner, discussing how to find and beat their opponents
"Okay, Gil is OP"
"This is how his powers work"
"Looks like UBW can beat it but I don't have enough mana to power it"
"I'll give you half of mine"
*Goes on to beat Gil with said power*

Kevin Jackson
Kevin Jackson

professional assassin
Out of practice for 10 years.
kids thinking they can beat wrestlers
They can, if the wrestler is underestimating them and the kid has a grenade on him (read: azoth sword).

Matthew Ward
Matthew Ward

What shield? He did it with a sword.
Yeah. He used a shield later in the shed.
Tell me how do you stop a lightening fast lance with a fucking sword?
By swinging preemptively.
This is also not called planning
Indeed, it's called tactics. Which isn't the same as strategy.
Give me an instance when he sits down with her partner, discussing how to find and beat their opponents, how to not get killed while taking a stroll in a war like a retard, how to proceed when identifying or encountering and opponent? His only strategy to find an opponent was "lets just take a stroll and find out"
Firstly, most of the Masters in the 5th HGW were unprepared due to how early and abruptly it started. This is a point made several times.
What I'm talking about here is when Shirou finds himself in a combat situation, he thinks and considers how to approach it. How do you think he beat Gilgamesh? Brute force? He used calculated pressure and exploited his enemy's weaknesses.
I've only read the vn
No you haven't. All of your complaints are those commonly made by secondaries like "Shirou has plot armor and never dies" or "Shirou doesn't think". You aren't fooling anyone; read the VN.

Joseph Morgan
Joseph Morgan

No you haven't. All of your complaints are those commonly made by secondaries
Maybe he just is that stupid.

David Perry
David Perry

Wow what a smart planning, at the end of the game.
It was fucking obvious, they didnt even need to think about it.

Also the reality marble asspull came here.
2. How the someone using noble fantasm with every fucking blow be beaten by normal swords?
It only resulted in his swords breaking?
Are you telling me they stopped just after clashing with a sword? They should have pierced right through him.
3. A fucking novice who just learned using ubw beats someone who does it all the time?

Samuel Powell
Samuel Powell

WHAT THE FUCK? GINGER KID WAS RUNNING TOWARDS KIREI METERS AWAY FROM HIM!

Would you take Shirou as seriously as Kiritsugu
Okay?
Kirei: oh ginger kid is going to stab me? hahaha I'm sure it won't penetrate my tough ass skin so I'll just stood here in one place like a fucking loser who's about to commit suicide on the middle of the road waiting for a car to hit him even though I can easily block him.
that makes fucking sense...

Bentley Fisher
Bentley Fisher

Do you forget how to ride bikes if you havent rode them for ten years?
Sword fighting relies on muscle memory

And he didnt even manage to stab him even once. azoth sword isnt a grenande.
It could at least clash with his sword.

Charles Hernandez
Charles Hernandez

Is this your first week on Sup Forums? Why can't you stop posting like a faggot?

Landon Martinez
Landon Martinez

I can easily block him
*I can easily block this whining retard.

Ethan Anderson
Ethan Anderson

By swinging preemptively.
Okay let me rephrase that
Can you stop a fucking bullet with a sword?
Its the same
Should have been obvious when I said lightening fast.

Also this is also not called tactics. Not by a mile
Fatefags are retarded
Its like arguing with kids. Im done

Kayden Hughes
Kayden Hughes

STRANGE FAKE
It's pretty good.

for now

Hudson Young
Hudson Young

Can you stop a fucking bullet with a sword?
This is actually a good example. Because you can't go faster than a bullet but you can be faster than the person pressing the trigger.

Christian Roberts
Christian Roberts

Meant for

Gavin Ortiz
Gavin Ortiz

You were a dumb frogposter all along? Well that explains it.

Ethan Ortiz
Ethan Ortiz

Not that guy, but
WHAT?
He didnt dodge it, so the question of speed of the one firing the bullet doesn't come, he didnt block it(and even that would have failed and lance pierce right through it), he SWUNG it.
Literally the option with the least chance of survival

Benjamin Clark
Benjamin Clark

I've only read the vn
No you haven't. All of your complaints are those commonly made by secondaries like "Shirou has plot armor and never dies" or "Shirou doesn't think". You aren't fooling anyone; read the VN.
Okay whatever you say, son
Goodnight

Adrian Gomez
Adrian Gomez

didn't address shit
got btfo about shirou being a shitty character armored by plot
huuurd duuur frog poster

Jace Anderson
Jace Anderson

He preemptively swung his strengthened poster in an attempt to block an attack he thought would be coming. Did you miss the part where he has been swinging his poster at lancer up until then and it worked?
He didn't make any point.

Cooper Gray
Cooper Gray

He didn't make any point.
says the delusional shiroufag AKA king of asspulls

Ayden Gomez
Ayden Gomez

Did you miss the part where he has been swinging his poster at lancer up until then and it worked?
Um, this again asking like how do you dodge a bullet with a sword.
That just means Shirou has ultra-god tier luck (or shitty writing)

Eli Powell
Eli Powell

How the someone using noble fantasm with every fucking blow be beaten by normal swords?
normal swords
Regardless of whether you read the VN or not, it's obvious you weren't paying attention. UBW was copying every noble phantasm that appeared, projected automatically even faster than Gils swords come out of its portals. They're degrade 1 rank but still enough overwhelm with speed.
A fucking novice who just learned using ubw beats someone who does it all the time
That's part of Gil's weakness. Gate of Babylon is so OP he never bothered training it above novice level because novice was enough to kill anything.

Joseph Taylor
Joseph Taylor

That just means Shirou has ultra-god tier luck
Or Lancer has ultra shit-tier luck.

Camden Baker
Camden Baker

He was shocked by what happened, Shirou took advantage and stabbed him in an instant. Stay fucking mad.

F/SN
asspulls
what

Kevin Kelly
Kevin Kelly

Reading so much analysis of Shirou has made me realize how boring he actually is. We even had to deal with this in Drei.

Bentley Baker
Bentley Baker

kek

Dylan Baker
Dylan Baker

all these fate and shirou apologists
Just admit fate is shit and appreciate the masterpiece that is prisma illya like me

Adrian Diaz
Adrian Diaz

You can enjoy both. Only idiots limit their tastes.

Luis Kelly
Luis Kelly

one of the highest rated game on EGS and vndb
needing "apologists"
Shirou is a brilliant and complex character and FSN is good. Your contrarianism is showing.

Brandon Green
Brandon Green

Just admit my line of thinking is the absolute truth
Why do you have differing opinions than mine?

Jacob Moore
Jacob Moore

enjoying shit
calling it taste
Do you also read LNs written by teenager nips and fanfics?

Justin Price
Justin Price

shocked
veteran exorcist who've seen many types of fucked up magic
shocked by projection magic

Gabriel Baker
Gabriel Baker

Had Kirei not ambushed her, Bazett and Lancer would have won the war.

Jaxson Brown
Jaxson Brown

Shirou is a brilliant and complex character and FSN is good.

Landon Stewart
Landon Stewart

Do you really consider Prisma to be a high horse from which you can judge people's taste?

Evan Stewart
Evan Stewart

You know, naruto and sao are highly rated too, doesnt mean theyre good

Hudson King
Hudson King

Shirou is a brilliant and complex character and FSN is good

Mason Edwards
Mason Edwards

Yes

Landon Bell
Landon Bell

No, they aren't. You're confusing popularity with acclaim.

Evan Long
Evan Long

HOLY SHIT SHIROUFAGS AND F/SN BABIES GETTING BTFO!!!

Jackson Nguyen
Jackson Nguyen

Fuck off touma

Leo Moore
Leo Moore

She ends up mutilating Shirou and taking his head with her in a bad end. Don't go full retard

Jace Powell
Jace Powell

Yes, exactly. If Shirou's character wasn't in a battle series with magical elements in a niche Japanese medium he'd be marveled as a literary masterpiece, a modern Hamlet that defines modern protagonists. First he'd need to be moved into a story without magic, and instead his backstory was that he was a survivor of a terrorist bombing 10 years and was then saved by the terrorist who planned the whole event. Then you could replace all the magical backstory with political elements and set the story in the Middle East, replace the Holy Grail War with a regular war, etc. If you had a more "serious" story that people didn't judge on the fact it had porn scenes and was from Japan, people would be regarding Shirou as one of the most interesting protagonists of modern literature. This is a fact that none of us can escape from even if we want to, Shirou's core psychology and thematic progression is absolutely incredible.

Ryan Collins
Ryan Collins

You're the only person in this thread who uses btfo and types in all caps. How do you not notice this?

Noah Brooks
Noah Brooks

HOLY SHIT! My opinion is winning because I say so!

Hudson Hughes
Hudson Hughes

You mean the bad end where Shirou opts out of the war? How is that relevant to her deciding to spare him after seeing him almost suicide against Berserker?

Sebastian Lewis
Sebastian Lewis

This is some pathological delusion. Do you actually believe you've won a debate here? Did you decide that actually arguing was too hard so you'd forgo that step and call yourself the "winner"?

Isaac Jones
Isaac Jones

not liking nasu's writing
痛い奴

Wyatt Ward
Wyatt Ward

Surprised by generally undoable magic
Questions who Shirou is momentarily

Autism.

Jaxson Rogers
Jaxson Rogers

Not if your future self is super strong and completely able to do what you dream of doing.

Angel Roberts
Angel Roberts

More importantly
Shirou's entire character arc, and even the basis of Archet's power and UBW consists of being "fake"
his origin is sword

Bullshit

Ian Perez
Ian Perez

surprised
not this shit again...

Josiah Sanders
Josiah Sanders

They don't win but you haven't achieved complete victory.

Complete victory would be having every single enemy you have become an ally who'd die for you, but that only happens in shounen manga.

Hunter White
Hunter White

They would have still lost to Gil, unless you're also assuming they never would have fought him.

Archer might have stood a chance if he actually went all-out against them with Rin as his master: It mainly depends on if UBW is enough to proc fragglerock or not

Ian Robinson
Ian Robinson

Bazett & Lancer could double team Gilgamesh . Remember how long he held Gil off on his own in Fate.

Julian Ross
Julian Ross

No you 13 year old

Aiden Clark
Aiden Clark

From the way the user I responded to commented , he implies that Illya spares Shirou because theyre siblings and out of love which is strange because she ends up torturing him in several bad ends

Blake Butler
Blake Butler

I know what's right. What I've protected until now, and what I want to protect right now. I know which choice is correct, and which is wrong. With that in mind, I...

[ ] Persist on becoming a hero of justice. The man who turned away from the Einzberns for something he believed was right. I've chosen the same path.
[ ] I just want to protect Sakura, that's all.

http://strawpoll.me/7273838

Asher Flores
Asher Flores

This and Fate/Zero. FSN aged like milk.

Landon Foster
Landon Foster

how'd it age like milk? it's fully voice acted and has great music.

Elijah Brooks
Elijah Brooks

Mahoyo genuinely has the best prose Nasu's written. Shit sets the mood so well, especially with the top notch visuals and sound.

I guarantee whenever it'll sound like shit in english though, whenever it gets translated.

Matthew Wilson
Matthew Wilson

Reminder that Kirei got btfo by Caster's bone creatures while Shirou managed to fight against them.

Liam Nelson
Liam Nelson

Isn't he with Rin or Saber every time he fights them? And with Caster nowhere in sight.

Ian Morales
Ian Morales

guy who normally has no talent is now capable of doing basic magic at a level so advanced nobody else on earth could match him.
not being surprised

Zachary Gomez
Zachary Gomez

Tomoko save my soul for hell with her love.

Jace Cruz
Jace Cruz

I chuckled

Jason Morris
Jason Morris

This trudeau is my man
No you fucking retard you dont have to kill anyone.

Caleb Rivera
Caleb Rivera

surprised by what? by a kid charging towards him with a shitty dagger?

Jonathan Sanchez
Jonathan Sanchez

Him reproducing Avalon which basically makes him immortal.

James Cook
James Cook

Avalon had been inside shirou's body the whole time.

You actually think a veteran exorcist who went through a lot of fucked up shit would be surprised by.... that?

Jordan Ortiz
Jordan Ortiz

Yeah but he gave it to Saber right before the final fight. The one he used in the fight was created from scratch.

Jose Phillips
Jose Phillips

surprised

Lincoln Gonzalez
Lincoln Gonzalez

saving peolpe
People are evil and rotten to the core, they don't deserve to be saved if they can't save themselves. the only one who was right was gilgamesh

Liam Nguyen
Liam Nguyen

So there is some sort of X-COM made of dead ancient heroes?

Kayden Mitchell
Kayden Mitchell

a shitty dagger
How secondary can you get?

Luis Price
Luis Price

This

Ryder Morris
Ryder Morris

And he failed when he realized those ideals were still worth living for.

Shirou doesn't fail though. He not only goes on to live his dream, he goes on to surpass Archer.

He does better than Kerry. He does better than the self a fought against. He gets to forge a new future that hasn't been written.

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