Why shouldn't a college education be free?

Why shouldn't a college education be free?

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no matter which way you cut it, someone has to pay for it, may as well be the person that benefits from it...

Because almost none of us will use anything above 7th grade reading, writing and math skills after schooling ends.

Why shouldnt a carton of milk or gallon of gas be free? If you wish to reap the benefits of something then you should be the one to earn it. If you aren't willing to accept the cost of a collage education then you don't deserve to attend collage and should begin to search for a job.

/thread

the bachelor's degree has already become the new high school diploma even with many students taking on crippling debt

make education free and you'll end up with professional students who just keep studying to avoid being in the real world

could you imagine if everybody took women's studies could stay until they got a PHD, then start working on a second major for gender equality?

Supply and demand. Every single person who isn't a drop out is getting memed into going to college and consequently suicide, anxiety, drop outs, and depression are rising from millenials and the younger generation. Kids are being told that hardwork will get you somewhere yet they live an easy life with no struggle.

Why should I pay for someone else's college when I've already paid for mine?

Do you work 8 hours for free?

Not everyone needs college, the "everyone MUST go to college" idea was a mistake

Come to Finland. Free education and high Tax procent

Almost :c

The more people have degrees the less degrees are worth. If you can't afford it take it as a sign that the universe wants you doing something else. Learn a trade or go into business for yourself.
Eventually there will be too many fucking electricians and carpenters and not enough people with degrees and the cost to aquire one will drop.
This is the life you were born into. Make the best of it instead of bitching and asking everyone to do it for you.

Basically this. The entire education system is a sham.

Why does it cost thousands of dollars per semester instead of a few hundred like in the 70s though?

It is, you can learn everything they teach on YouTube. You pay for the piece of paper

Yup. The only reason why education is pushed so fiercely is because leftists are incapable of thinking critically about issues.
A lot of the aristocrats and old money attended higher education as a form of tradition and to form connections with other wealthy families. These kids would be successful no matter how fucked up they spent their childhood, but Leftists saw this correlation between wealth and higher education and did some retarded assburgers mental gymnastics and thought that it was Trust Fund Johnny's thesis on Ancient Greek faggotry that made him wealthy.

Leftists are amazing...

Why can’t you get a job and pay your own way like everybody else?

Because it involves the labor of others. It can't be "free" without slavery, or theft.

So reality is the answer to your question

Because once you publicize something, you give everyone a voice in its content. If the populace is going to fund people's tuition fully and completely, they're going to want certain majors completely gone if they deem them not 'useful'. Gender Studies, Arts, Anthropology, all gone.

Also, the idea that 'degrees are necessary to get a good job' is not only horseshit, but won't be solved by 'free college'. If you fill every single college to the brim, you're going to have to build more. If you build more, then they're going to be filled to the brim. And if all colleges are filled to the brim with students getting Bachelor's degrees, then Bachelor's degrees REALLY don't matter and now a Masters will be what a Bachelor's was, just as a Bachelor's was what an Associate's/Diploma was and so on and so forth. Saturating the market with a product does not bring its demand or value up. That's just basic logic.

And finally it's hilarious because it hurts people at the bottom THE MOST. Say you're someone who didn't graduate high school, through fault or no fault of your own. Today you can clean up your act, get a GED (which doesn't amount for much but it does open a lot of entry-level doors), and find an entry level job. Now a GED means even LESS than it did yesterday so you need a degree, but you can't afford to take time off and get a degree. It brings the bottom down, the middle down, everyone is brought down by free college except those that already benefit from nepotism or those pursuing PhDs, which will always retain value.

You're a shill, and a moron

No one said endless free educatiom AND housing for infinity for any major. Its grants for a select bumber of chosen major positions for qualifying student. Btfo fuckless faggot

The first people that will line up against that idea is all the major university staff.

If college is truly made "free", then EVERY college has to charge the exact same price--- whether its MIT or Framingham State (a local community college). Why? Because its FREE--- meaning the tax payers pay for it. And when tax payers pay for it, the US government negotiates the price it pays, since its the ONLY legal payer.

The second thing that has to happen to make all college education free is to nationalize it. That is, there can be NO private universities anymore. Why not? Because private universities could charge what they want. And that price would be WELL above the current US Government price, since they won't be low balling the yearly cost to "keep the cost to the US taxpayer down".

The third thing that happens is it becomes illegal to give money to colleges. Why? Because this would give some colleges more money than others. This will result in political pain with cries of "Racism" and "Social Justice For All". So no more private moneys of any kind to colleges.

So now you have a US with no private education allowed, all colleges paid purely by the US Government, and as a consequence, every college will be required, because it is funded purely as a public utility by the government, to teach identical courses and material. That is, every college will have everything set by the US government.

Sounds great, right? There will be no difference between Alabama's local Calhoun College and Boston's MIT. Same course, same cost, same admittance requirements---- EVERYONE that applies, first come, first served, but mind the affirmative action requirements which will shift the first come, first served policy.

It shouldn't be free but it shouldn't cost 2 grand to take one class either.

fpbp as usual

It is free. If you’re poor you get financial aid. If you’re rich your parents can write it off. Students get into debt because they want to go to the expensive private schools they don’t really need. Or they choose to go away for college and end up with debt from housing and food expenses.

Someone ran the numbers and said it would just be about $35 a year for every taxpayer.

And honestly, it's worth having a country of less stupid people.

And that's a problem in and of it'self. The H1B visa exists because we aren't generating enough talent to satisfy this country's needs. The ONLY way to fix this is better higher education

It will never be free. It will always cost money. The question is will only the people who attend college be the ones to pay for it, or will everyone have to pay for it for the rest of their lives.

>There will be no difference between Alabama's local Calhoun College and Boston's MIT

I don't think this is the case even in prestigious high schools like Stuyvesant and mediocre high schools like Bayside High School.

What separates the schools isn't the content or the way the material is being taught. Most of the best professors in the country couldn't give 2 shits about their undergrads and have their TAs teach for them.

The difference comes from the quality of the student body.

People have a misguided belief that the environment plays a major role in our development when it plays almost no role.
In this case, the students make the school prestigious, not the other way around.

American (((universities))) are overpriced and the quality does not reflect the pricetag for most schools not in the top 50

There is no such thing as free. What you are really asking is "why shouldn't the government pay for college education.

The answer is that the product is mostly worthless. We need to be popping the education bubble, not shoving in more money as fast as possible. Current government spending on it is already a terrible waste.

>No one said endless free educatiom AND housing for infinity for any major.

No need to lie. Plenty of people say that

>going to college makes you less stupid

What's the point of earning one and having paid for it if it becomes free for all?

Here's an easy way to start off with nothing. Don't got to college. By going to college you accept that the benefits of it outweigh the costs by definition (or your retarded in which case why go to college). Either don't go to college or stop complaining about a deal you consensually signed up for.

>The H1B visa exists because we aren't generating enough talent to satisfy this country's needs

Bullshit corporate propaganda.
Tech wages have been stagnant for years. If there really is a supply issue, wages would be going up astronomically YoY.

H1B visa exists to keep wages stagnant and keep corporate profits high.

>No one said endless free educatiom AND housing for infinity for any major.

Well sorry if I don't interpret 'free college for anyone and everyone' as free tuition for any and all majors forever. Housing I haven't really seen many people propose, but the idea of tuition being free means just that. Free. As many classes as you like, as many majors as you like. So does that mean that english majors won't have free college? Or arts majors? Is the public going to be able to decide which majors deserve funding?

because its a service

I would love for it to be free, but since it's both exclusive and fueled by consumables "free" actually means "payed for by someone else".

This isn't exactly a terrible thing either, it all depends on if the value of having that educated person around is greater than the value I am expected to pay for his education. For example if everyone had some disease that cost $100 to cure, but we could all pay $25 to send some kid to school who would discover a way to cure the disease for $50 then in the end we are $25 ahead making his education "free". However as a current college student I can say with relative certainty that this is not the case under current conditions. "Education", at least in my country, is a shit show were we are buying a degree and not an education. We might produce one of those kids for every hundred and at that point it is not worth the cost to everyone else as the benefit is so small.

If we want to make college "free" then we first need a massive overhaul of the current system which would exclude a vast majority of current/prospective students, removal of all race/economic status/other selective pressures, and only let in a select few of the best we can produce. This also has potential to lead down the road of potential slavery of college grads as they would be expected to produce a benefit equal to the cost of their education in order to "repay" those who funded them, although that is unlikely.

In short, a college degree is today's equivalent of a title of nobility, and we use these titles to move upwards in social status in lieu of actual ability. By definition we can't give these away for free or our entire system would collapse.

less stupid, im sure you ment to say less culturally marxist programmed

This. Apple isn't hiring Hajeed because 'oh man we just can't find anyone here in America!', they're hiring him because Hajeed will work for half of what an American would.

H1B visas exist because corporations use it as a way to depreciate the value of specialized labor, while the millenial cocksuckers are cheering them on with the shrieks of diversity and open world without borders.

because it costs money

Be cause this is the real world faggot, and people like me don't want our tax dollars funding half the shit these colleges are teaching. man up, and pay for it yourself.

The price of textbooks has gone up. Also books, I would pay $30-40 for literature and $60 for math and science. The price has literally doubled (if not trippled in the last 20 years). Reason, student loans.

What happens when education is free? $1000 Books?

Almost all high schools are funded locally through local taxes, mostly on home owners via property taxes. This is often supplemented with a local sales tax. High schools receive small amounts of federal money through grants to the States, which then redistribute the money to the various schools following whims of local politicians, bureaucrats, and what they earned via various federal formula of moneys earned (ie, drop out rate, attendance rate, etc).

The "free college" movement would be funded at the federal level, meaning things would work as I described.

Keep in mind, there is nothing stopping your local colleges from being "free" in the same way most of your local high schools are "free". That is, your local communities could take on the funding of the college through local taxes, and therefore students would never receive a bill for tuition. There are actual US communities that do this, although they are rare to completely offset the tuition with locally raised moneys.

Because it isn't free.

Stop crying and do the following

Pay for first semester using federal and state assistance (throw some of your own money in obsly), dont be retarded, get a loooooong time student loan, pay like 30$ a month and finish paying the loan off when u are 30.
Education is a right, higher education is not.

>When the government is forced by law to pay for tuitions the universities are free to raise the prices
Daily reminder that tuitions skyrocketed because of increased government financial aid

>Hello mister blacksmith sir, I'd love to learn how to make swords and sell them from your humble store, making you and our fair kingdom money by crafting strong swords and shields for everyone that offers a fair coin.
>K, give 10.000 and I'll teach you a trick or two that'll maybe get you a job somewhere else doing something you probably didn't learn from me.
How did it ever come to this.

I'm saying that even if you dumb down the supposed quality of an elite institution's education, it's not going to affect the quality of their students.

Students make the institution, not the other way around.

>education makes you smart
Also
>pay for my degree that has zero application to the real world.

She looks exactly like i thought she would

>Why shouldn't a college education be free?
Because college is not necessary for the vast majority of jobs. Shit, you need a college degree to be an assistant manager at Target now.

>$35 a year for every taxpayer
>implying it's worth it to fund some tens of thousands of professional victim snowflakes going through worthless degrees like gender studies, polsci or Beyonce studies

Nigga you stupid. The only degrees that could be subsidised, but currently aren't because they pose no such issue as the inability to repay loans is STEM. Unless you run over some pretty shitty luck in your life, if you can't pay in 12 years tops your loans you got a serious problem. This is if you never ever applied or financial aid and scholarships before and during uni.

>Someone ran the numbers and said it would just be about $35 a year for every taxpayer.

And you think those numbers will stay stagnant? That these colleges won't fill to the fucking brim to the point in which we build more, which will cost even more money, which will again in turn fill to the brim?

Ding ding, we have a winner.
H1B best displays it's use in Tech industry for wage suppression. the Average US worker is better versed in what they are worth while the average poo in the loo is desperate enough to be a literal wage slave as they dangle the H1B over them and if they complain they yank it fast enough to fling Pajeet back home without paying him a cent for the last 30 days of work.

I am not paying 35$ month for some faggot to major in lesbian dance theory. Kill yourself. College does not make you smart, it provides knowledge, most knowledgr does not equal intelligence. I would rather make myself smarted spending 35$ month on a book.

ANYTHING LESS THAN 8TH GRADE PROFICIENCY IS CONSIDERED FUNCTIONALLY ILLITERATE

someone should make a response political cartoon where the millennial are throwing their "give figure student loan debt" on the back of a baby; the future generation.

Oh, it'd be awesome if it'd be free.

So tell the greedy professors to work for less/free, and tell the stupid college admin departments to slash their own salaries/costs/throats.

Because otherwise it won't be "free", since there's no such thing as free.

Keeping costs of professor's salaries what they are means that there's a cost involved and someone has to pay that cost. Not free.

Get these goody goody profs to do their duty to the future by teaching for free. Go ahead, try it and see how selfless and giving these people are.
>wah wah I already work for hardly anything!
>my poor little adjunct professorship
>wah wah actually I know nothing about life and have nothing to teach except nonsense
They're already overpaid.

Also
>FIVE-FIGURE STUDENT LOAN DEBT
Only 5-figure? Not 6-figure?
Was that cartoon from the '90s?

>it provides *fake* knowledge

Fixed that for you.

H1B does have a use but the current rules leave it rampant for abuse. There is no incentive against companies just applying for shitloads of jobs @ $60K (at which most of the requirements to prove you tried to hire an American and you aren't penalized on the hire if your firm is "H1-B dependent").

This is why you have ~200,000 applications for 65,000 spots each year on H1-B, and why people with homes and families in six digit software jobs can't cut the visa renewal and then are sent to Canada or back home in order to keep them within their multinational company... because they lose on the coin flip for the application.

Why should people need a college degree just to make a reasonable wage?

Why should we? Why should we pay so someone can get the career they want? It's not the job of the taxpayer to ensure an adult gets an education. Public education for children is already a debatable topic, now you want public education for colleges? Especially since now all colleges are going to become publicized, the quality of the education will dip when the government gets its hands on regulating the content of the classes.

Do some research on how overpriced these money grubbing institutions of higher learning are and get back to me. Why is high school free but college isn't? There are some pretty large public high schools out there that support themselves using boosters and other donors.

Let's look at a class at a public school that charges $400 a credit hour. The class is 3 hours. With 30 students enrolled, the university gets 400x3x30 = $36,000. For a full time professor that teaches 4 classes a semester, that is about $144,000 paid for his classes just for that semester. This is just the in-state rate. The state BOE is paying the rest of that professor's salary, as well as those for staff, administrative, and operating costs for the school.

The out of state rate generally falls between 2 and 3 times that of in-state, and more in line with private schools. For $1200 a credit hour, the professor's courses $432,000 for single semester, and about $1 million per year if you count fall, spring and summer semesters.

I doubt many professors are making $1 million a year, since the national average is $115K. Most of it is going to the school in some other way. Where does the rest go? Boosters pay for expensive coaching salaries. Corporations provide a lot of the research grants. Supplying run-down chalkboards, buildings and school desks shouldn't cost that much since any cheap community college has the same basic stuff for their students. There is really no good reason for the rates paid by students. Someone is getting rich. You may want to look at trustee boards. Universities are basically just corporations now and pay money back to investors.

>Why should people need a college degree just to make a reasonable wage?
Supply and Demand. The sheep start to get disposable income, and college used to only be for the wealthy and very respectable professions (Doctors, Engineers, Lawyers, etc.). Now, there are a fuck ton of kids attending college, and still getting the same jobs their parents had.

State shouldn't pay for you to get drunk and party while obtaining a degree that will be worthless to society

You want a free education? Join the military and contribute you leach

Companies who hire specialists with higher education should pay special "education tax" that should partly offset the price of college education.

Why colleges are so expensive.
youtube.com/watch?v=yTjnpJvZrwM

In short, the government offers more loans, so the colleges just up their rates.

>go to school to get paid more money so the employer has to pay a tax for the fact that they hired someone with more education, leaving them with less money to pay the person with
seems real fucking logical user

You also choose to take that debt. You could have gone to a community college for 2 year and cut that debt in half.you didn't. It's no one else's responsiblity to cover your moronic dealings. Hopefully you learned a less in finance retard

Totally agreed user! I had to get my Master's just to be considered for jobs my grandfather could have gotten with a GED.

The education system in this country is fucked thanks to the goddamn financial system which thrives on debt rather than wealth.

In this Bizzaro world debt == money.

>increase in unemployed specialists and increase in expatriation
Duh, what happened?

Yea, what fucking job is that? Bullshit

(((Bizarro)))

okay, fair point. The one who benefits, has to pay.

But why exactly is your education so expensive? The relation between service and price is extremely out of order.

College education outside of STEM is completely worthless from a pragmatic standpoint. Why should we sink hundreds of billions into something that is not a good investment

I'd suggest that STEM education should be made free, and only STEM. But I know that this would just result in STEM's quality and standards dropping like a rock. And we need intelligent people in STEM, desperately.

So no. Scholarship programs exist and when they aren't marred by affirmative action they already select for people who should be in school.

Someone here doesn't understand the difference between private colleges and public colleges.

MIT, Yale, Harvard...all the private schools will still be able to charge whatever they want. Only public universities will be affected by this.

only STEM majors, business majors, and in exceptional cases the arts, should be subsidized. education should only be "free" if we can be reasonably assured the graduate will enter a higher income tax bracket to pay back what he took from the system. but giving free education to retarded niggers and women for a sociology degree? no.

Making college free will primarily benefit the poor, therefore increase taxes on the poor to pay for it.

If you have a problem with the above statement then you are why college shouldn't be "free"

>feds decide to put the budget into college
>colleges jack up their prices to take advantage of DUDE FREE SHIT, drop standards to get as many kids in as possible to more DUDE FREE SHIT, and more people abuse the college welfare system to get more DUDE FREE SHIT

Probably anything middle level public sector or management positions at medium or large enterprises. Even certain entry level roles are expecting MA/MSc.

Every officer in the US military is supposed to attain a masters degree. The British Army is going the same way. I own businesses and barring the very specialist one, the staff are overqualified across the board.

It's going to implode within the next five years, so don't worry about it.

Because it costs

Most universities are private and know that they can charge exorbitant fees due to the student loan market making college tuition possible for people who normally wouldn't be able to pay. There are no regulations and there is little incentive to provide a high quality product, since colleges are providing a service to a customer base that desperately wants their product

Can I have the source on the $35/yr? I'm curious.

The only reason those meme degrees exist is that you turned education into a Jewish business.

On the contrary, most "engineers" go into jobs that could be learned through an apprenticeship and a two year qualifying course.

I know that really rubs the people who did Mechanical Engineering at university and think they're Iron Man, so I'll say it again. You could have gone to a technical college like you used to do.

So we agree that the high fees don't reflect what the education is worth.

Aren't there state-owned or federal-owned universities?

my grandpa was a machinist and retired as the president and ceo of two different companies (once in his 50s and the other in his 70s)
he never worked at a company longer than 10 years (grandma liked to move a lot)
he had a high school diploma and liked to read

Have you ever tried moving into a leadership role at a company?

My grandfather was a regional director for a huge agriculture company in Florida. He only went to high school...not one single day of college.

He worked there for 10 years and got promoted to the directorship. I've been at my company for almost 20 years. For 12 of those years, I had a BS and couldn't even apply for leadership roles because they required MS or higher. I went back to school and earned my MS to even be considered for promotions.

By the way, my boss (who is my grandfather's age) got his position with an Associate's. So yeah, our generation's degrees are increasingly worthless.

Why wont you faggots just come and study to a european university? Unleass you are a ivy faggot you got better and far more cheap unis trougth the old world

There are plenty and in-state tuition is typically less than $20,000 a year plus financial assistance like scholarships, versus $50K/yr for a lot of private universities.

That lesbian dance degree that's worth nothing is subsidizing your degree that's worth something. You start changing things and you'll find cheap lesbian dance degrees and far more expensive STEM degrees.

>You could have gone to a technical college like you used to do.
maybe technically true, but the reality is that a good Uni has connections to top tier companies that a technical college does not. and as a recent graduate from such a Uni you have a window of opportunity to negotiate a high salary out the gate. that's just the way it is.

It doesn't exist. The Sanders Campaign estimated that free college would cost 75 Billion a year. Assuming 315 Million people in the Unitted States (Not taxpayers but people, including infants and people living off of SS) the cost would be $240 per person.

Number of taxpayers is 140,000,000 so now we are at $500 per taxpayer but remember that 47% of Americans pay no/negative taxes to the Federal Government. People who actually pay taxes now are paying an extra $1,000 a year so others can have "Free" College

why should it be? define free as any policy that subsidizes education surly is not free. somebody is paying. Not to mention there are ways to recieve an education free to you that doesn't involve the government.

This hurts more than it should. I'm considering doing weekends for an Executive MBA because it's now basically expected.

The one off shot I have is that my organization heavily promotes from within because it's large, but also its own niche, so we kind of work differently from other companies and internal hires are really favored.

Easiest solution to this: overturn Griggs vs Duke Power. One single court case is the reason our system is so fucked up. Why? It's an affirmative action case from the late 70's that says that employers can't use general standardized tests to make employment decisions because minorities don't do as well on them. What was the result? Instead of just asking for your SAT score, employers started asking for a college degree. "Hey, only people with high SAT's will get a degree, so it's the same thing." But then everyone starts getting a college degree. "Well, let's ask for a masters then." But then everyone starts getting a masters. "Well, maybe if they got a PhD...." On and on in an endless shitshow, and all because of some bullshit affirmative action decision. Get rid of Griggs, and employers can just hire people based on SAT scores again, and then you can pay for an $80 standardized test instead of a $200,000 diploma and get to the same result. How many trillions have we wasted just to pretend that IQ tests are racist?

(((others)))

Being free isn't the answer to the crippling debt, ending the government backed loan scam is.

College would fall back to affordable prices if nobody had the money for it. The problem is the government thinks that colleges have muh biased against Tray-bobo and Da'quan for being welfare tier poor so it's their job to destroy economic barriers and get these people "opportunity". Universities then know that kids are getting loans no matter what and slowly raise their tuition more and more. Rather than the government thinking "wait they're milking us" they just keep upping the size of the loans creating the vicious cycle.