Why are fighting games the best competitive genre and can they be made more appealing to the masses without dumbing...

Why are fighting games the best competitive genre and can they be made more appealing to the masses without dumbing them down?

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>shiki beating arc

Yes. No.

They can only be made more appealing to the masses by way of hype and showcasing high level play between pros at tournaments. This truth is self evident.

Tell me how the fuck to play without being a massive faggola and what all the lingo means

Fate was a mistake.

There's a lot of sites that explain all the lingo and a lot of video tutorials for every game. Games have also started including tutorials. I didn't try it but I hear XRD's tutorial was pretty good.

None of that is from fate. Unless you mean fate milking killing everything else is bad, which is true.

>Unless you mean fate milking killing everything else is bad
Yes.

>Friend is good at fighters, I'm not
>We both pick up a game at the same time
>He quickly outpaces me and every match is a win for him
>No matter how much I practice I never improve enough to beat him

What's the solution?

git gud

The best competitive games are racing sims and vs puzzle games. If you want fighting game to appeal to the masses get rid of the grand piano inputs. I think MvC has a 4 button system that's like smash but more appealing to normal fighters.

Play more
Ask him for advice and try to apply it

It's gonna take time no matter how you look at it, but if you keep playing and thinking about why you lost and how you could have prevented it and how to improve, you will get better.

VF4 Evo for PS2 had a great, if encyclopedic, training mode. It explains all the tactics with demonstrations and even gives text based descriptions of all the lingo and beyond. It was like a 2-hour crash course on everything you need to know about fighting games, from theory to situations to tactics.

Of course all that stuff just comes naturally to some people as it all just follows standard logic.

Only few games have more than 4 buttons.

If he's good he likely understands the metagame that runs through fighters, and lets him strategize while you're still learning a character. As another user said, have him advise/teach you.

Practice practice practice; as you get better at figher inputs you spend less time thinking about them and are more perceptive to those strategy match-level decisions.

Getting good at fighters takes a LONG time, sorry to say.
If he already knows FG fundamentals, and you don't, he'll naturally be able to apply that to a new fighter and get ahead of you very quickly.

That aside, are you practicing by using training mode and watching videos, or are you just throwing yourself into matches hoping to get better? 'Cause you gotta train "properly" for it to really pay off.

t. thousands of games played in fighters and still just mediocre

>racing sims
Boring, gimme the good shit like pic related or WipeOut

I consider myself pretty decent and I didn't spend that much time in training. Mostly to learn a some combos.

There's no way to make fighting games less complex without removing depth.

SFV is probably the most simple traditional fighter on the market right now removing lots of links, option selects and subsystems but even it demands a level of awareness, reactions, planning and decision making that creates a clear gap between better players and worse players.

If a game has any value it doesn't matter how simple it is. Maybe you can bring more casuals in, but if they give up because they cant even input the moves they weren't gonna stick around to get good no matter how simple it is.

>Getting good at fighters takes a LONG time, sorry to say.
Only true if you're white.

>Let little asian kid play a fighting game
>he's a pro after 2 days

>let little black kid play a fighting game
>he's a pro after a week

>let little hispanic kid play a fighting game
>he's a shitter pro at the end of the first day

Play other people, watch vids about your character, learn proper combos and setups, watch vids of high level players using your vs his character.

It depends on the game as well. And also on what you consider "decent".
I play BlazBlue and training mode is a lot more important there than in, say, Street Fighter V, which is more footsie based IMO.

>be made more appealing to the masses without dumbing them down

They can't. So adjust your budget and marketing and aim for success with smaller communities and sales.

Only Type-Moon I'm familiar with is Kara no Kyoukai, will I be fine with this? The game looks fun and I know that Spooky doesn't shut the hell up about how good it apparantly is

How can you be so shit at Melty Blood

I play melty blood and I am better than 90% of people online.

practice more and play more

>Implying anyone even lays a finger on the Asians

Don't design your game around long combos.

Nothing, and I do mean NOTHING, turns a player off from a fighting game faster than (relatively) long periods of gameplay where their control is snatched away from them. That's frustrating. Especially when they're learning and coming to grips with the game.

It's a fighting game, you don't have to know any character. If you are interested in learning it, have this pastebin

pastebin.com/dLeQLe9x

There's a link to DL the game and most importantly a link to the melty blood discord, which you should join.

If you just want to casually play arcade mode and shit it's probably better to get the steam version since it has english.

Nickname? Also lol that scrub match in Op's video.

Doesn't seems to be true when you watch the current situation
KoF and GG who are "long" combo game are way better than SF5

If you want I can play you right now.

Yeah, all three of 'em.

Legit though, I'm only very slightly familiar with Melty, so I can't make any comments on that, but training mode is an invaluable tool for running through simulations of situations that give you trouble, getting better at combos/discovering new combos, practicing blocking and teching, etc.

Took me about 4 hours one evening just grinding out one particular combo, but now I can do it 99% of the time.
>fucking j.wA-5D-5B
It seems so easy now, but man, I used to hate that input.

>It's a fighting game, you don't have to know any character.
I should've elaborated - I need to like the characters and shit too alongside it actually being fun to play, do I need to be familiar with Tsukihime or whatever the fuck too in order to do that here?

What fi ace combat went full competitive gaming mode?

Whoa hold up, let me-- yup, yeah, the OP asks how to appeal to the masses, not how to appeal specifically to Anonymous Poster 371738767.

What's a good fighting game to start in terms of learning basic tactics and game flow? Like literally first time picking up a fighter. I really like watching the faster 2d anime fighters but playing Mvc3 is so overwhelming. I feel like there may be a better place to start with fundamentals.

>grad order was a mistake

fix

What happened 14 seconds in? Shiki's super is a counter or something?

I played melty for years without ever having read tsukihime, so yeah.

>implying the asians are godlike when they almost always have the advantage of having the game months before the rest of the world does, developing a head start on tech and reactions

they look pretty mortal in games that they dont have an arcade release for

you dont need to know anything about tsukihime, I didn't and I still figured out that Kouma was the baddest motherfucker this side of the train tracks

No and no.

>comes into fighting game thread
>wants to talk about airplanes

>can they be made more appealing to the masses without dumbing them down?
look at SFV
there's your answer

Flashy combo get more people into fighting games than SF
The only people that still play SF are nostalgia fags
the masses rather play KI or MK because the combo are flashy and fucking long than shitty slow as fuck SF5 5hit bnb
I don't know the stats but I'm fairly sure KI have more player than SF5 even when it's blocked on W10

if you've played fighting games before it isn't that hard to pick up a game in comparison to picking up a fighting game for the first time. just learn a game you like and stick to it for a while.

Is melty blood gonna get rereleased anytime soon? I'm dying

You see she "explodes" at 11 seconds. That's the Blood Heat activation. When you are in Blood Heat, if you shield (kind of like a parry on a button) with a perfect timing you get a special super move called "Last Arc". That's her Last Arc, which is one of the strongest in the game because it does so much damage.

>the best competitive genre
>doesn't even a score

It got a Steam release a while back

There's more to life than Street Fighter you know. Stop thinking of it as the bassline.

fighting games are like arena FPS
why would you ever play them if you don't already? you will never be able to compete with the majority of the scene as they have years, if not decades, more practice then you?
hope you are a genetic freak and super gifted at clicking buttons fast?

the only way fighting games will ever become big is if they simplify them a lot, as in no more extensive commands for moves. one dedicated button for one dedicated move.
would play like shit and all the pros would never bother

so in short, can't and won't be done. fighting games will just become more and more niche til they just stop being made.

The steam version is dead becaue the netcode sucks.

If you want to play with other people, use the pirated version and the discord linked in

>can they be made more appealing to the masses without dumbing them down?
Yeah, make the inputs accessible like in SFV
Can't go simpler than that though

*baseline

post your ip, at least if you re EU or US east

I mean even the non-asia asians like Justin/Du

The only time SF4 had been won by someone not from Asia was when the winner was European-Asian

Got it.

Playing King of Fighters XIII with this guide in mind youtu.be/r75Lz1Drp8g really broadened my understanding of fighting game fundamentals. I don't know how much KoF XIV has changed since then though.

Also in general I find just watching fighting game tourneys and trying to read pro's fighting game inputs onscreen really helps you lend some context when you're in a corner/trying to get into a combo etc.

93.151.207.229:46318

>Why are fighting games the best competitive genre
Because who doesn't like a good 1v1 fight? Fighting caters to our primal desires.

> can they be made more appealing to the masses without dumbing them down?
Depends on what you mean by dumbing down. If you keep all the mechanics of SF for example, but change the inputs like quarter-circles and Z to something like Forwardx2 then casuals would have an easier time doing complicated moves and the core gameplay would remain unchanged.

Actually I'm not sure if I was confusing this video with Juicebox's tutorial on footsies, but this is probably more relevant to you anyways: youtu.be/FQQCan5oo90

What a bullshit mechanic! All that work maintaining the lead to have it gimped from a random ass block? Was this in Vanilla? I would punch my friend in the face if he did that to me.

>Take Street Fighter, but make the inputs easier

Man, if only there was a game like that. Fuck you Riot

Holy shit I forgot this existed. What happened to it?

Thanks user

It sucked and was going to die in a month so Riot purchased it.

>can they be made more appealing to the masses without dumbing them down?
Nope, because that would require the game to fall outside of the FGC's strict and arbitrary definition of a "real fighting game" and still be recognized by the community

>random ass block

And did what with it?

all the scrubs just found something else to whine about like being unable to deal with basic bitch fireball/uppercut gameplay and dropped the game anyway

When are they gonna learn that catering to casuals does nothing but bad?

It's a perfect block not a random ass one

the things that make fighting games competitive are the things that keep it from ever being appealing to "the masses"
the only way to sell fighting games to casual players (like me) is to have a decent single player component

And yet fighting games are bigger now than they've ever been? They'll never be the premiere """"e-sport"""", but it seems like they'll always have a healthy playerbase.

>sf4
A game with a lot of japan-exclusive arcade time, as I said.

I'm not saying asians are bad, just that they're about as skilled as everyone else when put on an equal playing field. Justin and Du are good, but you have players like ricki, kbrad, punk, smug who are on the same level if not higher than Justin and only a little behind Du.

They'll never be popular. MOBAs are better.

People can just button mash until they find something that works.

actually not a bad way to start

once they find something, they can learn to master it, and it goes from there

the problem is dedication

Bitch, I know how to Just Guard. You spam that shit until you get a rhythm. In actually good games, those are designed to build momentum, not unjustly turnbout a match. Might as well have X-factor and meterless ToD.

git gud scrub
It's a parry that you can use if the opponent is retarded and still keeps going ham even though you can do it. The mechanic is there to keep an ounce of thought in your play.

>tfw wanna get good at fighters
>but then realise I'd have to spend thousands of hours just to get good enough
I already did that with ASSFAGGOTS I don't want to spend another year just for fightans.

You still have to let your opponent enter blood heat freely and play like a fucking retard and get ex shield for him to last arc you
If you ever get a last arc fuck you up, you earned it.

This is why you stick to co-op and single player shit. You need to not have a life to git gud at competitive games.

This is correct and.


This is the only way to attract more people. But even here it's so difficult for a casual to grasp so much of what is happening without a good idea of the game itself and the skill barriers to doing certain things.

How do you spam Last Arc when, ignoring the "just guard" button's cooldown since that's what you seem to be doing here, it requires an activation mode to even go into like that user said it did?

ggs

sorry but I gotta stop now, I have some things to do

i played tsukihime and i don't remember shiki with boobs, what gives?

gg

>more appealing to the masses

what the fuck are you talking about
in terms of competitive genres, sure, the entry floor is kind of high for most people, but in terms of a spectator sport it's probably one of the more popular ones

iktf bro

>spend years gitting gud at FPS
>don't want to go through all that shit again with fighting games
>just watch streams of fighting game tournaments

It'0s not a just guard and you can't do it when blocking, it's a parry on a button that has a whiff animation that's punishable with a counterhit combo.

>tfw can't get any of my friends to play anything that isn't SFV
Playing random guys from discords just isn't the same.

Several fighters are pick up and play friendly. Try Sf5. A lot of people rag on it becaue it dumbed everything down but for a beginner you'll probably like it since you have zero exposure otherwise

This Shiki isn't from Tsukihime.

People think they were planning on reskinning the game essentially with League characters, but the game got cancelled

>requires meter to go into a timed state and then a perfect parry (not "just guard" like in Garou, more like the parry button that Last Blade complete with whiff animation and so on) within that time period to even do
>"random ass block"
The fuck? Do you want MvC3 Phoenix Wright's evidence collection in there as a further requirement on top of all that or something?

ah that was pretty obvious, how dumb of me

>requires meter to go into a timed state
Which also requires a different timed state reached by hitting 300% meter.

The game was always a prototype to get interest from investors. The got bought by Riot and cancelled it.

Supposedly Riot wanted to use them for a Riot themed fighting game, but nothing has been said since except rumors.

>my opponent fucks up
>I have to do a bit of work to get off good damage
>I fuck up
>my opponent presses a button and I lose half life

U focking serial m8?

Do you also complain that supers are easier to do than a full meterless combo and still do more damage? Retard.