Which style of 3D Sonic do you prefer? The Sonic/Tails/Shadow levels of Adventure/Adventure 2, or the Boost levels?

Which style of 3D Sonic do you prefer? The Sonic/Tails/Shadow levels of Adventure/Adventure 2, or the Boost levels?

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The speed levels in Adventure/Adventure 2 were in my opinion better in basic game design terms simply because of higher freedom of movement, more unique stage gimmicks and so on. However the Boost levels have a much higher level of polish, much fewer glitches, a clearly bigger budget, and the camera doesn't shit the bed 4 or 5 times per level like the Adventure formula.

I'd give a slight edge to the speed levels of the Adventures but in an ideal world we'd get the best of both - the gameplay style of the Adventures but with the polish and budget of Unleashed/Generations and without any of the 2.5D sections they keep shoehorning into newer titles. It'll never happen but a man can dream.

The Knuckles levels of SA2 with the radar from SA. I could play a whole game like that, honestly. Maybe a game like Ape Escape or something.

>tfw another user has the same dream

one day we will get the ideal game

I prefer sonic 06. Redditors hate it but they fail to see that the glitches are the only problem in the game. The core gameplay is solid.

>The core gameplay is solid
>Every character in that game runs and moves at half the speed they should.
>No way for Sonic to do a spindash while moving or for him to jump out of it
>NONE of Knuckles or Amy's attacks ever connect

Anything even remotely good about the Adventure games was made worse in 06.

Sonic 06 is broken on many more levels than merely glitches
>The movement needs a significant amount of tuning to counteract how splashy the controls are
>Homing attack needs gravity rather than just moving in a lateral straight line
>The entirety of the story (Outside of Shadow) is SHIT
>Character models are fucked
>Terrible hub world side quests
>Animations are stiff and fail to show emotion
>Level design feels very out of place for a sonic game (I have the same complaint for Unleashed)
>Silver's gameplay isn't fun at all
Shall I go on?

Welp! You pretty much said everything I was going to say.

Except I like the 2.5D segments. Still, I wouldn't want those in an Adventure style game.

Adventure Style levels WITH Boost levels in-between segments

You wanna know why Adventure 2 was so memorable?

Chao's

This is because chao garden forced you to go back and replay almost each level a billion times, which means you eventually memorized everything; music, level design, enemy location, controls, and so on. Sonic games are meant for the player to come back to it's levels a bunch in order for the player to get better and complete them faster. The only problem was up until these games there was no reason to do so. That is why chao garden was there.

I never even touched the chao garden and I enjoy both Adventure games more than Boostshit

>those arms

Unleashed was perfect. It had the speed, the hub levels, a little battling action, and a fun little story with a mildly entertaining sidekick.

>Adventure Style levels WITH Boost levels in-between segments
Adventure style levels with boost as a temporary power-up or item

Just go to Neogaf, they have, they have the all the things that, make the things that make the happiness smile. Go now to the, thing. Happy times await at Neogaf. No hu-hurt feelings, no Drumpf, just happily sitting in a circle, jerking eachother off, trying to ignore the man walking around us with a shotgun. Don't worry if you don't come first, don't don't worry is you come second. Don't come last, Jimmy. Just, just dont, come last Jimmy. Come last Jimmy, please, I don't wanna die, Jimmy.

Stop getting your game critiques off of Youtubers, I didn't care for the Chao but I still like Adventure 2.

Rouge

Imagine trying to Boost through Final Rush or Crazy Gadget
Its better if they design both segments by themselves

List of things SA2 was memorable for:
>Quotable dialogue
>Great soundtrack
>(Arguably) Best Sonic controls in the franchise
>Entertaining plot
>Multiple secrets and missions in each stage
>Fantastic multiplayer options
>Chao garden
Hmmmm.... Really.... Makes.... You.... Think...

>>Quotable dialogue
>>Great soundtrack
>>(Arguably) Best Sonic controls in the franchise
>>Entertaining plot
>>Multiple secrets and missions in each stage
>>Fantastic multiplayer options
>>Chao garden
>THE MOTHERFUCKING BIOLIZARD
fixed

I remember it for the bat tits

Rouge is entry level, fuck off

Sonic's levels from Adventure with more paths, but polished like was Unleashed or Generations. Add parkour abilities for Sonic, get the spindash back like it was in Adventure 1, allow Knuckles to climb walls, Tails flying, add Shadow and/or Blaze as extra unlockable characters and it is enough.

Still, boost games can be fun, but only Unleashed had the right idea of the sense of speed. You start fast sure, but as you level up your speed things get more insane and Generations kinda lost that feel. But Generations at least got more paths within levels, like Seaside Hill that has many of them. The 2.5 platforming sections are just not good, that needs to disappear

>sonic and his crew travels the entire planet
>then they run out of planet and go into space
>sonic and shadow go super sayan in space to fight a lizard sending the moon into earth

Just has a good tone to it, sounds epic, instead of "haha eggman is doing his antics again"

I still think Adventure had the superior plot
NOTHING can top Chaos as a villain

I had a much better times with the boost games despite the more restrictive movement and simpler mechanics.

I don't know anymore at this point, they both have their positives and negatives, I just know Generations was fun as fuck and if Forces can recreate that fun then I'm happy.

Adventure was still very good. I also prefer Adventure 2, but I'm probably biased because I really like Shadow.

Hell, I'll even argue that Riders and Heroes had decent plots.

06 was almost okay at the very base level. Getting rid of Elise definitely would have helped.

Unleashed felt... cliché, I guess...? Like, "we've done ancient evil before, how can we top that?" "Let's make ANOTHER ancient evil, and have Eggman awaken it AGAIN, except this time it's in the core of the planet and the emeralds are inert! Also, the ancient evil has no character or build-up to it."

>06 was almost okay at the very base level. Getting rid of Elise definitely would have helped.
Want to know how to make 06 more tolerable?
Make EVERY SINGLE NPC as Unleashed depicted its humans, and turn Elise into a hedgehog

>chaos
>super easy to kill before it goes ultimate
>low stakes, it already flooded the city, sonic already lost the battle
>fight is alrighr, with super sonic dodging lasers and smashing it from the inside
>world is still decimated after sonic wins

>biofuckinglizard
>outta nowhere
>ultimate lifeform showdown
>shadow has to dodge projectiles, home attack spheres and grind its rail
>turns ultimate and wants to crash the moon into earth
>stakes are high, shadow and sonic go super saiyan
>biofuckinglizard shoots lasers amd projectiles, being effective at keeping the saiyans away
>at the end the world is saved and shadow fucking dies
>they all remember shadow

I dont know man, chaos was meh

>We could've had this
>But instead we had resources and budget devoted to completely alternate game mechanics

>Unleashed humans
Ew no. Adventure humans were fine.
>turn Elise into a hedgehog
I'd go with something other than a hedgehog, but that could work if you took out all the pseudo romance shit

>Ew no. Adventure humans were fine.
Unleashed humans fucking nailed what humans should look like in Mobius/Sonic's World

Chaos had the superior design and motives
Also THUNDAH

>low stakes, it already flooded the city, sonic already lost the battle
>world is still decimated after sonic wins

These two things bothered me the most about SA1's plot. Everyone's fucking dead. Even after Chaos and Tikal go up into the sky, the city is still fucking flooded. At least have Chaos use his remaining magic/power to fix the city or something.

Unleashed was like a bad DreamWorks or Disney movie. I'd rather not have Wreck-It Ralph looking characters in Sonic games.

In what way is the core gameplay solid?

It does look cooler but it barely raises any stakes, like sonic fails to stop its evolution or it from destroying shit

Maybe that just signals how strong it is, but in unleashed you fix the world after it's torn apart and in adventure 2 you save the world from getting crushed, it just feels like you're actually working for something

I'd rather not have realistic humans that clash with the sonic character designs

But in Adventure you're trying to PREVENT it from becoming Perfect, because its working up to becoming something bigger

Sonic's an anthropomorphic animal, he's going to look slightly out of place next to humans no matter what.

>Adventure humans were fine.
>Fucking everyone looks heavily detailed and realistic as shit
>And then there's just Eggman and the rest of the Sanic cast
>Nobody bats an eye

Much better than realistic humans. They fit the world much better.
Hell, Eggman is a funky proportioned cartoony human already.

Too bad the second half of the boss fight is shit.

thats the only time when the Biolizard fight is better

these anons speak the truth
Unleashed had the best World-Building and NPCS

>Get a Gameshark
>Mod Knuckles, Rouge, mechless Tails, and Egg-o-maticless Robotnik into Sonic and Shadow's levels
>Outside of horizontal bars, the characters can almost flawlessly traverse the stages just fine in their own unique ways

This is what the game should have fucking been. But every time Sega has allowed you to play as more than one character in the same level, they edit the fuck out of the level to the point where you're not even playing the same stage any more. This is especially awful for shit like Knuckles, who has INCREDIBLE gameplay, but they fucking lock him into little arenas searching for his ehmmerolds instead of running at high speeds and punching shit that's in his way.

Honestly, Robotnik in City Escape, Knuckles in Radical Highway, and Knuckles in Pyramid Cave are more fun than playing them as Sonic or Shadow.

I fucking hate the Unleashed/Colors boost to win shit because a GOOD player would be able to move that smoothly/effortlessly in Sonic Adventure 2 with Sonic or Shadow if they spend a little time. That's why Adventure 2 is always so fun to come back to even despite its shit camera, because you fucking EARN your free-flowing experience instead of just holding down the X button.

And jazz

Reminder that Ice-Cream man is a canon pimp

>Robotnik in City Escape
youtube.com/watch?v=HIJCqSQ_j4Y

>See Sonic Unleashed for the Wii in the bargain in for $5
>"How bad could it be?"
>Start the game
>All cutscenes are condensed 480p .fmvs of the fucking in-game scenes from the 360/PS3 version
>They fucking redid almost all of the NPC voice acting and replaced them all with the same two voice actors, only Professor Pickle and his assistance kept their voices
>Then the actual game starts
>Perspective is permanently squished vertically, can't be changed
>Levels are just fucking giant, barren wastelands just so Sonic can drift and shit without hitting...everything
>Occasionally you might see two enemies together

>This is especially awful for shit like Knuckles, who has INCREDIBLE gameplay

That always annoyed me. Knuckles felt way too good in Adventure 2. And also had speed, yet he is locked in hunting stages when he could completely work out in the speed levels

>Honestly, Robotnik in City Escape,

That was hilarious. I mean, Sega teased us back in 2001 with every single character, including TAILS WALKING AND FLYING, in the damn chao world. Who the fuck didn't run around with Eggman in that goofy way in the chao world? Or play around with Tails?

>That's why Adventure 2 is always so fun to come back to even despite its shit camera, because you fucking EARN your free-flowing experience instead of just holding down the X button.
True. But Sonic's input for the same button with bouncing, light speed dash, etc wasn't funny. Fucking getting As on Hard mode missions with Sonic with bottomless pits with rings for light speed dash and Sonic would bounce into death

In all honesty, Sonic Adventure/Advance 2 might be where the series peaked and probably could've simply ended imo. The Adventure and Advance games were great continuations of the original series. Sonic Heroes and Sonic Advance 3 were okay but unnecessary.

90% of the games released after those games were absolutely shit, with Sonic '06 being the worst of all.

when was the last time you looked at Eggman?
like REALLY looked at him

>mfw I saw how he got under the bar

>Knuckles felt way too good in Adventure 2.
FUCKING THIS RIGHT HERE
Nerf his glide and I'd play an entire 3D platformer with the SA2 Knuckles/Rouge control

Time attack day time levels. That's PS2/Wii version.
Daytime Eggmanland is fun though and had robots in there(like Holoska did), but most of the day time stages seemed unfinished and probably were. That version came out way too late for a PS2 version and releasing for both wii and ps2 meant severe downgrade

The Sonic adventure games were painfully mediocre though.

Is this faggot actually claiming Sonic Advance 2 was great and Sonic Advance 3 was unnecessary??

>the speed
Executed in the worst way for a platformer.

>the hub levels
Executed poorly given Sonic's movement at slow speeds.

>a little battling action
There was much more than "a little", and it was straight up bad.

>a fun little story
Meaningless if most everything else about the game is subpar.

>with a mildly entertaining sidekick
That's just false.

Game had top notch production values, though, I'll give it that.

>a mildly entertaining sidekick
Chip is a borderline Mary-Sue

Sonic sells a lot, so it could never end.

>Heroes
What was unnecessary was playing 4 times the same levels to get into the true ending.
The grind level mountain level was a mistake when the gameplay wasn't polished enough especially when grinding and changing rails didn't work right.
Some missions of the Chaotix were mistake, like those when you need to destroy 80 robots(or whatever number it was) but in 80 in all level, instead of like half of it to not make it a pain.

Knuckles felt better than Rouge though. but talking about their abilites, even swimming felt good

Where he has blue arms.

After Advance 2's level design shit the bed, Advance 3's level design shitting the bed further was indeed unnecessary.

Not same user, but would say the same. Advance 3 is so bland that I only remember Toy Kingdom stage and how I hated that Ocean Base that is way worse than Metropolis
Advance 2 had fun stages like Hot Crater, Ice Paradise, Techno Base and the memorable Music Plant. Leaf Forest was a good first stage.

Cyber Track was cooler than Techno Base.
And how could you fucking forget Chaos Angel?
The level designs were shit but the level themes were great.

Ok, I will give those 2. But sometimes I want to forget that Chaos Angel existed, because as a level design they are bad, especially act 2 and 3, but the music of act 1 is one of the best of the series.

>Mobius
Comicfags need to leave

This minus Silver. He wasn't fun and some of the Shadow levels with vehicles sucked too but the core Sonic gameplay was great.

"Mobius" has become such a commonly accepted name in the western fandom dating back to the very first game that it may as well be canon. Like "Strangereal" for Ace Combat. It doesn't mean the comic world specifically.

It's still wrong and he should still feel bad.

Another Plus.

I guess I just don't understand the Adventure hate I really liked almost all aspects of that game, especially the presentation with music, graphics and story. It was over the top and didn't take it self seriously, kind of like a B-movie. It wasn't stupid in the wrong way like Chip it was stupid in the right way like Sonic and Shadows last "what you see is what you get" moment. Stuff like Maria's death, the Egg-Grandpa firing squad, or blowing up the moon were the perfect levels of insanity.
The boost games suffered this ending up with a much simpler presentation and the gameplay bored me as well.

This one

fpbp

reading comprehension

>Unleashed
>Mobius
>In the same sentence ever
I comprehended it just fine. Just saying "Sonic's World" would have sufficed

reboot took notes from Unleashed's world building dumbfuck

What are you even talking about comicfag

Go to Sup Forums

Surely there has to be some way to get a good mix of Adventure and Unleashed-style NPCs, yeah? Like, cartoon faces and stuff are fine, but the least they could do is have some more realistic proportions to the characters.

I unironically like the commander and the president from Shadow the Hedgehog.

>sonic adventure gameplay is just holding forward and jumping over shit
>sonic generations is just holding x and jumping over shit

why do people think these are different when sonic adventure is just generations with worse handling that'll send you flying into pits if you dare to run at ramps at a slight angle

SA2 was the best blend of game variety without getting caught up so hard in gimmicks like the later ones did. Over 15 years and it's still my favorite, but fuck the go karting

>One has semblance of actual platforming
>The other is a car racer with "platforming"

adventure constantly places boosters that jack you up to max speed and takes away character control so you dont kill yourself. have you actually played these games?

to what degree does adventure have any additional "platforming" that generations doesn't have? How stupid do you have to be to not realize that holding up through speed boosters is the same thing as hitting x to boost?

>How stupid do you have to be to not realize that holding up through speed boosters is the same thing as hitting x to boost?

actually, fuck, it's even worse, because at least you have control over when you boost and can run out. In adventure you go fast during certain stretches of the level no matter what because you will literally die if you don't go fast when sega wants you to.

>adventure constantly places boosters that jack you up to max speed
Spindashing is the max speed you dumbass, did you even play the game?

i have played the games and not once do they require you to spindash. The game DOES require you to hit max running speed at many points, which is why there are boosters placed everywhere to automatically bring sonic up to that speed (which is entirely out of the players control and is automated)

I'm not sure if you've actually played these games quite honestly, or maybe you played them as a child and are defending them without remembering how the levels are set up. Any situation where you'd think you'd need to spindash (to go up a ramp or slope) there are convenient boosters placed so that sonic can just go at max running speed instead of ever needing to spindash. Look at the forest level in SA2, which has many ramps like that.

The difference between Adventure and Boost gameplay is partially in level design - one need only look at areas like Red Mountain, the At-Dawn section of Speed Highway, or Twinkle Park, in order to see what I mean. Sonic Adventure introduced the "corridor" gameplay but it wasn't for every level and it wasn't as much of a strict corridor, with more meaningful variations and small "open" areas. Adventure 2 is much closer to the boost gameplay though and has much more linearity and "corridor-in-the-sky" syndrome, which was then compounded from Heroes onwards and became the Sonic formula as we know it today, which has persisted into the boost formula - although in Generations it seemed like Sonic Team had become aware of the corridor problem and tried opening things back up again in stages like Seaside Hill and City Escape.

However, the ACTUAL core gameplay difference between Adventure and Boost is the difference in handling and turn circles. Adventure handles well at low speeds but terribly at high speeds, with a loose turn circle that sends you veering off at a slight touch of the stick. Boost handles like a shitty tank with bad turning at low speeds but far smoother at high speeds. This means that despite sharing many core gameplay and design fundamentals, Adventure excels better in platforming and Boost excels better in speed, despite the actual ratios and pacing of said sections not being very far apart. Ideally, Sonic would have a varying turn circle based on his current speed and acceleration, so that he could handle like Adventure at low speeds and Boost at high speeds.

The separation of Adventure and Boost is some bullshit that the fanbase has done because it wants to separate itself further (because Sonic fans are masochists I guess). The true 3D Sonic redpill is realizing that they're two sides of the same coin and that the ideal path lies somewhere in the middle

>one need only look at areas like Red Mountain, the At-Dawn section of Speed Highway, or Twinkle Park
Nice job bringing up the only three examples that weren't linear corridors.

>Adventure handles well at low speeds but terribly at high speeds, with a loose turn circle that sends you veering off at a slight touch of the stick
Literally get good. Precise controls are never a bad thing.

>one need only look at areas like Red Mountain, the At-Dawn section of Speed Highway, or Twinkle Park, in order to see what I mean. Sonic Adventure introduced the "corridor" gameplay but it wasn't for every level and it wasn't as much of a strict corridor, with more meaningful variations and small "open" areas.

not only are those basically the only areas that are open like that, they're all awful; They're just wide flatness that don't utilize sonic's speed in any way nor do they have platform setups that work better than those provided by linear level design.

Sonic is an inherently linear character because he's based around momentum, which accumulates based on linear forward locomotion. It triggers me deeply when people suggest he belongs on anything other than linear race tracks/obstacle courses.

>boosters
I just skip those sections when I can. There are levels I can't, like Windy Valley that is a literally corridor level.

Going back with what I said, that's what I do with the spindash. I spindash some places to ignore boosters(like sections in Sky Deck), or to shortcut places(like Red Mountain).
Spindash is the most useful shit in Adventure 1, like it was in the classics since 2.
Sometimes you can spindash and jump very afar and skip shit, that was the best part of Adventure 1 for me, finding new ways of finding paths or shorcuts in certain levels.

SA2's soundtrack is pretty low tier for the series.
Prove me wrong.

Ice Cap, Sky Deck, parts of Lost World (snake room etc), Final Egg all had areas that were more linear than the examples I mentioned but certainly don't fall into the Speed Highway style "corridor in the sky" category.

Besides which, the point I was making is that the level design isn't really the problem - it's the turn circle thing.

I did git gud, but that doesn't change the fact that being able to a near 90 degree turn on a dime at full speed is not only stupid and finicky at first, but goes completely counter to everything Sonic has ever stood for.

>goes completely counter to everything Sonic has ever stood for
Please explain how

I completely agree with this

Talking about Heroes, is that ST actually gave alternative paths in some levels. Grand Metropolis was pretty notorious with that and worked well, but somehow they fucked up in some other levels
In fact, one of the bigger problems with Adventure 1 and Heroes gameplay were not polished enough, while Adventure 2 was and the boost era is even with the "tank" Sonic without boosting.

I want a comfy game that plays like Sonic Jam's hub world desu.

no, but its unanimously agreed that 06 has the best soundtrack

ahahah what?
06's soundtrack is great but 2, 3 and Unleashed have it all beat.

Not the same user, but there is basically no way to change trajectory on a dime in classic 2D sonic. You move in a direction, and you will keep moving in that direction until sonic loses the inertia that hes obtained either through braking or getting launched off of a stage object like a spring.

If you think momentum is a big part of the sonic series' mechanical identity (and it was, on the genesis), then yeah, having sonic be able to change direction immediately goes against that.

Adventure and Adventure 2 were literally my childhood