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Why can't indie developers understand how to make a proper character design?

Is that supposed to be a satyr

Because they don't hire actual concept artist.

Why do they have to always make them look like they were born deformed? The guys already a fucking satyr for crying out loud!

Yeah because overwatch is so much better right

The issue isn't that the character is poorly designed in terms of presentation, it's the fact that it's poorly designed in terms of presentation and mechanics.

Why does this goat fucker have the same moves as Fox? Why does the orc chick have the same moves as Ganondorf? Why does the samurai chick have the same moves as Marth?

If you're going to create an indie smash game to set yourself apart from a successful mod that you made, why go through the trouble of calling back to the thing that you're trying to distance yourself from?

Fuck me, P:M almost died for this.

assblasted Project M dev detected

Overwatch is a bad game, but their character designs are actually good.

Not an argument

because they're talentless losers who went to full sail instead of getting an actual education
inb4
>art
>actual education
it is, you just can't get a white collar career out of it.

This, with some obvious exceptions.

>Overwatch is a bad game
Fuck...
Off...

Well, yes?

Westerners are literally triggered by appealing design and think ugly shit is endearing

Make...
Me...

Seriously, who types like this?

>he didn't deny it

Anyone who's not an assblasted contrarian permavirgin like you...

Design Class 101

This is Sonic the Hedgehog

He's a hedgehog with an attitude. A majority of his poses has him in some action stance or 2cool4u pose. His main attack ability is rolling into a ball and destroying things with his spines, similar to an actual hedgehog, but not as deadly obvious. His silhouette is unique and very distinct. You can tell it's Sonic the Hedgehog almost immediately even if the only thing presented to you was a silhouette.

This is Kidd, the Space Goat

He's a goat in space. He's supposedly a bounty hunter, but you wouldn't be able to tell unless you looked up his bio. He's apparently based on the "space animal archetype that's become an iconic part of the genre", which loosely translates to "We want to rip off Fox McCloud". His silhouette isn't that much of a stand out. You can make out the goat features of horns and ears, but that's about it. This guy could pass off as an NPC in a Ratchet and Clank game or Wildstar. He has no decent poses or outfit that really bring out the whole bounty hunter characteristics in him. Prsent the silhouette with this basic pose and no one will be able to tell who the fuck this guy is from a line up.

Do you want to know whats sad about this character?

>completely unwarranted comparisons to Overwatch
Try googling a game before you post in a thread about it

>Do you want to know whats sad about this character?
The fact that he's not only a ripoff of Fox in design, but also a ripoff in terms of moveset as well?

Outside of him just being entirely unappealing, what is sad about him?

His concept art was actually pretty decent. He still had his goat features, but they were exaggerated to the point that they were unique to him. There's another piece that has more detailed facial features and attire that helped establish his job as a hunter. For some reason, they scrapped the concept and went with a more dumbed down version of him.

Even paladins tops this garbage.
Hell, i like some battleborn models way more than this bullcrap

It's always funny seeing meleefags who think they can make a better game than Sakurai get BTFO.

They're trying to force a "legacy" of character archetypes in platform fighters, just like how traditional fighters have shotos, charge characters, and grapplers. Melee is meant to be analogous to SF2.

It's stupid, but that's what they're doing.

Here's the other piece

One thing to note is the rocket pack he has in these two pieces and the dash pose presented in the first concept art. In that concept, he's clearly using his horns, a design feature of the character, as an actual weapon in his arsenal list. They could have taken this concept and expanded on it. Instead, they made a lame as fuck 1:1 Fox McCloud clone instead of taking what they had and running with it.

Wow, you really got him...

they literally hired a professional that worked at riot games for years

spacies is the most retarded smash thing ever
imagine if this was a fighting game term?

>this function has to be a fucking furry

>Riot Games
Well that explains the terrible designs.

Oh boy.
And i thought Bethesda was the champ in the "good concept, shit execution".
They outlied the liars.

You talking shit about yordles?

Really? I like a lot of their stuff. This is one of the splash arts that guy made by the way.

>Meleefags

They're clearly not listening to the concept artist they hired and paid for then

>fighting games
>shoto: has certain moves
>zoner: has certain rmoves
>grappler: has certain moves

>smash
>spacies: has to be a furry

Head B looks pretty good, I wonder why they didn't used that.

Nope, that's a goat. Three guesses as to whom it's referencing

I like A's face and ears with B's horns

The thing is, that shit doesn't work when you're basing your legacy archtypes off of content that doesn't even belong to you.

Even then, comparing a grappler like Zangief against a grappler like Abel is like comparing night and day in terms of how they play while this goat fucker is practically a 1:1 copy of Fox based solely on what little gameplay we saw of him so far, right down to having the same animations.

Nigga you blind.
Apart from those two lovebirds, since Braum lol had some of the best designed characters in vydia.
Hell, they have more personality than most of aaa game protagonists

>asking why the developers of a literal Smash Bros ripoff doesn't have good designs.

>fighting games
>these character archetypes have to have these moves, but lets give them a spin or change properties to make them play completely different/more defensive or aggressive from the base archetype

>smash
>LET'S JUST FUCKING RIP OFF ALL OF FOX'S MOVE LIST

>basing your legacy archtypes off of content that doesn't even belong to you.
Every 2D fighter has those archetypes, though. Not just the ones owned by Capcom.

You're absolutely right about him being a 1:1 copy, though. That's taking it too far.

Looks exact same to me as any other furry design.
I guess it's only okay when Nintendo does it?

Hey man, the changes that P:M made to the Brawl roster (plus Mewtwo and Roy) were fucking phenomenal.

I just don't understand why exactly they shat the bed so hard here, did all the talent stage a mass revolt in response to them shutting down P:M?

...

I don't see a huge problem with this. What's the issue?

>Dreamworks face

woah...such a burn...
only on...the PS4...damn...

Making something from zero is very different than creating something from scratch man, even if P:M was a good mod (which I can't tell since I never played it) the characters and movesets were already there.

I dunno about Roy or Mewtwo in the game but the thing is that those are characters who were designed already in a previous game and share most of their moveset with other character.

>Making something from zero is very different than creating something from scratch man
They didn't though, most of the characters we've seen straight up steal moves from smash bros. characters.

guess they just didn't pay the guy enough

Sorry meant to say that making something from zero is different from tweaking an already existing product. Was just having a retarded moment there. Agree totally with you.

I actually kinda like the goat guy they have now, but this still looks so much better

>Implying anyone will be playing smash without the characters.
Just look at Rivals of Aether and Brawhalla, non-existent scenes.

That's because those both those games fucking suck because of some dumb as fuck decisions.

Rivals doesn't have fucking grabs and Brawlhalla is completely weapon based.

Brawlhalla sucks for a lot of reasons, but Rivals is a great game that changes the Smash formula plenty. But because it's too different it's bad? Clearly the only thing that will make Smashfags happy is exactly what they already have

Is Wayforward not indie?

Is that Knockwurst?

yep

because DUDE, MELEE REFRENCES LMAO!!!!
It's fine for a sequel/sipritual successor to have references to the competitive aspect of the previous game, or whatever, but when it's the entire game, it's fucked!
All the characters we currently have seen are literally FUNCTIONS. Not one of them has been unique as of now.

Rivals has like 8 fucking characters and an barely functioning online mode that would have greatly help it establish a niche community.

No? They get consistent deals from big publishers to shit out games based on properties. They're hardly indie.

Shantae is also a terrible example as it started out as a Capcom published game. Her roots hardly put her int he indie realm.

The fact he looks like a satyr and not a plain goat or ram or whatever really works against the design. you see that face and your brain goes "this is a fantasy character", and it clashes with the rest of the look.

Like I see this guy and feel like he'd fit in as a WoW character.

fox, they just used the frames of the other characters and made these skins and pawned it off as Icons.

>Why can't indie developers understand how to make a proper character design?
because they tend to be social justice warrior hacks and/or work on the cheap and just farm out DeviantArt artists

Rivals successfully grew their competitive scene by latching on to Smash and using their infrastructure. Now, every Smash major has a Rivals side event, and those are considered by the Rivals scene to be their "majors".

I honestly think he looks great in concept art but the execution kinda sucks.

Why the fuck would you need grabs in a game without shields?

That character design is badass!

should've just gave him a full on animal goat head instead of that generic furry shit if you're going to give him that generic armor

he looks like shit in the concept art
The designs are very bag
It looks like a generic moba or something
there's no style to any of these characters, because they took no risks for them

Wasn't really an example, was just asking. I guess she just gets that label because the first game sold less than Code Name Fucking Steam and because the series never really had any marketing outside of Nintendo Power a few years before that went under.

>No L-cancling
>No wobbling
>3 frame buffer
>can grab ledge behind you
>NOT!Fox shine is not frame 1 and doesnt semi-spike

Fucking dropped. Would maybe try out if they didnt cater to tr4shfags with shit like buffering and no L-cancling.

>Let's attract Smash fans by replacing their favorite characters with terrible reskins
What the fuck were they thinking? If people wanted to play Fox, they wouldn't to play as a wavedashing goatman. Either make something unique or leave the source material alone. It screams bad imitation.

>C head, E body
10/10 combo. Angry goat wastelander with a gun would've been great. An average Starbucks employee with pasted on horns is not.

L-Cancelling is a shit mechanic.
>Casual bloo blooo
Yeah no, I play other, much better fighting games. L-Cancelling is fucking stupid and does nothing to add to the game outside of an arbitrary execution requirement.

That he was created not to simply be himself, but as a poor substitute for another character

Fox's smaller frame and the nimble skittishness of his combat style makes sense to me because he's a fox

Im shit at conveying my thoughts on this, but taking that moveset and literally slapping it onto a goat doesnt work out for me. I feel like a goat-fighter should be bruiser that brute-force rams the fuck out of you with his horns, complete with a bulkier frame

So you're playing a warp-spawned chaos beastman in whatever this game is? Day 1 buy, where all the sisters of battle at

Lightshielding and tilting your shield can be used to force missed L-cancles

L-cancling also adds a huge amount of skills required and add an infinite skill ceiling to melee that tr4sh doesnt have.

Id argue its the complete opposite

What makes an execution mechanic arbitrary or not?

His a goat because of shitty homage to BASED mang0 the KID. You know, the Kidd the GOAT.

An arbitrary execution requirement that keeps Fox and Falco from absolutely dominating the competitive scene, because they're incredibly hard to play without messing up.

If it's just something that's often done without much downside. I don't really like rapid/roman cancels and the like but there's an element to risk/reward with them because you have to spend resources in order to use them. Basically the shit is arbitrary if there's no decision making in involved and you just do them.

>all the characters are brown women

WEEEEW LAD

> People shit on Icons for reusing moves from Brawl/Project M
> The same people praise Rivals of Aether for its originality and effort, a game with blatant copies of moves from the very same game

You dont like them because you are a casual scrub, take it like a man. High skill ceiling with loads of inputs are needed for hype esports games since pros can make the impossible possible. Melee is literally a physical sport because of the required inputs it has.

Blame modern 3d sculpture designers. Most of those designers are into this shit

Someone will fall for this bait.

The shit that's different is pretty cool, but I won't excuse that Zetterburn is 99% Wolf.

>He bested me in an argument
>b-better call bait!

kys fag.

I want to point out something on this subject. Whenever a game has a bunch of generic white dudes, they're all diverse with entertaining personalities, strange quirks, bland yet interesting designs, and often leave a good impression of their game. However, when a game features mostly colored folks, be it African, Brazilian, or Latino, they're always coated in cluttered designs, have really obnoxious personalities, and generally don't leave a lasting impression. Why is this? What makes generic bald space marine macho white men so much easier to design around? Why are bimbos and anime girls the easiest to design around for female characters? I'm not saying there aren't good designs mixed among the bad ones, but how is there such an overwhelming difference in quality when it's LITERALLY just a difference in color? Why do they have to rely on convoluted backstories and pandering to minorities and ethnicities to attempt a unique design? How can people fuck up that badly?

They think copying the look of AAA games somehow makes it easier for them to get sales when it does the exact opposite. Steam library is filled with games that look like this, people will browse 100-200 games in few seconds and their eye will never catch this one and stop to take a look.

I don't understand how they managed to make the most generic mobile game/chinese knockoff looking characters possible.

Its just you who are racially biased

Jelly of that BBC?

And then you have the characters who are just mashups of established characters, like Absa (Zelda + Mewtwo) and Wrastor (Marth + Meta Knight)