Weapon durability

Ayden Morgan
Ayden Morgan

Zelda durability
Weapons degrade fast
Enemies give you weapons that scale based on your progression even faster than they break
Enemies come out of the ground at night and deliver them to you just in case you were too lazy to hunt down a camp during the day
Shrines shower you with OP elemental weapons on top of this
Always have a million decent-good weapons on deck when one breaks
System is pointless

Souls durability
Weapons degrade very slowly
Repairing them is so cheap it may as well not even be a thing
System is pointless

Name one game that implements durability in a way that isn't a pointless, minor annoyance.

Dylan Hill
Dylan Hill

Fallout
Oblivion

Wyatt Miller
Wyatt Miller

This. But I'd rather BotW have no durability issues.

Kayden Rodriguez
Kayden Rodriguez

Name one game that implements durability in a way that isn't a pointless, minor annoyance.
there isn't,this is just some thing called "realism" that doesn't belong into video games,because they are supposed to be fun and not a real life simulation

Daniel Perez
Daniel Perez

Zeldas durability is an annoyance. They should have made the weapons be like a linear progression without the ability of weapons breaking. You can find and use a bunch of shitty low damage weapons like skeleton arms or shovels or whatever, but getting new swords or a spear costs lots of money and some materials to make.

At a point it was never a problem to have like 10+ weapons on me dealing over 30 damage each but in the beginning it was annoying as fuck for them to break. Or maybe if using them as tools (like to cut down trees or push rocks) didnt wear out the durability and only combat did.

I think games like Oblivion and Morrowind did it best. Your weapons and shit can degrade but you can repair them yourself with the hammer and shit. That was always fine and fun in my opinion.

Jack Wright
Jack Wright

ffxiv
weapons degrade at a moderate rate
can either repair via an NPC or find a skilled blacksmith to repair it, which can give bonus stats

Ethan Gomez
Ethan Gomez

Dark Souls 2
Weapons degrade just right to be a factor and force player to diversify and adapt

Nathaniel Clark
Nathaniel Clark

Diablo and Diablo 2. Suck my cock op.

John Parker
John Parker

just put a Zod and be done with it

Hudson Hughes
Hudson Hughes

It was pointless shit in 2 tho

Aiden Parker
Aiden Parker

Name one
no, anything brought up that actually fits your criteria will be met with
I meant a GOOD one

fuck your face and fuck your life, souls and zelda sell like hotcakes and your petulant whining will never change that

Gabriel Anderson
Gabriel Anderson

Fire Emblem

Levi Long
Levi Long

5 years playing and i never found a Zod despite finding over 20 Chams over them and multiple others

Jason Rivera
Jason Rivera

Game sold well
Therefore, it is immune to criticism
also souls doesn't sell that well

David Parker
David Parker

WoW caused armor/weapon durability to drop 10% on death. This wasn't pointless in that it made for consequences if you keep wiping in an instance or raid.

The bethesda titles do a good job. In fallout you repair your weapons through recycling duplicates in worse condition. This made finding duplicate weapons not a bad thing if you decide not to sell.

Is correct in that the durability system had two exceptions that made things interesting, ethereal weapons/armor that were better than normal but couldn't be repaired, and unbreakable/self repairing gear.

Fuck this guy, trying to define fun and video games based on realism levels realism. Why don't all games just get rid of gravity they'd be way more fun right?

Michael Wilson
Michael Wilson

BotW durability accomplishes some specific objectives. It keeps weapons as loot valuable since there's always utility in having multiple good weapons, and it means that plundering late game areas is rewarding without breaking the game since you'll eventually wear those weapons down.

Souls durability is retarded in every game that isn't DaS2 where it's frustrating and shitty. All it does is occasionally make you farm or pop a soul if you die with a near broken weapon. I guess you can say it's ammo for the handful of weapons with special attacks that drain durability, but that's basically not a concern outside of DaS2,

Cooper Scott
Cooper Scott

Dead Rising did it good

Julian Martinez
Julian Martinez

It keeps weapons as loot valuable since there's always utility in having multiple good weapons
Kill enemy
Spiked boko club/Knight's broadsword
Do a shrine
Put in an extra 5 IQ points for a secret chest
Another elemental weapon
lol weapons in this game are fucking worthless

Kayden Kelly
Kayden Kelly

BotW implements the durability system it has because it allows players to go anywhere and do anything in any order immediately.

Some fucking chump kid would break the game by going into lynel territory or hyrule castle and getting lucky and bagging a really powerful weapon at the start of the game and just literally use it the whole game.

Ayden Anderson
Ayden Anderson

This is a legit good reason thanks

Brayden Perez
Brayden Perez

The 20th elemental greatsword you get is still useful as opposed to most games where anything that is worse than what you currently have equipped is vendortrash.

Isaiah Parker
Isaiah Parker

At end game, sure. But as you progress throughout the game, getting strong weapons and keeping stronger weapons is a task.

Carson Harris
Carson Harris

The 20th elemental greatsword you get is still useful as opposed to most games where anything that is worse than what you currently have equipped is vendortrash.
I wish the elemental weapons were vendor trash in Zelda. 90% of the time my inventory is full of them and I can't even take it.

Parker Jones
Parker Jones

Wow, what version of BotW did you play? You had a full inventory of elemental weapons during your playthrough of the main dungeons?

I didn't get a full inventory of good weapons until after I beat the game.

Eli Sullivan
Eli Sullivan

Go to hyrule castle grounds
Get a bunch of OP regular weapons
Go to the coliseum
Get a bunch of OP elemental weapons
WAOW WOT A DIFFECULT SEESTUM THEES IS.

Hudson Garcia
Hudson Garcia

Because you're a brainlet who doesn't get the shrine chests or you're just lazy and don't do shrines.

Zachary Clark
Zachary Clark

use weapons on weaker enemies
they break
What now homo?

Wyatt Cooper
Wyatt Cooper

start the game
5 weapon slots

uh
how
how did you have room, how did you survive to do all of this with the few weapons you could carry

Jayden Miller
Jayden Miller

Use my bethesda fast travel back to the coliseum and restock on them in 2 minutes obviously.

John Bailey
John Bailey

You must have been doing a ton of koroks then. When I was playing I regularly broke most of my good weapons and it was a chore to get more with the limited inventory spaces. I had to prioritize.

Jaxon Allen
Jaxon Allen

The game gives you the freedom to play like this but its really obviously not optimal.

Anthony Scott
Anthony Scott

Don't kill the enemies with good gear the developers put into the game and wanted you to kill

Jaxon Bailey
Jaxon Bailey

In my original playthrough when I was learning the game, weapon priority was a big thing so I saved the most powerful weapons for bosses or stronger enemies when I got overwhelmed. I didn't have many inventory slots to work with, either, and I would regularly use crappier weapons on weaker enemies and try to conserve my powerful weapons.

I never experienced being overloaded with high quality, really strong items like these anons are saying.

Jace Sullivan
Jace Sullivan

farming for items in a game where everything drops a weapon on death
Literal autism.

Christopher Hall
Christopher Hall

I think he means, stopping your playthrough to go to hyrule and the coliseum and then going back is not optimal.

Tyler Peterson
Tyler Peterson

the weapon thing is a minor annoyance to me but what really annyos the fuck out of me is fucking koroks sitting under a stone on top of huge mountains

Anthony Diaz
Anthony Diaz

Do some fun, satisfying fights in the coliseum to stock up on good weapons with solid durability
Waste time killing a camp full of bokoblins for boko clubs that will break in 15 seconds
Clearly the latter is more optimal

Andrew Kelly
Andrew Kelly

I feel like Dark Souls 2 almost had it right. The weapon degradation varies between weapons and is just fast enough that it can be an issue with some of the soul weapons with special attributes. Problem is instead of fine tuning it they threw in a bunch of "gotcha!"'s and bullshit moments in the form of areas and enemies that ambush you and degrade your equipment and not your weapon. So instead of planning a head and being prepared it all gets thrown out the window when a bunch of explodey dudes destroy your rings or you get dropped in a room or bottlenecks with corrosive urns and black phantoms.

Asher Nguyen
Asher Nguyen

waiting for the next blood moon just to get more weapons
traveling back to a set location to farm them
They literally put the camps in the game to deter you from doing this and the blood moon to prevent you from doing this. Take the hint.

Landon Hughes
Landon Hughes

I almost never ran out of weapons even in the beginning why even do this, pure autism my man

Easton Diaz
Easton Diaz

Why don't all games just get rid of gravity they'd be way more fun right?
ummm... no,but if it was fun then yes

Isaiah Barnes
Isaiah Barnes

What annoys me is Koroks being so hidden period.

Xavier Mitchell
Xavier Mitchell

If you don't waste time and weapons killing stupid boko camp #532 full of weak monsters that don't drop anything the weapons will last you between blood moons easily.

Hudson Clark
Hudson Clark

Whether it was an issue for you or not, the fucking durability system is in the game so that during a playthrough, kiddies aren't going and getting one single fucking amazing weapon that's unbreakable out of Hyrule Docks or some shit and then using it the whole god damn game because why not.

It's there so you can't just waltz into the high powered areas with 4 or 5 hearts and 5 weapon slots and get the best item in the game.

Tyler Miller
Tyler Miller

I dunno, after playing the game for awhile I kinda like it. I feel like if the weapons didn't break then they wouldn't even matter. Every weapon would just get tossed for the next one. But in this game every single weapon is so important. Its a vital resource. It makes finding them feel more significant which feeds back into that desire to explore that the game goes for.

Jordan Gomez
Jordan Gomez

BOTW's system is not pointless, its actually pretty fucking smart

In a game with no real progression in terms of RPG mechanics, the weapon system is pretty much the only way of scaling your power level to the things around you. You cant stick around in areas that are easier than where youve been without running out of the powerful shit and being forced to use weapons that make sense for the enemies youre fighting

Maybe it could have been done better, but i dont see any other game doing it

Camden Edwards
Camden Edwards

I'd rather have 1 of each weapon but no durability. Instead of 1000 knight bows or elemental staff, I'd rather just have 1 with no durability. But bring back magic bars. It's makes finding rare weapons actually fun. Instead of finding a rare weapon and just keeping it in the house forever with no use, I'd rather just fucking use it without having to worry about it breaking.
I'm not saying I want all games to get rid of it. It works for some genres. But in zelda it's more annoying than anything.

Jordan Hall
Jordan Hall

Once again the game lets you do that, but its not how it was designed and is thus not very fun.

Luke Turner
Luke Turner

It's there so you can't just waltz into the high powered areas with 4 or 5 hearts and 5 weapon slots and get the best item in the game.
You literally can though lol. Why do you think going directly to the end of the boss was such a massive selling point shoved down your throat?

Carter Jenkins
Carter Jenkins

BotW is the first game to do weapon durability well, just like its the first game to do open world well

Samuel Clark
Samuel Clark

Killing a reskinned mob you've killed a million times with le increased health padded difficulty meme isn't fun either.

Hudson Bailey
Hudson Bailey

Personally I like Zelda durability. I hated it at first but it forced me to use everything available which led to a funner experience for me.

The only time it becomes an issue is when you need the good stuff for the horse faggots or something but I've never run out of good weapons since I just trade out shitty weapons on shit mobs constantly.

It's also extremely gay for the legendary stuff because they are such a pain to grind for. I think they should have had master sword style durability at least.

Dylan Lewis
Dylan Lewis

You literally cannot though. The item will break.

Justin Johnson
Justin Johnson

But going back to farm the same exact enemies in the same place every time you need weapons, now that's fun.

Grayson Wood
Grayson Wood

Name one game you've played that doesn't use reskinned mobs or mobs with the same tactics but more health/defense.

Robert Robinson
Robert Robinson

7 days to die

Chase Evans
Chase Evans

Killing Lynels and Lizalfos is 10000% more interesting and fun than killing a bunch of fucking bokoblins and maybe a moblin.

Matthew Wilson
Matthew Wilson

Good thing there's Lizalfos camps.

Jose Russell
Jose Russell

NOTHING about any Zelda game is better than any part of Dark Souls. Bosses, combat, fun, multiplayer, dungeons, DaS is superior in every department. Only a cocksucking Nintendo nostalgiafaggot could possibly disagree.

Joseph Miller
Joseph Miller

Strong introduction, lets see how the defense handles this

Landon Sanders
Landon Sanders

How about this?

Weapons and equipment can degrade but you can repair them yourself using a skill check and materials or possibly a repairing mini-game to affect the quality of your repairs. If you're not confident, you can visit a shop and use materials and currency to get it repaired to a standard level. It offers the choice of a guaranteed average job, or risking a botch in favor of a very well done repair.

Is there a flaw in this? I can't really think of any from the top of my head.

Benjamin Turner
Benjamin Turner

Where's the fun?

Parker Rogers
Parker Rogers

NOTHING about any Dark Souls game is better than any part of Zelda. Bosses, combat, fun, multiplayer, dungeons, TLoZ is superior in every department. Only a cocksucking DaS gitgudfaggot could possibly disagree.

Brandon Reyes
Brandon Reyes

In the mini-game.

It much less tedious than having to hunt or trek to a shop to buy your weapons every time they break.

Luis Bell
Luis Bell

I understand what purpose the durability system as it stands now has. I think it is a bad system, but its purpose is clear - to ensure players experience what the developers saw as the "fun" way to play the game, changing their weapons instead of getting attached to one particular weapon or weapon type, and to restrain the imbalance of any "disk one nukes" that are found.

Keeping the durability system but allowing repairs - field repairs, at that - removes the purpose of the system. It's less tedious, but unlike the previous incarnation, it also doesn't seem to have a point any more, as all it does is force players to play a minigame periodically rather than alter how they play, much like how durability systems in a lot of games basically boil down to "remember to click "repair all" at a merchant every now and then". At that point, it would be better to simply cull the system altogether.

Jaxon Sanders
Jaxon Sanders

Oboro Muramasa did it the best in that broken/inactive weapons recharged and swapping to a new weapon cause a screen-wide attack. It gave the thrill of constant tension without breaking game tempo.

Christian Diaz
Christian Diaz

but in the beginning it was annoying as fuck for them to break.
The point of that was to get you to think on your feet and don't just rely on your weapons in combat, but also on all the other options you have. I agree that the durability in general could have been a bit longer lasting, but I think in general it is well implemented. It serves a purpose in early game, and isn't an annoyance in late game, while also getting you to explore more in mid game.

Owen Murphy
Owen Murphy

i like this

how i would do the weapon system in botw different:

champion gear: as is (after the first, need a "tier 2 rarity" weapon + materials + specific blacksmith)
elemental: tier 1 rarity (only in shrines, but materials + specific blacksmith can make them)
high damage weapons: tier 2 rarity (lynels and hynox, or you can use materials + any blacksmith)
regular weapons: tier 3 rarity (advanced mobs, or purchase from blacksmith)
shit weapons: common (regular mobs, and available from shops)
link can learn how to smith (as he can learn to cook) and is able to make tier 3 and common weapons

that, of course, would demand a few extra cities/settlements and a more populated hyrule

Kayden Collins
Kayden Collins

The Zelda model but where they last much longer and are rarer does work. Maybe a system where they can be repaired, but each time they are they permanently lose maximum durability.

James Hall
James Hall

That's fair enough. My idea was to have the rate of degradation nowhere near close to the modern games "Only get 20 hits/shots before breaking completely" system, making the mini-game not so common, but worth it for valuable weapons as part of a risk/reward system.

The point about the current system being designed around having players not get too attached to any one weapon seems to be moot anyway as the system itself deters people from using their best weapons for difficult encounters on the premise that it's not worth it.

A system that is too strict will have players using the same, weak weapons much like the common problem that people save all their healing items for a boss, only to never use them for fear of it not being worth it. How many people finish a game, stocking up on the max amount of whatever the game considers a health potion, only to use a few and rely on any other means available?

The method I proposed seems to be fair enough to allow a smooth gameplay experience for the most part.

Jaxon King
Jaxon King

I can't. If the durability system actually matters it's annoying, if it doesn't then it's pointless busywork. Bloodborne's weapons have durability but you barely notice it because they degrade so slowly, get restored if you upgrade them, and are cheap as fuck to repair. The mechanic might as well not even exist at that point.

In BotW's case, it's kind of fun in certain specific instances, but overall it really damages the character progression. None of your weapons are a permanent upgrade to your kit, they're always fleeting, and they scale with enemies so you never feel any more or less powerful. The only exception is the Master Sword but even that has durability, the only difference is that it goes on a cooldown timer instead of breaking.

Josiah Cox
Josiah Cox

In some games like Paint The Town Red, weapon durability is implemented to force the character to constantly keep scavenging for new weapons, instead of just finding one OP weapon and sticking with it.

Owen Clark
Owen Clark

I always thought Dark Soul's durability was in place to limit the overuse of certain weapons between checkpoints. Crystal weapons have their damage offset by having irreparable durability loss, while special weapons suffer heavy durability loss when you use their special abilities.

Jeremiah Morgan
Jeremiah Morgan

Well, in BotW's case, the game focuses more on exploration than on character progression. If you find a devent weapon in BotW you will usually be happy about it and pick it up (unless you are hundred hours into the game and keep farming lynels). And in the early game the durability system forces you to think outside of the box and use your runes, your surroundings, the glider and stealth to win fights (that's the reason why the island trial is so satisfying, it is a vertical slice of the early game).

So, like with all mechanics, you have to ask yourself wether it serves the game's main point. You can argue that the durability was not implemented well in BotW, but you should acknowledge that a certain amount of thought went into it by the developers.

Jeremiah Allen
Jeremiah Allen

You can also just rush Hyrule castle every blood moon and just get Royal Weapons that will last an eternity

Luke King
Luke King

the game focuses more on exploration than on character progression

Well you see this is supposed to be a Zelda game, in which case those two things should be intertwined. This applies even to the very first game. You explore the world, find a key item or a heart, and it directly helps you with completing the game. There's no sidegrades, there's no trigger that causes reskinned enemies to start spawning, etc. There's a very clear and straightforward progression system. In my opinion that's a thousand times more satisfying than BotW's mostly wishy-washy system where you get most of your tools at the start, have some initial challenge, and then find a ton of ways to break the game into a million pieces. The game never throws enemy encounters at you that are any tougher than your first lynel (at least in the base game), the enemies scale with the weapons so there's never a paradigm shift, and the game doesn't introduce any new mid/late-game enemy types. Even the spirit orbs are an abstraction, they're useless by themselves and you can never "max out" on hearts and stamina simultaneously. Everything about Breath of the Wild's progression screams "ambiguous", there's very little form or substance to it.

you should acknowledge that a certain amount of thought went into it by the developers

What an absurd thing to say. Execution is way more important than concept, when I'm playing the game I'm not thinking
hmmm I might not like this system but the developers worked REALLY HARD on it so I should be more forgiving
I'm focused on the video game.

Brody Ross
Brody Ross

System is pointless
Say that to DS2 SotFS durability matters in that

Owen Perez
Owen Perez

Maybe Dead rising?

Joshua Rodriguez
Joshua Rodriguez

Well you see this is supposed to be a Zelda game, in which case those two things should be intertwined.
You should focus less on what it is "supposed" to be in your mind, and focus on what it is. Aonuma himself said they wanted to break with Zelda tradition here, so maybe progression just isn't the point this time. I agree with a lot of your criticism, but you should see games for what they are. Aonuma himself said they wanted to break with Zelda tradition here, so maybe progression just isn't the point this time.

Anyway, I think enemies scale with how many of them you have killed, not with what weapons you carry. And that thing about the spirit orbs is really picky nitpicking.

What an absurd thing to say. Execution is way more important than concept, when I'm playing the game I'm not thinking
hmmm I might not like this system but the developers worked REALLY HARD on it so I should be more forgiving
I'm focused on the video game.
I threw that in because a lot of people seem to shit on the durability system because they didn't get what it was there for, and in return didn't play the game in a way that it was fun.

Jose Harris
Jose Harris

I want a shooter with realistic bullet mechanics instead of durability. At the start of the level you pick your loadout and get maybe 3-4 mags in reserve. Once those are done, you have to scavenge weapons from dead enemies. Enemy weapons have at most a full mag. Idea is to keep moving forward and killing dudes to make sure you always have weapons/ammo. Throw in some decent FPS melee combat/takedowns a'la the first Mirror's Edge and a quick pace to the flow of the game to top everything off.

Christopher Cruz
Christopher Cruz

True. I liked the fact that the durability actually made enemies dropped guns worth my time and picking up. Recycling guns to maintain your guns was a good way of doing it.

In general durability sucks tho, it's put into too many games that don't need it.

It should really only be in a survival type of gamr.

Noah Stewart
Noah Stewart

Get a sword that knights used
Breaks in like 15 swings of normal sword use

Adam Gomez
Adam Gomez

Here's my take on improving the Zelda system.
weapon durability rate stays about the same or weapons are stronger but less frequent
have each weapon type have more utility and moves based around them rather than the flat 1hand, 2hand, staff and wands. also have disposable weapons like Spears stackable but do more damage when thrown and less when used as a melee weapon (polearms are inversed of course)
have it when weapons break they give you fragments
you can use fragments and base weapons to make weapons from smiths in the different towns, mixing monster parts and other things to add effects to them.
crafted weapons are more durable and can be reforged at low durability but have to be remade entirely if broken or lost.
make dungeons/puzzles based around specific weapons, though this is more based on level design not the weapons themselves

seriously the biggest issue with Zeldas system is that much like crafting food/elixirs, it's really bare bones. Sure blunt stuff breaks rocks and boxes better and axes are good for trees but it feels like there's a lack of variety when it comes to combat.

John Ward
John Ward

That's a reason sure, but the original Zelda was go-anywhere from the beginning and it didn't have durability. Instead it had soft zones where enemies hit harder and soaked more damage. Without enough health or damage, you'd die very quickly.

Alexander Ramirez
Alexander Ramirez

While you're kinda right, BotW fucks up your own argument because getting powerful weapons early forces the game to scale up regardless.

I did a play through where I scavenged the castle a bit right off the bat. Afterwards enemies were mostly high tiered with end game weapons.

Austin Nguyen
Austin Nguyen

it was, especially when the old ability system used the weapon durability for charges rather than magic
now it's pointless

Parker Baker
Parker Baker

It seems to in fact be based, at least in part, off what you're carrying based on my experience doing

Juan Murphy
Juan Murphy

i like weapon durability in BoTW but there should have been a way to repair and enhance the ones you like. like a 5th smithy fairy or something in Hebra

Nathaniel Rogers
Nathaniel Rogers

You understand that in MMOs repair costs / travel costs exist to remove currency from the "economy", right?

Anything else is just a bonus.

Samuel Thomas
Samuel Thomas

Souls durability isn't pointless when you're fighting enemies like Gaping Dragon or Sinh who can degrade your weapons

Bentley Johnson
Bentley Johnson

I know that you anons wouldn't care about any other opinion about weapon durability so I'll share what I found that has been generally agreed upon by most players:
The weapon degradation causes a great deal of Too Awesome to Use, where players pick up rare weapons, but fear actually using them in case they need them later and end up having inventories clogged up with weapons for "just in case", or just straight-up avoiding battles altogether. This also ties into the inventory management of the game. The menus themselves are usually precise and clear, but you have to scroll through a lot of junk if you have a full inventory.
This also makes shield surfing almost useless until you increase your inventory size — shield surfing puts a constant drain on your chosen shield, burning through its durability very quickly. While shield surfing is very fun, the sheer strain it places on your equipment is too much for long sessions, resulting in the mechanic not being used as often as it should at best, and barely being used at all at worst. It's a real shame, because shield surfing is awesome.

Ayden Mitchell
Ayden Mitchell

Well the knights using them all died so

Nolan Richardson
Nolan Richardson

most of the items in Breath of the Wild are at least 100 years old
most items break easily
Deepest lore.

Luke Fisher
Luke Fisher

Start of game, weapons are scarce
Everything is half broken or more
All weapons do shit dmg due to this
Get past beginning of game
Enough weapons drop from everything that you can keep everything fully repaired at all times
System makes beginning obnoxious, and is pointless after 1/4 of the game

Yeah, great.

Brayden Bennett
Brayden Bennett

Star Wars Galaxies

Sebastian Gomez
Sebastian Gomez

Favorite weapons are the ancient weapons you can craft at the tech lab or pick off of guardian scouts
My face when they break like they're made of fucking glass

Jaxson Collins
Jaxson Collins

tests of strength respawn every bloodmoon. get to farming friend.

Noah Price
Noah Price

tests of strength respawn every bloodmoon
They do? Thanks senpai I didn't know that

Wyatt Smith
Wyatt Smith

I actually don't have to if I use the Savage Lynel Bow exploit, but it still makes me sad how quickly my inventory of ancient weapons gets depleted due to their weak durability.

Gabriel Reyes
Gabriel Reyes

go to hyrule castle semi early
go to armory
put down warp medallion point there
warp back every bloodmoon for awesome weapons

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