Why is music theory filled with so much useless bullshit that no talented...

Robert Perry
Robert Perry

why is music theory filled with so much useless bullshit that no talented musician in history even thinks about?

All urls found in this thread:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CD-E-LDc384
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fjwWjx7Cw8I
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=audiation
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=49alQj7c5ps
Elijah Martinez
Elijah Martinez

it's what happens when you try to convert music into words

Landon Long
Landon Long

he fell for the music theory meme

Julian Bailey
Julian Bailey

develop descriptive system to understand and analyze the workings of music
some sperg on the internet gets mad because "three adjacent whole tones" is too esoteric a concept for them to bear
woooooooooow

Brody Jones
Brody Jones

see these three notes? they're called three notes!
mkay

Cooper Hill
Cooper Hill

cute

Alexander Rivera
Alexander Rivera

see these three ones, they make a three!

Jaxon Butler
Jaxon Butler

no musician has ever thought about something as complex as tritones before
do you play bass?

Mason Green
Mason Green

I've seen some of your posts lately, but I've been banned so I couldn't say this sooner...
but now I would just like to let you know FUCK YOU

Brandon Mitchell
Brandon Mitchell

Get filtered, fucking tripfag faggot.

Blake Clark
Blake Clark

"Three adjacent whole tones" means a completely different thing to just "three notes", idiot

Jaxson Anderson
Jaxson Anderson

tritone
useless bullshit

Dylan Rivera
Dylan Rivera

tritones
complex
guitar and drums

Austin Sanchez
Austin Sanchez

Because it's primarily an analysis and troubleshooting tool for musicians. It's like the service manual for your car. Do you read it in order to understand how to drive? No - you reference it when there's something wrong.

Carter Cruz
Carter Cruz

BECAUSE ANY ASSHOLE WHO THINKS THERE IS A THEORY ABOUT SOMETHING AS ABSTRACT AND INSANE AS MUSIC IS AN ASSY ASSHOLE

Aiden Scott
Aiden Scott

see

Asher Scott
Asher Scott

You have to be 18+ to post here

Benjamin Thomas
Benjamin Thomas

i can't be assed to learn something so it's completely useless

Logan Morgan
Logan Morgan

lmao imagine being this mad over an innocuous post

why are you quoting me lmao

William Myers
William Myers

that reading comprehension
OP was the one who thought tritones were a uselessly complex idea, so I quoted him as saying that. I asked if he played bass to insinuate that he is a mouth breathing retard.

Grayson Miller
Grayson Miller

Because you're a fucking retard, kys

Wyatt Diaz
Wyatt Diaz

lol dumbass we said the literal same thing

Angel Bell
Angel Bell

Imagine OP's mind when confronted with something like polytonality or irrational meters

Jace Green
Jace Green

I mean, it's descriptive, not prescriptive. For example, the chord progression of G-D-C features a tritone when going from D to C (F# to C). That's an example of a tritone. You don't need to think to do something as simple as a I-V-IV chord progression yet it will have a tritone.

tl;dr Music Theory isn't Music's Ruleset, it's essentially labeling the inner workings of music.

Oliver Martinez
Oliver Martinez

i agree with everything you said but still go to leddit

Samuel Diaz
Samuel Diaz

seriously
intervals are like week 2 of an intro music theory class

Jackson Sanders
Jackson Sanders

anyone on reddit knowing music theory

Ethan Bell
Ethan Bell

typical mu poster

Charles Kelly
Charles Kelly

why are you quoting me lmao
Because you're wrong.

Luke Sullivan
Luke Sullivan

nope

Thomas Allen
Thomas Allen

Irrational time signatures are a meme my friend

Adam Wood
Adam Wood

Good bait

let's enjoy this one riff that makes use of a tritone

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CD-E-LDc384

Robert Morales
Robert Morales

see
Conscious use of music theory is utterly useless to a talented musician unless there is something wrong going on.

Anthony Murphy
Anthony Murphy

nothing you are saying contradicts anything that I have said lmfao

Wyatt Jenkins
Wyatt Jenkins

Hurr durr I don't need to know theory, I just *feel* the music, man!
Everyone uses theory, dipshit. Even if all you know is how to play a C-Em-G-D progression and realizes it sounds good then that's theory. The difference is that some people can express it in words and actually communicate with other musicians about what's going on without sounding like a blubbering retard

Jeremiah Bell
Jeremiah Bell

being such a butthurt spaz that you see a tripcode and immediately fly into a fury to attempt a debunking of a completely sensible and non-controversial post
why do anons do this ?? is it autism ??

Jeremiah Anderson
Jeremiah Anderson

I agree with you and I already hate you. stop being a faggot and drop the trip.

Luke Ross
Luke Ross

Literally every theory is like this.

Nathaniel James
Nathaniel James

some sperg on the internet gets mad because "three adjacent whole tones" is too esoteric a concept
"three adjacent whole tones" isn't an esoteric concept in the least. It's such an elementary musical concept that it hardly ever needs to be described in theoretical terms. Which makes the OP right (about stuff like that being useless bullshit to talented musicians) and you are wrong in disagreeing.

John Evans
John Evans

I just *feel* the music
Talented musicians just "hear" the music, because that's how music works.

Jack Price
Jack Price

"three adjacent whole tones" isn't an esoteric concept in the least.
yeah i know you fucking aspie rofl thats the point
imagine having a reading comprehension this lo

Gavin Evans
Gavin Evans

yea and if you know music theory you can actually easily realize what you imagine instead of having to fumble around for hours and not even getting close

Daniel Ramirez
Daniel Ramirez

see
Actually talented musicians don't use music theory to write music. They use it to edit/refine what they've already written, IF necessary.

Benjamin Perez
Benjamin Perez

wanting music to sound good
plek

Nolan Scott
Nolan Scott

why do anons do this ??
Being anonymous means no one has preconceptions about what a poster is gonna say. Using a trip just means people know what to expect in advance.. Your reputation for retarded assholery precedes you.

Joseph Carter
Joseph Carter

he is correct here with
develop descriptive system to understand and analyze the workings of music

Jaxon Roberts
Jaxon Roberts

Uhh the tritone is actually a pretty fucking important part of music.

Julian Fisher
Julian Fisher

Yeah, see

So what your saying is that the OP is actually right?

Blake Garcia
Blake Garcia

there is no craftsmanship in music, only godsend geniuses

people hating on music theory are the worst

Carson Morgan
Carson Morgan

And he is wrong here

So important that it doesn't even need to be discussed since it is such an elementary concept to hear.

Eli Stewart
Eli Stewart

play bass
learning music theory
:^(

Charles James
Charles James

t. only listens to popular music

Benjamin Thompson
Benjamin Thompson

so having a word for the interval consisting of six half steps is superflous to you?

Ian Clark
Ian Clark

Yeah who needs music theory? I mean everyone has the talent, giftedness and imagination of popular musicians who didn't use theory, right? All art is subjective bro don't make me learn things
*releases generic bandcamp shoegaze jam in E minor on for the 13468737776468854th time*

Jace Young
Jace Young

see

you can actually easily realize what you imagine
If you can already imagine exactly what it sounds like then theory is useless to you. Music theory =/= music notation.

Adrian Taylor
Adrian Taylor

here's also this obscure, little-known 60s psych rock song. deserved to be a hit but I guess everyone heard that tritone in the intro and threw the record away in disgust

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fjwWjx7Cw8I

Chase King
Chase King

if you think there isnt a great gap between imagining and actually realizing music you obviously never wrote any music

Matthew Kelly
Matthew Kelly

I'm a neo-classical composer with multiple performed works who regularly performs repertoire by the likes of Schubert, Britten and Ives at venues like Carnegie Hall and Saddlers Wells. Take what I say un-seriously at your own peril.

Do you know what a mediant is without using Google?

Jason Collins
Jason Collins

composers use intuition to compose
performers use intuition to perform
listeners may use theory to explain composers' and performers' intuition
both composers and performers may also use theory when intuition fails or to nuance either composition or performance

Joseph Stewart
Joseph Stewart

can be any minor or major chord thats a major or minor third away from the current chord

Camden Bennett
Camden Bennett

see
I know EXACTLY what I'm talking about.

a great gap between imagining and actually realizing music
Means you are lacking in playing ability on your chosen reference instrument. You don't need more theory, you need better chops.

Cooper White
Cooper White

Well shit, turns out Beethoven wasn't talented because he was deaf

Noah Ortiz
Noah Ortiz

neoclassical

HAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Jose Scott
Jose Scott

You're aware that things like scales, intervals and chord progressions constitutes as theory, right? Are you telling me that no talented musicians knows scales?

Lucas Thomas
Lucas Thomas

How would you write a fugue without using theory.

I think you're deliberately misusing language. Nobody "needs" theory but even using a V-I progression because you know that's what a perfect cadence is means you're "using" music theory

William Mitchell
William Mitchell

you know britten and ives both heavily made use of deterministic concepts in their composing? thats like the purest form of directly making use of THEORY instead of whatever-they-imagine-sounds-cool-in-their-head

Samuel Gonzalez
Samuel Gonzalez

It's the proper name for the third scale degree of a diatonic scale. Ie. it's the ACTUAL name for an interval consisting of six half steps. Which you apparently didn't know (until I told you just now.) And yet, that didn't stop you from knowing what that interval was.
Ergo my point - details like that are indeed (for the most part) superfluous.

Jace Richardson
Jace Richardson

ITT: People who aren't musicians and thinks just because some musicians can't describe what they're doing in music theory terms means they don't use theory

Andrew Brown
Andrew Brown

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=audiation
He was incredibly talented.

Grayson Baker
Grayson Baker

An interval consisting of six half steps would be a tritone, the other user was right. What the fuck are you talking about?

Ian Collins
Ian Collins

thats doubly wrong
first of all, its not six half steps, but three or four
second, nobody today uses this word to describe intervals, but always the relationship between chords like i described (see any paper on schubert, that nice non-theory using composer you perform so often)

Connor Torres
Connor Torres

Laugh all you want. I'm the one ITT actually getting paid to make music.

You're aware that things like scales, intervals and chord progressions constitutes as theory, right?
They actually AREN'T. They are basic features of music. Theory is just a way of describing them using non-musical methods.

Are you telling me that no talented musicians knows scales?
A truly talented musician already have the sounds of scales internalized in their auditory cortex. So no - they don't NEED to know how scales are described in non-musical (aka theoretical) terms. It's mostly superfluous.

Landon Fisher
Landon Fisher

ITT: autists debate semantics

Michael Flores
Michael Flores

How do you think the "basic features of music" came about? Do you think cavemen knew what scale degrees a mixolydian scale consisted of when they started smashing rocks together?

A truly talented musician already have the sounds of scales internalized in their auditory cortex. So no - they don't NEED to know how scales are described in non-musical (aka theoretical) terms. It's mostly superfluous.
If you know the name of a chord or scale and how to play it then congrats, you know theory. Or do you think Dm7 or Ionian are "musical" terms?

John Perez
John Perez

What the fuck are you talking about?
uses this word
Naming things in music is superfluous. Sounds are what matters. You don't need theory to make sounds - only to help refine what sounds you've ALREADY made if you feel such is necessary. People who get hung up on the supposed importance of music theory in WRITING (not analyzing - it IS useful there) music are destined to fail as composers.

t. Successful Composer

Owen Russell
Owen Russell

See

Alexander Ramirez
Alexander Ramirez

How do you think the "basic features of music" came about?
Regular vibrations in a gaseous medium.

Do you think cavemen knew what scale degrees a mixolydian scale consisted of when they started smashing rocks together?
Of course NOT. That's my point. They listened to the interplay of sounds and reacted. Formal music theory has naught to do with it.

Christopher Lopez
Christopher Lopez

so beethoven failed cause he made contrapuntal sketches for pretty much every major work of his?

Oliver Lee
Oliver Lee

not analyzing - it IS useful there
You just disproved your own point. As a neoclassical composer you must have analysed the works of classical and other neoclassical composers and used your learning to some extent in order to compose your own music. If you truly didn't use theory at all to compose you wouldn't be able to call the music you compose "neoclassical".

Jackson Kelly
Jackson Kelly

How would you write a fugue without using theory.
The same way the first person who wrote a fugue did - by fiddling around with the sounds at my disposal until I like what I hear. Making music itself is essential. Music theory is secondary.

Robert Ross
Robert Ross

He SUCCEEDED because he had a really well-trained ear from his youth. Everything else he accomplished musically was completely dependent upon that fact.

Jonathan Reyes
Jonathan Reyes

no he succeeded in doing nice counterpoint cause he studied counterpoint for multiple years in his youth you moron

Josiah Campbell
Josiah Campbell

ITT: Mu-drone numales discuss about something they don't know batshit about and call it pretentious and over-complex because their nut sized brain can't process it

Keep listening to music because it's "fun" or "chill" you ultra plebs, but please stop pretending you are better than top 40 listener.

Jordan Ramirez
Jordan Ramirez

you are all stupid, spouting stupid opinions because you dont have any real life experience on the subject you claim to know about

You should learn theory. But dont listen to me, listen to a professional with actual skin in the game

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=49alQj7c5ps

Michael Young
Michael Young

Most of those things had a reason to be and a deeper meaning (usually spiritual), but thanks to the now prevalent materialism, they've lost all meaning, seeming pointless.

Logan Butler
Logan Butler

As a neoclassical composer you must have analysed the works of classical and other neoclassical composers
Yes, because that's what they make you do in formal music school.

and used your learning to some extent in order to compose your own music.
No, because I am not a hack composer. Detailed analyses of other people's music are only helpful for accomplishing two things:
1. Writing music that sounds exactly like someone else's (something I don't do since I'm not a hack), and
2. Understanding how to analyze your own music AFTER you've initially composed it.
Initial composition is all on you and your creativity. Analysis (music theory) is an optional 2nd step.

Aiden Thomas
Aiden Thomas

If you truly didn't use theory at all to compose you wouldn't be able to call the music you compose "neoclassical".
It's neo-classical because it uses much of the same SOUNDS as previous eras of music. Theory has almost nothing to do with it.

Oliver Scott
Oliver Scott

this is a useless post and should be deleted

Noah Flores
Noah Flores

No key signatures beyond (in circle of fifths) E or Aflat
No rhythmic subdivisions less than sixteenth notes

If you need something beyond this, either specify it as it comes up or rethink your approach.
Your Welcome.

Nathan Lewis
Nathan Lewis

Guys, this dude is the best composer on Sup Forums. Listen to him. It's obvious he knows what he's talking about.

Isaac Walker
Isaac Walker

That's not the point of music theory. Why wouldn't you want to understand, study, dissect and classify something as fascinating as music? It's what humans do with everything in nature. It can get annoyingly confusing for outsiders because it is incredibly complex at various levels. In math you have theories about the very concept of sum. You may argue that you don't need them to know what two plus two is, but, again, that's not the point.

Jaxon Lewis
Jaxon Lewis

It's so much easier to learn how to play practically rather than read about it. Who could seriously read a textbook and say "Ah, let me apply this to playing an instrument right away!" Fucking autistic people who can never actually be famous, and just stuck being some boring, well-educated cellist or someshit.

Luke Cox
Luke Cox

The point is any literal retard will realize something's off when you play a scale with an accidental, meaning that scales are just a way to describe how music inherently works
Remember when you were learning scales and you weren't sure on a note? You probably knew you got it wrong as soon as you played it even though you didn't actually know the scale

Blake Sullivan
Blake Sullivan

One of the main reasons for why music theory exists is so musicians can actually communicate with each other no matter what instrument they play so it's no wonder that the aspies on Sup Forums hates it and looks down on people who learn it

Grayson Russell
Grayson Russell

A wise man once said you're always only half a step away from a good note

Christian Flores
Christian Flores

Becoming famous is the end goal for all artists

Found the middle schooler.

Jonathan Ortiz
Jonathan Ortiz

this is the absolute state of Sup Forums

Josiah Taylor
Josiah Taylor

one post represents the entire board

Jordan Morgan
Jordan Morgan

muh top-secret """real""" music club

Wyatt Smith
Wyatt Smith

kek wrf nigga

Logan Butler
Logan Butler

why are you posting this on Sup Forums?

Blake Barnes
Blake Barnes

These... peasants... Guitar players.. Not musicians they are.

Connor Brown
Connor Brown

Self-proclaimed bass player
Only plays roots

Jayden Wilson
Jayden Wilson

So you play bar chords and a dissonant percussive device? You answer is in the puddin'

Nathan Taylor
Nathan Taylor

Ok, OP. This is quality thread.

Nolan Gutierrez
Nolan Gutierrez

Meme's Tongues In Aspic?

Liam Gonzalez
Liam Gonzalez

ITT: People who don't play music spout opinions, while Cowboy Chord Cody and Pentatonic Pete cries about how music only requires soul and feeling to be good, all while people who truly understand music sit back for the shits and giggles.

John Collins
John Collins

"Professional Bassist"
Plays in local punk band

Julian Collins
Julian Collins

I don't even have a firm grasp on music theory, and this thread/OP is just hilarious.

Wyatt Watson
Wyatt Watson

this

Austin Rogers
Austin Rogers

Better chops
Involves playing to a metronome and keeping as accurate rhythm as possible. The spooky music theory is a part of that too.

William Fisher
William Fisher

People who have contributed to this board are long gone.

Charles Price
Charles Price

That has nothing to do with the post you replied to whatsoever.

Zachary Moore
Zachary Moore

Involves playing to a metronome
Being able to keep a steady beat is part of basic musicianship - NOT music theory. If you can't even keep a steady beat then learning music theory will do nothing for you.

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