Kino Ren is more interesting than Vader

Kino Ren is more interesting than Vader.

His character development is far better and he redeems the entire film.

Fuck you, Sup Forums.

Why do all you cucks wanna see stupid villain that "outbadasses" Vader?

You're all faggots

>pretending that stupid lightsaber design offers any actual advantage.

We don't fucking KNOW anything about him yet. He could grow into an interesting character, sure, and I dig his potential, but as of right now he is the Vader Surrogate.

Also
>outbadasses Vader
We'll be getting Thrawn soon enough

Hand guard. Prevents his hand from getting cut off like everyone else in Star Wars.

>Kino Ren is more interesting than Vader.
Yes, but the rest of Star Wars got JUSTed hard, so much so that it most likely will never balance out. Maybe if they don't fuck over Ben Solo and at the end him and Luke form a Jedi Order... I can forgive. Then do spinoffs of Kylo being a bounty hunter monster slayer big guy with his own apprentice.

Derivative of Vader sure. That's well explained by his Vader boner and mask fapping scenes.
It's his inner turmoil that makes him more interesting.

I love it when you cucks complain about him being revealed as a young whiny lad as if its not the fucking point.
I also love the fact that you complain that he loses a duel despite being blasted by a bowcaster.
Sure he can stop a bolt middair.
Is he Powerful? Yes. Disciplined? No. Wounded? Yes. Emotionally scared after just killing his father? Yes.

Fuck with me, niggers.

Rey and Ren are both powerful and undisciplined.
They just should have shown it more with Rey instead of making her a mary sue.
They should've had her accidentally hurt someone while trying to use the force. I hope that happens in VIII

That's retarded.
You're retarded.

What's stopping another blade from crossing right through the inside halves of the crossguard that are hilt and not part of the blade?

Pretty sure ep VIII is gonna tell us that Luke ignored the fuck out of Ben while he was in his academy so that no other student thought he was favoring his nephew.
Big fucking mistake.
That isolation is probably why and how he was influenced by Snoke to buttfuck everyone to death.

I love Reddit. I'm so glad this thread is reddit.

Explain, Mickey Mouse.

He would be if they didn't reveal his face so soon.

You only say that because you say the prequels. faggot

They should've had him played by Julian Casablancas from the Strokes. tbqh

If you look at the development of Vader in the 4th movie vs Kylo in the 7th, Kylo has far more character development. It's not even close.

One of the problems with Vader is that Lucas didn't make him (or at least show him to be) powerful enough. We are told that Vader, and definitely Anakin, is the strongest user of the force ever. But he's barely shown to do anything of value with his powers.

That plasma bolt stop in midair by Kylo was just more than anything Vader has been shown capable of doing in the movies (and that includes him "stopping" Han's DL44 in cloud city). Yet, Kylo is supposed to be magnitudes weaker than Vader.

It's a tough line, if you make the force too powerful, than it's just an auto-win button: "blow everyone's mind up inside their skull".

Why is he supposed to be magnitudes weaker?
When was this said?

They're exhaust ports that happen to form a crossguard. The beam on the cross goes all the way towards the main beam, it is impossible to have a saber cut through that section.

The lore was that Kylo created his light saber without the direction of the Sith, since they aren't a thing anymore. This caused the unskilled Kylo to have an unstable saber that needed exhaust ports to compensate.

Lightsaber hand guard is dumb as fuck.
It's actually a handicap because you have to worry about not stabbing yourself.

True, absolute powerlevels are never stated. For all we know, Kylo could have the potential of Vader or Palpatine, or even greater.

What we do know, however, is that he has never been trained to use the force by the Sith. He has no actual teacher and has learned everything on his own. So chances are, his realized abilities are far lower, regardless of his ceiling.

So an untrained Kylo is seen doing things similar (if not greater) to the master of the force Vader.

Vader just wasn't shown to do enough "cool" things with the force. Even blocking a blaster bolt is seen as something extravagant when in reality it should be something that Vader can do without thinking about it. We were just never shown this.

Interesting. I wish they would've exposed the top part of the crossguard then. It just looks like they could be sliced off.

I'm assuming this is bait but I did enjoy Kylo Ren as a character. It's hard to compare him to Vader too, ironically. But that's kind of the point, since the major point of his character is that he tries to be like Vader when he's not really all that much like Vader.

Anakin was the chosen one, obviously he's supposed to be stronger than any random sith.

It's not really a handguard. They're exhaust ports because his crystal is cracked and they're the only way to keep the blade stable.

I think that he's never been challenged.
Akin to Rocky in Rocky III.
Whether or not he's more powerful is really yet to be seen.
One thing is for sure though. He hasn't had to face another force-sensitive opponent yet.

Also I think Vader is way more restrained than Kylo. Hence why Kylo throws tantrums and Vader just crosses his arms.

I don't get why that triggers so many people. How does showing his face make him less interesting?

He killed all of Luke's students, which some leaks suggest were young adults instead of kids and armed at that. They all would have been force sensitive.

Maybe I'm crazy but didn't some supplementary material mention that Kylo and the Knights of Ren went around and killed Force Sensitives so nobody could oppose Snoke? Like part of their job was hunting them down?

OP is right and objectively speaking, TFA is a better movie than Hope and Jedi.

Also much like Maul being aware of where his second blade was, I'm sure Kylo is pretty good at knowing how not to stab himself like a goddamn moron

I agree to some extent, it's good he's different to Vader, there's no way a similar villain would match Vader in the public's eyes. The downside is that he comes across as pathetic, and there's no other central villain to take up the slack. Aggro general? Just as pathetic and barely any screentime. Snoke? Big hologram, does literally nothing. So to introduce some threat there's a super mega death star which is lazy and boring.

Sure but he did have the Knights of Ren with him.
Maybe he just killed all of the YOUNGLINGS.

I don't actually believe that Kylo is as strong as Vader, I just think that this whole "force" thing had poor planning and foresight.

We never see Vader do really anything spectacular, and yet we know he's the strongest force user. The bar was set so low for force abilities, that anyone that's force sensitive is nearly on the same level as Vader.

They should have shown Vader bringing down ships and blocking 50 blaster bolts at once with just the Force.

This also prevented Anakin from doing anything spectacular in TCW and the prequels. Anakin in TCW and ROTS is supposed to be the strongest fucking thing in the galaxy, but we barely get a glimpse of that due to how low the force bar was set with Vader.

So now, when we see Kylo doing basic shit for a person really attune with the force, we put him on the same level as Vader because of poor planning on Lucas' part.

Perhaps that will be the purpose of Benicio Del Toro's character in VIII?

>He had the Knights of Ren with him

This was never said. In fact, recent stuff seems to be more vague on whether or not he really slaughtered all the students. They usually just say he destroyed what Luke built, which could mean a lot of things.

Yeah I mean he does best a buncha jedi at the temple in ROTS, but that's shown offscreen because of PG13.

I hope the ending of Rogue One will show Vader's true abilities.

Didn't they explain that there was some kind of field around the ports that kept Kylo from slicing his hand on them? I swear that was in a design book somewhere.

This was shown bruh. Remember that whole flashback with them all behind him as he stabs that fool in the back?

Why doesn't the current imperator train more sith than just Ren? Was this ever explained? Surely the rule of 2 no longer counts considering Ren doesn't have any official master who trained him, nor does he have a student himself.

Those were the Inquisitors from the Star wars rebels cartoon.

I always liked the theory that some of the Knights of Ren ARE Luke's students.

>whiny deviantart poster who hates his dad is a good villain

That flashback in the rain wasn't the Jedi Temple massacre. It was a different time and place. This was already confirmed.

>Le badass character with no character development is better

Anakin WAS supposed to be the most powerful force user. Then he got fucking diced. That's why the Emperor wanted Luke instead.
Luke had greater potential than Vader, then why can't Kylo have more potential than Luke and Vader?
Well maybe not more but at least equal potential

fuck off its from google images

Vader literally is a better character

I actually think that's more tragic, in a way. Kylo is very powerful but his emotional and mental issues hold him back majorly. I think this was pretty much implied already.

No they weren't you retard. Put your canon boner away it's slapping against your keyboard.

How? Because nostalgia and muh scary? OT Vader had no real character until the very end.

Vader had much more presence, but that's about all he had.

Kylo Ren isn't a Sith, nor training to be.
Ren is a title, not a name.
The rule of 2 was full of loopholes and workarounds.

He did literally nothing in the first movie

Both Ren and Vader looked bad ass until you got a look at the person behind the mask. Both Anaken and Kylo were effeminate men.

I don't think Snoke wants any other Force Sensitives around that could threaten him. My theory is that he's keeping Kylo around and grooming him because he plans to take over his body eventually.

>Put your canon boner away it's slapping against your keyboard.
The hell does that even mean

This. I don't think Kylo Ren is great either but Star Wars fans lick Vader ass for no real reason. It's just expected of them now.

Well, whatever they call themselves now, why doesn't the current big bad train more of his minions in the use of lightsabers and the force? Surely force sensitive people aren't that rare that Kylo was the only one he found, considering Luke had a whole school full of students.

They fleshed him (Anakin) out in the prequels in order to give him more depth.
Sure, people can complain that this ruined his presence in the OT but he wasn't supposed to be a pure incarnation of evil. The emperor Palps was.

especially since his face is interesting as hell. i could see the complaint if he looked like chris pratt

Kylo will probably be equally fleshed out by the end. People keep forgetting that it's only been one movie. It's way too early to start comparing the two.

But the start of the argument was that Kylo Ren had more flesh and character in TFA than Vader had in the OT. Which still hasn't really been disputed.

true, off-topic but The prequels fleshed out Boba too. Not in characterization as much but in action.
Showing Jango doin his thing showed us how Boba did his thing off screen in the OT.
I think Lucas made Jango to make up for tossing Boba into the pit without showing how BA he was.

It's him showing his face so early + the ridiculous tantrums he throws. That just makes him look pathetic and silly. If you cut out the tantrums, he'd be perfectly fine.

There probably are more, but there was only one red lightsaber villain in episode 4, which means there's only one red lightsaber villain in tfa

>If you cut out the point of the character, he'd be perfectly fine

Yeah but in comparing their roles in their respective debut films, Kylo is a more dynamic character.
I didn't say interesting because of course Vader is interesting. why the fuck does he breathe like that? ie

Again, those tantrums had a point. He's a young, undisciplined Lad. At first glance you're SUPPOSED to think he's better than Vader in every regard. His tantrums and Julian Casablancas mug show he's not.

You realize that his tantrums make up his personality and character, right?

He's not Vader, he's not supposed to be Vader, that's the whole fucking point. He tries to be Vader, and we get glimpses of potential, but he tosses it away because he's unable to control himself (yet?).

Kylo has known character flaws, something that we don't have with Vader until the final movie (or arguably 2/3s of the way into the fifth movie).

You can have him show anger and being unable to deal with situations appropriately without making him look like a raging autistic kid who just lost an Overwatch game.

As if Vader wasn't autistic and raging during his young days. I'm not even going to waste time pointing out all the instances in the PT where he acts like a bitch.

In Ep IV its Luke who goes on a journey while Vader is a given bad guy.
In Ep VII its Kylo who goes on a journey while Rey is a given good guy.

They're just inverses of each other. Thats also why Rey is such a fucking mary sue.

>Thats also why Rey is such a fucking mary sue.
Nope. You're supposed to absolutely adore the cunt. She's supposed to be utterly enchanting.

Angst is the fast-track to the Dark Side, just look at Anakin

I dont know if he's better than vader but I will say he was easily the best of the new characters.
Poe was close but other than that its not like he much to compete with.

You can adore someone without any character development. People adored Vader in ANH and he had ZERO. People adore Poe and he also has zero.

The Pilot in a ANH has character development
The Pilot in TFA does not. (Poe)

(ignoring the fact that rey is also a pilot somehow)

INVERSES.

They're the easiest way to rip off of characters and plot devices without people realizing it.

Poe sucks as a dynamic character. He was just well acted and you thought he was cool.

It's not supposed to, that's the point.
It's not a hand guard. It's exhaust vents because his saber is imperfect; it's part of his character, he's a tryhard who can't get it to work right.

it's funny because it comes off as an improvement but in reality its because Kylo is autistic. But really he didn't have any good reference to look at so I'll toss him a bone

You're comparing a villian of one movie versus one who was in 6.

Or at least make it barred

Kylo is a literal anthropomorphisation of the Sith code.

He is not only the best thing in an otherwise brand kick off to the new trilogy, he's honestly one of the best things the franchise has done period.

Bland*

Fuck me.

>this is supposed to be the badass

And I'm still saying he's a better character.
Better acted too.
I'd fuck Adam.

>It's him showing his face so early + the ridiculous tantrums he throws. That just makes him look pathetic and silly.

But that's the point.

what was the best thing about TFA? all I ever hear about is what was the worst thing

>Missing the point that hard

...

They really fucked up in letting Driver portray and voice Kylo.
In the OT they had James Earl Jones voice Vader while they had Prowse play him. This was done Prowse sounded dumb as hell but also so that Prowse wouldn't have a ton of power to bargain his future salaries with.

Adam Driver has shit ton of bargaining power for future installments.

...

I'm autistic enough to have tried the toy. The cross guard stops your hand from slipping into the side blades

Do you think Nolan feels BTFO? Star Wars has done it right twice in 2 different ways meanwhile BANE is one of the biggest failures in modern cinematic history.

The point that you're a retard?

Remember when Fox gave J-Law too much bargaining power with mystique and she royally raped the character by having her be a good girl, wear a pointless uniform, and not appear in blue skin ever?

HEY WAIT, YOU GUYS.
ARE james "my name is earl" JONES and felicity JONES related?

If you don't think so you're a racist Imperialist.

Why couldn't a nigger father a white girl?

Fuck off, there's actual discussion in a star wars thread for once

Hollywood actors are paid to push agendas, what the fuck else is new you autist?

please tell us why Vader or Maul is your favorite character

The only thing we know about anakin is that he thinks spinning is a cool trick, fuck off

This guy is absolutely right. They have to be related.

No, the point that Kylo is not at all meant to be a badass. He is legit presented at the beginning as intimidating but the rest of the movie undermines this. The undermining is intentional because Kylo is not a stone cold bad ass. He's a confused and tormented emo angst ridden young adult. The movie is inviting you to make fun of him and you oblige, but mistakenly mock the movie in turn under the assumption it unknowingly did this to Kylo.

John, you're the retards.