Metal and Doomsday clock

Kayden Allen
Kayden Allen

in 2017, DC gives both Moore and Gaiman excuses to sue

which event will end up being stupider, pic related

All urls found in this thread:
https://comicsheatingup.net/2017/08/12/spoilers-and-review-dark-night-metal-1-rocks/
https://comicsheatingup.net/2017/08/12/spoilers-and-review-dark-night-metal-1-rocks/#more-21427
https://vimeo.com/223025116
http://www.neilgaiman.com/FAQs/Sandman
https://youtu.be/tgCiC6qTtjs
David Gutierrez
David Gutierrez

Moore can't sue because they're not making a sequel to Watchmen and Gaiman was likely asked

Ryder Thompson
Ryder Thompson

1. DC has to get permission from Gaimen to use Endless, it's in a contract
2. Daniel was in Morrison's JLA a fucking decade ago

Brody Bennett
Brody Bennett

Maybe Snyder asked Gaiman for permission like Morrison back then.

Mason Russell
Mason Russell

Any reason they're not using his more known look? Is it a way to get through a loophole or something?

Nolan Roberts
Nolan Roberts

2. Daniel was in Morrison's JLA a fucking decade ago

tfw Morrison's JLA was 20 years ago

Brandon Parker
Brandon Parker

Because Morpheus was killed and Daniel is now Dream? Duh?

Aiden Bennett
Aiden Bennett

... because that Dream is dead?

Anthony Gomez
Anthony Gomez

guys probably should have spoilered that for him

Isaiah Collins
Isaiah Collins

He was also in Johns' JSA.

Gabriel Sanders
Gabriel Sanders

I've honestly not gotten around to finishing Sandman, how does this dream differ from Morpheus?

Gavin Phillips
Gavin Phillips

And appeared in Johns' JSA in one issue.

Ryan Wood
Ryan Wood

It's a little difficult to explain, just finish read it.

Jeremiah Price
Jeremiah Price

And Robinsons Earth 2

Josiah Sanchez
Josiah Sanchez

Fair enough, quit my shitty job so I've got all the time in the world right now

Charles Roberts
Charles Roberts

that's Wesley Dodds, user

Henry Nelson
Henry Nelson

Me too user.
Enjoy your free time.

Leo King
Leo King

Thanks man, any reading recommendations? I've been reading through some of Morrison's Doom Patrol and I like it, but does it pick up early on or is it a big payoff kind of deal?

William Nguyen
William Nguyen

I dunno.

Where is the Doomsday Clock scan?

Levi Moore
Levi Moore

Will Doomsday Clock have Doomsday in it?

Nolan Rogers
Nolan Rogers

Death was also in Cornell's Action Comics.

Jacob Garcia
Jacob Garcia

Maybe, but please don't tell me you think that because the story's called "Doomsday Clock"

Daniel Morgan
Daniel Morgan

No real big payoff or pickup in Morrison's Doom Patrol. It just stays like it is until the run is done. His Animal Man is better, but Milligan's Shade the Changing Man is best of that ilk.
If you're going back through Sandman, you've got some good reading ahead of you.

Mason Smith
Mason Smith

Superman also kills batman at some point during the event so I'm guessing batman will also meet Death and Death's Pedant will probably be made of the immportant Metal

Asher Perry
Asher Perry

Probably just a nightmare sequence.

Cameron Sanchez
Cameron Sanchez

that could be too but then again if Dream is in play the Rest of the endless could be too

Jonathan Baker
Jonathan Baker

He came here to bitch about shit he had little knowledge of. He can fuck off

Connor King
Connor King

to bitch about
Dude was only asking why Dream wasn't in his famous black robes, chill out

Easton Roberts
Easton Roberts

Do you think Killer Frost will be involved?

Isaac Walker
Isaac Walker

Seriously fuck you. You know fully well that's not how that shit plays out.

Retard.

Benjamin Peterson
Benjamin Peterson

At least this proves that the Lucifer 2.0 author was a complete hack

Grayson Hernandez
Grayson Hernandez

Different Sandman user.

Isaiah Bailey
Isaiah Bailey

Sorry I'm a casual faggot but who is he?

Joshua Scott
Joshua Scott

Wait, was that Dodds or Sandy? Because Sandy was in Johns JSA for a bit

Kevin Smith
Kevin Smith

It's Dodds

user got confused

Adam Lee
Adam Lee

Dream of the Endless, Daniel, The Sandman, etc

Hunter Ross
Hunter Ross

There were some preview pages released that show the Justice League fighting multiple Batmen, so it's probably a robot or something.

It's Dodds with a Sandy-style costume.

Joseph Parker
Joseph Parker

Anyone made a thread about this? This guy spoiled the entire issue.
https://comicsheatingup.net/2017/08/12/spoilers-and-review-dark-night-metal-1-rocks/

Brody Young
Brody Young

I thought Shade was the weakest Vertigo book. Strong characters, but the plot was just meandering around. Basically Milligan filling in whatever he could.

William King
William King

plot
it was never about plot user. shade was v poetic and it was a deep study of a few key themes and ideas across 50-70 issues (Milligan wanted to stop after 50 which is why the last 20 are count em if you want

John Foster
John Foster

It cracks me up, this obsessive possessiveness of a character that is a blatant rip-off of Elric.

DC should ask Michael Moorcock if its ok to use the character instead.

Jaxon Williams
Jaxon Williams

Elric
Sandman

what are you smoking?

Kayden Cruz
Kayden Cruz

You seriously don't know? Gaiman has admitted that he stole many elements of Elric. He was a big fan of Moorcock and wrote the foreward to one of the later book collections where he openly acknowledges it.

Colton Morris
Colton Morris

Gaiman has no legal agreement. Writers just ask him out of courtesy and respect for his work.

Samuel Jenkins
Samuel Jenkins

He also has a short story about a young teen loving Moorcock
One Life, Furnished In Early Moorcock" (Elric: Tales of the White Wolf, 1994)

That might actually be what you are referring to

Michael Johnson
Michael Johnson

So will this be the story that finally addressed the 3 Jokers plot point?

Cameron Green
Cameron Green

In the early interviews of Metal Snyder said he wasn't doing any Rebirth stuff, so probably not.

But you have to know at this point it's just timeline bullshit and not really a big deal, right?

Jacob Stewart
Jacob Stewart

no everyone's pretty much stated that's Johns's story to tell. I know it's a slow build user but patience

Eli Mitchell
Eli Mitchell

why do they need his permission? what kind of deal they got?

Wyatt Garcia
Wyatt Garcia

Is JLA going to cross over in the event? That might be when that Destiny/Frost scene will happen.

Charles Sullivan
Charles Sullivan

This is so fucking stupid

Isaiah Gomez
Isaiah Gomez

Around 1989, shortly after Death was introduced, Greg Weismann (of Young Justice/Gargoyles fame) used Death in Captain Atom, where she and Necron showed up as avatars of death.

Neil threw a huge queen size tantrum demanding NO ONE was allowed to use the Endless EVER without his explicit permission.

About a decade later (around the mid-00s) DC signed a deal with Gaiman where NO ONE was allowed to touch any of the Endless and any characters/concepts from the book. Which, in Neil's eyes, also included Hector Hall or Lyta Hall (even though they were longtime JSA members).

It's why they were killed off like they were in a bye-the-bye fashion in JSA during Infinity Crisis, and why Johns couldn't show Danial on-panel taking their souls away to a dimension "where they could never return. The fact that Hector only appeared ONCE in Sandman and was the new Doctor Fate (and played a major role in JSA) meant NOTHING to Gaiman; he declared Hector belonged to him simply because he appeared in Sandman and NO ONE NO ONE could use him ever again.

(Neil's attitude is also why a planned Swamp Thing/Poison Ivy special he was going to write got vetoed hard, as Neil wanted to kill Ivy off and it in writing that no one could EVER bring her back)

Paul Cornell had to kiss his ass big time to be allowed to use Death and even then, Neil only allowed DC to let him use Death if Neil and Neil alone could write the issue (which he ghost wrote) and Death's cameo in Action Comics #900

Ayden Young
Ayden Young

Metal is supposed to be like an alternate edgy world so that's why you see Superman killing Batman, three Jokers etc.

Christopher Wilson
Christopher Wilson

Neil only allowed DC to let him use Death if Neil and Neil alone could write the issue (which he ghost wrote)
sauce?

Cooper Green
Cooper Green

tfw your long standing hypercrisis theory that Endless exist across multiple multiverses holds up
Nice

Sebastian Morgan
Sebastian Morgan

How much of this is real? Because there's some parts that were real (the incident with Greg Weisman using Death in Captain Atom) but it sounds like you embellishing and projecting.

Jordan Cooper
Jordan Cooper

They need Gaiman's permission to use the Endless mostly because of how they work in the multiverse as a whole. As long as it isn't something like "there are more than one avatar of Death and Endless' Death is for happy deaths or whatever" Gaiman doesn't see problems with it.

Gabriel Martin
Gabriel Martin

wow what a twist you pull here user. Gaiman is just a fucking smart businessman and he negotiated some smart contracts. And I think it's good The Endless can't be ruined by shitty DC writers

Cooper Bailey
Cooper Bailey

I wonder how much of that BleedingCool "Dr. Endless" stuff was real or not. Neil seemed confused by the allegations and denied them, but then DC did cancel the book to (maybe) resolicit it later.

Mason Wright
Mason Wright

dream
an op son of a bitch
king of dreams
stronger than saitama and goku combined
read the sandman my friend

Ryan Bennett
Ryan Bennett

Shit, I wonder if any of the other Vertigo heavy-standbys will show up

Tyler Jenkins
Tyler Jenkins

I jast read the sandman last week , and then ..this happens !

Blake Sanders
Blake Sanders

Very good timing. Other than Overture and being referenced off panel in a JSA story arc, his last appearance was in Morrison's JLA 20 years ago.

Wait nevermind, he did appear in the early 2000s a few times in the Lucifer series (which you should read next)

Daniel Long
Daniel Long

Is he showing up because he's Hawkman's grandson? I'm assuming this is from Metal?

Blake Baker
Blake Baker

Yeah it's from Metal. This website got their hands on it and posted a bunch of panels from it.

https://comicsheatingup.net/2017/08/12/spoilers-and-review-dark-night-metal-1-rocks/#more-21427

Daniel Rogers
Daniel Rogers

Superman kills Batman the same way he killed Joker

Carter Ramirez
Carter Ramirez

what is sandman about for a unclutured dude who only reads super hero comics

Kevin Roberts
Kevin Roberts

it's fucking terrible
This isn't surprising at all.

Carson Gray
Carson Gray

The world's longest most convoluted magical suicide

Evan Anderson
Evan Anderson

It's about how giving in to delirium and sets one out on the path of destruction that ultimate leads to death.

Kayden Taylor
Kayden Taylor

that....is an impossible question to answer. It's literally about everything. The 'main' character, I have quotations cause you leave him very often to have stories about other people who just barely interact with him, is Dream. So it's very heady and deals with a lot of abstract concepts.

I really don't think there is a good way to describe it. But it's THE most studied comic in university classes (far more than Watchmen) and it lauded as the best achievement in art and lit that comics as done. While I don't agree that it's the best, it certainly deserves a place amoung the best

Daniel Ramirez
Daniel Ramirez

The first story-arc is actually very much a super-hero comic. It was only after it that it became a story about stories, with several of the issues being short stories that were held together with common themes.
In the beginning, Morpheus (Dream of the Endless) is captured and imprisoned by human occultists. He is an Endless, who are personifications of concepts (Destiny, Death, Dream, Destruction, Desire, Despair, Delirium). When he was captured, the Dreaming, the place that he controlled, went into disrepair. When he is freed at the end of the first issue, he teams up with various people (Martian Manhunter, Mister Miracle, John Constantine) to recover his personal items and reclaim the Dreaming properly.
After that first arc, it becomes a very otherwordly examination of literature and really good world building.

Some fans actually made a pretty good fan-film out of one of the first issues (#6), and is pretty horrifying.
https://vimeo.com/223025116

Also this if you want a really TL:DR

Cameron Perry
Cameron Perry

More leaks

Noah Kelly
Noah Kelly

And even that was literally making good on a hanging plot thread from Sandman.

Carson Fisher
Carson Fisher

Didn't this event start with them revealing that he has a machine that can literally bring himself back to life?

Blake Clark
Blake Clark

Daniel Hall Dream
Grandson of Carter and Shiera Hall
DUDE Nth METAL LMAO

Julian Myers
Julian Myers

Weren't the last 20 when the comic basically became a parody of Doctor Who?

Hunter Myers
Hunter Myers

Different user, but that actually sounds like a good description. Shade goes to New York, his son rapidly grows, and he juggles ~7 new random characters. I can't remember if I actually finished it after that, because it really went off the rails after Kathy got shot and killed

Hudson Edwards
Hudson Edwards

There's a difference between a tripfag and a namefag.

Jason Hill
Jason Hill

You mean this page, where they literally reference the agreement, call Daniel by his title, and you can tell that it's obviously him?

Parker Bailey
Parker Bailey

Might as well post this again.

Jonathan Adams
Jonathan Adams

Holy fucking shit this garbage is hilarious.

Ayden Carter
Ayden Carter

plot twist

...I was reading that before you posted

Angel Wright
Angel Wright

Moore doesn't have the rights to Watchmen does he? Isn' t it something like the when the book goes out of print it goes back to him.

Carter Gutierrez
Carter Gutierrez

what even happened with this

Joshua Nelson
Joshua Nelson

Anyone but Gainman writing the Endless
Anyone but Moore writing Watchmen
How can anyone defend this shit? Don't you have any shred of integrity?

Jaxson Jenkins
Jaxson Jenkins

Of the 4 things previewed 2 of the 4 have been done and the 3rd is the current arc. Seems this will come last.

Leo King
Leo King

http://www.neilgaiman.com/FAQs/Sandman
If I'm not wrong, Gaiman doesn't own Sandman. So why would he sue?

Isaac Hall
Isaac Hall

Because Sup Forums is parroting a 20 year meme rumor started by Rich the Leech.

Tyler Rogers
Tyler Rogers

*20 year old meme rumor

Asher Fisher
Asher Fisher

Could this lead into other Vertigo charcters showing up

Robert Kelly
Robert Kelly

Yeah, like he'll ever read it.

Isaiah Sullivan
Isaiah Sullivan

A- Finish Sandman, it's pretty cool. Overture was pretty cool too.

B- Read Lucifer, it's awesome, maybe my favorite comic ever. The original series (starts with Sandman Presents: Lucifer), not the current one.

Other books I'm reading/recently read that I'd recommend:

Deadly Class- assassin high school drug bender coming of age story

Saga- intergalactic late stage multi-generation race war family story

It Hurts- standard friends goofing around story with some minor Apocalypse elements and a few zombies and cyborgs, etc.

I don't completely disagree, but how does it prove that?
Like seriously I don't get how they're related.

Henry Martin
Henry Martin

what the fuck is with that signature?

Levi Ramirez
Levi Ramirez

I think that the puppet master that Doctor Manhattan was referring to at the end of the Button Mini-Arc is the Presence

Logan Hill
Logan Hill

you should read overture if you haven't, it's sort of a prequel to sandman.

Jason Green
Jason Green

It's was the 90s, user.
https://youtu.be/tgCiC6qTtjs

Robert Murphy
Robert Murphy

What magic did Bill do here?

Connor Carter
Connor Carter

Dont forget Death was in Lex Luthors Action Funnies a couple of years ago

Julian Perry
Julian Perry

She's cute.

Tyler Robinson
Tyler Robinson

I'll bet Bruce will have to die for some reason, like he has to be dead to access some place in the 'Dark Multiverse' so Supes kills him intending to bring him back.

Expect that page to be the last panel of the issue though, with no explanation.

Evan Butler
Evan Butler

18-20 years before the drop RoevWade made abortions legal.

Isaac Sanchez
Isaac Sanchez

Has more to do with superpredators and the rise of the prison-industrial complex, but abortion is relevant too.

Robert Martin
Robert Martin

superpredators
What?

Logan Sullivan
Logan Sullivan

Overrated goth shit for emo teens that still sells like hot cakes in tpb to said demographic especially girls of that demo.

So makes sense for DC to want to weaponise it for use in the DCU like with Watchmen

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