What's going to happen when robots obsolete the majority of low skill jobs?
The amount of jobs created by robots (Maintenance, programming, etc.) will never even come close to replacing the amount of jobs that will be lost (Almost all manufacturing, call center shit probably, professional driving).
I really don't see how this doesn't eventually end with a literal war against the people trying to force automation everywhere, people will literally lose their entire livelihood to this shit at some point and there won't even be a realistic option to switch skills because those positions will be filled
We enter an age of communism. People will live freely, but those who are most educated will be at the top: engineers, programmers, scientists, etc. Education will still be a priority.
Ayden Ortiz
More nogs on welfare and less immigration.
Austin Sanders
it's almost like hitler foresaw the ultimate ends of our world and attempted to expand and repopulate the countryside with a world where most people were noble farmers, feeding the strong minds and bodies of the nation.
David Diaz
>Communism >Educated will be at the top Farmers and iron workers are the only two professions praised under a communist regime and both would cease to exist with automation.
Jackson Martin
if companies are going to switch to computers and automation they should be taxed rather than universal income for the both should coincide with each other
Luke Jones
RARE
What's going to happen is there is going to be an all out war where developed countries fuck over the undeveloped countries or we somehow invent faster than light travel and go to other worlds and start colonizing.
Hudson Jackson
or*
Levi Gomez
And it won't work. At some point resources will be taxed and the government will do what Communist governments always do, purge.
Angel Bennett
Can you see each other from your island bungalows?
Eli Russell
Mexicans already do that.
Jordan Adams
>People will live freely 163. Suppose the system survives the crisis of the next several decades. By that time it will have to have solved, or at least brought under control, the principal problems that confront it, in particular that of “socializing” human beings; that is, making people sufficiently docile so that heir behavior no longer threatens the system. That being accomplished, it does not appear that there would be any further obstacle to the development of technology, and it would presumably advance toward its logical conclusion, which is complete control over everything on Earth, including human beings and all other important organisms. The system may become a unitary, monolithic organization, or it may be more or less fragmented and consist of a number of organizations coexisting in a relationship that includes elements of both cooperation and competition, just as today the government, the corporations and other large organizations both cooperate and compete with one another. Human freedom mostly will have vanished, because individuals and small groups will be impotent vis-a-vis large organizations armed with supertechnology and an arsenal of advanced psychological and biological tools for manipulating human beings, besides instruments of surveillance and physical coercion. Only a small number of people will have any real power, and even these probably will have only very limited freedom, because their behavior too will be regulated; just as today our politicians and corporation executives can retain their positions of power only as long as their behavior remains within certain fairly narrow limits.
Liam Gomez
well remember when someone invented the 3d printer what that did for small business? That is a robot that takes the place of small craftsmen but what it does is it enables inventors.
When robots take over, you will get a shit ton of very cheap and very advanced consumer goods.
clothes and other social industries will be mostly the same and employ a majority.
But what will happen is more DIFFERENT factories will emerge. You wont need a 10 acre plant to do factory work. With advanced robots, you could do what a factory could do in an area just a little bit bigger than a garage.
This means that the barrier to entry for small manufacturing drops massively and small businesses around it explode. Entrepreneurship becomes commonplace.
The especially good ideas will go corporate and global. And the bigger a business gets the more professionals involved via legal, accounting ect.
You are looking at robots from a retarded perspective.
If more can be created from less, it means there is more IN GENERAL that becomes available.
Let us pretend that human energy is used to create goods. Since its economic, there is a fixed amount of human energy divided about the jobs and work hours and directed towards company/ business or entrepreneurial goals.
The more efficient the means of production, the less human energy it takes to create. Therefore opening up more space for different goods.
USA has the most goods available to it in the world and the number has been expanding rapidly due to increasing market efficiency. Robotics is just ONE type of efficiency (though it is one that is exponential).
If robots turn 100 man hours into 1 man hour, then that leaves 99 man hours to invest in new, different or better products/jobs/ventures.
Ryder Cox
communism is a retarded meme you dumb cunt. Even in an ideal technocracy it will never work.
kill you rself
Brody Hill
So, that movie was right? The purge is gonna happen...
Connor Moore
That still doesn't do anything for the millions of people whose jobs cease to exist because cars drive themselves, everything is manufactured by robots, etc. Also, where are you getting the idea that small entrepreneurs will be able to afford fully-automated production lines? Robots require a huge initial investment, which large, preexisting businesses will be able to put up far easier and earlier than their smaller competitors. Car-building robots arms have existed for decades, for example, but dudes who build cars in their garages still do it by hand because they can't afford that shit.
Jaxson Thompson
yikes you treat it as if this is going to happen overnight. it's going to happen over many generations and the impact will be negligable
Jonathan Gomez
The jobless economy is real and coming.
A day will come when it is more normal to be unemployed than it is to be employed. That's why you install a basic income before hand, so when unemployment reaches critical mass everyone has a safety net.
"BUT WHERE DOES THE MONEY COME FROM FOR THAT BASIC INCOME YOU COMMIE PROGRESSIVE KEK?!"
It doesn't come from anywhere. People using basic income to purchase items do not own those items. They are effectively government assets, and are subject to be monetized or forfeited at the governments whim.
They don't lose money, they gain an asset. Effectively the only money lost is that used on consumables or items that have depreciated beyond use, and those items will be well within the margin of the governments income as the government takes over and automates agriculture, ensuring that no one can survive without the governments rationed food.
It's not something to fear. It's literally the only way to survive in a post human obsolescence world. Our technological progress will be the death of our way of life, and your granchildren won't even care or know that it's gone, just like the industrial revolution was the death of our great great grandparents way of life and we don't know or care that there's is gone.
Earth is nearly done. The human population is already reaching unsustainability and there's two ways to go. 1) a massive population reset (WWIII) which really only solves the issue for another few generations. We won't LOSE the level of technology we've attained or 2) a single world government with the goal of colonizing other worlds to exploit. Once again there will be a frontier. Something the planet hasn't had in nearly two centuries. Someplace people can go to be relatively free from the bonds of a constricting government, where their labor has value again. At least for now.
Matthew Reyes
Why the fuck are people so intent on forstalling automation for the sake of maintaining menial labour?
Jesus germany is importing illiterate mudslimes rather than work towards automation.
Gavin Stewart
"if the steam engine gets invented what will happen to the 80% of people who work on farms?"
you during the industrial revolution
Jonathan Torres
>What's going to happen when robots obsolete the majority of low skill jobs? >people still have voting rights >establishment still wants to be in their position >establishment just introduces universal basic income >while doing UBI, establishment also hands out mass-produced narcotics and shit >most people receiving UBI are doing drugs and don't care about politics >establishment still holds power
Brayden Sanders
3) Destruction of the industrial-technological system; yes, this will result in the deaths of bilions of people, but the survivors will live better, freer, more dignified lives than we could possibly imagine, and postponing the inevitable collapse will only make it worse when it does happen.
Justin James
The majority of the world isn't made up of inventors or people with the capability to invent.
The majority of people and majority of current jobs are low skill low education tier jobs and there is already an over saturation of college educated workers who can't find a job because nobody wants to hire them because either >Jobs don't exist >It's not profitable to hire more people
Robots don't do shit to help 90% of people in terms of employment
Nathaniel Murphy
The powers that be would abolish them to do something about all the drugs and the crime that happen as a result.
Owen Jenkins
>Impact will be negligible There already aren't enough jobs for the college educated, it will only get worse over time as even the shitty jobs they don't want to take (That are filled by the less educated who will also become unemployed) unless absolutely necessary get replaced with robots
Michael Reed
>What's going to happen when robots obsolete the majority of low skill jobs? Thankfully one of those low-skill jobs is killing and disposing of homeless people.
Problem will fix itself.
Alexander Brooks
That won't happen. Look at you sitting on your computer, gonna give that shit up faggot? Gonna go organize an attack and blow up a tech manufacturer? No, didn't think so.
Jace Fisher
The difference is that there's no where for work to go after robots
At least with that shit you could go to the factories. Where do you go with robots? >Repair/program robots You don't need millions let alone billions doing that
Juan Bennett
Yes, because we all know how great the Industrial Rvolution and its consequences have been for the human race.
Carson Clark
>those who are most educated will be at the top: engineers, programmers, scientists, etc. Yes, goy, of course. Trust us, we'll put you on the top. Now go and make more robots for me.
James Bell
Then we'll be ready for Bernie Sanders
Ayden Sanders
It's not just low-skill jobs at risk. Knowledge jobs like doctors, lawyers and architects are also at risk in the next 5-15 years
Brandon Stewart
>implying I wouldn't
David Gomez
Best Case scenario is we adopt the economy from star trek. I'd say the best practical solution is another plague. The black Plague helped lower the population of Europe enough that it helped new ideas come about, and in the long run made Europe stronger, by helped start the renaissance. If we had another plague that wiped out enough people, but not enough for society to collapse, it could help us in the long run.
Hudson Powell
>you will be targeted for extermination by a cyborg from the department of social security.
Life expectancy, and population doubled during the Industrial Revolution. It was very beneficial to humanity, all technology we have today: vaccines, computers and electricity all stem from it
Other sectors? People made the same argument during the Industrial Revolution, thats not a meme. If no one can earn enough to pay for products made by robots, then the company doesn't make money, its a symbiotic relationship where they rely on each other.
Jobs will switch to things like coding or the medical field, job demand creates jobs in different areas.
Oliver Wood
>666
Why has kek forsaken us?!?! KILL THE ROBOTS, QUICK.
Wyatt Peterson
>What's going to happen when robots obsolete the majority of low skill jobs?
The same thing we did when technology turn farm work from 90% to
Benjamin Turner
Ah, but the greentext implies "implying".
Aiden Brown
You're missing the point.
Going from working the farm to working the assembly line is a lot smaller of a leap than working the assembly line to working the fucking programming of a robot.
The people whose jobs will be the first to go won't even have enough money to pay for the education needed to do any of that shit
also >implying longer life expectancy and the population doubling is a good thing 90% of the world's current problems are a result of overpopulation
Zachary Howard
whoever owns the robots becomes extremely rich less money to go around means everyone else is very poor robot owners start their own economy, effectively excluding the majority robot owners survive rampant epidemics that wipe out the majority of the human race go on as a much smaller population to do whatever the fuck they want, as kings in an empty kingdom
Isaiah Ross
>China You should lurk moar about this country, because its communistic
Josiah Howard
Yep. Look at data science. A brand-new profession, yet everyone seems to already be a professional data scientist, with fucktons of classes, books and guides from "experienced professionals".
Older people will lose jobs to automation, while fresh graduates take the new jobs and fill up the new professions.
Alexander Lee
Cool picture. You have any of the rice fields?
Andrew Brooks
take a picture in Chinese city and theres a 90% chance it will look like a complete shithole. Theres a 99% chance it will have smog in the picture.
Lincoln Bailey
If you honestly think that life expectancy not being less than 20 than you are literally the most retarded person I've ever met, should we go back to farms and not bathing? Are you honestly this much of a retard?
Right, changes in markets cause temporary unemployment as people find new, generally more skilled, jobs. This doesn't happen overnight, you won't wake up tomorrow and no one has a job anymore. Truckers will get replaced with robots --> no one becomes a trucker anymore. Factory jobs disappear --> people don't become factory workers anymore
Julian Myers
I knew Islam was good for something.
John Hall
1. The Industrial Revolution and its consequences have been a disaster for the human race. They have greatly increased the life-expectancy of those of us who live in “advanced” countries, but they have destabilized society, have made life unfulfilling, have subjected human beings to indignities, have led to widespread psychological suffering (in the Third World to physical suffering as well) and have inflicted severe damage on the natural world. The continued development of technology will worsen the situation. It will certainly subject human beings to greater indignities and inflict greater damage on the natural world, it will probably lead to greater social disruption and psychological suffering, and it may lead to increased physical suffering even in “advanced” countries.
>vaccines, computers and electricity They've all done more harm than good.
Gavin Miller
That was my point, I was trying to get him to post pictures of the shitty boonies also.
Charles Young
IBM's Watson already does a better job diagnosing cancer than the best oncologists, with a 30% higher accuracy.
Humanity is fucked.
Justin Perry
>If you honestly think that life expectancy not being less than 20 Primitive life expectancies are the result of infant mortality dragging down the average. Most preindustrial people who survived childhood lived well into their sixties, barring accidents.
Connor Flores
What's going to happen when machines obsolete the majority of farmimg jobs?
The amount of jobs created by tractors (engineers, mechanics) will never even come close to replacing the amount of jobs that will be lost (Almost all farmers, ranchers, agricultural industry, etc)
I really don't see how this doesn't eventually end with a literal war against the people trying to force automation everywhere, people will literally lose their entire livelihood to this shit at some point and there won't even be a realistic option to switch skills because those positions will be filled
-you 150 years ago during the industrial revolution, which was far more world changing than today's automation
Colton Bell
Rice terraces are a very good landmarks
Liam Myers
Okay, lets just pretend that's the way we go.
Congratulations without technology we are stuck on earth.
Lets just presume that either climate change is a hoax or has been reversed (something that will take even more of the technology that you want to get rid of to achieve)
There are still countless other threats to the entirety of our species if we're all stuck here on this planet. One extinction level event is all it take. We're toast at the first giant asteroid that we can't stop because we've shunned technology.
"better to die free than to live a slave"
Bullshit, the entirety of evolution on this planet has been a massive push to protect ourselves from dying out. To go against that instinct now is to invalidate hundreds of millions of years of exertion and sex.
Reversing the rise of technology is just tantamount to genetic suicide. So you might as well just DO IT FAGGOT.
Cameron Ramirez
The Industrial Revolution happened when the world had a much smaller population. Manufacturing easily picked up the surplus labor from agriculture.
Now we have a world where most manufacturing and agriculture jobs are going away. Can't have everyone on Earth just providing services to each other. Someone's gotta make shit.
Kevin Smith
You're insane if you think that people from the third world are worse off now than they were in the 1700's. Life expectancy gone up, and the population is growing. People are now being vaccinated and standard of life is way better than 400 years ago.
And you are seriously saying that people are worse off now than 400 years ago? After hundreds of years of massive scientific development? After life expectancy has risen across the world? After disease rates have massively fallen?
And just because people are worse off in the third world, they still are way better off than they used to be. You are seriously stupid if you think vaccines have caused more harm than good
Parker Phillips
ok?
infant mortality rate falling = good
what are you arguing?
Matthew Hall
This is why we need to get off earth. If we can start asteroid mining and putting a colony on mars it opens up many new economic opportunities which may create many jobs down the line.
Owen Cruz
88% of all jobs were "lost". I work in automation. You should read "the Goal". This is not a new problem. There will always be work. There will always be those too lazy to work. The will always be change in what work there is.
Nolan Allen
You can't invoke evolution as justification for maintaining a society that allows undeniably genetically inferior specimens to reproduce. Also: >we should live like zoo animals kept at the pleasure of our technocrat/robot overlords because what if we didn't have space rockets and nuclear bombs to save ourselves from a hypothetical asteroid
Kevin Long
>To go against that instinct now is to invalidate hundreds of millions of years of exertion and sex.
Oh and another thing, YOU might be willing to, but I guarantee you won't push that counter-survivalist philosophy on enough people to make it stick.
Go join the Amish right fucking now, and try convincing 6 billion others to go with you.
Juan Bennett
With the amount of money we waste on shit currently, we could probably speed up space exploration if we'd actually fund it.
Easton Cox
they already have, we just call those robots "chinese"
Nathan Wilson
We stuck on the earth because scientists cares only about the payment, and to create a new invention, you need an investor who will 'fix' your invention to turn it into another source of profit. Also, the whole science is looking doubtful - scientist created over 9000 theories, from how universe was created to how to travel to other stars, but the problem its all just weird words, and weird symbols that pretends to be a formula. Even if we will get the robots, they all will be just a bunch of slaves unable to do anything but their job
Mason Hill
I have read Goldratt's "The Goal", but it's been awhile since then.
I don't think you can just reassign people to new jobs because of automation indefinitely. Eventually there won't be enough jobs to reassign to, at least not without significant further education/retraining. That's why automation fucks over people with families so hard.
Dylan Lopez
Sup Forums will then find it's newest demographic to hate
Landon Hernandez
Do you even know what science is
Ian Russell
>infant mortality rate falling = good wew lad
Angel Reyes
But what is there to go back to? Agriculture as a life style was miserable as well and plagues, famines along with having zero agency in life (admittedly this is the case now for different reasons) were widespread.
I mean fuck, I think you'd have to go back to the true naturals stye of mankind where was when we were Hunter-gatherers to be truly happy again.
Or perhaps there is a point in the future where something akin to that lifestyle is reached again? I believe that there may be a light at the end of this hell tunnel our species is being collectively I raced through by the pandora a box openness the day agriculture was figured out.
Either way I do not see any reason to go back wards. Industrialization in the 19th century was a horrid experience, yet things got better.
Perhaps this may be the case again. Or it may all be a glorified death spiral we just don't understand well enough to prevent and that what is viewed as progress has actually been a sprint towards Armageddon.
Who knows.
Levi James
>no sources for your outrageous claims
sage
Isaiah Wright
We just need peaceful aliens to civilize us. Humans are probably viewed as the Dindus of the Galaxy.
Sebastian Hernandez
This is why comparing to the Industrial Revolution makes no sense. The population wasn't nearly as massive back then.
We have a large and growing NEET class in the US, Japan and Europe. This is the first sign of the shit hitting the fan.
Gabriel Rogers
History has proven the workforce will change. Retraining in new skills is a given. The invisible hand doesn't care who it fucks over, it'll still keep the economy going. Time will tell, though I fear UBI or something similar will eventually get passed somewhere and wreck another major country ussr style.
Isaiah Rogers
I don't see how this is relevant at all or even remotely answers the question. The problem is that when you free up those 99 man hours, the average uneducated nigger has to somehow fill those hours, and they won't be able to.
Isaac Clark
Huh, looks almost like our gdp and technological exponential growth... I wonder if these are somehow linked... maybe economies of scale is a thing...
Lucas Williams
I damn well can. Evolution has peaked here on earth to the point that "inferior specimens" are allowed to survive, but it won't be the case in the new frontier of space.
Also, note that's really the case with literally any species. Evolution and natural selection aren't, nor have they ever been, a particularly efficient machine to weed out genetic weakness. They do it, but just not efficiently, and that is all you're seeing when you see a Down's Syndrome couple. Wait a few more generations, and that won't be an issue. Especially when technology allows us to manipulate evolution as we see fit with gene therapy. Shit that is literally on the verge of being tested on humans, and has already been proven on animals.
Your own ignorance of the mechanics of evolution is your own fucking problem.
Much like that down's syndrome couple, your genetic line will end. Either via natural selection (no sex for you) or via gene therapy where the chromosomes are restored in the developmental stage (the stupid is figuratively washed from your genes)
Jayden Morales
I get what you're saying, but we shouldn't rely on history too much when current developments are shaping up for something unprecedented. You're right about the invisible hand not caring about who it leaves behind, but those people will be a financial burden on us if we don't provide some assistance with the retraining/relocation. Most people stuck in Detroit and other hellholes just can't afford to leave, so they just resort to crime and welfare.
Carson Nelson
>But what is there to go back to? [...] >[...]you'd have to go back to the true naturals stye of mankind where was when we were Hunter-gatherers to be truly happy again. Great job answering your own question. Hunting and gathering is a proven strategy that worked for nearly all of human history. We've spent the past 10,000 years trying to fix the problems we created by adopting agriculture.
Aaron Gonzalez
I think a Democratic Socialist model might work 40 years down the line when society actually needs it. No communist country in the past ever needed it. Not only did they fail because of corruption and the many problems with communism, but I think another unseen factor is that it just wasn't necessary yet.
>he doesn't see any conflict between human dignity and the prospect of human beings becoming manufactured products designed by engineers for the benefit of the system good goy
Ian Perry
In current state, it more looks like a religion for me - everybody believe in it without a doubt, countrys pay enormous amount of cash to scientists(priests), laboratories(temples) built in every country and even its own hierarchy. If someone will deny science, people will call him a freak(infidel). Just look at progression of different beliefs - multiple gods(pagan) -> only one god(christianity, islam, etc.) -> no god(science)
Jason Morris
>Hunting gathering >Working anymore Too many people, too little huntable game
Christian Evans
I think getting rid of genetic defects isn't really taking away your dignity. If I had to choose between having down's syndrome or being genetically edited not to I think everyone would choose the later.
Joseph Reyes
"Necessary" eh? You've clearly spelled out what exactly that means in your post.
"A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the majority discovers it can vote itself largess out of the public treasury. After that, the majority always votes for the candidate promising the most benefits with the result the democracy collapses because of the loose fiscal policy ensuing, always to be followed by a dictatorship, then a monarchy."
Elijah Powell
>he doesn't see any conflict between human dignity and the prospect of human beings becoming manufactured products designed by engineers for the benefit of the system
Irrelevant. Earth is not a Safe Space where anyone needs to respect your dignity. Pussy.
Xavier Johnson
There will be more low skill jobs, and jobs that are currently "skilled" will be come more automated and be known as low skilled.
This is how it has always happened
Before excel, there were thousands of jobs that were purely crunching numbers
those roles still exist, but now can be done by any moron with a computer, because they are automated
New low skill jobs are created as always.
Hunter Edwards
>manufacturing technology in that isnt increasing that quickly, most things that can be automated have been already
You forgot programming, that will be one job that can easily be done/streamlined by technology in the future.
Slowly humans will become more robotic anyway, it is already happening, smartphones becoming an extension of us, constant internet connections, tradition/culture declining, google glass, artificial replacement parts for injuries will soon be bionic upgrades. It will be extremely gradual though, probably the population will gradually fall as the world becomes a less enjoyable/inhabitable place for humans, As usual, things will adapt.
Ryan Gomez
the entire population of the earth could fit in an area the size of manhattan.
this makes no sense, people being hungry at the age of 60 because of "overpopulation" is better than them dying at age 18 with a toothache.
What the fuck is wrong with you? If the earth gets too populated then people die, but killing them earlier or letting them die at birth is retarded.
People are 100x better off
Samuel Thompson
The main effect of the plague was scarcity of labour leading to increase in wages, leading to innovation to increase productivity. All good virtuous stuff!
Owen Lopez
Why does total population size matter for this argument? Everything is scaled, if there are 10 times more people now then there are 10 times more jobs.
Robots will not nearly have as big an impact as the Industrial Revolution
Sebastian Bennett
What is outsourcing?
Zachary Ward
sounds good to me.
Caleb Rogers
>Life expectancy doubled OH GEE WIZ PEOPLE STOPPED BEING 13?