Ask your questions on Islam, France or anything !

>I am a French engineer, born in France from Moroccan parents!

I can answer any questions you have on Islam, the situation in Muslim countries, the situation of arabs and muslims in France or whatever you want!

Other urls found in this thread:

wikiislam.net/wiki/List_of_Killings_Ordered_or_Supported_by_Muhammad
lemonde.fr/societe/article/2016/08/20/saint-etienne-du-rouvray-l-un-des-terroristes-inhume-dans-le-val-d-oise_4985436_3224.html
youtube.com/watch?v=dQgz1Cq5yUo
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conquest_of_Mecca
islamqa.info/en/94840
muslim.org/islam/aisha-age.htm
twitter.com/SFWRedditGifs

How do I get a pakistani gf as an average looking white male living in toronto?

how can I convince you to kill yourself?

Well, I guess it depends on the girl!

You can't!

Morrocan gangs

Where are they in Europe

What major cities in morocco

France, Holland.
Fes, Casablanca.

The murder rate per capita in the US is much higher than Morocco, so is Capital punishment. so if you're implying we're inherently violent, make your case with numbers rather than smug questions.

In France, you don't really have gangs. What you have is more arabs and blacks in ghettos, and a lot of them are doing shit such as burning cars, selling drugs, and destroying place where they live. But you have good people too, but media just focus on delinquents.

It is quite funny because these "arabs" are not the ones who immigrated but their sons. So they basically don't speak a good French and don't speak arabic. So when they come back to Morocco during summer holidays in order to see cousins, etc. most are hated because if they were doing this in Morocco, they would be sent to jail immediately with perhaps some torture in the meantime. Picture is how "French arabs from ghettos" look like!

For other countries, I know that there are not so much Moroccan in UK. More in Spain, Italy and Belgium. I have to admit that when I went to Brussels, I was shocked by the number of arabs. Especially that we were in downtown.

Major cities in Morocco are Casablanca, Rabat, Tanger, Meknes, Marrakech, Fes and Agadir!

What do you believe is the penalty for apostasy?

What do you believe is the penalty for homosexuality?

What is your view on female genital mutilation?

Do you believe your prophet Muhammad was the perfect man, whom we should all emulate?

Do you believe the shariah trumps secular law?

Kill yourself. You're as "French" as i am. Just a kebab squatting in Europe.

You realize you will die when the day of the rope comes, right?

But most 'real Moroccans from Morocco' looks like this. In grey, the Moroccan king

Is it true that Jews in France are leaving due to Muslims?

What are your thoughts about Jews living in Morocco?

Do you consider yourself a full Muslism

Do you support Sharia Law?

Would you be happy if France was ran by Muslims under solely Sharia Law?

Would you support a government takeover by Muslims either peacefully or violently if it meant that France would become an Islamic state under full Sharia Law?

Would you support a full on Jihad against the Europe if it meant that Islam became the dominant religion in the world and that Europe would be a full fledged Islamic State?

1/ No, let God judge them.
2/ Depends on if it is public or private. In private, I believe we should let God judge them. If they are doing cray stuff in public like the picture here, they should be send to jail. But well, it is just my personal opinion, I don't really care.
3/ Forbidden and no excuse. It is done only by blacks and some Egyptians for cultural reasons. But I am against this !
4/ Yes!
5/ Well, it is a complex question. Let's imagine tomorrow the governments tells you that you should kill all Spanish people for example (I won't say Jews or blacks because I know Sup Forums would love it haha). But you are Christian and you believe it is forbidden by God, what are you going to follow? Law or your faith?

But in fact, there are not this problem as I believe that European laws doesn't interfere with Islam laws at all. I know that there are some scandals with some guy who married 4 women or stuff like this, but Islam tells you that when you are in a non-Muslim country, you have to follow their laws (except if it is serious stuff such as killing or non-Islamic principles)!

Well I am pretty integrated! I followed the whole French educational system (which is elitist, instead of your shitty American education) and I am now an engineer.
I consider myself French as I was born here, my native language is French (my arabic is shitty) and my friends and family are here!

Do you want to displace the Christian demographic through migration and breeding, so that Sharia law becomes the new world order?

Perhaps, who knows what will happen! haha

Jews are leaving to Israel, but I don't think it is due to Muslims. They just feel France is more antisemitic since Dieudonné scandal and the terrorist attack against a jew child school (Mohamed Merah) and another attack (Hypercasher) against a Jew shop -- but i don't consider them Muslims.

But on a daily basis, nobody has anything against jews. Even if some people make basic jokes on them.

Concerning Jews living in Morocco, well before the creation of Israel, they was a lot of them. You have all the separate jews in Maghreb (Morocco, Algeria and Tunisia) and they were always treated good. Some Moroccan jews are famous in France such as Gad Elmaleh for example.

Where in France are you living?

Do you believe France will become an Islamic country in 50 years?

1/ Yes
2/ Depends on what you call Sharia Law. If it is what is depicted by medias, no! If it is true Islam as I know it, yes!
3/ No, it is not a Muslim country so I don't understand why we would force a non-Muslim population to follow Muslim rules. Especially that today Islam is sick of all these extremists which try to force everybody to do what they believe is Islam. i remember a guy who told me that
4/ No.
5/ I am against war for religious beliefs. So no Jihad against Europe. I believe that the most powerful weapon concerning beliefs consists in speaking such I am doing right one

you talk like a faggot and your people are in the process of destroying Europe
you think you are acting cute about it but there really is a bounty on your head

No! I want European police to kill all these arab-niggers and terrorists giving us a bad reputation over the world!
In fact, a lot of arabs in Europe believe that there is terrorism in European countries because it helps politicians to be re-elected.

Well, that's good to hear.

Thanks for responding. Allow me to ask some follow-ups

>1/ No, let God judge them.
Reasonable

>2/ Depends on if it is public or private... ...I don't really care.

I don't necessarily disagree, but I have to stop short of the jailing suggestion. I am personally repulsed by homosexuality, but the beauty of living in a free country is that we don't jail people for doing things we disagree with. I do, however, think that pride parades, etc. things that shut down major streets and upset business in the cities should be banned though.

>3/ Forbidden and no excuse. It is done only by blacks and some Egyptians for cultural reasons. But I am against this !

Good. I am very glad to hear it.

>5/ Well, it is a complex question... ...Law or your faith?

This was a cop-out, and I am disappointed. I am not asking you about whether or not you feel it is okay to disobey an immoral law. I believe it is okay to disobey an immoral law. I am asking you if you believe the specific precepts put forward under shariah should come before secular law - precepts of religious intolerance, gender inequality and often barbaric punishments for crimes. This is what I am asking you about.

>4/ Yes!
Okay and here is my main problem with Muslims. In my mind, the main difference between the reasonableness of modern Christianity and the backwardness of modern Islam lies with the Prophets. Jesus was essentially a good-natured socialist hippie

however, a very objective look at Muhammad's life shows us he was:

cont.

Paris, and I also lived in Bordeaux and Toulouse.
I don't think so because most young "muslims" (well in fact their parents were muslim and immigrated here and sons were born here but are not really muslims) are drinking alcohol and doing party such as native people. They don't really care about religion.

>Illiterate (although I do understand that his illiteracy and subsequent ability to put the Quran to written word is a big deal in Islam)
>A merchant-turned warlord, and conducted numerous military campaigns
>A slaver, who gave justifications for slavery
>A pedophile, who married a 6 year old and consummated the marriage when she was 9
>A looter, who plundered cities and seized their wealth for the 'ummah'
>Someone who ordered the death of thousands
>Someone who would have revelations to suit his political needs, even his wives teased him for this

So don't you see how this man is absolutely antithetical to Western 21st century values? The teachings of Jesus mesh nicely with our society, but it seems clear to me and any other Westerner that the major problem with Islam is its prophet. Not his PR, you have plenty of people trying to convince us Muhammad was a feminist and other garbage, but the fact that the man whom you consider the perfect human being, seems quite like a warring, slaving savage to us. And I don't know if that is something Islam can overcome, but I think it must if it has any place in the future of humanity.

Some more questions, but of a more theological nature:

How could Muhammad be sure that it was the Archangel Gabriel who appeared to him at Mt. Hira and not a djinn or shaytan?

How can the doctrine of 'ismah, of theological infallibility, possibly be conducive to a healthy religious community? Should there not be a line between the infallibility of God, and the fallibility of His interpreters. God is infallible, but religion and men are surely not, and I am wondering if you believe in the doctrine of 'ismah

Not my "people", these guys are not Muslims.
You have to understand this what happened in europe! (I will take the example of France):
>Ahmed, born in Morocco cames in the 70s to work as cheap labour in French factories. He was happy, even if he was poor, and was respectful of laws.
>Sons were born here, and some of them are doing shit such as selling drugs or burning cars, acting like american niggers (without the killings). Tehey don't speak a proper French or Arab, so they are rejected by everybody.
>Now these guys, without education, are easily brainwashed by some terrorists or shit like this. You don't imagine how some people from ghettos are stupid (I know them, I spend from 0 to 17 years old in a ghetto).


Now I believe the problem is that the left was accepted all this shit because they were always using the excuse: "it's not their fault but the fault of the society because we excluded them, etc.". The truth is that these people are representing 5 to 10% of the ghetto, and they are shitting on everybody, even other arabs and I never understood why they weren't beaten to death. The other 90-95% are good people in fact.

It is really common sense. But I believe that media like to focus only on shit. i guess we all saw this during the Trump election

how's the moon cult going?

Also, how do you feel knowing that there is no historical record of your religion before Mohammed began preaching it in 700 AD? While there is clear evidence of Judaism and Christianity existing extending into 1000-2000 BC and 1 AD respectively.

How do you argue that Islam is a peaceful religion when Mohammed himself preaches to violently kill infidels and in the early years Islam was spread largely through military conquest of the levant and the middle east?

2/ You are right. that's what I told you I don't really care.

5/ Well I really consider that religious intolerance, gender inequality or barbaric punishments are not part of Islam. I mean you can talk with older Muslims about these stuffs and they never was considering this. In fact, most of them think the new generation is more extremist. I believe Internet had an impact on the youngest.

>Also, how do you feel knowing that there is no historical record of your religion before Mohammed began preaching it in 700 AD? While there is clear evidence of Judaism and Christianity existing extending into 1000-2000 BC and 1 AD respectively

Islam never claims to be the oldest religion. It claims to be the last and final religion. Jesus and Moses are prophets in Islam but it is understood by Muslims that they distorted God's message.

In reality Muhammad lived in a portion of the Arabian peninsula that contained both Jews and Christians, and thus he was influenced by both of them.

Why can't you eat pork?

Ask it something about engineering.

1. Moroccans are pretty cool. Do you see this changing?

2. Will muslims ever develop a generation that isn't bothered about religion.

3. Do you think you are discriminated against?

4. Do you think muslims not from morocco are compatible with france?

I bet if I was an imam I could convince you to kill yourself

Are you going to be out on the street once Le Pen repeals affirmative action?

T'es ingé dans quel domaine ?

What would you say non-muslims should make of people who have such violent fundamentals towards others as islamists?

>4/ Yes!
Then you need to die.

>Illiterate (although I do understand that his illiteracy and subsequent ability to put the Quran to written word is a big deal in Islam)

Well, the pre-Islamic arabs loved poetry. So having a guy who can't read and write having better 'words' than all the best orators is quite a miracle. Quran uses rhymes, etc.

>A merchant-turned warlord, and conducted numerous military campaigns

When you really look at the history of Islam, they were really peaceful during a lot of times. Some were killed until they decided to left Mecca and to move to Medina. Then, wars started between Muslims from Medina and polytheists from Mecca due to the
That's what you


>A slaver, who gave justifications for slavery

Slavery is not the same slavery that you experienced in the US when you kill black people or cut arms or stuff like this. You had to treat them well and there was many ways to free them (if they convert or if they ask to, and then you have to pay them until they are able to pay you their purchase price).
For example, emancipate a slave is equivalent to fast during 60 days in eyes of God. And you are really encourage to free many slaves.
Today there are no longer slavery, so it doesn't apply anymore. And I am against what ISIS is doing, which is really anti-Islamic.
You have to go back to the context. I mean look at when all slaves were free, most of them were begging to their old masters if they could come back. The idea is to free them, but not at one time with no control.
Islam was also saying that a slave or a king is equal to the eyes of God. And this is the reason why Mecca bourgeoisie tried to kill the Prophet Muhammed.

i know. He made the whole thing up to gain political power and land by meshing together the teachings of Moses, Jesus, and placing his own spin on the doctrine when he stood to benefit from it.

Most religions are shams (not trying to be and edgy athiest).

Judaism was derived from the polytheistic beliefs of the mesopotamia and influenced by Zoroastrianism after the Babylonian captivity. The idea of Yahweh came from a fusion of multiple gods over time. We didn't gain concepts like Heaven and Hell until after the jews were in Babylon for decades.

Christianity started off as an offshoot of Judaism, and historically Jesus was most likely a rebel with a religious cause (kinda like ISIS). We also received further influence from the Gnostics, which is how we get Ideas like the devil being less of a diety and more of a tempter who keeps us impure.

Islam is a cheap rip off of both of those, which are rip offs of Gnosticism, Zoroastrianism and Polytheism with a military backing.

>A pedophile, who married a 6 year old and consummated the marriage when she was 9

Well it comes from a hadith (which is a testimony, and some are false). But some guys gives other examples and say she was 17, other 15, others 21.

>A looter, who plundered cities and seized their wealth for the 'ummah'

War is war. They attacked Muslims first and they lost. I think it is the mean difference between Islam and Christianity. Both are for justice. But when there is an injustice, 'modern' Christians accepts to do nothing and talk about love when Muslims think they should be a punishment against this injustice.

>Someone who ordered the death of thousands

If he killed thousands of innocents, it is horrible. If he killed soldiers during a battle, I think this is not horrible (even if war is horrible but when you fight, you fight to win)!
He is the one who forbid poisoning waters, or killing old people, women and children or anyone abandoning the other side and converting to Islam during war! He have some strict rules!

>Someone who would have revelations to suit his political needs, even his wives teased him for thi

Well, let's say he did all of this for political needs. What did he do with his political influence? He wasn't rich, and was accessible, modest and humble. Most sect leaders use their influence to become rich, isn't it?

>i don't consider them Muslims.
Still they getting burried on muslim cemetery when it is haram to burried non-muslims there. J'en ai marre de cette merde de comment ils sont pas considérés des musulmans mais ils trouvent toujours une jolie place dans vos cimetière.

>2/ Depends on what you call Sharia Law. If it is what is depicted by medias, no! If it is true Islam as I know it, yes!
Reality isn't how things are but how I like to think they are. I suppose all muslims countries that say they follow Sharia Law and do things like stone women aren't real muslims neither just like fake muslim terrorists that happens to be born to muslims and raised as muslims.

>When you really look at the history of Islam, they were really peaceful during a lot of times.

But the perfect man being any sort of warlord and executioner at all sets a very dangerous ideal for Humanity, don't you think? I believe nonviolence is the highest principle we can achieve. If the perfect Human to 1.6 billions killed people who did not follow his faith, 1.6 billions can, at any time, believe that it is moral and justified to kill people who do not follow their faith. It's incredibly dangerous.

>Slavery is not the same slavery that you experienced in the US

Slavery is slavery is slavery. It was not chattel slavery, but Islamic slavery claimed far more victims than US chattel slavery ever did, and the depths of its depravities were just as deep as the Americans were, do not kid yourself into thinking that because you can find some examples of slaves being treated well, or being set free, that all, or even the majority of slaves had such treatment. Also,

>Today there are no longer slavery, so it doesn't apply anymore.

What a ridiculous statement. There is more slavery today and far more unfree persons than there has ever been before at any period in history. Most of the slaves remain in majority Islamic countries. Mauritania only abolished slavery official in 1984, but only passed laws that allow slaveholders to be prosecuted in 2007. 2007!

>The idea is to free them, but not at one time with no control.

How heinous. If the idea was to free them, Muhammad would not have taken slaves in the first place.

>Islam was also saying that a slave or a king is equal to the eyes of God.

More corrupt moralization, meant to somehow rationalize to slaveholders that it was okay if they held slaves and mistreated other humans because they would all be equal in the afterlife... what garbage.

>So don't you see how this man is absolutely antithetical to Western 21st century values? The teachings of Jesus mesh nicely with our society, but it seems clear to me and any other Westerner that the major problem with Islam is its prophet. Not his PR, you have plenty of people trying to convince us Muhammad was a feminist and other garbage, but the fact that the man whom you consider the perfect human being, seems quite like a warring, slaving savage to us. And I don't know if that is something Islam can overcome, but I think it must if it has any place in the future of humanity.

I understand your opinion because it is based on what you think Islam is (and I wasn't muslim and was seeing all the problem in Muslim worlds and bad publicity on Islam, I would perhaps believe like you). But the truth is that he gave very strong principles on forgiving (he forgave one of his biggest opponent who killed the Prophet's uncle and ate his heart), on equality (before him, arabs were burying girls alive), on justice (every human is equal under the eyes of God and the only distinction is made of the faith - a non-arab is not superior to an arab and vice versa). Even during war, he gave some strict rules (don't kill women, old people, children or people fleeing), don't poison water or burn lands, don't torture prisoners, etc.
He also united all the Arabian peninsula.

>Some more questions, but of a more theological nature:

>How could Muhammad be sure that it was the Archangel Gabriel who appeared to him at Mt. Hira and not a djinn or shaytan?

Well, I guess you have to look at the whole picture. If it was a djinn, I guess he would have made a worst message than slaves and masters are equal, don't bury the girls, a non-arab is equal to an arab, etc.

By the way, Jesus is one of the most important prophet for Muslims. Do you think a djinn would say that?

>I am against war for religious beliefs. So no Jihad against Europe. I believe that the most powerful weapon concerning beliefs consists in speaking such I am doing right one
So why the fuck do you believe that such a warmonger as Mohammed is the perfect man instead of the peaceful Jesus?

How can the doctrine of 'ismah, of theological infallibility, possibly be conducive to a healthy religious community? Should there not be a line between the infallibility of God, and the fallibility of His interpreters. God is infallible, but religion and men are surely not, and I am wondering if you believe in the doctrine of 'ismah.

Well, I don't know what you mean by religion. but yes men are faillible. I have to admit I am not an expert, but I believe God is infaillible and that the Prophet was the best human such as others prophets such as Moise, Jesus, Jacob, Salomon, etc.

Moon cult?

Well, I don't think there was a Muslim world coming out of nowhere.

+ they started war first. What did you expect, to let polytheists slaughter them? You can"t compare a kill during war to a kill of a innocent guy!

>Islam never claims to be the oldest religion. It claims to be the last and final religion. Jesus and Moses are prophets in Islam but it is understood by Muslims that they distorted God's message.

>In reality Muhammad lived in a portion of the Arabian peninsula that contained both Jews and Christians

That's perfectly true! We consider Jesus not as God's son, but as a prophet. And all the prophets of the Bible are also prophets in Islam. We believe that Biblead Torah were sent by God, and then with time, humans distorted God's message. So God has sent a last prophet, Muhammed, with last God's book which will never be falsified again (and in fact, a Quran from 6th century and a Quran from 21th century are exactly the same, not even a letter has changed)

>Well it comes from a hadith (which is a testimony, and some are false). But some guys gives other examples and say she was 17, other 15, others 21.

But here is the problem, clearly a massive amount of Muslims believe from Muhammad's example that marrying children is okay! It takes place all the time in Islamic countries, and now even Turkey, the so-called moderate nation is trying to pass legislature to allow the marriage of girls as young as 13.

>War is war. They attacked Muslims first and they lost

And then Muhammad made war against Mecca. I do not think any modern Human should hold war or making war as an ideal.

>He is the one who forbid poisoning waters, or killing old people, women and children or anyone abandoning the other side and converting to Islam during war! He have some strict rules!

But he absolutely did order women and children to be killed.

wikiislam.net/wiki/List_of_Killings_Ordered_or_Supported_by_Muhammad

>Well, let's say he did all of this for political needs. What did he do with his political influence?

That's not the point I'm making. I making the point that it smacks of fraud.

>I understand your opinion because it is based on what you think Islam is...

You're saying that, because his acts did not descend to the depths of say, the Mongols or Vlad the Impaler, that makes what he did somehow acceptable? And that's just laying aside the claim that he was the perfect man! The perfect man owned slaves! The perfect ordered murders! How can you possibly believe that?!

>I guess he would have made a worst message than slaves and masters are equal, don't bury the girls, a non-arab is equal to an arab, etc.

He certainly didn't give the message that masters and slaves are equal, for if he had given that message, he would have simply broken the shackles of slaves and outlawed it. He quite obviously wanted slavery, that most evil of human institutions, to continue.

Because I am Muslim

You can

1/ Moroccan from Morocco are cool and educated. Some Moroccan born in French ghettos are uneducated and looks like niggers in the US even if most of them are also cool!
2/ If you are talking of western Muslims, it is already the case. Look just at French Nabilla or Ayem, these girls are tele-reality whores.
3/ I have to admit that I was never discriminated because I speak a proper French and had the opportunity French elite education (prépa + école d'ingénieurs)
4/ I think it is more of culture. But I can"t say as all arabs in France are mostly from Morocco, Algeria and Tunisia. We don't have Egyptians, Iraki or Pakistani

>By the way, Jesus is one of the most important prophet for Muslims.

I have never seen a self-professed Muslim emulate Jesus. So far as I am concerned, that seems to me much like a grab for legitimacy.

>
Well, I don't know what you mean by religion. but yes men are faillible. I have to admit I am not an expert, but I believe God is infaillible and that the Prophet was the best human such as others prophets such as Moise, Jesus, Jacob, Salomon, etc.

Doctrine of 'ismah is specifically about the Prophet and his immediate family, as well as those who act in his standard being infallible AS WELL as God. To me that is supremely arrogant. Nothing is perfect or infallible but God, not even any recipient of His messages

You know that an imam is just another man? He can be wrong too. Many people think imams are kind of islamic priests, but it's wrong. It is just a guy chosen in the community because people think he is the most knowledgeable guy around.

I am not against LePen because he wants to put French first, I am against her because she is a commie and they disgust me.

Ingénieur généraliste grande école + diplôme d'ingénieur pétrolier

Depends! I am against violence against common people. I have to problem if secret services kill a terrorist or an extremist. Go to Morocco or Algeria, you would see what they do to terrorists, you would just love somebody has the balls to do the same thing in Europe. If you want, I can talk about ka3a torture for extremists.

Oh!

lemonde.fr/societe/article/2016/08/20/saint-etienne-du-rouvray-l-un-des-terroristes-inhume-dans-le-val-d-oise_4985436_3224.html

They refused to bury a Christian priest killer in the muslim cemetery

I believe this to. You don't stone women. But really, look at Maghreb, Egypt, Irak, Lybia. You don't have women stonning and they are Muslims. You just take the example of a shithole in Afghanistan where 50% of people don't even know how to read

Do you notice Sunni-Shia conflicts in France? Morocco? What are your thoughts on that?

OP when did you get raped in bum bum by immam lad ?

>But the perfect man being any sort of warlord and executioner ... It's incredibly dangerous.

Yes, I think too. Nonviolence is key. In fact the thin is that Islam gives many rules for the citizen, but also how a Muslim state should act. For the average citizen, violence is forbidden (and you can look at the Prophet history -- he was famous because he was trustful, even if you are a non-muslim) and you have to respect each other. Now, when another state declares war on your Muslim state, it is the duty of each Muslim to fight and to go to war. I know this is complex, but it really logical. Such as today, you don't have the right to kill somebody in the street, but if Canada was attacked, you would have to join the army and fight for your country. And unfortunately, there will be dead. That's why I said that you can"t compare killing innocents with killing soldiers on a battlefield.
And wars against muslims were started by polytheists. At the beginning, there was peace treaty between Mecca and Medina, broken by Mecca if I remember well.

+ if 1.6billion people really thought this, there would be more wars?

>Slavery ... such treatment. Also,

Well, like I told you, if you follow the Prophet example, he freed many slaves. The man doing the call for prayer was an ex-black slave freed by the Prophet.
Now, when there is money, you always find a way to do it. Look at Ottoman muslim people taking white people and cutting them balls to sell them as slaves. I don't think you can justify that by Islam, but I guess you will always find a way to legalise that if you really want.

How is LePen a commie?

For OP

youtube.com/watch?v=dQgz1Cq5yUo

Dont Ignore me dirty filthy mudslime .. ok
I will burn you !
why does that dirty paedo baby raper mohhamods you worship hate women so much Nigger ?

>What a ridiculous statement. There is more slavery today and far more unfree persons than there has ever been before at any period in history. Most of the slaves remain in majority Islamic countries. Mauritania only abolished slavery official in 1984, but only passed laws that allow slaveholders to be prosecuted in 2007. 2007!

If you took Mauritania, well, it is a black poor country and I have to admit I didn't know there was still slavery. Let's say that political and judicial power is not really effective.
Btw, before 1960, Mauritania was a French colony also.

>How heinous. If the idea was to free them, Muhammad would not have taken slaves in the first place.
>More corrupt moralization, meant to somehow rationalize to slaveholders that it was okay if they held slaves and mistreated other humans because they would all be equal in the afterlife... what garbage.

No really, if you look at the Prophet life (as my parents teach me), we learn that this is bad and that you have to treat everybody well. I mean Islam really put emphasise on many things such as non-violence (except in case of war, and even in war, there are rules), respect, morality, etc.

See

How many child brides do you have?

>But here is the problem, clearly a massive amount of Muslims believe from Muhammad's example that marrying children is okay! It takes place all the time in Islamic countries, and now even Turkey, the so-called moderate nation is trying to pass legislature to allow the marriage of girls as young as 13.

But most Muslim countries don't marry girls at 13. You are talking about shitholes somewhere in Afghanistan.

>And then Muhammad made war against Mecca. I do not think any modern Human should hold war or making war as an ideal.

You should look at the whole picture.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conquest_of_Mecca

>peace treaty
>broken by the Quraysh (polytheists)
>took Mecca without killing anybody (and they could have slaughter their ennemies if they really wanted)

>But he absolutely did order women and children to be killed.
>wikiislam.net/wiki/List_of_Killings_Ordered_or_Supported_by_Muhammad

Not sure of the source. During my education, people really emphasised that even during war, you don't have the right to kill women, old people, children and those who don't want to be involved in the battle.

>That's not the point I'm making. I making the point that it smacks of fraud.

yes but I say that when you fraud, you do it for some reason. Money, women, etc. He won nothing. He wasn't even rich.

>You're ... ordered murders! How can you possibly believe that?!

Read the Wikipedia article for example

>He certainly didn't give the message that masters and ..., to continue.

I give you a link because I am not an expert of the subject: islamqa.info/en/94840
Look at thee full picture. But you don't have the right to put a free man as a slave (except during a war) and when you are a slave, you can buy yourself.

>I have never seen a self-professed Muslim emulate Jesus. So far as I am concerned, that seems to me much like a grab for legitimacy.

I heard that Quran talks about Jesus 35 times when it talks about the Prophet by his name only 4 or 5 times

>Doctrine of 'ismah is specifically about the Prophet and his immediate family, as well as those who act in his standard being infallible AS WELL as God. To me that is supremely arrogant. Nothing is perfect or infallible but God, not even any recipient of His messages

People thinking this are shia people (5% of whole muslim, they are mainly in Iran). Sunni (95% of muslims) don't believe because you have the same blood than the prophet, you are infaillible.

The main difference between shia and sunni is that shia believes a member of the Prophet family should be commander of Muslims when sunni believes it should be the most qualified.

No Shia in France or Morocco, so no conflict.
Shia are a minority of muslims, located in Iran, Eastern Irak and Lebanon mainly.
These conflicts are in Irak-Iran, or between Saudi-Iran.

Never raped, imam are not priests and they have the right to be married (I say this with no intention to offend any Catholic)

>but I believe God is infaillible and that the Prophet was the best human such as others prophets such as Moise, Jesus, Jacob, Salomon, etc.

But he raped a little girl...

She has absolutely no economic plan. She still wants welfare and she just took her father's party. She is popular because people are tired of the mainstream French party which are really corrupt or weak.

To give you an example:
I am an engineer. Average salary: 42k
My boss pays 60k after employer contributions and I earn 33k after employee contributions. After that, I have to pay income tax, so I just earned 28k (when I cost to my boss 60k, so 32k to the government and 28k for me). And this is in Paris where a 300ft-square flat costs 1100e/month.
You have to pay taxes on everything also (home tax - 1k, 20% on each product, etc.) and have to take compulsory insurance.

If you are on welfare with 2 kids, you can earn 1,500+/month. After taxes, I am around 2,000/month with a rent to pay in Paris. So you are richer by being in France in a small town on welfare than to be an engineer in Paris (and I have a kind of French Ivy League diploma - others have even worse)

Only François Fillon and Emmanuel Macron seems to understand that we pay too much taxes and that we need to lower it!

0

Look at muslim.org/islam/aisha-age.htm
Nobody knows really her age. If you try to find her true age, you will have many answers by looking to different Islamic source

>The above mentioned statement by Aisha in Bukhari, about her earliest memory of her parents being that they were followers of Islam, begins with the following words in its version in Bukhari’s Kitab-ul-Kafalat. We quote this from the English translation of Bukhari by M. Muhsin Khan:

“Since I reached the age when I could remember things, I have seen my parents worshipping according to the right faith of Islam. Not a single day passed but Allah’s Apostle visited us both in the morning and in the evening. When the Muslims were persecuted, Abu Bakr set out for Ethiopia as an emigrant.” [9]

Commenting on this report, Maulana Muhammad Ali writes:

“This report sheds some light on the question of the age of Aisha. … The mention of the persecution of Muslims along with the emigration to Ethiopia clearly shows that this refers to the fifth or the sixth year of the Call. … At that time Aisha was of an age to discern things, and so her birth could not have been later than the first year of the Call.” [10]

Again, this would make her more than fourteen at the time of the consummation of her marriage.

By the way, thank you because most people are really respectful! I love debating with you

>Nobody knows really her age.
That's bullshit revisionism and you know it. There is consensus among Muslim scholars that she was 6 when he married her, and between 9 and 10 when he first raped her.

up

you dude wast

Well you can go to Morocco, Turkia, Algeria, Lebanon, Syria, Egypt, etc.
Nobody marries a 6-year old girl.
You don't even have the right to marry someone before puberty in Islam. And the woman must agree before marrying a man.

...

Reread that post and then you'll figure out why you're being ignored...

>You don't even have the right to marry someone before puberty in Islam.
And when does puberty start in Islam? 9?

> And the woman must agree before marrying a man.
Children can't consent to marriage. They're children. Also why are you calling little girls women? A woman as a fully grown adult.

I guess that puberty is when you have your first ejaculation as a man and first period as girl.

Before puberty, in Islam, you are not responsible and cannot be judged. If a children die, he goes directly to Paradise in Islam. And you cannot marry

So I guess it is around 13-14 for most people?

My grand-mother was married at 15 with my grand-father who was 18

>“The Prophet wrote the (marriage contract) with Aisha while she was six years old and consummated his marriage with her while she was nine years old and she remained with him for nine years (i.e. till his death)” (Bukhari 7.62.88).

>The Prophet engaged me when I was a girl of six (years). We went to Medina and stayed at the home of Bani-al-Harith bin Khazraj. (Bukhari 5.58.234).

Seems to me that if the Prophet can fuck 9 year olds, so can anyone else; he lead by example. And we both know that they marry away little girls as young as 11 or 12 in many Muslim countries today.

You aren't French

These are hadiths. Which are testimonies and could be false. And basically, when you have contradictions, it means that the hadith is false. But I agree with you that there should be some work done on this subject in Muslim countries and that is a current problem.

Je le suis !

checked

>Born in France
>Raised in France
>Lived in France with th rest of his French family
>Nope not French

wew lad

I guess this means that your KEK wanted I up this thread, isn't it?

Do you consider Muhammad a pedophile and child rapist now that you know he had sex with his child bride Aisha at age 9?

Daily reminder that Jesus is the one and only savior and the moon god worshiping false prophet mohammed is burning in hell

thank you and fuck off /pol is a christian board

Do you live and work in Toulouse/Airbus? We might have met irl. Then again, there's so many of you sandniggers in France...

No, I was born in Toulouse but working for a petroleum company in Paris

...

Btw, is it true that Airbus salaries are jokes? I heard about 33k as a starting salary in Toulouse

Sup Forums is a true freedom speech board

I appreciate your balls for coming here, but you gotta realize that this is the sort of attitude that holds Muslims back from being civilized. You have to acknowledge the fucked up bullshit parts of your religion and bring Islam into the modern age. Christians have Jesus who basically disregarded the Old Testament idiocy, and Islam needs something similar.

I really believe that there is a big problem in the Muslim worlds, due to political problems (corruption, wars, terrorism and brain-washed people). It is really complex and can not just justify this by the religion.

If it was only religion, then I can say that Christianity is false because during the 14th century the Muslim empire was the center of civilisation when Europe was suffering. I think that today we are in a kind a Muslim middle age.

I hope peace will come back to Muslim countries. But the situation is not easy in Lybia, Syria, Irak due to war and the corruption of the Saudi family (financing terrorism)

I met a moroccan who was working there. Yes, the salaries are a joke, because they don't produce anything worth the money they spend. They cut every corner.

Yeah when I heard that I choose to avoid aerospace industry.
A friend in civil engineering is doing 5000 swiss franc per month in switzerland. Is it good?

Look. What you're saying is all true, but only for extremists. Child marriage happened in the bible and we've moved past allowing that through law and applied cultural pressure. Some countries where Islam is present have yet to reform, yet we know at once point they were "modern" so it is possible for Muslims to ignore their scripture.

OP is saying extremists are assholes too. If some asshole preacher goes too is inciting violence, you either ignore them, talk to them, or lock them up. It doesn't matter which religion. We already have laws and enforcement agencies for this in every single country dealing with extremists of all sorts. Targeting a specific religion does nothing but inflame tensions in an already tense situation.