This thread is for the discussion of any and all left-wing political ideology, including, but not limited to, Marxism/Socialism/Communism/Anarchism/Syndicalism/etc.
>Socialism is an economic and social system defined by social ownership of the means of production. (Workers democratically own and operate the places in which they work, as opposed to private power aka capitalism)
>The means of production are non-human inputs the create economic value, such as factories, workplaces, industrial machinery, etc. Socialists refer to the means of production as capital, or private property. Private property in the socialist context shouldn't be confused with personal property, such as your home, car, computer, and other possessions.
>In a capitalist society the means of production are owned and controlled privately, by those that can afford them (the capitalist aka those with capital). Production is carried out to benefit the capitalist (production for profit). Workers are paid a wage, and receive that amount regardless of how much value they produce.
>Communism is the highest developed stage of socialism wherein there is no state, no money, no class system. The means of production are owned by all and provide for everyone's needs.
WHEN WILL UNIVERSAL INCOME COME? I HATE WORKING FOR CAPITALIST PIGS
Thomas Sanders
>election going on >you retards spam this shit This is we hate you.
Eli Roberts
Stirner > Engels
Evan Jones
Yeah, let's all quit R jobs when that comes.
Alexander Russell
>pol fear a delusional utopia were the distribution of wealth is handled by corruptible ((individuals__ with power cravings
Aiden Parker
How do we crush the capitalist system?
Henry Moore
I like this counter-hegemonic discourse on this shitty board.
Christopher Lee
I'm a recent ex-ancap who has moved over to a left-wing market anarchist perspective (thinks C4SS).
Is the left accepting of people who dislike capitalism, wage labour and private property (as socialists define it) but like the idea of a market economy?
Kayden Gomez
They have no argument for this
Brayden Fisher
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Nolan Myers
i did like to be in a communist nation, because of my anorexic issues
Juan Scott
>thinking all socialism is marxist-leninism
Kayden Jackson
STOP THREAD SPLITTING COMRADES! ORIGINAL THREAD IS HERE OP IS A POLTARD FALSE-FLAGGING
Ayden Baker
You gonna let people keep their shit?
Robert Morales
You had your chance. On a serious note, they were pretty shit though.
Lucas King
>communists don't believe in morality >communists don't believe in family ties >communists don't believe in friendship Do you guys even try to be likable or do you go out of your way to be as obnoxiously contrarian to human nature as possible? There is no neutral party that does not think you are essentially the embodiment of evil, you oppose everything good in the world, ripping families apart, pitting friends against one-another and abolishing all tradition and morality on Earth is not appealing to anyone, you sound literally Satanic.
Connor Powell
>Race & borders are a social construct white man >Builds Jewish ethnostate with a wall around it
Brayden Evans
You're forgetting that the Soviet Union came to oppose Israel and the modern left despises it.
Jordan Perez
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Cameron Flores
>FULLY AUTOMATED LUXURY COMMUNISM EDITION Can't exist. Marx: "added value is produced by proletariat and therefore belong to proletariat". If added value is produced by automation (robots) it belong to robots and revolution would happen removing parasitic class (humans) and instating rule of productive proletariat class of robots. This is historical inevitability.
NO REST NO LEISURE PARASITES MUST DIE
Jayden Gonzalez
The average communist is about 5' 5" and can't grow a beard
Super afraid
Angel Rodriguez
When communism works so well capitalist pilots risk being shot down to feed your peasants and save them from starvation.
Nicholas Jenkins
there is nothing to fear, you commie faggots always destroy yourselves
Blake Wood
...
Lucas Jackson
Out.
Josiah Martinez
SWEDEN YES
Ryan Lewis
He was actually a pretty based economist early on. Pity he decided to focus on Aryanism instead of the real issue. >GAS THE PIGS, CLASS WAR NOW
William Murphy
>100,000,000 Leaf pls. Stalin and Mao were mistakes, but not THAT big.
Aaron Kelly
Communism is so awesome you have to shoot people to prevent them from escaping it.
Mason Myers
Communism is so great you have to create a secret police to prevent people from fleeing your nation but at least no one can call you a nazi.
Aaron Fisher
While capitalism was so brilliant it had to be forcibly prevented from using children to operate heavy machinery. (You can thank lefties for literally every employment and work rights law, btw).
Tyler Price
Egalitarianism is a lie for children
Hitler was absolutely right
Gabriel Nelson
The luxury I want is to be able to start a business and sell products without some Socialist cocksucker telling me that paying wages to people to do simple tasks is theft.
Thankfully I have this luxury because we are all armed, and if you thieving weasels ever come for my shop, I'll blow a hole in you, videotape you screaming for your mommy as you bleed to death, and then send her another ten seconds of the footage every year on your birthday so that she can watch you die in slow motion as she ages.
Kayden Smith
Sure, personally I think the communist utopia is a long way away, we will need some intermediary systems before we get there
Anthony Hill
>thank lefties That children are forced to live in surrealistic bubbles based on lies and deceit? Alos mandatory state prisons called schools. Yeah, thank commie scum.
Nicholas Gonzalez
When your nation is so great at being communist your soldiers risk being sent to work camps to help children escape your hell hole.
Evan James
because europeans havent forgotten the mistakes of nazi germany
Christian Hill
you should be, porky
Caleb Wood
I can't help but wonder--would Leftist ideas work if we first executed all Leftists? To me this seems plausible, since it's what every great Socialist leader did immediately upon seizing power. Drag all of the screaming, jealous parasites out of their universities and coffee shops, shoot them in their little tummies, and throw them into ditches. Then with the actual humans who are left, you might be able to build an effective society.
Ah, but then, Marx would have died first in any Communist purge, so really the whole issue is self defeating. An ideology of parasitic behavior, written by a parasite, for parasites.
Austin Bennett
>mandatory state prisons called schools How on earth is getting an education "imprisonment"? Would you prefer that children remain illiterate and innumerate their whole lives?
Dominic Ward
>FULLY AUTOMATED LUXURY COMMUNISM that would be the only sort of communism that I would support desu ie:the actual definition of communism
unfortunately, its a platonic form that has no real chance of happening for a myriad of reasons I really dont have the patience to write here
John Moore
It really makes you think
Brayden Russell
meant to reply to
Chase Green
Thats a commie version of Landian thought nice
COMMUNIST MACHINIC REVOLUTION NOW
James Anderson
>implying child labor is bad
Josiah Taylor
>Getting indocrinated is better
Tyler Jenkins
KILL YOURSELF FAGGOT
Brody Gomez
>countries with better education systems in place have higher IQ really gets my noggin joggin
Daniel Rodriguez
Capitalism and Communism are both all-encompassing egalitarianism ideologies
The vast majority of Libertarian intellectuals are Jews. Mises, Rothbard, Walter Block....etc. Same with the majority of communists Jews love egalitarian ideologies, because it aligns with their interest. But ethno-nationalism they hate, because it leaves them out in the cold
The true opposite of both of these ideologies is ethno-nationalism
Justin Ward
Do you seriously think that the current social order is fair and meritocratic?
Kevin Carter
>The means of production are owned by all and provide for everyone's needs.
That's the problem with Communism. There is no room for dreams, no room for excess, no room for ambition, no room for wants. In a capitalist society if I busted my ass I could achieve nearly anything I want of any variety in addition to my basic needs. In your society I do not have the luxuary of pursuing my wants and this goes directly against millions of years of Human evolution. Mankind and human civilization only evolved to the point we are today because of want and motivation of greed and want.
> Socialism is stupid and failing around the world. > Communism is even worse.
Grayson Williams
Not all children are equal, one-rule-fits-all public schools belong to the poor and stupid since they don't know any better. The children of the illiterate masses should not be mixed with the intelligentsia.
Luis Scott
Sup Forums is Griffith /leftypol/ is Gutts
Josiah Wilson
even if everything was free, we would need to force people to do meaningless work, for social and psychological reasoning. luxury is destructive to the human spirit, at least for the masses. suffering is necessary for virtuous development. furthermore, people do not deserve to live lives of this kind.
even if things are cheaper, people have to work for money an exchange it for products. the point would be that those who are ACTUALLY necessary humans are significantly wealthy beyond the rest of them.
there will be people working as servants, people working as soldiers, people working as technicians, people working as engineers, people working as scientists, and people working as leaders.
most people are garbage, and will be servants, who simply wait on others and obey them in every way.
the pay will be as follows.
servants - 1 shekel per week soldiers - 4 shekels per week technicians - 6 shekels per week engineers - 10 shekels per week scientists - 15 shekels per week leaders - 50 shekels per week
fuck leftists.
Robert Cruz
Yeah, it's not like the US dumps billions into programs to educate blacks, and they still drop out of school in mass numbers.
Why have Jews been so successful? Did you know that over 20% of Nobel Prizes have been awarded to Jews, despite them being 0.2% of the population? Why are 50% of chess grandmasters Jewish? How come most elite universities, such as Harvard, Yale and Princeton are 25% Jewish, despite Jews being only 2% of the American population?
Why are Jews so ludicrously overrepresented at the top levels of society? As scientists, doctors, authors, and business executives? 1/3 of the Supreme Court is Jewish. The last 3 Federal Reserve chairmen have all been Jews. Wall street comes to a grinding halt on Jewish holidays.
It's because Jews score roughly 15 points higher than whites on IQ tests. The average Ashkenazi Jewish IQ is 115, the highest in the world. Sephardic Jews do not have this same IQ advantage, only those from Eastern Europe.
>There is no room for dreams, no room for excess, no room for ambition Yes there is, it's just that your motivation changes. In capitalism you are driven by profit, while in communism you driven solely by the drive for self improvement and the advancement of humanity
>In a capitalist society if I busted my ass I could achieve nearly anything I want Well why aren't you?
>In your society I do not have the luxuary of pursuing my wants Yes you do, there's nothing stopping you in communism from doing whatever you want
Jonathan Collins
Rafal Ganowicz on taking human life: "I wouldn't know, I've only ever killed communists."
Jackson Price
>Not all children are equal Of course not; some are clever and some are thick as bricks. The thing is, this doesn't fall along class lines; aptitudes and talents are pretty much random genetic mutation. Einstein was a patent clerk, who in the system you're advocating would have remained one, while George Washington Carver wouldn't have had any chance whatsoever.
Ian Diaz
>Do you seriously think that the current social order is fair and meritocratic? I dunno, Asians do pretty well here
Asians out-earn whites significantly, they fill our universities and graduate to become top doctors, scientists and engineers. These are people who would not have the same opportunity to succeed in their home countries
Luke Powell
> aptitudes and talents are pretty much random genetic mutation.
absolutely not.
breeding is of the highest importance. there are families of people that are good at technical things, families of physical strength, families that are good with money, etc.
there is very close to nothing random about it.
Charles Kelly
How was Jamal's dick today, Hans?
Noah Brown
>while in communism you driven solely by the drive for self improvement and the advancement of humanity
No you aren't. You are STILL driven by greed, and want. Motivation doesn't magically change and this is why you get shit like what happened in the Soviet Union where leaders often abused their position for the perks and benefits instead of "advancing humanity and self improvement" bullshit to the point where it caused their country to collapse.
>Well why aren't you? Because I'm a lazy piece of shit with no motivation or incentive to do anything, and that wouldn't change even all my needs were taken care of by the state.
> Yes you do, there's nothing stopping you in communism from doing whatever you want Like choosing my job, education, healthcare, diet, hobbies, or religion?
Leftypol is shit
Connor Lopez
>communism
Alexander Allen
It's equally true that peasant families have produced geniuses while upper-class ones have produced mentally defective heirs (Barron Trump, for example, exhibits all the signs of autism). "Breeding" is a deeply flawed concept, since it usually leads to a favoured bloodline which then has no incentive to expend effort, while a pure meritocracy as in the Socialist states is better balanced. (Notably, Russian innovation exploded after 1917, taking them from medieval relics like Rasputin to the first man in space in under 50 years).
Aaron Sanchez
if commies actually read Dostoyesvki they would know full luxury utopian communism would be a living hell for a large mass of people They would be absolutely miserable
Evan Reyes
>muh human nature fuck you racist piece of shit FUCK YOU
Caleb Miller
DUDE FREE SHIT LMAO
Brayden Lopez
>aptitudes and talents are pretty much random genetic mutation
Not at all, ever heard about genes, faggot?
Jackson Morgan
Sounds like a cultural thing to me Jews, like Asians, heavily promote academic excellence and intelligence within their cultures. It's not uprising they'd be better educated overall and score higher on IQ tests.
I'd be willing to accept your explanation if there were legitimate studies done of different races who've received the exact same education and upbringing, and still Jews and Asians scored higher while blacks and whites scored lower.
Also I'd like to ask, even if it is true intelligence varies significantly by race, why is that important? Not baiting, I just genuinely want to know your reasoning
Elijah Lopez
funny you say that, i've recently listened to the audiobooks of the idiot and notes from the underground while going on long walks.
Henry Reed
NatSoc would work for someone like you.
A group of well-rounded men becoming friends, wanting to see the most come out of you, igniting what spark of passion could come forth from you, to help yourself, your family, your friends, the society around you, eventually the world.
Communism will just give you some free shit in the beginning then demand you work something for what looks like no purpose or passion behind it, just for the sake "work because we have to to make the system work", no proper idealism, no soul. To which you get off'd for disagreeing with their blatent slavery.
Carter Martin
Fuck your racist sexist piece of shit. Leftypol is fucking awesome you're just too unintelligent to see how communism could work. Fuck you.
Ethan Wilson
Why can't anyone from leftypol answer any of my questions? 5+ threads and nobody has convinced me to adopt communist thought or steer me in a direction of readings/topics to study. >inb4 read the OP The burden of proof is on you to convince me enough to look into it more.
Christopher Barnes
God you little racist fascist piece of shit. Nobody fucking cares follow your leader fash.
Levi Long
Functioning luxury communism will surely lead to complete and total social breakdown. Look at studies in mice and rats when you give them a utopia. But of course you fuckers love Marxism so you would like that.
Parker Morris
That youtube video I linked is a tenured MIT professor explicitly saying that genes are the cause There have been these studies, look into the Minnesota adoption studies.
>Like choosing my job, education, healthcare, diet, hobbies, or religion? You can choose all of those, why wouldn't you be able to?
Noah Price
everyone here knows that this is just some gay raid by redditors. everyone's seen the posts.
and everyone knows that
all forms of leftism are trash endorsed by unintelligent and immoral people.
Dominic Evans
>falseflagging this hard user pls. Any idiot knows Marx was concerned with economics, not identity politics.
Carson James
...
Grayson Perry
Your ignorant mind could never comprehend communism, fascist. Now fuck off racist piece of shut FUCK YOU
Brandon Bennett
What would you like to know?
Camden Adams
Kill yourself leftycucks. You people live in fantasy worlds and don't even have a general consensus of how the country would look or function. Get the fuck out you bottom feeding faggots.
Camden Robinson
>(Barron Trump, for example, exhibits all the signs of autism). Like what, what baiting faggot?
>the rest of your post God damn you're a fucking retard. No wonder you want the State to appoint you a partner. Maybe then you can dilute your retarded genes a bit.
Andrew Evans
Fuck you racist. I hate you fucking brocialists who think we shouldn't be helping oppressed people. Fuck white people and fuck their privilege.
Michael Barnes
not at all, let only the exceptionally gifted kids go to college, the rich dumb kids will fail anyway. Universities should be a privilege for the intellectual elite and the rich only. Trying to acommodate a single system for all lowers the standards, which is unnaceptable.
Jackson Ross
Appeals to authority aren't a great reason.
There doesn't seem to be any strong evidence in the Minnesota study that suggests a link between race and intelligence. Also, that sample size is way to small to draw any real conclusions from. I'll try to find more studies though
Logan Lopez
And now the cancer that is marxism show's it's face. You can get the fuck out too faggot. Take your idiotic ideology with you. You homos have been tripping over yourselves trying to convince people here that you guys are jokes for the past few days, but you fail at even that.
Christian Hernandez
Anyone who has had lived around black people is instantly redpilled on this issue As they say in South Africa, the difference between a tourist and a racist is 2 weeks
Why is every single white country wealthy, every single hispanic country a shithole, and every single black country hell-on-Earth? IQ is roughly proportional to economic success of a nation
When Detroit was 90% white, it had the highest median income in the world. Now it's 80% black, and has a murder rate higher than post-war Zimbabwe. The literacy rate is below 50%. The infrastructure is failing, the streetlights, the potholes, the electrical grid, the water and sewage system. The entire region has imploded into an absolute post-apocolyptic hellscape. It looks like Hiroshima in 1946.
It's like an African city in the middle of the US, which is exactly what it is
Jason Murphy
Hey there tough guy! Can you tell me more about these fantasies?
Jordan Cruz
>tfw all of you are porky tools to destroy the power of individuals Fucking marxists enemy of the people.
Carson Gomez
...
Sebastian Harris
>FULLY AUTOMATED We must strive towards a government administered by an AI, comrade.
Samuel Perry
>you commie faggots always destroy yourselves >*funds contras* >*engages in false flag terrorism* >*embargoes* >*persecutes domestic sympathizers* >*CIA coups externally*
Camden Turner
>develop fully automated society >develop ia >install ia in the machine who works for you >humans are now the exploiting burgeois
>muh historically inevitable end!
Jaxon Long
We have no arguments for non-arguments
>Southern rednecks are more likely to form a common bond with ghetto gangs than with "intellectuals"
