Tfw want to be more religious but can't force myself

>tfw want to be more religious but can't force myself

How do some people do it? The ones who go to church every Sunday , were in youth group, go on mission trips?

I volunteer at my church, tithe and am in a bible study and it does nothing for me.

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youtube.com/watch?v=QAaW6BYhfNM
youtube.com/watch?v=w6qYjisp51M
youtube.com/watch?v=v_X6TpC2rWQ
youtube.com/watch?v=s8BJo3ca5O8
youtube.com/watch?v=qx0AWex1kTc
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you are looking at the wrong entrance.

What do you mean?

also

youtube.com/watch?v=QAaW6BYhfNM

ask questions, make connections, research and dig deeper

religion is meant to be explored and experienced.

you don't leave food, games etc inside their packaging and wonder if they're any good, do you?

>I volunteer at my church, tithe and am in a bible study and it does nothing for me.

Those are all works of the flesh. God is not worshiped by the flesh, but by the Spirit.

Going to church doesn't make you a Christian any more than going to New Zealand makes you crave carnal relations with sheep.

It's a transformation you have to consent to; a confession out loud that Jesus is Lord, and a belief in your heart that God raised Him from the dead.

As Jesus is God, and as He did rise from the dead, all God is asking is for you to believe the truth.

You can spend your entire life being supremely "religious" and miss the entire point of your own existence.

Also forget about any protestant denomination.
They are all devoid of any spirituality and represent a personal faith which is pretty much dead.

John 3

Jesus answered and said to him, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.”

Most people don't actually question their religion. They're just born into it, do. the things I said and develop faith. Some of the most religious people i know for example, have never doubted what their church told them.

You gotta start praying boy. Meditate on scripture. Things will work out that way. Keep asking God to help you

>papist
>leaf

>pope is a nigger loving Marxist

Checks out

Got lots O puss in youth group, stayed very high, was popular for stinking like dank always.. Good times..

Absolutely heretical

>The bible
>heretical

Romans 10
But what does it say? “The word is near you, in your mouth and in your heart” (that is, the word of faith which we preach): that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved.

For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

For the Scripture says, “Whoever believes on Him will not be put to shame.”[ For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek, for the same Lord over all is rich to all who call upon Him.

For “whoever calls on the name of the Lord shall be saved.”

Hope it was worth it.

You've made the first step. The rest will come spontaneously, unless you decide to give in to degeneracy of course

PRAISE KEK, lad.

Read the book ; Happier Than God.

Not memeing here, nor trolling. It is extremely good. This book + A New Earth was so close in saving me from becoming a cynic reading Dawkins and Schopenhauer, The Denial of Death and so forth.

I may be saved again. But Sup Forums has me in it´s dark clutches atm.

If you were once saved, you are saved now.

If you are not saved now, you were never saved.

Make sure of your own salvation.

God isn't real, OP

god isn't real

once you start wearing something religious, be it a tattoo or neclace you'll know how important your faith is. if you think the cross is "heavy", that should give you strength beause that's what it is

we're approaching a time where nobody goes to heaven due to lack of faith. that's the punishment to our fathers for not teaching us their way of life

My sister went from slut to church in less than 2 years. In fact she's easily the most devout christian I've ever seen, even more so than my grandma.

Dunno man

Mankind has worshiped, prayed to, sacrificed to, donated to, killed for and died for over 1500 documented deities. Seeing as none have any more proof than the other, chances are you picked the wrong one.

That's the power of the Holy Spirit to transform people's lives.

Too bad she will forever be a used up whore

Praise Kek.

Forever?

No, not forever.

>Say a magic prayer and invite Jesus into your heart!
>Hurr baptism is evil!

Easy believism is even worse than Catholicism and Eastern Orthodoxy.

You're probably just in a slump, user. It happens. Or maybe your church leadership sucks. Either way, just have some faith and patience and it'll pass.

dude just go to san vicente in baja california and build houses

Goddamn christcucks are cringey as fuck.

watch YT videos about the end times deception. That made me religious as hell.

Define what 'religious' means to you

To me religion=spirituality+politics+art

smoke dmt and confuse yourself into believing in a higher power. it works!

You must pray for faith and you must listen to preaching and scripture.

John 20:30-31

>30 And truly Jesus did many other signs in the presence of His disciples, which are not written in this book; 31 but these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that believing you may have life in His name.

Luther writes in his Small Catechism concerning the Lord's prayer.

>The First Petition.

>Hallowed be Thy name.

>Q:What does this mean?

>A: God's name is indeed holy in itself; but we pray in this petition that it may become holy among us also.

>Q: How is this done?

>A: When the Word of God is taught in its truth and purity, and we as the children of God also lead holy lives in accordance with it. To this end help us, dear Father in heaven. But he that teaches and lives otherwise than God's Word teaches profanes the name of God among us. From this preserve us, Heavenly Father.

And the Hymn version:

Vater unser im Himmelreich,
Der du uns alle heißest gleich
Brüder sein und dich rufen an
Und willst das Beten von uns han,
Gibt, daß nicht bet allein der Mund,
Hilf, daß es geh von Herzensgrund.

Art, literature, philosophy, science. All activities in the pursuit of truth, of becoming closer to God. Art is the primary engine of the evolution of human thought, before a thought becomes clear, solid and communicable it's etheral, unreachable and only expressable through art.
youtube.com/watch?v=w6qYjisp51M

>Art, literature, philosophy, science. All activities in the pursuit of truth, of becoming closer to God
Some people who engage in those activities without pursuing truth or God. Many such cases. Very perverse wills. Sad.

I know that feeling

I grew up christian, left the faith about a year after I graduated highschool, felt very confident as an atheist.

began doing LSD. never had a "god" moment on lsd, but one trip I noticed it felt like someone else was in the room with me, trying to affect me in some way, like trying to get me to notice. That feeling never went away when I'm at home. Kind of like how people describe ghosts but i never see it, or feel a temperature change, but I can feel that it is there, in some way. I usually can tell where it is, too.

I know its crazy, so I only like.. kinda believe its there.

But when I touch the walls now, I know I am living in a manufactured reality. I dont know by who, or why, but I think that implies some sort of god, by definition. Even if he is just a computer programmer.

but anyway, back to this being, one time, while completely sober from any drug, I get the feeling like he is near me again, and then I just get a huge influx of thoughts that definitely were not mine. I was very confused, but at the same time the thoughts were very clear. It seemed like a combination of the thing "telling" me stuff and my brain "rationalizing" what was coming in. So a lot of the thoughts are semi-corrupted by the way I perceive reality.

most of it dealt with an afterlife, where people with desired traits in this life are filtered out into a higher reality when they die, and those that failed to meet the criteria were "destroyed" so that new attempts at good people could be made.

I have slowly come to believe in god since that happened. I dont think I believe in Jesus, although I do find his story inspiring. I specifically recommend everyone read Proverbs.

Ive been asking for god to reach out to me any day now. I alternate from feeling very happy about being in this realm to feeling like I am trapped (but not exactly panicking or anything, I tend to think to myself "its not very nice of you to have trapped me in here like this without an explanation").

that's because they are happy with just that.
different people user, if

the other fag is right and imo the best thing to do with religion (if you are stuck innit) is to explore and question it.

there's a million outcomes to that and one of them will stick.

Read about the Martyrs and Church Fathers

Faith is not a good pathway to the truth.
Evidence and reason are the only reliable pathways for truth, and faith is inherently dishonest in its very nature.

Or perhaps I'm wrong.
You've reached a conclusion that god exists, that your god is the right god, and the path you've taken will lead to pleasing this god.

I'm willing to entertain that I'm wrong, but I doubt that you are. To prove that I'm willing, can you offer me an example outside of religion where FAITH is a reliable, good pathway to truth, because I can't think of any.

Faith is believing what you KNOW ain't so.

Faith is not a virtue, unless its in your mark and you're a confidence trickster.

I await your well thought out response, since I'm willing to consider the possibility I'm wrong.

you don't need to participate in cuckshed organized religion to find spirituality and the Lord

Thats because she's really very simple, mentally speaking, and trading one vapid indulgence for another makes sense.
In religion, she gets attention for talking about jayyyyysus, and telling everyone how terrible she used to be before JAYYYYSUS.

youtube.com/watch?v=v_X6TpC2rWQ

Shhhh! Oh vey, you can't let the goym know, they'll be pissed we cut the tips of their dicks off for god!

>can you offer me an example outside of religion where FAITH is a reliable, good pathway to truth, because I can't think of any.


placebo pills

attitudes win competitions

faith that its unlikely someone will drive into my lane and kill me on the way to work keeps me from disfunctionally staying home in fear every day.

Really? Its nice that someone actually tried to offer a reason that they're religious.

I was because I was indoctrinated, and put into religious environments by others. Constant exposure to other religionists and the rituals made them seem to make sense, and it was only after years of being removed from them that I even began to question how bizzarre the habits were.

Spend some time in a secular country desu. Perhaps you can yet be 'saved'.

placebo pills are a pathway to a lie and a deception. You just countermanded yourself.

UNLESS you're willing to REDUCE the quality of your position to 'the noble lie for good reasons', which I think would be moving the goalposts in my favor against you, you might want to try again.

We're talking about RELIABLE pathways to TRUTH, using FAITH.

Aside from religion, can you give me some, please? Thankyou for trying, I appreciate the engagement, and will try to be fair :)

im not the person you were previously talking to.

placebo pills do work. Thats the thing. The faith in the pill makes it work.

I mean, I should have engaged with your comment on attitude, and driving lanes matter but thats not faith in the attitude, its attitude, and my question was about TRUTH.
Because if its not the TRUTH, then its not a pathway TO truth, right? Doesn't have to be 'capital' truth, however, I'm willing to step that back. But it has to be TRUE.

Its closer to 'faith' that someone will stick to the lane rules, and thats a better example. Wheres the truth that faith leads you to there though? I can't see anything true, just some good guidelines, COMPLETELY ARBITRARY FROM COUNTRY TO COUNTRY (sorry caps) for safe road use.

Doesn't work if you drive american style over here on NZ roads, for instance.

Well when we're talking about placebos,
THEY DONT DO ANYTHING.
We agree that, thats why its a placebo.

Unless you want to contest that bit.
So its the lie + the TREATMENT that the patient recieves that makes them better.
The placebo is NEVER a cure, is it?

You're selling a lie as a truth. You may want to reconsider your approach.

im not saying that faith is always right or always leads to truth, but it sometimes does. and it is often practical. Depends on what you have faith in.

Also, the way you are wording your argument makes it seem like you are saying there is an objective truth. I do think there is, but we dont actually know that. And how could you tell if something actually is true or not at all? do you not test it by the pragmatic outcomes and predictions utilizing the knowledge would give you?

the placebo does stuff and does nothing. It is mostly the faith in the placebo that does the thing. Scientists use placeboes as a control, instead of nothing as a control, because simply believing something will work OFTEN causes it to work. But its not guaranteed to work everytime for everyone. Its confusing, yes.

I WANT to be on the same page as you.
I'm really really struggling to come into accord with your position however.

I repeat, do you think faith is a good pathway to the truth, and can you give me an example outside of religious truth?

Placebo, as we agree, is not a real drug, and the attention the patient recieves is part of what makes them feel better.
I don't WANT you to concede that religion is a placebo... I invite you to move faith into a better position than the example given.

When is it ever a RELIABLE pathway to TRUTH?

The pyramids were built through faith that they would be built, faith literally moved mountains not that far from where Christ made that speech. If you don't have faith in your society you won't help to build a future, you won't plant any metaphorical trees.

I didn't conclude that God exists and then justify it. I found God through researching what is meant by these ideas, at first I called myself a "secular Christian" since I only saw it as a valuable tool that I was heavily influenced by through being born into a Christian society but reading more I came to realize the worldview described is based on reasoned arguments Now I have reasoned faith that Christ is the way to my eternal salvation. That the will of God is expressed through Christ.

If you are really open to trying to figure out what was meant by the texts and the early church, do what this guy says, google Justin Martyr or Philo.

fpbp
Read the bible. Fuck the church (well, maybe that's a bit extreme).
But the bible is where the spark is.

GOd I am A sinner. I fornicate, I take your name in vain. I am sorry.

I'm listening to this
youtube.com/watch?v=s8BJo3ca5O8
My favourite movemnt is the Lacrimosa. Here;s a translation.for the latin of that movement.


Mournfully be that day
On which from ashes shall arise
The guilty man to be judged;
O God, have mercy on him.
Gentle Lord Jesus,
Grant them eternal rest. Amen.

but why does the placebo sometimes work enough that it must be adjusted for in statistical analysis?

I don't subscribe to a religion, so unfortunately I'm not sure I can convince you of one.

And its hard to answer your question about anything. There is no way to actually know if something is true. At a certain point, after seeing a pattern so many times, we just give into it and accept it as true. Even though it might stop at any moment.

>arguing there is an objective truth

Well now we're getting into epistemology and it could get a little too complex for anyone here to find it interesting or worthwhile.

I would say that 'true' things correspond to things that can be, objectively verified as 'true'.

It can be objectively verified that, for instance, the rules of rational mathematics are consistent and true.

When we have ACCURATE models, we can make RELIABLE predictions about the future,
and only accurate information produces useful predictions.

Go to blessyahowah.com if u want the truth about God.

>Well now we're getting into epistemology and it could get a little too complex for anyone here to find it interesting or worthwhile.

you are making assumptions about a lot of individuals you do not know.

I don't know much about epistemology, but definitely enjoy talking about it.

doesnt the bible stress the importance of the church?

We practice it as a sense of duty, not out of Euphoria. It's part of upholding western heritage.

No, now you're projecting faith onto me.
>The pyramids were built through faith
Er, mate, the pyramids were basically the Pharohs equivilent of the big dam we had down south round here a few decades back.

A big public works project that basically kept everyone busy.

Faith? Faith is a ridiculous agent to invoke as far as the pyramids are concerned.
Slavery would be a better agent to invoke, and you invoking faith for it just puzzles me.

"Reasoned faith" thats an intellectual contradiction if you break it down into its root words. Reason and faith are, as far as I can tell at odds.

Figuring out what was meant by the texts is best done through secular study, unless you think that doing a whole lot of mushrooms and drinking your own piss is the 'best' way to 'understand' shamanism.

I mean I can see how you can make ad-hoc justifications for faith. That is NOT 'reasoned faith', thats the very definition of ad-hoc.

Thats a good question! And a question answered best through REASON RESEARCH AND INVESTIGATION, AND NOT FAITH!

HOW ABOUT THAT, FAMALAM!

The studies on placebos found that the fact that the patient believed themselves to be recieving treatement medicine and care was discovered upon looking into the less-than-chance nature of placebos.

The scientific conclusion was that the patients felt better because of the attention/care they received, and recovered better (in the 'how do you feel' outlook side of things. Technically all in their head) as a result.

The sugar pills obviously didn't cure diseases or cancer, obviously.

>There is no way to actually know if something >is true.
Er...thats objectively false. The scientific method is the most reliable one we have for testing a hypothesis however.
I don't have faith in things that haven't been verified, as a general rule. You can't falsely project your faults onto others.

>doesnt the bible stress the importance of the church?
I'm of the Mel Gibson school of thought that the Catholic church has been subverted since Vatican II and the current pope is a complete faggot.
I still class myself as a Catholic though. I think/hope the church can be saved.

>how to meme myself into being religious?

Definitely my favourite pol meme

>HOW ABOUT THAT, FAMALAM!

being less condescending would do you well.

>Technically all in their head

So, they BELIEVED they were getting good treatment that would make them better, and this caused them getting better? are you agreeing with that?

>The sugar pills obviously didn't cure diseases or cancer, obviously.

yes, faith clearly isn't something that can easily be said "always works". doesnt work more often than it works. usually it works best when combined with other practicalities.

> scientific method is the most reliable one we have for testing a hypothesis

This sounds a bit weak to be calling things objectively false right before it.

>I don't have faith in things that haven't been verified, as a general rule

You probably have faith you will not die in a car accident tomorrow. Someone who only believes what has been scientifically proven to them would live a very dysfunctional life. Skepticism is good, yes, but lack of evidence is not evidence of lack.

> You can't falsely project your faults onto others.

Not sure where you are going with this? what you are talking about?

Just watch enough Pastor Anderson videos and you'll get where you need to be. Download all of his shit from their website and listen to it on a USB stick in your car.

Don't tone police me when I provide you an example that directly countermands you brah.

>this caused them getting better? are you agreeing with that?
Me agreeing with you doesn't help you the way you think it does brah.
If you want to concede that the god you worship is imaginary/ a placebo, then we're done, because this was about faith being a pathway to truth.

>yes, faith clearly isn't something that can easily be said "always works"

This is something YOU want to concede? Because my position was when is faith EVER a good pathway to the truth?

The truth is the placebo patient isn't going to recieve a cure; the truth is the treatment will make them FEEL better.

Is that what god is? A placebo that makes you FEEL better?
Stop losing the argument bro, I want you to win, but you keep kneecapping yourself.

Our Father
Who art in heaven.
Hallowed be thy name.
Thy kingdom come,
Thy will be done,
On Earth as it is in heaven.
Give us this day our daily bread,
And forgive us our trespasses,
as we forgive those who trespass against us.
For thine is the kingdom, the power and the glory,
Forever and ever,
Amen.

I meditate everynight while listening to gregorian chants. I get in tune with like everyones benis bruh

Someone in ancient Egypt made a good case through logic and math that a bunch of desert apes could build pyramids. The citizens who put those plans into action had reasoned faith in their pharaoh and he in turn had reasoned faith in those plans and the planner. The builders were not slaves, there are diaries from the dedicated towns specifically for building pyramids, the people of those towns were well off and fulfilled in their work.

Christianity provides the best framework for the long term pursuit of truth, the scientific method emerged from the tradition of scholarly research practiced by monks trying to get closer to God. I have faith that the only timeline that will actually happen, the one that is ultimately the will of God is the one where we continue to advance our species understanding of God in the name of Christ. In other words Christ is the Logos made flesh.

>If you want to concede that the god you worship is imaginary/ a placebo, then we're done, because this was about faith being a pathway to truth.


I dont worship a god. reread our conversation and pay attention to my ID. This is what i was talking about when I said being less condescending would do you well. People on here call me nigger and jew all the time. Condescension and assumptions lead to bad arguments.

If you'd like to restate your point with this new (?) information that would probably fit better.

Oh great spagetti monster
please extend
your noodly appendage
to me
and to all of us
that we may be touched by your pasta
let us all
be given of the meatballs, and perhaps even
of the tasty sauce
that goes with some pasta
but no parmesan for me, Im dairy averse today
amen

you can start watching pastor anderson, a Sup Forums friendly preacher


youtube.com/watch?v=qx0AWex1kTc

...

I think my prayer was just pasta your understanding.

Dude, do you ACTUALLY think they started building BIG pyramids without SMALL pyramids?

Faith doesn't enter into things that are OBJECTIVELY VERIFIABLE.

If you can OBJECTIVELY VERIFY something, its not a position based on faith.

REASON and Faith are mutually exclusive positions yo.

> the scientific method emerged from the >tradition of scholarly research
Hey, don't frame me as bagging on scholars bro. Saying that the early scientists were religious at a time when it was social-political suicide to NOT be (punishable by death in some circles) doesn't really compel me though.

>the best framework for the long term pursuit >of truth

But I'm trying to draw attention to the dishonest nature of faith.
Let us CONCEDE that christianity might have it right, for the sake of argument.
If I had faith that pastafarianism was right, faith would be the worst pathway to truth, because I would ignore evidence from that point.

Like those who hold faith based positions.

These arguments are stupid m8.
It's one of those things where you're a sceptic until it happens to you. Like someone would believe all UFOs are bullshit till they see one, or ghosts. It's all well and good taking the empirical stance until you're presented with something you can't reproduce but that you know happened. Faith is sorta like that. You can't reason it out to anyone but you know it's real.

...

When you do your pre-shooting manifiesto, can you put the blame on Reddit?

Next on tonight's playlist.
youtube.com/watch?v=aPxHEN9lXCU

Nope, you're changing tacks again.
If you have something that is tangible,then you have a reason.
If those reasons you have would be insufficient to convince someone else, I would invite you to examine why that is the case.

If you can show me an example of when faith is a good pathway to truth, I would like to see it, because I can see examples of when faith prevents you from reaching the truth.

"My delusions are real and you're just going to have to trust me on that" is the least compelling argument heard so far in this thread, and I'm going to have to say sounds like a reason to not hold the position you hold.

>those arguments are stupid mate
proceeds to fail to make an argument for faith.

The point of my post flew way pasta your head again m8y.

The only thing clear is how closed you are to considering anything but your nihilistic narrative. You clearly have not read anything about any of these concepts you arrogantly claim to be the authority on. Faith is not "dishonest" you are dishonest, you claimed to be open to arguments but haven't addressed a single one. Faith as defined by the context of Christian thought is what makes everything work including building the pyramids or crossing the street on a green light. You are making up your own concept and calling it faith to serve your narrative, the euphoric condescension drips from every word even though you are way out of your depth and clearly don't actually understand anything being discussed.

LOL

>Is that what god is? A placebo that makes you FEEL better?

That is not what was stated at all you filthy kike, kindly reread the conversation before jumping to your own conclusions, on subjects you know nothing about.

>Stop losing the argument bro, I want you to win, but you keep kneecapping yourself.

How about you stop being such a condescending ass, and actually make a proper well thought out arguement?

Listen to the people that have said "read the bible"

I only just started and it's the best fucking thing I've read so far I get goosebumps when I start relating to it then start freaking out. Not sure how to describing getting closer to God from a 4channers POV but take my experience for what it is.

I don't think so, tim.
"Wouldn't convince others. Happens to me, can't prove it. I must be right, thats the only answer."

>You are making up your own concept and >calling it faith to serve your narrative,
Projection much?
Pyramids are fucking objectively verifiable things, and you're calling them faith?

We're done here familam, and it is YOU who is so far down your smughole that you can't hear the argument.

>Faith is not "dishonest" you are dishonest
^^^ this is the nature of your argument.
Assertion without base. Laters, I'm done, this topic bores me, I leave having seen
"Placebos! Pyramids"
as the arguments for how faith is ever a reliable pathway to truth.

I'm entertaining the possibility that you are a secular troll masquerading as a religious troll, and if you're not, thats a somewhat sad reflection on this discussion.

If you had any truth to your position, you'd be able to point out why faith in pastafarianism (a false belief) was a reliable pathway to truth when it was preventing the subject from listening to evidence of the REAL GOD, because for the example, god was real for the sake of argument,

AND YOU COULDN'T EVEN DO THAT.

You know faith is dishonest, you just don't want to admit it, and thats ok.
Not really, but whatever, I'm done with you.

>I don't think so, tim.
>"Wouldn't convince others. Happens to me, can't prove it. I must be right, thats the only answer."
You misunderstand me. I'm not trying to convince you. I know I can't.

read KJV bible to find answers

>faith is ever a reliable pathway to truth
You have very clear ideas about what you mean by faith is but you haven't felt the need to explain that to anyone because you honestly think your naive worldview should be obvious to anyone but it's not. The context of the thread is Christianity, so assuming the concept of faith is meant in the Christian context is reasonable. In that context the word faith is in fact used to describe things like believing and trusting that people won't run you over when there is a green light.

Thank you for arguing for my positions you don't understand at all so eloquently you subhuman trash. Blind faith is not a reliable pathway to truth and no one ever claimed it was. If I have reasons to estimate a 99% chance of an outcome I can reasonably live my life believing and trusting in that outcome, having faith in the process and my estimation skill. But you can't even concede this objective fact of how the fucking concept being discussed is defined because you hate truth and will do whatever you can to obfuscate it so you can keep jerking off to cartoon horse porn.

>you hate truth and will do whatever you can to obfuscate it so you can keep jerking off to cartoon horse porn.
Ya blew it. To obvious a troll. You were 10/10 until that point.

100% serious, if you think I'm a troll you're a newfag. He is a degenerate justifying his degeneracy and contributing to the decay of civilization.

I haven't been following the conversation (I'm blasted m8) but if he is a horsefucker then fuck him.

thats because people have no fucking clue how to read the bible, they don't question the anti semetic things, or question why the jews needed a book to tell them to not fuck animals in the first place, and to not fuck their family.

and why jesus calls peter, the one who started the catholic church a literal satan, while judas who betrayed him, was his closest friend, a brother closer than his actual brothers.

follow the teachings of christ alone, do not follow any rules except for what he gives you, and ignore his 12 disciples as they will lead you astray.

Considering how he's been acting thus far? I'd pin him as more of a goatfucker, to be well and truly honest.

A few of Jesus' disciples DID truly practice the faith, but a good few of them were also corrupt, or became corrupted overtime, And Judas was corrupt enough to sell him out for 30 pieces of silver. which says something about how 'faithful' he was.

>ignore his 12 disciples as they will lead you astray.

My most religious was when I was reading the Ragamuffin Gospel and practicing the meditation in the book, very non-denominational book. I since walked away from it, idk...

you have a poor understanding of what happened.

jesus asked judas to do this to him, as it was required, and it broke his heart.

pic related. feels bad man.