In most european countries, gun and self defense laws are a joke...

In most european countries, gun and self defense laws are a joke. Makes me sick to know that if someone invades my home with the intention to rob me, that I don't have the right to confront and incapacitate said person with a firearm. Chances are very high I would go to prison if I did so. What's the purpose of those ridiculous laws? Forces people to be victims in their own homes and protect the well-being of criminal scum. Europe is generally a good place to live, but in this sense it's a shithole. Europeans are forced by law to be spineless cowards. Turns out there are some things that America gets right.

Other urls found in this thread:

knack.be/nieuws/belgie/tubeekse-juwelier-die-overvaller-doodschoot-niet-vervolgd/article-normal-73240.html
hln.be/hln/nl/960/Buitenland/article/detail/2420721/2015/08/12/Juweliersvrouw-die-2-overvallers-doodschoot-wordt-niet-vervolgd.dhtml
shogun.nl/luchtdruk/geweren/gamo-black-fusion-igt-mach1.html
youtu.be/ci-3ikKecRg
landlordstation.com/blog/time-day-home-burglary-statistics/)
griffith.edu.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0011/712694/burglary.pdf),
guncite.com/gun_control_gcdgbur.html
theacru.org/harvard_study_gun_control_is_counterproductive/
twitter.com/NSFWRedditVideo

You're cucked by your own government

Exactly. And I hate it

WTF RARE!

>What's the purpose of those ridiculous laws?

For a long time they weren't needed. People feel generally safer knowing almost no one has firearms than if everyone had them. It's like game theory scenario where you force everyone in the #NoGuns field and the can't hurt each other. I think both USA and UK are in some form of Nash equilibrium in this sense that you don't want to switch from the current situation.

UK:
>Safe neighbourhood: why would you add guns that may fuck shit up?
>Ghetto: there already is enough crime, fights and stabbings. Last we need is to add guns.

USA:
Safe neighbourhood: it's all good, why are you after my guns?
Ghetto: criminals ALREADY have guns, don't take it away from the people.

Well our governments are constantly scared and being a nogunslol zone makes them at least able to see a coming threat. Just think want went on in Europe before WW2 when you had militias freely forming as they like. You had revolutions like every year kek. Imagine being a Berlincuck and seeing 30k people with arms wrecking the streets outside. This used to be normal. It was our very own version of "checks and balances".

Start training if you feel so strongly about it. Fuck guns it would be as much an advantage to your opponent. Learn to fight and protect your family.

What's the purpose? surrendering your family's well-being to the state, who's gonna be the one in charge.

You'll be completely dependant upon their actions, rendering you completely helpless to even do something as basic as protecting your own family.

I do know to fight, been training martial arts and fighting systems ever since I was old enoug to do so, that's why I feel so strongly about right to self defense. But the thing is, if someone attacks me with a knife, my training wont help me. That's when I want to be allowed to use a firearm.

>luxembourg
>anything bad happening ever
>anything happening ever at all

That's actually a pretty good explanation of the situation here. There are more guns than people in America, no point in banning them.

Or Switzerland.

I'm afraid I don't get the reference

Switzerland's gun laws are pretty based. Can you guys carry there?

1. You can have a gun, yes you will have to ""train"" 6 months to get one but in the end (it doesn't even matterrrr) working 6 months to protect you and your family isn't that big of an investment. You're just a lazy piece of shit.

2. Some professions do make it legal for you to purchase/have a firearm without any training. (jewellery for example)

3. Most ex-soldiers kept their guns after (we had a draft in Belgium until 1992 i think), only cucks gave their guns back.

4. If you would shoot/kill a burglar while he is in your house you will never get punishd for it. Try to find me 1 officer who would jail you for defending yourself. The police would just file the report as if you had no choice because the police is also getting sick of our cucked goverments.

OP is a 17 year old with no real life experience or whatsoever.

You're a stupid fuck, learn how to read before commenting. I did 4 years in the Army, I own guns. That's not what I was talking about you retard. I'm talking about self defense laws. Police officers here go to jail if they shoot an armed burglar who's running away from them. Burglars successfully sur home owners when they tripped in their staircase. If you shoot a home invader, you go to prison. That's the point of this post. Now fuck off you low life poser.

In Britain where allowed to have a curved blade under 52 inches(at home that is) Get yourself a sword!

That blows honestly. Even in Jew York you have a right to shoot an intruder if they actively look for you.

And if you knew anything about the legal troubles of self defense at all, you'd know that the police doesnt prosecute anything, but the courts. The police would never find you guilty, but our cucked up laws do. Look it up, there are plenty cases like that

What the fuck did you just fucking say about me, you little bitch? I’ll have you know I graduated top of my class in the Navy Seals, and I’ve been involved in numerous secret raids on Al-Quaeda, and I have over 300 confirmed kills. I am trained in gorilla warfare and I’m the top sniper in the entire US armed forces. You are nothing to me but just another target. I will wipe you the fuck out with precision the likes of which has never been seen before on this Earth, mark my fucking words. You think you can get away with saying that shit to me over the Internet? Think again, fucker. As we speak I am contacting my secret network of spies across the USA and your IP is being traced right now so you better prepare for the storm, maggot. The storm that wipes out the pathetic little thing you call your life. You’re fucking dead, kid. I can be anywhere, anytime, and I can kill you in over seven hundred ways, and that’s just with my bare hands. Not only am I extensively trained in unarmed combat, but I have access to the entire arsenal of the United States Marine Corps and I will use it to its full extent to wipe your miserable ass off the face of the continent, you little shit. If only you could have known what unholy retribution your little “clever” comment was about to bring down upon you, maybe you would have held your fucking tongue. But you couldn’t, you didn’t, and now you’re paying the price, you goddamn idiot. I will shit fury all over you and you will drown in it. You’re fucking dead, kiddo.

I thought you couldn't use weapons to defend yourself in Britain? I may be wrong, though.

Here swords are illegal aswell. Antiques are exempt, which is why I own several antique 19th century sabres

find me one judge that would prosecute you for shooting a burglar who is inside your home

The sad part is a lot of people are easily shootable through their windows at night

Your not allowed to leave the house with it. But you can owm swords, bow or a crossbow. Kek. Medieval shit.

longbows

In belgium al of those are legal to carry if you are +18.

Look up the french laws for "légitime défense". By those laws, the judge will have to, because you escalated the situation by confronting the invader with a weapon. What you should have done according to the law is to lock yourself in and call the cops. It's only "légitime" if your reaction was immediate and you were surprised and left no other choice. Grabbing your gun and confronting the invader is, according to the law, unnecessary escalation. In that case you will be the aggressor and the courts will prosecute you for it

not owning a gun is irresponsible. it should be everyone's duty to defend their homes, in respect of the people around you.
I sometimes get wet at the idea of a federal europe made by semi-independent city-states.

So you are surprised the law doesn't just say: lol shoot the nigger?

I am almost certain the USA will state almost the say kinda law concerning self defense. It is up to the judge to interpret the law and the situation.
Again if you would shoot someone who is in your home against your will stealing/threatening you. No judge will prosecute you.

You obviously have no clue about how fucked our justice system is. Learn some law, do some case studies, you'll see. Poor naive guy

Perfect execution. Belgium receives country-status for the next 7 days.

No. You need a "Tragebewilligung", a carry license, which is only issued to LEOs or security. As a civilian, you can only get one if you can prove that your life is in immediate danger.
Pretty cucked to be quite honest with you family.

>Makes me sick to know that if someone invades my home with the intention to rob me, that I don't have the right to confront and incapacitate said person with a firearm.
This literally never happens
If it does just use a pipe or bat to get them to fuck off you little pussy. If you're so scared you need a firearm, chances are you're a weak fag who deserves his head caved in by some skellington unnourished refugees

Having the second amendment, stand you ground, and castle doctrine is a really cool feeling.

I would were one on my side everywhere i go desu.

here it's pretty much the same concept, albeit a little less extreme. if you kill a burglar without him directly threatening your life, it would most likely be considered excess of self-defense. the thing is, it's hard to assess if your life is being threatened directly in some situations. I don't know what I'd do personally. Only thing I know is that if I end up killing someone in my house, I'll never report it. Dump the body inna de woods and to hell with it.

> jeweler shot a robber dead, not persecuted

knack.be/nieuws/belgie/tubeekse-juwelier-die-overvaller-doodschoot-niet-vervolgd/article-normal-73240.html

> jeweler shot 2 robbers dead, not persecuted

hln.be/hln/nl/960/Buitenland/article/detail/2420721/2015/08/12/Juweliersvrouw-die-2-overvallers-doodschoot-wordt-niet-vervolgd.dhtml

Your even allowed a shotgun but there are just so many rules that its hardly worth it.

that is why you have an extra airsoft replica pistol laying around in case there's a dead invader trying to steal your shit

I think the mentality behind it is the escalation of force. If a criminal scumfuck doesn't think you will attack him he wont bring a gun or feel he has too. I'm not saying i agree( in England you basically have to offer the gentleman a cup of tea and a turn with your girlfriend for his trouble) but there is a theory behind it. personally i think once you've invaded someones home uninvited with the intention of robbing/doing harm then all bets are off.

Yep, if some fucker steps in your house, just grab your baseball bat or kitchen whatever. Anything can be turned into a weapon.

Well then congrats to belgium, unfortunately it's not like that everywhere. A police officer here got prosecuted for shooting an armed robber near the belgian border. That's fucked.

I agree to a certain extent. In Italy it's pretty rare for a burglar to be armed in the first place, unless they're robbing a high target. that's why you can get fucked if you shoot somebody in your house. Couple of years back an old guy shot a fleeing robber with a rifle, and he got fucked because the guy didn't have any weapons.

A melee weapon won't do facing several burglars armed with knives you keyboard warrior punk.

Come on! A sword vs 3 blokes with knifes. You stand a fair chance i reckon.

just atleast buy airsoft or some airpressured weapons.
Buy something like this
shogun.nl/luchtdruk/geweren/gamo-black-fusion-igt-mach1.html

(to all americans you are allowed to laugh right now but this is how cucked we are)

It's pretty strong in the end, you can severly damage someone with it and stopping him

>getting in a fist fight with 2-3 albanian dudes with knives and chains while your family is there

dude, I know you want to be a real ubermensch but I don't really see that going well for you. have you ever been in a fight?

Eh, i guess shooting someone in the back is a little too far. If you tell someone to leave your property and they don't it should be open season. Farmers in Britain get in trouble for shooting at fleeing robbers which i think is far as the threat has already left.

sheit I wanted to answer the dutch guy

Or you don't. Multiple opponents are the most dangerous thing in any self defense situation. Now that's not the case in movies, but in real life very much so. If you train HEMA, you'll see that even when you have the advantage of a longer blade, facing three opponents that are armed aswell is likely to go terribly wrong. Too many people here speak too much from their hollywood movie experience.

>Eh, i guess shooting someone in the back is a little too far.
exactly this.
if you tell a robber to get the fuck out and he does, than you're not defending no more but attacking him, if he does run away.

>Makes me sick to know that if someone invades my home with the intention to rob me
thats what you get for inviting muslims to your countries
poland is one of safest countries in the world and its hard to get a gun here

B-but they will come one at a time.

As much as I agree with you about the muslim immigrants, we've been having those problems ever since eastern european scum came here many years ago. Sorry Poland, but it's true. I'm talking serbians, albanians, bosnians.

yeah I mean, ideally you want to confront them gun in hand and tell them to get the fuck out. the guy heard noises downstairs and shot blindly. robber tried to flee as soon as he heard noises. I wouldn't really called that self defense, but if you decide to invade other people's homes, you have to take into account accidents happen.

somebody take people off of their high horse please. hell, I don't have anything against you but fuck if you've gotten condescending since pol started to ride you guys' dicks.

*poles

>if someone invades my home with the intention to rob me,
Makes me wonder when Russia became safer than Europe if thats seriously a concern of some people there?

And on our example - introducing guns would have only negatives. Already legal traumatic guns caused huge increase of shooting incidents, deaths and trauma because of aggressive culture of gopniks, bandits and kavkazians. Allowing real guns, would just result in way more lethal gun crimes.

Think about it. Gun control "works" (unless you are in shithole like US oversaturated with them). The common nigger in Luxembourg or Sweden is unlikely to possess one.

However if you legalize them for yourself, you also legalize them for Jamal. So he can get them easy and legally and cont care about consequences of using them in crime because has zero IQ. Plus increase of black market of stolen/illegaly sold ones.

So if now you have to fear a nigger with a knife trying to rob your flat, in which case just install metal door and police button. With Guns widespread, you`d have to count on that nigger trying to rob you already with a gun. Plus him just shooting you on a street while drunk for fun.

Stop being pussy.

This is true. You would have to justify why whatever weapon or object you use was nearby. You can't say I left my sword next to the bed to protect from burglars. It has to be I grabbed the nearest thing to defend myself which was my replica sword from my desk.

Pretty fucked up that the saying 'An Englishman's home is his castle' is consigned to history. The law is on the side of the criminal. The parasitic lawyers just care about the money.

If you have home invaders, deal with it, and do not involve police.
Dealing with it may involve strong acids, wood chippers, hacksaws, pig farms

You don't get it, do you? We ARE allowed to have guns. I DO own guns. In fact, Luxembourg has pretty loose gun control laws, which I love. But you're right, the common criminal won't have guns (most likely). This is not about being a pussy, it's about defending your and your family's life. If I caught someone invading my home, I WOULD use my gun to stop them. If they'd attack me or my family, I WOULD use lethal force to stop them. What annoys me, is that the law won't have my back and that I'll get in trouble for doing the right thing. That doesn't mean that I'll let them just fuck me over. I'd take the consequences. But it's ridiculous that there are consequences in the first place for people who are defending their home.

People should be allowed to defend themselves.
Police cannot be there to save you.
Gun allows women and elderly to fight back against stronger attackers. Even a able bodied man needs a gun if being attacked by someone bigger than him

Very correct. self defense isn't sport. It's not about honour or fairness. If they mean you harm, you should be allowed to defend yourself with all means you have. If you get attacked by 5 people, the honourable russian would suggest to fight them off with his superior fighting skills. But that won't happen. The only way for me to get out of that situation unharmed is if I'm able to run or to dispatch them with a real weapon.

Have you never watched home alone? Just set a bunch of traps.

youtu.be/ci-3ikKecRg

>he doesn't even heat up the front door knob or buy tarantulas

ultimate faggot desu

>I don't have the right to confront and incapacitate said person with a firearm
>What is self defense
>What is right of a citizen to detain a criminal until police arrives
But you know, that you do have the right to confront and incapacitate said person with literally anything else right?
If you're trained well with something, either a martial art or a blunt object, it becomes as dangerous as a gun for the intruder. An untrained man with a gun is much more dangerous to himself than a man trained with anything else.

Also the majority of home invaders in Europe usually are not prepared to encounter the home owner with a gun. Actually the majority of break-ins happen during the day, where it is likely that the home owner is not at home (landlordstation.com/blog/time-day-home-burglary-statistics/)

If it were the norm, to have guns in Europe, most home invaders would have one too in preparation, thus making home invasions much more dangerous for those who don't have a gun
>Inb4 everybody should have a gun then
Good luck training those 74 year old widows for example (old people tend to live alone and houses with fewer people inside are usually targeted more frequently: griffith.edu.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0011/712694/burglary.pdf), how to use a gun correctly in the middle of the night after being woken up by strange noises in the dark. In the US it's not even that unlikely, that you have old folks trained with guns, in Europe, that would practially be impossible to do.

>Inb4 jewish cuck, liberal etc. buzzword

this comment could have been funnier if the fucking luxembourg jew didn't have his video ready to copy paste into the qr box

I stand corrected. Kek.

As I said, your hollywood experience is speaking. It doesnt matter that I'm a martial artist and have a baseball bat. If there are 2+ able bodied men with say knives, chances are very high that I'll be fucked.

Think faster, if your pizza/pasta infested brain allows you to

lmao, I think I posted a couple of seconds later but since it shows different minutes, I'll hang my head in shame and go cry in a corner

> your hollywood experience is speaking.
Most likely my experience from knowing people who actually enduldge in martial arts.

Again, most burglars in Europe are not prepared for a fight, they want their loot and leave.
And now even if they are willing to fight you and you are able to get a gun, think of this (which I also mentioned earlier):
If you are likely to get a gun, it's also most likely not going to be 2 able bodied men with knives but 2 able bodied men with guns, so having a gun yourself doesn't really help your situation, it just changes their weapons and you're fucked either way.

I keked user. If it makes you feel better.

thing is, gun is actually scarier than a 60 lbs dude who needs to put on a kimono to fight. I'm not professionally trained or anything (3 years of amateur boxing, but I'm skinny), however even a trained fighter knows the odds aren't in his favor when confronting a guy with a knife. Against two able-bodied knife-wielding adults, either you're a fucking navy seal or "fighting" means you vomiting blood in around 10 seconds.

Then those martial artists are full of themselves = full of shit. Fighting multiple opponents is an absolute mess. Real fighting systems will teach you that. Krav Maga has you spar against 2+ opponents, it's a shit show.

No, guns are more easily available here than you think. But for some lucky reason, criminals havent figured that out yet. Many of my friends have guns. But I rarely ever hear about criminals having them. At least here in Luxembourg, I with my guns will have a huge advantage over the vast majority of criminals. And I don't care that they dont want to fight, of course they dont, they want easy money. Too bad huh? I want to detain them for breaking into my house and trying to fuck me over, so I keep them in check with my guns until police arrive.

This.

I didn't even know they had internet over

There was a case here some time a go, where a guy shot attacker in the face with a shotgun, and it was ok. It`s going in the right direction, i believe.

That definitely IS the right direction. That's the justice system working as it should. However in many western european countries, that's not the case

I mean, if fighting a guy at your same height, same weight and same level of training basically gives you a 50% chance to win, fighting two basically gives you 150% chance to lose. IF they are not armed. If they are and you don't own a gun, comply with their requests and try to de-escalate the situation.

I get what your saying but wtot if they were there to kill you? Its not ideal but got to do what you can. I would rathet die fighting then comply.

Doesn't explain why self defense is basically a crime in eurocuck countries and you're expected to be a victim or go to jail for "disproportional" violence

Okay, so you're telling me, that you're more likely to get hurt or even killed when approaching burglars in a no-gun situation, am I understanding this correctly? Or to put it like this: If you have a gun, you're more likely to handle the situation of a burglary to your advantage and are less likely to get injured when confronting a burglar?

Then I would like statistics that clearly indicate

1) lower burglaries in areas where gunownership is higher than where it is not

2) The likelihood of injury or death afflicted towards the victim during burglaries going down in areas where legal gunownership is more common.

Other than that, you guys are pulling your arguments out of your ass. Now, if you can show me such statistics, I'll shut my mouth and whole-heartly agree with you.

>learn to fight to defend yourself, guns are as much an advantage to the other side
>wymyn, grandpas, sick people and unfit people don't need guns because it'd help young thugs as much as it helps them, just teach 80 year old mr Smith kung fu

Its a fair point user. I just assumed op was an able bodied man.

Exactly. Now self defense of course isnt a crime. However, by defending yourself, what you do to the other guy (injuring/killing him) is a crime, when you dont have the context. That means, in front of a court of law, you will have to prove that it was self defense. If it happend at night, at home where there were no witnesses and no cameras, you will have a hard time. The law will treat you and the invader seperately. He will be prosecuted for breaking in and stealing your stuff, you will be prosecuted for shooting him. From that point of view, your guilt is proven if you only look at the facts. Fact is: you shot a person. You'll need to prove your innocence in that case and why it was necessary for you to shoot said person. If you can't, you'll be in trouble. It's truly fucked

guncite.com/gun_control_gcdgbur.html

First page that came up, you'll find more if you google the keyword of "hot burglaries gun deter"

theacru.org/harvard_study_gun_control_is_counterproductive/

Side note: I'm planning on buying a .38 snubnose this week. I don't have one of those yet.

well, if you have people who are actively looking to kill you, you wouldn't sit around play vidya. Or you would, but with c4 linked to a spring trap on your door.
The scenario I pictured is people looking to steal your stuff. the odds to encounter someone who casually breaks in into your place to kill you "just for fun" are too slim to take into consideration in this context I think.

>Although there is no evidence to indicate gun ownership deters overall burglary rates
Is the first sentence on that page.

Also:
>and in the U.S. a victim is threatened or attacked 30% of the time during a "hot" burglary
How likely is that in the Netherlands and UK?

That is a study on restricting the acquisition of new guns in a country with already massive amounts of legal and illegal guns in the public domain. That's not going against any of my 2 arguments.

>a widow can't use guns so ban them
>the widow will just fight the burglers with her superior mma skills

We're not talking about overall burglaries now are we? At least I'm not. It clearly indicated that criminals don't break into homes where they assume people might be present in fear of them having weapons. What you said was that you wanted statistics showing that areas with higher gun ownerships see less burglaries. That's what this page states about hot burglaries. 13% in the US, ~50% in the UK and Netherlands. I don't care that much if someone breaks into my home when neither I nor my family is in there. I have an insurance that covers my damages. But in Europe, criminals don't shy away from breaking into homes where the owners are inside, because they are not scared of what the owners might do to them. In the US, that's the case, because the citizens are actually allowed to do something. We are not. Hence no point for criminals to wait for us to leave

You cannot defend yourself disproportionately in the uk.

If someone breaks into your house with a knife or other weapon and you kill them you will not be prosecuted because your life was at risk.

If someone is in your back garden and unarmed and you run out and hack them to death you will.

If you chase them down the street and physically harm them in a way that could kill like the much cited article of the asian guy who was jailed ( for chasing the burglar down the street with his sons and beating him over the head with a cricket bat) you will be prosecuted.

The law is sound in that it is reasonable.

We got the same problem, bro. I feel you

Did you even read it?
>Nations with stringent anti-gun laws generally have substantially higher murder rates than those that do not. The study found that the nine European nations with the lowest rates of gun ownership (5,000 or fewer guns per 100,000 population) have a combined murder rate three times higher than that of the nine nations with the highest rates of gun ownership (at least 15,000 guns per 100,000 population).
>For example, Norway has the highest rate of gun ownership in Western Europe, yet possesses the lowest murder rate. In contrast, Holland’s murder rate is nearly the worst, despite having the lowest gun ownership rate in Western Europe. Sweden and Denmark are two more examples of nations with high murder rates but few guns.
>the study also shows that Russia’s murder rate is four times higher than the U.S. and more than 20 times higher than Norway. This, in a country that practically eradicated private gun ownership over the course of decades of totalitarian rule and police state methods of suppression. Needless to say, very few Russian murders involve guns.
Here's one related to burglaries:
>Britain and the Netherlands have a "hot" burglary rate near 45% versus just under 13% for the U.S., and in the U.S. a victim is threatened or attacked 30% of the time during a "hot" burglary.
guncite.com/gun_control_gcdgbur.html

Just deal with them and don't get the law involved
>That episode of Bottom where they duct tape a burglar to the ceiling

>Makes me sick to know that if someone invades my home with the intention to rob me, that I don't have the right to confront and incapacitate said person with a firearm.
In Germany you are, as long as you have a lisence to own your gun. One of the reasons why I'm getting my hunting lisence right now, would recommend this to every user in europe.
But you're right, the EU and leftist partys try everything to take all our guns away and regulate the shit out of it.

>duct tape
It's duck tape you uneducated swine