SOCIALISM GENERAL

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Fuck off.

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OP is a faggot.

"But... but.. muh communism has never been tried"

see

Except that socialists are always all too willing to define "worker ownership" as "state ownership" and thus advocate for a giant, hulking big government state that's primed to topple and leave millions of co dependent Marxist boys scared wet and left to fend for themselves.

Say no to authoritarianism.

I'm saying no to corporate tyranny as well.

Hi comrades

Hey.

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I used to think like this when I was 19-20yo. Watched zeitgeist and the corporation. Got excited about these 'movements' like occupy and decentralized crowd cooperation like operation chanology.

Then you meet people who aren't college professors and young adults and learn about different real world issues involving state and corporate control.

Capitalism is just more efficient. Life's not fair but Cuba is the shining example of what socialism/communism can achieve in the real world and I am not interested

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WHEN YOUR RETARDED IDEOLOGY WAS CREATED BY BANKERS TO DESTROY NATIONS REFUSING TO COOPERATE AND YOU ARE TOO SIMPLE MINDED TO WORK FOR YOUR OWN NATURAL SURVIVAL

I just don't think people should have to work hard just to give more money to your boss. Workers generate the amount there paid in a lot less than the hours that they work.

kill yourself

sage

>13 Posters
>19 Replies
>7 posts by this ID
lol

closing this tab now. sage

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Is this a meme for ants?

Sorry
see

Fuck off breadlines. We have the entire western world to prove capitalism works, you have a book written by an autist and a history of nothing but failure kys

this

Why do we need socialism?

comrades, what do we need to learn from Venezuela

Because with out it when we get full automation our system will collapse.

How do we know this?

Actually abolish private property instead of just making price controls and nationalizing some stuff. Also don't base your entire economy on oil and pray you can ride the boom forever.

>All jobs are replaced by robots
>massive unemployment
>no one can buy anything

Communism never works.

Isn't this speculation? Why will socialism solve the problem?

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>when you turn a country full of illiterate peasants into one of the most powerful countries in the world in like 40 years

By letting everyone control the means of production so everyone can benefit from owning the robots not just an elite few.

>implying this happens in high skilled societies
Socialists are faggots.

It doesn't need to be all jobs just enough to crash the economy.

Off Yourself Edition.

Wouldn't AI advance as well meaning that robots would no longer want to work for us. This in turn would lead to a violent human vs robot war with many live lost in the process. How and when does socialism decide that AI is a threat to it?

The robots that do all of the manufacturing will not be in the hands of only 0.01% of the population.

wow, throw out the last point and the materialism and you get USSR

was Mussolini literally Stalin?

Communism isn't "politically incorrect", get off this board REEEEEEE.

Same way capitalism does.

So why not continue as capitalist?

Because people work extra to give their boss more money. Say I work 8 hours. In just 4 hours I generate my wage. In the next 4 hours I generate money for my boss. I should either be paid more or work less.

How do you know this?

Otherwise the boss wouldn't make any profit. If the workers got paid the full value of their labor the boss would get none.

How do you determine what is the full value of your labor? True there is surplus value but that surplus value is not fixed.

The value of labor is the value of what it generates.

But you agree to sell you labor and some decides to buy it. What is the problem there? If you do not agree to that, do not sell your labor. There will be conditions when labor does not create any surplus value.

You did not agree you were forced by the threat of starving if you don't work.

You were not forced to agree. You may live as a hermit or put your own capital at risk and become your own boss. You agreed to exchange your labor for a higher standard of living, right? So why are you unhappy with the boss or the outcome? After all he provided you a job.

>live as hermit
Live on the privately owned land?
>put your own capital at risk and become your own boss.
I need capital. I need to work to obtain capital.

Head out into the mountains I am sure no one would notice. I think you have 7 years and then you can claim squatters rights. It was your incentive of not starving that prompted you to acquire a job. Again no one forced you or held your hand while you waited in the unemployment line. So if you are mad be mad at yourself for making the decision.

dirty dumb commie scum

In capitalism you have to either get a job or live in miserable conditions. Its not a real choice.

either be credit slave or live in a forest

so, thats the freedom?

>Hong Kong and Taiwan vs. China
>South Korea vs. North Korea
>Chile vs. Venezuela
>United States vs. Russia and USSR
>Cold War West Europe vs. East Europe

Economic freedom directly correlates to economic prosperity, anons.

So you are upset that you have to work? You would rather not work and still have all the advantages of working? Are you the moral agent of millions of workers? How do you know what is best for them? Especially the workers that work hard in order to save up money to start their own company or to leave money behind for the benefit of their loved ones. You think you have better ideas for them?

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I think everyone has the right to live a somewhat OK life. So we should make food and housing free in a socialist economic system.

fuck off leftypoo

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Thats how it should be. The weak should suffer whilst the strong and intelligent prosper

I agree that people should be able to live an OK life as well. Hasn't capitalism raised the standard of living for millions of people? What is more important income equality or income mobility?

>So we should make food and housing free in a socialist economic system
So you want to enslave everyone else to the will of the lazy is that it? People don't have the "right" to what you work for, if me and 20 other men work our butts off to build a small village for our families then Jim the lazy drug addict doesn't get to come in claim one of our houses and say that it's his "right" to own that house because he needs to live an OK life.

first post best post

Oh hey look, a long list of failed socialist societies.

ok, now tell me how do I prosper even if I am strong and intelligent if the only thing I inherit from my parents is their debts? for example my father was a failed busynessman

then I enter colledge, I am in debt again

I have a job and buy a house, I am in debt again

if I lose my job I have to find another in half a year, unless my saved money runs out

every year thousads of californian cityzens loses their homes for debts, does this mean they are weak or stupid?

No, it looks like a single drop can break your back under capitalism

Don't you have a gulag to starve in?
sage

Cunt

>implying capitalism isn't slavery
All systems require the domination of one class by the other. I simply want to make the bourgs the oppressed class.

>politically incorrect

I'm pretty sure the logo should say Politically Correct you cock smuggling faggot.

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why would you bring this picture here lol

this isnt holocoast denial thread, shill

People do not prioritize. But then again at least they had they choice. Go to trade school instead of college. Do not buy a house if you are not sure you will be able to take on extra debt.

>Advocating killing rich people is politically correct

Why are you upset with the "bourgs?"

ye dude let's get rid of the elite by becoming the elite, heheh that'll work this time.

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fuck off losers
the ussr is dead

For any actual leftists reading this thread, I recommend some Murray Bookchin, his writing has made me reconsider elements of statist socialism.

marxists.org/archive/bookchin/1969/listen-marxist.htm

You realize opposition to the bourgeoisie isn't just about establishing some scenario where they continue to exist but are constnatly abused, right

They are the cause of all the problems in our current world. War is for profit. Immigration and globalism are profitable and are pushed by bourgeois. Exploitation. Our whole world is going to shit because its not "profitable" to fix it.

people want to live good, they dont want to live in trailer or some ghetto, they dont want to drive trucks or sell crack

they want to live at least not worse than others and as possible - better than them, they want to be able to go into politics without having rich daddy, or to become movie star without shooting in porn

Your presidents are film stars, millionaires, sons of politicians and so on

Soviet politicians were sons of tractor drivers, opressed kulaks and illiterate peasents

socialism gave them the freedom

No. The working class is the new elite.

I don't believe in commie shit but I do like collecting old commie stuff. Does that count?

I'm a pretty hard leftie and while I don't fundamentally disagree with your premise, the Soviet Union cannot be apologized for on account of teh degree to which it violated the basic human rights of its constituents and ignored the necessity of mass democracy as an element of socialization

Socialism requires the willful participation of all members of a society. While I stay breathing, I shall not cooperate with your Big Brother schemes and will gun down anyone who wishes to impose their will upon me.

That is the fatal flaw of your shitty utopian system. I am not a brainless ant who works for the Mother Queen. I am an individual and I will do as I wish, not as I am told. This stubbornness alone is why your system fails.

Now fuck off commie.

He's a commie, you can't expect him to understand his own ideology.

I thought it was the politicians that made the decisions for wars. So your issue is with crony capitalism?

There is no other capitalism but crony capitalism.

I'm also a commie, he just sounds like an edgy teenage tankie which is just as fucking stupid as an edgy teenage libertarian.

Thats what the first stage of socialism according Marx. Instead of a bourgeoisie dictatorship we will get a dictatorship of the proletariat.

you are thinking in globalist terms

there are no basic human rights, human rights exist only in particular culture and western type democracy and individual rights were not a part of russian culture