My dad says that Trump destroying trade deals will make it so that no one in the world will want to buy American-made shit, because everyone else will just deal with each other. Also that white people and millennials will never take up car factory and field jobs.
Does he have a point?
No. your dad rims other men at the car factory.
Your dad is an idiot and rims other men at the car factory.
you go ahead and believe in whatever globalist, neoliberal fairy tales you were told
I sincerely hope you move to India/China if you love globalization so much
Your dad sounds like a stupid faggot. My condolences.
What said. I can confirm. Your dad gave me a rimjob.
Seriously though your dad is a moron. If the wages are there then they will work there. If the wages aren't, because under the table slave wages are available then they won't. It's pretty much that simple.
China has a rapidly growing middle class and if Trump and his protectionist hand holding buddies get their way with business, China will have the superior standard of living in 50 years.
No and you dad rims other men at the car factory.
Anyone who thinks the future of American prosperity is in manufacturing; whether it's low IQ trade work, automation, or high tech is clinically retarded. The future of American wealth is solely in the service industry.
The brown countries will continue to serve as the sweatshops of the world. As it should be.
That is, until wages reach an equilibrium or the US abolishes the minimum wage.
>China will have the superior standard of living in 50 years.
lol
and "middle Class" is subjective
in the west they would be below the poverty level
But I expect dumb Kiwis who are hooked to the Chinese real estate bubble to shill for their new masters same as Hongcouver residents.
damn this dude can give a speech.
How is it shilling? China will benefit from US protectionism because they'll become the centre of the global economy. I would rather see the US in that position for now.
No. He doesn't know what the fuck he is talking about. People in other countries don't know half the time where shit comes from because corporations change the labels on what they sell.
nobody was buying our cars anyway
>that's right goy abolish the minimum wage
>who needs a house when you can live in a comfy cage?
The economy and living standards of the west have been dying ever since neoliberals like you took over the country
>they'll become the centre of the global economy.
They already are you stupid Kiwicuck
FUCK SHILLS
TIME TO WRECK SHAREBLUE
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KEEP IT BUMPED THE SLIDE IS REAL
Not gonna lie, former son of your dad here. This is fucking hilarious watching him hem and haw . But in all seriousness we can't let this guy keep rimming dudes at the factory.
>high wages
>manufacturing jobs
>low cost of living
You get to pick two and only two.
of course no one wants to work in a factory, because they don't want to be paid 7dollars an hour to stand next to Paco all day.
No one is buying american but we can't even compete on our own soil. the currency taxes and ridiculous chinese shit have fucked up local market.
Cost of living is only high because neoliberals allowed massive debt bubbles )fueled by mass immigration) in finance, especially in real estate, insurance, securities, student debt, healthcare, transportation, etc.
Technological progress is what makes cost of goods go down, not lowering wages.
Lowering wages has one affect, cutting living standards. Now please fuck off to China to be a literal wageslave.
No. Trump's trade policies will either attract business, and business will become profitable, or it will drive business away. Business won't come here and then fail. US CEO's are smarter than that.
What's happening is those proposed trade deals are going to lower the corporate taxes so that US businesses will bring their capital (200 billion dollars) back from overseas, and they'll invest it in the US. Right now, businesses are afraid of the 35% tax that is in place.
Also, your dad rims men at the car factory.
Kek
China is the most protectionist nation on the planet. They have tariff and non-tariff barriers to imports that add up to an equivalent of 35%. If they are allowed to be protectionist, then they have no right to insist upon selling their goods here in the U.S. with virtually zero tariff. Trump intends to even the playing field between the U.S. and China, and the Chinese should be glad. If we wanted to, we could invade them, and anyone else we cared to as well.
The days of the U.S. playing sucker are over. Adjust your portfolios accordingly, it's happening.
Your dad is a fucking idiot.
>t.manufacturing worker
If you post your address I'll kick his ass for you, user.
The US is retarded and is allowing East Asia to dominate manufacturing in our own country.
>when your dad gets btfo by a paki
So you want the US to be more like China? Guess that's why you voted for a totalitarian.
the media is going to blast this plan too, saying it's going to increase price on good. Which it might, BUT the entire reason shit gets made in china is because it's literally dirt cheap. So you raise the tax of something that's 13 cents it's not 15cents who gives a fuck?
There's honestly not a huge downside to what trump is proposing imho!
it's now 15cents*
>work at BMW in Spartanburg SC
>$16.50 starting pay to drive a forklift
>$22 for QC
>huge home in white neighborhood under $150k
Bogan plz.
Then why are the nations where our manufacturing is outsourced to the economies that are growing, and growing the fastest, while the U.S. economy is stagnant? Is it because economies that are overly focused on service industries consume capital, while those that are overly focused on it create capital?
Free trade is a meme. The chinks know it, they want their exports to the U.S. market make their balance of trade positive indefinitely, because when more currency flows into your country than flows out, the richer you become. You can't three card monte your way out of the damage that a negative balance of trade does to your economy over the long term.
You will see the downside when Walmart starts charging more for your tendies.
>protectionism is a solely totalitarian value
wrong my dear Kiwicuck
protectionism began with the founding of the American Republic
we had strong protectionism until the 1970s in our country
If you are against protectionism you are either a globalist or a jew
en.wikipedia.org
Protectionism in America began with Alexander Hamilton (who was also the one that introduced strict immigration limits)
^^^^^^
This
The United States is protectionist throughout most of its history, 150 years to be exact. Our unequivocal embrace of no strings attached free trade is a relatively recent policy. All I want is that we restore things to the way they usually are here. Protection is for the benefit of a nation's citizens. It's not our job to whore out all our production just so some communist chinks can play catch up while their jewish bankers make a killing. It's literally somebody else's problem.
t. Chink
I want Walmart to crash and burn
money.cnn.com
I'd rather people like you go to China so you can die in an industrial accident.
Your dad sounds like a retard and he preps me before I ravage your mother's asshole.
So you can't take responsibility for your own businesses so you need government to hold your hand? SAD!
We are being raided with incoherent garbage, deliberate violations of the rules, and writing prompt one-posts, to hide the discovery of a three billion dollar slush fund set up by Obama to funnel government money to political activists.
>can't take responsibility for your own businesses
Outsourcing to China (or even Mexico) in order to exploit cheap labor is not "my responsibility." It shouldn't even be legal.
The bulk of the cost that imported goods bear is the shipping cost. You think goods manufactured in China magically teleport to the U.S.? No, they are placed on ships, and diesel is burned to move them all the way across the ocean. That's why, despite the relative cheapness of manufacturing costs over there, the stuff that ends up over here is often shoddily produced, because the transportation costs add up. Protectionism rewards consumers in so many ways. It reduces unemployment, thus cutting out the middleman for wealth transfer payments to the unemployed, reduces demand for fossil fuels, since goods consumed here are made here, and travel far less distance.
The media doesn't matter. This election proved it. Trump will implement these plans, just buckle up and prepare yourself to reap the benefits on down the line.
good point i hadn't thought of that about the shipping costs.
I think protectionism in America makes a lot of sense because of how large it is, for one reason.
It lowers your cost of living significantly, increasing your purchasing power. Bringing those jobs back will increase the cost of living without increasing wages which will lower the overall quality of living.
The government works for me. I send men like Trump to DC so that bad policies, which value the short to medium term horizon, and monetary gains at the expense of national unity and security, are stopped, and good policies, which value the long term horizon, and put national unity and security first, are implemented.
I honestly can't remember the last time I bought something made in America that wasn't bourbon.
White welder millennial here. Neoliberal trade deals like NAFTA have gutted factories and I've seen it first hand. I'm talking about massive compounds once employing 3,000+ workers, doing contracts for Lockheed and NASA, now mostly empty, losing contracts left and right because the cheaper outsourced manufacturing produced *surprise surprise* far lower quality products. This does not phase the neoliberals because once they run an American company into the ground they sell it to a financial chop shop and move on.
I have yet to hear a convincing argument about why the TPP was so great for workers. Sounds great if you're already any oligarch, but I'm not, so it doesn't. TISA is the next piece of shit they're pushing now.
Your dad does not have any ground to stand on. Invite him to Aptitude Testing Day for the pipefitters or ironworkers union. Thousands take the test, hundreds sit on a waiting list after. They are mostly white and mostly young. Meanwhile, Shit Factory Job #999 wants Leonardo DaVinci, is offering $13/hr, and it's a temp position. Gee, why can't they find a seasoned expert? What a fucking mystery.
>The government works for me
I knew you guys were gullible but goddamn.
Except NAFTA decreased unemployment and increased US manufacturing.
You also pay for those imported goods at the pump. Part of the cost of the gasoline or diesel that goes into your vehicle is a function of how much ocean traffic there is ferrying goods from China to here, and it's a big chunk that most people are unaware of, another externality.
it also means products are lighter weight so they can ship them cheaper, super bad for stuff like a drill press or a lathe.
>implying the glass is half full
You and I are two different types of individuals. I'm a glass is half full kind of guy. That's ok. We can agree to disagree about some things.
No. Your dad rims other men at the car factory.
I just never thought I'd see an America that loves its government.
Outsourcing destroys your domestic economy and lowers the wages of domestic workers making everything harder to afford.
Yes
kek
Government is a tool. Like a piece of heavy equipment, or an acetylene torch, it is dangerous, but useful. I'll always fear such a thing more than I will love it, but I will never let that fear dominate me, or prevent me from getting the most out of it.
I never thought I'd see a Kiwi that sucks so much Chinese dick
yet here we are
Wouldn't it be a more effective tool if it were lighter but you didn't have to compete for it with people much stronger than you?
Fuck I dont know why I am replying to a bait 1post OP but here it goes:
Your dad sounds like he listens to Levin, newsflash: you have NO RIGHT to cheap shit. As others have pointed out we used protectionism since the founding to help domestic industry. Moreover, we have better regulations and standard than almost every country that imports their cheap shit to compete (think China, Vietnam, Mexico, etc). We are already at a disadvantage with our labor laws and regulations so protectionism just levels the field.
Also, would you rather buy a cheap plastic colander made in China that breaks every year needing replacement or a solid metal one made here in the US that lasts a decade? (Yeah, China cant compete with quality because their shit standards).
Finally, the US does not need to "compete" with other nations when we hold the trump card aka innovation. The us innovates more than any other nation. Our iphones may be made in China but they were developed in the US along with many other items. If we just enforced out patent laws against fucks like China then the world would be forced to buy our high priced US made stuff meaning lower cost for US consumers
Right. There is a tremendous segment of the population here in the U.S. that is structurally or permanently unemployed. There simply are not enough jobs for legal citizens at rates that will allow them a reasonable standard of living. So they wind up being subsidized by the federal government. Whereas they used to would be employed by private industry, and receive the monies that enable them to survive directly, now private industry pays tax money to the federal government, and then the federal government distributes the money to the unemployed, creating an unnecessary and wasteful middleman that eats up revenue and further impoverishes the economy.
A government of 300 million people, more or less, is gonna be heavy and dangerous. That's just the way it is. The U.S. is a heavy operator, the heaviest, in fact. This isn't an island paradise like New Zealand, or a tiny tax shelter like Singapore, or the Roman/Zion banker Switzerland. It's not a one-off exception. The U.S. is the main event.
lets not forget the governments unwillingness to go after fraud and abuse in the welfare system meaning more people get away with bilking the system with no repercussions, in addition these people are less inclined to seek employment (employment that could start a career) because the starting pay is less than the benefits.
Yes, and part of this is a consequence of the tremendous economic dislocations that resulted from WW2. The current policies in place were designed to share the wealth globally, and spread things around to reduce the incentive for any sore losers to start another war.
However, WW2 was a long time ago, and the domestic situation in the U.S. is shaky enough to justify our calling a time out and re-jiggering our strategy.
So you're willing to gamble away the prevailing world order? We've had relative peace for 70 years.
The world needs us more than we need the world and this is a fact. They all own so fucking much of our debt they'd be more fucked than us if they tried to wage economic warfare.
There are no alternatives to US hegemony. The EU tried and has failed. There's a 50% chance the Euro won't even be around in 10 years.
China is a corrupt paper tiger. All their wealth is plastic and fake. They are masters of counterfeit, and their success is counterfeit.
India can't poo in loo.
Russia is about 3 steps away from being shoa'd.
Japan is sudokuing as a society
Brazil... lol
We hold all the chips, we have the biggest market for consumer goods, the biggest and strongest military, the most widely used and circulated currency, speak the global second language and if we had to we have the resources to close ourselves off completely and just do our own thing.
We don't need ANYBODY. They need us.
>no one in the world will want to buy American-made shit
not true
i buy clothes for cheap and resell it in latin america for profit. south americans love wearing anerican brands (levis, polo, nike, etc)
and they love iPhone and other American based companies (Ford/GM). my clients have never asked me for chinese made foods, they avoid them like the plague
...
Our middle class is crushed. A revolutionary proletariat has formed, just as Karl Marx envisioned when he embraced free trade policies in some of his works. This is a dangerous time for us, and we are under no compulsion to allow internal divisions to disrupt our own political situation. It is the job of every national government to look after the welfare and interests of their own nation and people above that of any other. America first. It's just common sense, and that's the way it's going to be. Get used to it.
Except it didn't really, what we lost and what we gained were qualitatively different.
>implying people will want to deal with the fucking chinks
Dude doing business with Chinese is almost more trouble than it's worth. They are constantly swindling and trying to cut corners and lie. They have none of the same standards or ethics we have in the west and our cultures are largely incompatible. China can control the Eastern world but the West is Best.
>tfw your country men 110% believe all propaganda
>tfw living in a soviet russia style propaganda state except it works
So I am beginning to think the cold war ended but we never stopped the propaganda for the same reason we couldnt just turn it off after world war 2.
No. Also your father rims his co-workers' asshole.
Why do you guys act like putting your own nation first means ignoring your place in international relations?
Confidentially, America first is a bargaining position, like a list price. We may be able to meet you in the middle, but you will never know unless you quit trying to press us into an old status quo that has since died, and is no longer relevant.
>I like you where you are
>I was taught to accept this is how the world works
>STOP! I SAY STOP DON"T CHANGE IT!
This is you.
Your dad is a liberal cuck, you shouldn't talk politics with him any longer or you'll end up retarded.
I'm not saying there's no room to move but World War II was pretty bad bro, I'd rather eat a little shit now than bathe in it later cause someone was triggered by free trade
>The current policies in place were designed to share the wealth globally, and spread things around to reduce the incentive for any sore losers to start another war.
wrong, the Marshal plan, while rebuilding Europe, mandated all materials and significant labor therein came from the US. This benefited us not Europe. Secondly, the deterrent for another world war was nuclear weapons.
Your mooslim dad is an idiot. If he is your dad.
You are right, what I said was unnecessarily condensed, and not as nuanced as your post. Regardless, I contend that the U.S. is currently in a bunch of bad trade deals, and it's time to renegotiate them.
You're implying that America is the one instigating it rather than reacting to a situation. As much people give America shit, they can effectively survive off of their own economy should the go full isolationist, how many others can say that without imploding?
Yeah, It will result in less exports. Economics and such.
No one can afford to sit out of the U.S. market, it's the biggest. We hold the Trump card.
yes he does
if the US puts tariffs on imports from other countries, those countries will put tariffs on US exports. tariffs invite retaliation. once we put up tariffs, countries will just put tariffs on our stuff and stop trading with us.
>apple
>coke
>hollywood/US based music
>US based designers
Bwahahaahah
No one wants American made shit anyway because it's filled with mercury infused corn syrup you dolce
Afraid your logic is wrong. First note that I said exports. Reverse tariffs will reduce US exports. Period. It is BASIC economics and it isn't theory. Its been proven (many many times).
As for imports, you are right. They will import the goods, pay the tariff and pass the cost on to the consumer (Americans). Again, BASIC economics.
I'd take a car factory job, or a job working in a field. Trump literally got me to work out again. I'm getting into shape for his jobs boom. I can feel muscles in places I haven't been able to feel them since high school. Soon, a big chunk of this spare tire around my waist will be gone. This is the most I've ever believed in a politician. Sure, the urban gentrification cucks won't take those jobs. They might break a nail or a sweat, and those fuckers can't have that. But people left in the places that have spent the last two decades and change being economically ass-raped by Bill Clinton's NAFTA will take those jobs. And that isn't just whites either. Look at what Detroit looked like before the auto industry left it behind, compared to the shithole it is now. Trump's promise to return those factories to American soil is the best possible thing that could happen to black men, and eventually their children: the black woman (or white coalburner) will have more incentive to stay with a man who has a factory job than she will if she has a welfare check and he sells drugs, leading their children to have all the benefits of having a stable father in their lives. Hispanics who came legally will stay. Citizens of Hispanic origin will find more job opportunities without their undocumented brethren hanging around. It's gonna be great. You're gonna love it.
>make it so that no one in the world will want to buy American-made shit
Not really. Merkin primary and secondary industry has been subsidised and held up by imported goods tariffs for years. No-one else in the world really buys American because it's so fucking expensive when you compare it with China.
> Also that white people and millennials will never take up car factory and field jobs.
In this he's correct. But then automation has made many of those shitslinging jobs obsolete any way.
Must suck knowing your old man can't give strangers rimjobs because there's a robot that does a better job. More cheaply.
>Americans think their garbage cars and other products don't sell because they are being unfairly taxed
That's why they need government to hold their hands. They can't take responsibility for their own shitty products.