THE QUESTION OF MGTOW

>tldr MGTOW is an impotent movement.

This video opened my eyes finally to mgtow. Break it down to it's core and mgtow is a nihilistic, narcissistic, anti-life, anti-biology, cult of disenfranchised people. I don't blame them, considering the current state of the world. But the lengths they go to rationalize your decisions is dizzying. Just admit you don't want to participate in the mating ritual and want to be monks. Admit that it's too painful to try to build and relationship and have it ripped away from you. Be emotionally vulnerable. Just be honest, and I'd have a lot more respect for you.

You were hurt. And now it's easier for you to avoid that hurt by bypassing any meaningful relationships. This is toxic, isolating behaviour.

You want to change things? The family is a microcosm of the macrocosm that is the government. The family was the world's first government/hierarchy. That is why the family is under attack right now. Because the government can easily control individuals but it has a harder time controlling millions of tiny little sovereign nations (family units). The one place a man could truly bring about change and have sovereignty over was his family/home. Men willingly bypassing a family have given away their power and spited themselves. It's all very confusing.

I'm starting to think some mgtow proponents are actually people, purposely and blatantly trying to destabilize society.

youtube.com/watch?v=SuJDdMFylhA

Other urls found in this thread:

youtube.com/watch?v=JSqrbdM8XjI
bookofpook.neocities.org/
heartiste.wordpress.com/2017/03/13/think-highly-of-yourself-and-women-will-think-highly-of-you/
twitter.com/SFWRedditVideos

>toxic
>spited themselves

I can't tell if you're a poorly disguised radfem or just a genuine dumbass.

It serves the same purpose institutional celibacy always did. It allows people who would have no chance to succeed in the dominance hierarchy, to have an alternative avenue to participate in society. The choice is either to give them some respect and have them influence people (like priests) or alienate them and have them become violent.

Care to say something? Like, you know - respond to my statement?

they are all fucked in the head children of divorce just like feminists who think the other gender are the enemy tbqh

Thanks for actually contributing a coherent thought!

I guess one of the things that bothers me, is, as of late - mgtow proponents seem to be almost openly hostile to any man that wants to have a family.

And, isn't it odd that most mgtow are white men? The mgtow movement almost seems like it's being advertised to white men specifically. Weird. I feel like the mgtow movement was setup for nefarious purposes desu.

The way I see it, if feminists are mainly repressed and frustrated women, MGTOW is just repressed and frustrated men. The difference: feminists have power to demand some sort of acceptance from society (example: the issue over fat shaming), while MGTOW lacks such power, being reduced to simply accepting their celibacy.
In conclusion: we would be better off without them both, as it will always harm society in one way or another - being the difference in that less power can reduce said harm.

Also, important to point it out, MGTOW would probably disappear if feminism lost its political power. Weirdly enough, the movement about men taking over their own lifes is completely dependant on the existence of a movement for "women's rights".

It's sad really. I do have legitimate sympathy for them.

I don't see much advertisement for it really. I heard about it because I looked into counter arguments to feminist propaganda. Even there it was a side issue at the time.

I think it is a natural occurrence in the same way that if you play a game and lose 100%, you start to believe it's not a game worth playing. As an organised movement I think it's a confusion between that emotional detachment and the real issues that exist with the trend towards demonisation and marginalisation of white men.

youtube.com/watch?v=JSqrbdM8XjI

90% of MGTOW are MGTOW because they haven't had contact with women in a sexual way ever or in a few months.

Huge majority of men in the movement use it as a crux to put all their troubles with women on.

Wow, lots of insight from Sup Forums tonight. Actual discussion taking place. Thanks.

Yeah mgtow, is kind of a direct result of feminism. But men should still strive to have a family if possible. Even if 99% of woman are used up, a decent man should still at least, aspire to have a family if it's possible.

Thanks guys

All women are whores whether you pay them in cars, jewelry, or cash. I'm not getting married to a slut just to get divorce raped by feminized government. You can babble about how I'm a race traitor degenerate, but I'm not going to go out and get married to some whore that's already taken 45 dicks by the time they're 25.
I could just spend my money on cute Asian girls that will appreciate me way more. You want to cuck yourself out to the feminized government and become a slave to your wife in the name of the "white race" go ahead. Most people, like myself really couldn't give a shit

What kind of mutated camel feet is the guy in the back cooking?

Really? Because inner city blacks have been MGTOW for decades

>All women are whores whether you pay them in cars, jewelry, or cash. I'm not getting married to a slut just to get divorce raped by feminized government. You can babble about how I'm a race traitor degenerate, but I'm not going to go out and get married to some whore that's already taken 45 dicks by the time they're 25.

I couldn't agree more to this.

>I could just spend my money on cute Asian girls that will appreciate me way more. You want to cuck yourself out to the feminized government and become a slave to your wife in the name of the "white race" go ahead. Most people, like myself really couldn't give a shit

This, I disagree with. The white race is very much worth preserving. I am not calling you a traitor - I think coward would be the better term. And I mean that in a very literal way not meant to hurt your feelings. As I said to another user. You don't have to get married and have a family BUT you mustn't give up on the idea just because you see it as daunting.

Existence (in general) was a mistake.

And look where it's gotten them!

If making the most rational, individualist choice makes me a coward, I'll go ahead and be one.

It's allowed them to have as many babies they want with no repercussions.

I don't know but dem burggers look mighty THICC AND JUICY.

The choice you're making is a rational one. Your mindset however, is poisoned. Detoxify your mind and soul and you might just attract the kind of woman that you think doesn't exist.

I care about you user. Either way, seek detoxification. If not the mind, at least the body.

We are living through the repercussions right now!

Any movement that isn't based around improving the lives of future generations will always fail.

>you might just attract the kind of woman that you think doesn't exist.
Kind of a silly statement. I don't believe they exist so why bother.

It's not a movement, it's just men waking up to the reality of modern "love"

I'll share my input I guess in case anyone is interested, from a newly MGTOW

The last time I was about to fuck, I realized that I had now lost all physical satisfaction from sex. It was a complete chore; every step. From meeting her on tinder, to having to hang out with her, to having to listen to her truly retarded opinions and comments, to having to slowly seduce her with booze and weed and once we finally got to the main event, I looked down at my limp penis and her ass and I realized that if I was gonna do it, I'd have to somehow convince myself to get hard. It wasn't gonna just happen.

The amount of bullshit I had to put myself through drained every bit of satisfaction from me. In that moment, I realized how fucking pointless the entire ritual was. Why the fuck was I wasting all this time, money, and especially energy chatting with some dumb bimbo I could care less about?

I pulled up my pants and told her to get the fuck out. This is a waste of my fucking time, and I told myself I'd stop wasting my time with chasing pussy for now.

Are you done with casual sex though?Sometimes it is like this. It's a chore to even do the deed, it's just a psychological thing, to say you've fuck girls a lot. But I've had bubbly little sluts follow me home after parties, and I've had really great times. I categorize myself as MGTOW but I don't cut myself off to ALL female contact

>The white race is very much worth preserving.

Its not.

Bringing white boys into a world that will hate them until the day they die is cruel. And it will only get worse.

>Durr nihilism durr making more whites is curel durr let shitskins make more kids

Nihilists should push their little world view on shitskins so they don't reproduce as much.

I have met many virgins at the church I used to go to that were LITERALLY not secret degenerates behind closed doors that have married and have amazing families user. I grew up on that kind of atmosphere and it was very real. It may be hard to understand from an outsiders perspective that this exists, but it does. Also, I knew many women and men that were virgins into their early 30's.

I've also met many amazing girls outside of church that I never capitalized on because I was too degenerate. I am telling you. Once you start changing yourself for the better you will find better women gravitating towards you.

Well you are a perfect example of this then I suppose. If you think you're not worth preserving then, you're not. But you speak for yourself - not for me or other whites.

White people have always had a cross to bear, and truthfully I feel like that is our destiny. But that doesn't mean we should shrink from it. The world is a better place because we're in it. White people are much maligned but we are ultimately a force for good.

...

I completely agree OP.

These MGTOWs seem to be lying to themselves. They want to feel like "enlightened men" who have transcended societal norms.

>Once you start changing yourself for the better you will find better women gravitating towards you
That's a lie, all you get is more sluts that want you cause you have the most to provide.
>that were LITERALLY not secret degenerates
how would you ever know?

Problem is even if they aren't going to screw you, they can decide one morning that they don't love you anymore.
Even if there were girls that were perfect wife material that would never betray me, there wouldn't be enough for everyone. Most men would still have no choice but MGTOW. I'm really starting to enjoy not having the existential crisis's i used to have of never finding a wife. I get sex fairly frequently, and I can't complain.

Are you planning on having children through surrogates? I could careless if you're MGTOW as long as you have an offspring.

Once again your flawed thinking exposes you.

>That's a lie, all you get is more sluts that want you cause you have the most to provide.

You are thinking about money! That's YOUR frame of mind. So you're projecting your attachment with money onto women. I know many CONTENT people with very little money.

Once you start transcending all this physical stuff mentality you will start finding yourself in situations with other people that are not around you because of what you have but because of who you are. What I am saying surely sounds cliche to you - but it's a cliche for a reason. Become the person you want to be with. Otherwise you are putting expectations on women that you yourself don't adhere to.

...

Arguing about saving the white race is pointless. White western women prefer career, vacations, casual sex, drink, a house and car, etc to having children.

Family comes way down the list of white females priorities and I don't see that changing in time to save us. The birthrate is in the toilet.

Women cant be forced to give birth, so unless by some miracle they suddenly realise the consequences of their actions and start having lots of babies we're finished. I dont see that happening at all.

Jesus fucking Christ. I mean agree with most of that - you're not wrong.

Women left to their own devices will always take a mile with the inch that you give them.

Whote men have a spirit in them, animated by god himself. Women are interchangeable across the board for the most part, but white men are worth saving.

This is not an argument, it is simply the truth.

A return to Christianity would make us prosperous again. But alas, I don't think women would ever go back to Jesus.

Again, though - this I know - just because things look bleak does not mean you should stop trying.

...

If it were a viable option, and I feel like raising a kid by myself in the future.
>people that are not around you because of what you have but because of who you are
A man is only what he makes and produces. Believing someone can love me for being "myself" is silly and hypocritical. You're advocating constant self improvement and change to attract a women.
>Become the person you want to be with.
I'm happy by myself. If you're implying I should be someone that I'd want as a wife... Idk what to tell you, I'm not gay. Men and Women provide different things in relationships
>Otherwise you are putting expectations on women that you yourself don't adhere to.
I'm not, because I don't expect to marry any woman.

An American investment banker was at the pier of a small coastal Mexican village when a small boat with just one fisherman docked. Inside the small boat were several large yellowfin tuna. The American complimented the Mexican on the quality of his fish and asked how long it took to catch them.

The Mexican replied, “only a little while. The American then asked why didn’t he stay out longer and catch more fish? The Mexican said he had enough to support his family’s immediate needs. The American then asked, “but what do you do with the rest of your time?”

The Mexican fisherman said, “I sleep late, fish a little, play with my children, take siestas with my wife, Maria, stroll into the village each evening where I sip wine, and play guitar with my amigos. I have a full and busy life.” The American scoffed, “I am a Harvard MBA and could help you. You should spend more time fishing and with the proceeds, buy a bigger boat. With the proceeds from the bigger boat, you could buy several boats, eventually you would have a fleet of fishing boats. Instead of selling your catch to a middleman you would sell directly to the processor, eventually opening your own cannery. You would control the product, processing, and distribution. You would need to leave this small coastal fishing village and move to Mexico City, then LA and eventually New York City, where you will run your expanding enterprise.”

The Mexican fisherman asked, “But, how long will this all take?”

To which the American replied, “15 – 20 years.”

“But what then?” Asked the Mexican.

The American laughed and said, “That’s the best part. When the time is right you would announce an IPO and sell your company stock to the public and become very rich, you would make millions!”

cont...

“Millions – then what?”
The American said, “Then you would retire. Move to a small coastal fishing village where you would sleep late, fish a little, play with your kids, take siestas with your wife, stroll to the village in the evenings where you could sip wine and play your guitar with your amigos.”

...

What's your point, should I move to a third world shithole and breed away? Life is more than family, my friend. You can put your time into work and goals and ideas, you can become much happier than investing in a woman

Stop being a beta male OP.
bookofpook.neocities.org/

its not about investing in a woman. if you find the right one (and you can) she will invest in you.

this is the wife you should strive for.

Epilogue: The Wife of Noble Character
10 F60 A wife of noble character who can find?
She is worth far more than rubies.
11 Her husband has full confidence in her
and lacks nothing of value.
12 She brings him good, not harm,
all the days of her life.
13 She selects wool and flax
and works with eager hands.
14 She is like the merchant ships,
bringing her food from afar.
15 She gets up while it is still dark;
she provides food for her family
and portions for her servant girls.
16 She considers a field and buys it;
out of her earnings she plants a vineyard.
17 She sets about her work vigorously;
her arms are strong for her tasks.
18 She sees that her trading is profitable,
and her lamp does not go out at night.
19 In her hand she holds the distaff
and grasps the spindle with her fingers.
20 She opens her arms to the poor
and extends her hands to the needy.
21 When it snows, she has no fear for her household;
for all of them are clothed in scarlet.
22 She makes coverings for her bed;
she is clothed in fine linen and purple.
23 Her husband is respected at the city gate,
where he takes his seat among the elders of the land.
24 She makes linen garments and sells them,
and supplies the merchants with sashes.
25 She is clothed with strength and dignity;
she can laugh at the days to come.
26 She speaks with wisdom,
and faithful instruction is on her tongue.
27 She watches over the affairs of her household
and does not eat the bread of idleness.
28 Her children arise and call her blessed;
her husband also, and he praises her:
29 "Many women do noble things,
but you surpass them all."
30 Charm is deceptive, and beauty is fleeting;
but a woman who fears the LORD is to be praised.
31 Give her the reward she has earned,
and let her works bring her praise at the city gate.

>a woman investing in you and not using you as a parasite
Idk what planet you live on

everything in this life is a symbiotic relationship.

True, I could pay money for a wife's sex. Or hundred's of cute hooker's sex.

meant for

ya that shit is fucked up. i cant believe he's pushing this awkward unreasonable philosophy so hard. He just states a bunch of unexplained axioms and things as fact that are totally not fact. Does almost seem like a troll somehow... terrible name though.

Yeah, I've really been getting this feeling like many youtubers are actually PAID shills.

I have zero evidence of this and I am too lazy to try and dig any deeper. I just get the feeling. So many cool youtubers you like initially because of their conservative views (trojan horse), then they start injecting nihilism and discord into any cohesive community that pops up.

zzzzzz

sorry this is a sensitive subject for you

...

>you have to be "hurt" in order to think X
smelly, dumb, social scum

Only breed attractive women

Collectivism vs Individualism

The leaf has chosen the right hand path, the burger has chosen the left.

Unfortunately for the latter, he was manipulated by the shitty conditions of his environment and disenfranchised to his NWO stance. I wish him and his possible wife to be to find light one day and purge their degenerate behaviors. However unfortunately, the wife has to take the first step as they have been the instigators with feminism, and their feeble irrational brains can't reason through their manipulation. Leaf doesn't understand that.

>a smart Leaf exists
I'm going to use the legal precedent set by God in the case Heaven v. Sodom, and say the Day of the Rake can be canceled if there's ten total good Leaves in America's Hat. Here we have one. The Lot of Canada.

This

I don't understand?
>individualism is irrational REEE

I didn't say Individualism was irrational, just that it was the NWO agenda. Women are irrational and easily manipulated into eating it though.

Thanks my burger brother. I'm going to get some rest now.

This entire thread has actually been super comfy and not a single troll. Feels good. Goodnight.

>NWO agenda
epic meme

Even though I'm a fag, my boyfriend have a very traditional relationship. He cooks, cleans, and supports me in everything I do. I provide a place for him to focus on his hobbies and art. Our relationship works because we're not invested in material things. Our primary struggle is that our individual focuses don't overlap much (I'm interested in ideas, he's interested in expressions of feelings) but I have friends for intellectual stimulation he doesn't feel like providing. He's a constant source of positivity, and the sex is great.

I feel bad for those of you who have to deal with modern women. Even if you found one who wanted to stay home, they probably wouldn't take the opportunity to better themselves and your communal space. They lack loyalty and their values are base. At most you can hope to tame a woman -- not trust one.

>I can't tell if...

the flag has a leaf on it.

ahh ok. can't really say anything to that

There's incidentally being MGTOW and there's identifying as MGTOW

Your problem is with casual sex (not the way sex was meant to be experienced) and your problem is not with women in general.

Let's go dawg, quality post. Right on

Women have literally become cancer, my friend. MGTOW exists primarily because women have turned into massive sluts who only care about cock and casual lifestyles where they can be as much of a degenerate as they want with no repercussions whatsoever. Family is something way, way down the list of priorities for women, and when they DO start desiring a family, it's only so they can have someone to provide for them, whilst they live out their degenerate lives. Why even bother with getting trying to get a date, and go through the whole long arduous, trying ritual to even get a girl to look your way, when she has probably already been dicked by about 80 different men, and have been used in just about every hole? To sacrifice your own happiness and aspirations to take care of some retarded bimbo who is likely cheating on you behind your back, and justifying it to herself by saying that you would be "fine with it"? There is really just no point to it whatsoever, especially since the only thing keeping women in line (Christianity), has long since been discarded since it was "keeping" women down. Dealing with women nowadays is just complete insanity, and will just leave you a broken, depressed wreck who is perpetually angry at the world, and you will die with only that anger and hate to comfort you in the end.

MGTOW as a temporary path for individual self-improvement? Sure. MGTOW as a political solution for society's ills? No way in hell.

...

>jap
>not MGTOW

you must be loads of fun on a date you freak autist

>Just admit you don't want to participate in the mating ritual and want to be monks
I have no problem admitting this.

thanks

fair

good point

I don't disagree necessarily but by constantly fucking bitches you are perpetuating the cycle of broken women. the one thing MGTOW never (conveniently) addresses is the hypocrisy. As I said to another user in this thread - you have to be worthy of a good woman. and no, I don't mean have a "good job" or lots of assets. I mean you have to have character yourself. You have to be someone she respects. Believe it or not there are many many many women out there that as long as they have a roof over their heads and they respect the man they are with, they can be happy! its not a fairy tale, it's the truth.

the hard part is actually embodying the ethics you want in a mate. by the sounds of it, you are probably not living a lifestyle you would want a prospective wife to have

Married with two kids. You cannot maintain your civilization with someone else's babies.

Bachelor japs are not MGTOW by the way. They are just autistic. Trust me.

people calling others autists on here are usually the autists. just sayin

and I respect you for that

>Married with two kids. You cannot maintain your civilization with someone else's babies.

may you be blessed user

>Believe it or not there are many many many women out there that as long as they have a roof over their heads and they respect the man they are with, they can be happy! its not a fairy tale, it's the truth.

Sorry, this simply doesn't align with reality. Women are garbage and incentivized to be so by the state and culture. It's ok, because fulfillment doesn't need to come from a woman

>You cannot maintain your civilization with someone else's babies.
implying my "civilization" is something that needs to be maintained / perpetuated

>30 posts in a MGTOW (hey check me out im a lonely rejected virgin) thread

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Many men live ethical and moral lifestyles, and are definitely people that are capable of providing and being loving. The thing is, women don't want that. They want Chads, and Tyrones, and Jamals. They want bad men who don't care for any of that "nice" stuff. They want men who will use them and then dump them. They want these men because the love the challenge of getting the giant stud, and making all of their friends jealous. They only care about those nice "betas" when they have hit about 30, and have decided that they want to settle down now after wasting away their life engaging in rampant hedonism. It's an utterly disgusting cycle that all women have now started to participate in, and it won't stop. Especiallly not now that they have been "liberated" from things like Christianity and the like which were "holding them back", and keeping them from being "STRONG INDEPENDENT WOMANZ". Society now has put pussy on such a pedestal that women can say anything, do anything and get away with it. There is almost no way that we are going to be able to remove this corruption with how deep it is now.

> MGTOW
> Leaf
Go away

Blaming mgtow for the falling birth rate is like raising the minimum wage and then blaming unemployment on businesses.

100% truth

damn, owned.

I never said fulfillment needed to come from a woman.

>Women are garbage and incentivized to be so by the state and culture.

EXACTLY. When nature takes it's course women are HAPPY to cook and clean and raise kids. I'm telling you. Be masculine and be dignified and you will find a girl that wants to fall back into her role. it is literally biology.

I'm just participating user. why are you trying to start shit? People are just discussing things. you dont need to get mad.

women don't want a beta. but they dont want "chad" either

they want this: heartiste.wordpress.com/2017/03/13/think-highly-of-yourself-and-women-will-think-highly-of-you/

it's all in the head

ukbro flies in with the truth

>Be masculine and be dignified
They're not feminine or dignified, and as much as you want to believe there's a unicorn out there in the wheatfields waiting for you, there's not

Who is this retarded ass leaf spouting his opinions like he's some kind of enlightened sage?

Feminism is nothing more than the government(and those who run it) using women to get what they want from the peasants(us).Anyone with two brain cells to rub together could figure that out.

The problem is after being put down all their early life for merely being male, and having females churched up to double standard after double standard, men have nothing other than sex to motivate them to go after women.
To do otherwise ends up with men judging women on the same standards as themselves to be safe, to make sense. The result ends up making women look like horrible, entitled, liars that know exactly what they are doing(something else men are commonly lied to).

What this retarded leaf needs to get through his head is that no matter how right he may be, if he doesn't come down to earth with the rest of us and acknowledge the legitimate concerns alot of us have with the 'modern' women and our reasoning for not pursuing relationships, men will not do so. Simple as that.

Fun fact: The tried and true tactic of telling a dude to man up still works, just not with women. Manning up is what feminism literally uses to fuck with men. Most of us have no problem with working to the bone everyday, and being happier for it because we know our work matter(no matter how little).

This retarded ass leaf has provided no reason for men to pursue women other than 'ITS JUST GOOD'. This not only undermines the concerns related to men and their personal relationships, but ultimately ignores them just to be 'right'. How in god's name are you going to keep guys interested in LTR's if you use the same tactics as feminism?

Also
>a leaf

I already found one.

and so have most of my childhood friends. many kids, great careers (architecture), lots of family time.

it sounds like you want misery. thats really what it sounds like to me.

>implying women arent just investments to raise kids and the onlt reason why you dont want kids is because youre mentally still a child
Fuck off leaf, shilling this all evening saged

Yea I've found them before too xD

I am not suggesting you find fulfillment in a woman. what I am saying is you cant right it off because you dont want to try anymore. a family is a HEALTHY thing.

the world is fucked up right now. MAJORLY FUCKED UP. but that doesnt mean that there is still not a "right" and "wrong" path

objectively it is better to build a family than to be alone. it doesnt mean your life will be unfulfilling necessarily but its what god wants

Started listening and it's boring as fuck, fuck off leaf