Does Sup Forums support capitalism?

Does Sup Forums support capitalism?

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The alternative is socialism and we all know how that turned out

COMMIE COMMIE TRAITOR TO OUR COUNTRY

I believe you are missing the second largest sphere, friend.

It's called 'Overhead'.

Yes

Corparatism is shit though, and thats what we see in this day and age

Big businesses lobby for new regulations and complexities in the law that will make it harder for startups, which in turn lowers competition. This is now happening on a global scale with unions such as the EU

thats real retarded sir

Without private capital, the amount you produce would be significantly lower. Human labor costs more than just salary, there is insurance, training costs, benefits, opportunity cost.

Being paid every penny you produce would make businesses economically unfeasible, which would mean you wouldn't get a job and wouldn't be able to produce shit in the first place

...

>Paid total value of production
>Companies make no profit
>Everywhere goes bankrupt

Commies with their wonderful logic again

>your jobs is to pick apples
>each apple your pick has a market value of 10$
>your employer takes 50% and now you have 5$
>apply income tax of 30% to it, now you have 3.5%.
>every dollar you spend is taxed, VAT, property tax etc... no you have 2%
>inflation makes your moeny less valuable, now you have 1.5$.
>For every 1.5$ that you make you owe 2$ to your government, now you have -0,5$

yes capitalism is really ((great))

If you produced that value then they would pay you that

because I work a menial labor job where the "total value I produce" wouldn't be possible without my co-workers and boss?

>bosnian economics

can you prove me wrong? This is even the most optimistic estimates, in reality you will earn even less .

It's sad seeing all these brainwashed so called anti-commies, not even realizing they're a stupid parrot, brainwashed into living against any natural laws.

Americans perfected the propaganda and staged the cold war to make you all stupid fools passionately anti-commie, because it's the only way for (((them))) to steal all your actual value and keep you in control at the same time.

Basically you're brain dead zombies, living off of misery of other people, thinking you're smart because muh ebul gulags.

They deserve the fucking gulags, you just don't know it because you're too busy consuming their propaganda.

>25% inflation rate
>magic random 133% tax at the end
>optimistic estimates
user pls, no wonder your country is bankrupt

>tfw too smart to understand economics

Lenin was a good man

Nobody has the energy to prove someone who is economically retarded wrong. Take an econ class.

based slovenia

implying money hidden in offshore tax havens is better

>an apple doesn't cost 10$
>you're not considering:
>the guy who will prep (clean, refrigerate, etc) the apple
>the guy who will transport the apple
>the guy at a shop who will buy the apple (from your boss) and then sell the apple (at a profit)
>the secretary that works for your boss and takes calls

also "kek, taxation = capitalism, not communism lmao"

But that was not perfect socialism

Sure, memes are a powerful way to persuade naive people to keep supporting your criminal scheme.

Great job, I guess all that money put into mind control was well spent.

...

then why did the soviets fall, and eastblock not like them

well after maybe 10 years you can expect an inflation rate of 25$.
It's not a magic random tax, it's the USA debt. Every USA citizen is 65.000$ in debt and the average salary is like 30.000$.

>those tiny taxes
Whew, that really doesn't apply here. With a 31.42% payroll tax and ~30%(depends on municipality, 29-32%) income tax it's bigger starting than your income is.

Stay strong, Sweden.

I'm so sorry.

When experts for mind control, with an unlimited budget, want something to fall, it falls. Not because it's bad, but because you can always count on local ignorance to create enough power to achieve the goal.

>tfw to smart to win the cold war

>everyone who disagrees with me is immoral
t. naive commie

so what you're saying is, memes did it

In the very essence, yes.

In capitalism you can choose to get the total value of your or work or work for a wage. The reason why people choose the wage is because it means they get a guaranteed income. It is exchanging their potential income for a stable income. Also your graph is misleading because it does not show the costs of production that eat away 95% of the grey area.

>that exaggerated OP pic
The 'total value produce' that is outside my income is a small portion, but when you have hundreds of workers, it adds up to a sizable profit.

But if your actually work looks like your pic, then look for another employer or work for yourself, it's that simple. Socialism is for retards who want the Big Daddy Government to handle all the complex things for themselves...and the end result is still the same.

Meme is just a nicely packaged, easily consumable ideology. Add some ignorance, and you have the most powerful weapon you can have.

Yes we do support capitalism.

Because I understand that I'm only able to produce that much of value by fitting my labor into a structure someone else has created.

If *I* created the structure that unlocks the value of my time I, as entrepreneur, would gain that share as well.

People like to imagine it has no benefit, but try laboring without the backing of your employer's company and see where it gets you. Even if you are successful you will understand the value and be pleased to claim it as your own.

If you give the government control over prices you are inevitably creating a less efficient system than if you had a free market system. This means lower wealth overall regardless of equitability.

Neo-fascists like the ones in Sup Forums have long since done away with the desire for any real economic knowledge and have replaced it with an unhealthy obsession with jews.

It's paying for my studies. I'll just fuck off when it's done.

Yes. Stop being a twat.

>free market
What is that? Some fairy tale for 3 yr old kids?

You're actually on point there. Everyone, left and right's abandoned the notion. There's little difference in economic policy between neocons and outright nazis, and modern commies just want a sky-high income tax, shying away from impeding the corporations. Scandinavia has some of the freest economies in the world, for companies.

Value is overrated. Go back to sleep OP.

That's because there will never be such thing. For the same reason our opinion is different.

Value is insubstantial. Workers are paid according to how their employers value the work they need done, not how valuable the worker considers his time. Just because you think putting whipped cream and cinnamon on top of a latte made by a machine should be a $30 per hour job doesn't mean that it ever will be.

>your employer provides capital that increases the number of apples you can pick by 1,000%

No wonder your country is so poor.

I love that the anti-capitalists in this thread are from broke shit holes that are broke because were under communist rule until just a few decades ago.

Brainwashing works.

Your memes don't work on me, I lived through all that. We were doing great until your blood thirsty criminal globalist master finally found a way to infiltrate and destroy us, after Tito's death.

All we have now is slavery, no control over anything, and a huge American military base.

We know your game.

youtube.com/watch?v=0RRnCnO1Y2c

>the only alternative to capitalism is Marxist socialism
Good goy. Keep thinking only within (((their))) two ideologies don't explore third position arguments

Gray bubble is only 5-9% (profit margins in most industries)

Taxes for me are roughly 30%, more if you include property tax

>>each apple your pick has a market value of 10$
If you can't disconnect the market value from the value of labor you're a fucking retard, plain and simple. If I weld two components together, each with a value of $100k, and it sells for 205k I haven't produced $205k in value. I just welded two fucking valuable things together. There's a lot more that goes into things, especially farming, than just fucking harvesting.

Reminder

So you're a commie but also agree that (((they))) need to be gassed?

You're trying to sell Hitler as a savior to a red blooded Yugoslav. Get real, we're not your average negro.

No
It's not far away from total crash now, no recovery, it's made this way

They fixed it in the 30ies, than fucked it later
The USSR vs the west shit, it was all on borrowed time. Both systems would collapse

Commies consider anything involving money to be capitalism

Nice chart, too bad it is not on scale.

I calculated, between 60 and 70% of the money my boss put out of his pocket to pay me goes into taxes.

Meanwhile, I know the margin of my company is only 8%.

Capitalism and communism are two sides of the same (((coin))).

Guess who benefits most from both?

No. Commies love jews, he's just trying to "speak your language". Commies still love kike social engineering. Leftypol is in love with feminism.

Not trying to sell hitler to anyone mate but you can't deny that that particular sentence is true

If you want to truly oppose the elite don't default to socialism vs capitalism because they're both shit and body fail systems instead think outside the (((box))) and come up with a better alternative system to both

>we were doing great
In the first like 3 minutes of the vdeo, the say:
>it's okay because it's not at all like the soviet union!
So it's good because it's not communist?
>Nobody makes any money and meals are cheap!
So it's good because everyone's poor?
>Europeans flock here for vacation!
So people with money they are allowed to earn go there because it's dirt cheap? Congratulations on being the Mexico of Europe.
>They have a bunch of lakes!
Okay, I take it all back.

That's how the controllers play the game, you're either a commie or a capitalist. Divide and conquer 101.

I's about being independent peoples working for your own destiny, according to your possibility. It's about not being a slave.

...

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Under communism I'd have to work to support every nigger on the block, and I'd only get back what some (((community leader))) decided I needed.

Because I live in Sweden and the Taxes ring is approx 50% of the income one and also fuck off shill.

You have to go to work only if you say you are able to work.

meanwhile in ravioliland

>leafs

Wow, a society where nothing gets done and we ALL get to live in squalor!

That diagram is flawed. For a great many people, the middle circle (income) is actually larger than the out circle (added value).

Yes, I know that's insane, but think about it this way: under capitalism, some companies make profits, and a profitable business generates the diagram in your picture. However, some companies are -unprofitable- and therefore must have at least some employees making more than they contribute to the company. You're perfectly willing to complain about companies making profits, but do you think that unprofitable companies are better?

Unprofitable companies will exist in both communism and capitalism. The fundamental difference is that under capitalism, a company that doesn't make a profit will eventually go bankrupt and disappear. Under communism, a company will just continue operating at a loss, draining resources out of the economy with no reason to try and reform itself.

>1 post by this ID
>literally 4 words
>most generic retarded bait ever

God i fucking hate /nupol/

GO BACK TO GOYBOOK IF YOU JUST WANNA ARGUE ABOUT CAPITALISM 101 SHIT

This is the typical rhetoric that globalists use to get ignorant local population on their side.

There was never, in the history of the world, an empire that lived off of a misery of majority more so than the modern USA.

You being in the upper class, getting overcompensated with the money of the misery they never even show you on TV, doesn't make your fairy tale true.

You get way more than you create, and it's the portion that was assigned to you. Yes, a portion.

You are exactly what you're trying to attack. And you have no clue about it.

> Implying your productivity would be that high without the capital goods the capitalist accumulated and holds, foregoing consumption he could have if he didn't save and hold.

>50 million people died in USA and there are insane amounts of work camps that work people to death

But USA is definately more oppressive than Gulag'ic Russia yeah?

Sure there is fighting in USA, always has, it's free men fighting for land and resources. But i'll take that over the sickening atrocities that happened under commune idealism.

Everyone dies everywhere, we simply look at the manner of their deaths to understand how good of a life they may have lived. I'll take dieing in North America 2017 > any of that shit you're pushing. Even if i end up twisting my ankle and hitting my head on a rock out in the bush with not a soul around me for hundreds of miles, dieing alone there is still better than dieing for some idealistic concept of economy/society i may or may not have agreed with.

Labor theory of value is objectively false, so graph is a lie.

>>In capitalism you can choose to get the total value of your or work or work for a wage. The reason why people choose the wage is because it means they get a guaranteed income

that doesn't seem to be a real choice

It is. You can chose to wage work for someone. Or go out and start your own shit. Do you want security, or do you want to live?

>This is the typical rhetoric that globalists
The typical rhetoric is going through a video you posted on 4chins point-by-point?
>You being in the upper class
I'm not upper class. You're just buttmad that our poorest have it better off than almost everybody in your country.
>You get way more than you create
What did you mean by this?

Yes.

Yes.
If you don't want to work for that salary you are free to leave

>you can stop being a slave, all you have to do is revolt
what a meme

Economics is a pseudo science.

>Do you want security, or do you want to live?
why not both?

This comic would probably flew over everyone's head

Legitimate question: if we're having a productive discussion on the merits of capitalism vs communism, trying out various arguments, practicing our rhetoric, and perhaps even shifting a few opinions, can it really be considered a successful slide? As far as I'm concerned, this is what Sup Forums is for.

Shillbots creating new threads only really helps them if the threads are garbage, but this one is good practice for answering a common communist criticism. It helps us be less retarded when we see the same argument on Facebook - now well have the ammunition to confidently tell our commie friends why they're wrong in a way that doesn't sound like autistic screeching. Or at least, that's the goal.

Now, look again at the pictures of eastern Europe we sometime post.

>why not both?
great reply, until you actually think

>do you want to sit on your ass all day and do nothing, or do you want to be a trillionaire
>why not both?

Where is the rest? Is that how it ends? Anymore like it?

What's it like to be bluepilled?

>empirical economics yes

>praxeology no

Actually it is a real choice. You get to choose between:

1) A consistent protected wage with materials supplied, but sacrifice part of your production value

or

2) Supplying yourself, with no wage guarantee, but you get to keep all earnings on production.

Most businesses don't use complex economics though. So, the whole "Austrian economics" is just a theory, and not the reality businesses use.

>mfw there are nationalists on this board that support a system that sells their borders to global corporations beholden to no one but their faceless multiethnic stockholders

USA has gulags all over the world.

You have the standard that you have exclusively because of those. It's easy to choose a "good life" when you can ignore how your portion is being secured.

Capitalism is the problem.

American capitalism is responsible for all the degeneracy Sup Forums hates.

National Socialism is the only solution.