No no no... Why is he blaming the good guys? This was clearly Paul Ryan's fault

No no no... Why is he blaming the good guys? This was clearly Paul Ryan's fault.

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How was it Ryan's fault? Trump changed the plan a ton to appease the freedom babies and they still wouldn't vote for it.

He put out a bill that didn't really repeal Obamacare. It was just Obamacare-lite.

youtube.com/watch?v=Kz13ZNrJY5M

Richard Spencer wants free healthcare, video related

He probably thinks he can negotiate with Ryan, but not with the hardline ideologues at CFG and Heritage. He's wrong, and Ryan will stab him in the back.

youtube.com/watch?v=BPuo4uCa-ZU

More from Richard Spencer on healthcare, video.

>Why is he blaming the good guys?

The Trump/Ryan care was dumb

Because the bill is still fucked.

They should have just repealed Obamacare, and at most expand Medicaid/Medicare grants to states slightly.

These halfass healthcare measures mean fuck all, and they're all shit. Either let the market handle itself or go full nationalism, anything in between is pure inefficiency.

We need free healthcare

This is fucking stupid it's Paul Ryan's fault not the freedom caucus

His bill wasn't as good as it should have been, they had 8 years, they didn't let the freedom caucus have a real say, and it's almost like it was intentional to try to pass some stupid shit like that.

Because he's working on removing that worm Lyin' Ryan and he can't be too obvious about it.

Ryan pulled the bill because it began losing support from "moderates", i.e. insurance company shills.

Gotta cut the taxes first. Then try again.

Because Trump isn't actually playing 4D chess. He is just lumbering along getting some things kind of right and other things wrong. Half the things he has done right, he did the wrong way and therefore can be easily undone by the next president.

I know that many try to find any excuse to defend him, so i expect some to blame the freedom caucus despite Ryancare being a shittier Obamacare. They need to repeal Obamacare and start from scratch.

Honestly, the content of the bill wasn't the real problem. Ryan's tactics were the issue. He attempted to forge an "expert consensus" behind closed doors and then foist it on the congress as a fait accompli. That sort of government by conclave may make sense to Catholics like Ryan, but it's innately offensive in America's Protestant culture. I knew the bill was dead once people started complaining that Ryan's people were writing it in secret. After that because the issue, nothing was going to get the bill through.

Trump's team is the good guys, the "Freedom" Caucus are controlled opposition

Actively working against Trump in an underhanded manner.
Against Trump.

The FC is all done.

Can the GOP stomach Ryan fumbling that, too?

Fool me once, shame on you.
Fool me twice, shame on me?

Trump backs Ryan on tax cuts and he fucks it up again, Trump is the one who is gonna look bad.

They wanted to deal with Obamacare before taxes and the budget because of all the bullshit they could deal with.

Now the tax cuts and budget got more complicated.

Ryan has effectively obstructed Trump and the GOPs agenda.

There is a real chance there could be a government shutdown.

Not all of the FC is bad, but some are hardened Never-Trumpers, also Paul Ryan let down Trump and went about it badly.

RON PAUL AS NEW SPEAKER FOR GOP!!!!!

Ryan wasted everyones motherfucking time.

All that fucking hype. The cucks at the GOP even paid for ads celebrating the repeal of Obamacare.

Ryan fisted the party.

The freedom caucus wants nothing short of perfection. They live in a fantasy land, you can't expect everything and giving nothing.

Because (((Koch Brothers))) threatened to axe each and every House Freedom Caucus member who voted for the bill by dumping them in the next primary election. That's right, the fucking (((Koch Brothers))) WANT Obamacare. Can you niggers wake up and realize just how toxic the BIG CLUB establishment is, how there's little difference between Democrats and Republicans, and how Charles Koch and George Soros are essentially the same criminals? These people aren't interested in making deals, they're interested in burning down Washington DC and the country with it when they don't get what they want. I hope Donald Trump knows what he's up against, because his friends in Washington DC are few and far in-between. Seems like even "good ones" like Rand Paul and Dave Brat are now swamp creatures out of either their poor judgment or seditious betrayal.

This thread is so dead. Guess the Trumpettes are still licking their wounds over their god-king being outed as a moron who can't fight for regular Americans at all - outed in a way even they can't deny. Even with a Republican-controlled Senate AND House, Trump can't do shit. All the people who thought Trump was great because they didn't know how the country works and didn't want to, and now it's plainly visible that Trump doesn't either.

Lame duck president within two months. What a fucking joke.

>the guy who took photos lifting womens dumbbells and cleaning clean dishes for campaign press didn't handle the bill well publicly

Yea, who saw that shit coming? :^)

...

The Bannon wing thinks they still have a shot at taking down Ryan..
How cute.

Bannon needs to start thinking about how to keep his job.
Bannon got into a fight above his weight class and got his ass handed to him.
Pitiful really.

So explain something Democrat shill:

Are you legitimately happy that they failed to repeal Obamacare because you love Obamacare? Because that doesn't add up with you also saying Trump isn't helping Americans.

So is Trump helping Americans by keeping Obamacare or does Obamacare suck balls and need scrapping? Which is it?

>Freedom Caucus
>Club for Growth
>Heritage
>good guys


Trump should have stayed out of this shit. He should've let Ryancare fail on its own lack of merit and condemned it for the shitheap it is. THere's nothing he can do anyway until Congress is more under his control and can write up an actual replacement for Obamacare.

I am legitimately happy they failed to repeal Obamacare because they didn't come up with something better to put in its place.

If you switch doctors because you didn't like the bandage dressing the old doc put on your wound, the new doctor is still a useless piece of shit if his proposed replacement was so inferior and dangerous that his own clinic and support staff won't let him perform the procedure.

Clearly not really Trump's tweet. It must be a SHOOP by some SHILLS!

>So explain something Democrat shill
Wow, now Trump himself is a shill! We're through the looking glass here.

>Why is he blaming the good guys?
Because when the good guys are given all political power in DC and can not deliver on a promise to fully repeal Obamacare the good guys take a fall. Ryancare would have turned Obamacare into Trumpcare and Trump and Republicans would have owned Obamacare Lite/Trumpcare. Either a full repeal of Obamacare or let it collapse.

Obamacare was born a Dem only law and it will die a Dem law.

I see this as only two real options.

1. Zero government involvement in healthcare, end of story.

2. Government sizes the means for health protection and offers equal coverage to all citizens. The problem is that we don't have strict enough standards for who we consider citizens and also who decides when someone is too far gone and not worth saving? should the elderly be left to die because their lives don't have much use left? Should retards be aborted because they will consume much more than they will ever produce? These are all left to morals and I feel that the government doesn't have the same morals as I do.

We need to just let Obamacare collapse. It will be our punishment for not supporting Trump more

>Sorry our president, don't listen to share blue trying to shill against the caucus! Fuck Ryan!
>O-oh... Our president is saying fuck the caucus?
>Well, he's still an unassailable 7D chess Grandmaster that never loses but he's just flat out making a blatant fuckup here, seeing himself up to be backstabbed

I don't even have obamacare but still support it. My state gives free healthcare, and the repeal of obamacare wouldn't effect me.

I just want Americans to stay healthy. Seeing so many white Americans with missing teeth, chronic health problems, etc is upsetting as fuck.

>Ryan's people were writing it in secret

No fucking shit, he's the speaker of the house. It's his job to be constantly drafting bills.

I wonder if Putin is disappointed that his little cuckpawn is such a complete failure?

I mean, who wouldn't be?

FUCKIN TOLD YOU. I EXPECT AN APOLOGY FROM ALL THE ANONS CALLING ME A SHILL.

fpbp

you can't appease those cocksuckers, they stopped price controls and public option

No. When you are ACTUALLY a political force to be reckoned with, like Putin, you have contingencies in place to collect advantage no matter how events shake out. It's likely that Trump's downfall is neutral or even advantageous any Putin scheme, and that Trump's actions have already had the desired effects.

I'm wondering now what is keeping Planned Parenthood part of the plan? Because I personally believe that the bill not passing was part of the plan but I wonder if this was also linked to trump wanting to keep Planned Parenthood too?

Trump didn't even read the proposed Bill.

In his white ethnostate, sure.

America's Protestant ethos require public, transparent debate on issues of important. You cannot govern a protestant nation with conclaves. Ryan, and other unassimilated catholics, don't understand this.

What does this spell for Trump's faction and their policy of secrecy and seclusion?

Vote Trump goy

It was a prototype, it became open for debate once it came time for that. You don't make a bill by letting 200+ people scribble on a piece of paper.

Someone posted that Rand helped with the IP selling info to business bill. That true?

EVE... EVERYTHING IS GOING AS PLANNED

we sowwy

He also endorsed Romney after the man screwed his dad over in 2012.

Rand is neocon-lite. Always has been

This. Unfortunately, Ryan's proposed bill was fundamentally unfit for deployment.

congress.gov/bill/115th-congress/senate-joint-resolution/34/cosponsors

Freedome Caucus is, what, 20 people?
Small enough that Trump can personally visit their districts in primary season to get them ousted.
Trump isn't a fan of Ryan but rightly sees the HFC as emotional idealists who can't see deals.

>Literally blaming everyone around him for his own faults, including his own party members. Fucking poetry.

Trump doesn't practice "secrecy and seclusion" so much as strategic ambiguity. You'll note that he takes very emphatic stances publicly, but is ambiguous on the details so those can be negotiated without tipping his hand. Trump's conduct is a negotiating tactic; Ryan's conduct is an effort to avoid public negotiation.

That's bullshit and you know it. Ryan presented a completed bill to the congress and then tried to shame Republicans into voting for it. He wasn't willing to debate it or negotiate until it became clear most members weren't supporting it.

>They should have just repealed Obamacare
How? There's no way in hell a Dem would vote for that and moderates were already dropping like flies as provisions were added to get it closer to what the Freedom Caucus wanted. A full repeal could never get 50 votes from the party who's voterbase most benefits from socialized health care.

Now they're pretending he didn't want it. Heeelarious!

ShareBlue shouldn't you be praying for your fag leader not to die?

What is the non-autist argument for or against single payer?
Single payer seems like it makes the most sense

> inb4 paying for boogie to eat 50 chicken nuggets per meal
> inb4 keeping retards alive


Economically, if you accept the premise that every citizen deserves healthcare without going into AnCap sex-slave-tier debt, isn't single payer the best way to abolish the beaurocrats and insurance leeches who are the real reason healthcare is fucked in this country?

This is bait. Sage this bait

>have 7 years to build consensus
>cant do it

It wouldn't survive our immigration policies. I think most Republicans would get on board if we shut down inmigration

The house Republicans repeatedly voted to repeal Ocare when it was just a symbolic act. They should have been held to that, forwarded the repeal bill to the Senate, and then forced republicans in the Senate to make the side they were on clear. Things are a mess now because the politicians in charge of the Republican party are too focused on helping each other avoid responsibility, instead of manning-up, taking responsibility, and holding each other accountable.

Trump is a degenerate manchild... we all new this was coming

Oh hey remember when Trump was boasting last week that he'd already turned so many No votes into Yes's?

I remembered back when Abby Martin was working for RT, she said Rand tried to get her press credentials removed and tried to get her fired because she asked him about his endorsement of Romney.a question.

youtube.com/watch?v=3UKXpzdFQ_I

Then it would have faced the same result as this shit plan?

Just because it's bipartisan doesn't make it good. Neocon Healthcare was just as bad if not worse than Obamacare is, just in different aspects.

My point was that healthcare needs to either be left alone and returned to a pre-Obamacare state or just needs to be nationalized for efficiency purposes. Either would be infinitely better than both healthcare acts.

Strategic ambiguity has the same effect on the Protestant political ethic; emphatic public stances make people FEEL better about what is being done to them, but doesn't change the withholding of information to prevent collaboration and debate.

Ryan can't avoid public exposure because the proposition must be released at some point, what makes it open or not open for debate and contribution is how forcefully and how soon it is forced to a vote after its public release. Trump is the one who issued the ultimatum, remember?

Don't get me wrong. Ryan is either a colossal fuckup or a turncoat, or both. It's still important to see Trump's weaknesses for what they are.

>freedom babies
Kill yourself commie fuck.

>The buck doesn't stop here
>t. President
HELLO DARKNESS MY OLD FRIEND

This makes more sense for me. If Paul Ryan was chosen as speaker, he has x amount of support. I didn't understand why Trump would openly backstab a large group. Eventually Trump will need their votes for something he wants.

I'll forcibly take 1.

thing about 1 is the healthy person still gets fucked

Thank you Its Ok now bby

So is Trump just a D in disguise?

I really don't get what he's going for. I thought he was stringing Ryan along but I don't know. Maybe listenig too closely to GOPe fags like Penis.

>You can't con people, at least not for long

Trump wants universal health care together with the democrats.

He understand republicans are ruthless heartless darwinists when it comes to health.

>the healthy person still gets fucked
How? I'm not violently, forcibly mandated to pay for a service I won't use to subsidize everyone else while government mob freaks scrape half off the top. I see no downside for me or for freedom whatsoever.

No. American citizens should not get fucked on healthcare so that we can embarrass or politically disadvantage the GOP or the politicians that comprise it.

Fork-tongued politicians balking when asked to back up their shitty lies is the system working to protect us. OUR job as citizens is to recognize the hypocrisy and incompetence, not to file in to the chopping block so that history will have a clear example and cautionary tale demonstrating why something doesn't work.

I'm glad Planned Parenthood was saved and even Obamacare, Ryan care is garbage. We should have universal care.

Everyone thought Trump pulled some 4D chess, but it seems Rand pulled some Frank Underwood shit. Trump has no choice but to see him as the enemy because Rand will never be satisfied with a compromise.

Pic related is a real winner.

Or maybe he really is completely uneducated on matters of government and gets his opinions directly from pundits and internet articles

haha what? Trump conned all the low-information uneducated white trash that voted for him. And he did it for an entire year.

abortion prevents unwanted births. problem with that?

>glad a leftist criminal organization stays federally funded
for what purpose? getting rid of planned parenthood doesn't get rid of abortion. It just gets rid of one evil leftist establishment that should not be federally funded.

Ryancare sucks, sure.

>Strategic ambiguity has the same effect on the Protestant political ethic; emphatic public stances make people FEEL better about what is being done to them, but doesn't change the withholding of information to prevent collaboration and debate.

I disagree. Ambiguity in negotiations is a way of getting other factions to make their own positions clear, before you begin negotiating in earnest. Think of the Supreme Court pick, arguably one of the most important things he's done so far. He struck out a very strong public position that it would be a Constitutionalist in the mold of Scalia, but demurred when asked for a specific name. This created an opening for people to publicly suggest candidates, while also making Trump's priorities among candidates clear. Ambiguity is an invitation to negotiation, not an attempt to shut it down. It sparks a broad public debate, as everyone else tries to argue their position in the open.

Contrast that with Ryan's approach. He drafted the bill behind closed doors. He then publicly announced that it would be a "consensus bill". This shuts down debate, as it innately marginalizes anyone who objects as being outside the consensus. Ironically, this is the same approach hillary took in the 90s, and it failed for the same reason. You can't govern a Protestant society by conclave.

You do if you are stupid as fuck like Ryan and have no fucking idea what you are doing. He wasn't able to pass it because hes a fucking idiot, he should have gotten some input. He should have been writing this fucking thing for the last 7 years and had it unveiled the second trump was elected president, but hes a fucking scrub, and he needs to go.

Trump was elected for a single fucking thing

Repeal Obamacare

Not repair
Not replace
Not update

Fucking repeal, and he could accomplish that goal at absolutely any fucking time he wants but he keeps dancing around the subject then threatens to leave it there. When America elected the faggot to repeal it. That should have been the first fucking thing he did ten minutes after taking office. His inauguration speech should have ended with "Oh yea by the way Obamacare is hereby null and void!"

I agree it was obamacare lite. But now it's on the freedom caucus to put something out that can be passed with enough votes. I can also see Trump's side. Passing something that takes away the mandates is something rather than nothing. You can always work on other parts of the bill and get rid of it down the line? Honestly, that's going to be super hard just like trying to repeal just parts of Obamacare.

I'm with the freedom caucus right now on this one. I know Trump promised repeal and replace right away but I'd rather see a repeal now and replace later. I'm okay with the parents insurance until 26. It's the insuring people with pre-existing conditions that will make and has been making the premiums go sky high.

There's so much material nowadays, I wonder if we should consolidate into a daily Trump Failure General.

yeah! fuck those people with pre-existing conditions!

I agree Trump is missing the opportunity here. Paul Ryan should be fired.

This. Freedom caucus types are tolerable when the party is in the opposition and doesn't need to actually legislate, but this kind of shit is not called for when you actually need to govern.

You don't need to legislate. Everything needs to be removed - nothing added.
N o t h i n g

I don't deny that strategic ambiguity can be an effective approach in the ways you describe. I do think that ambiguity is an invitation to speculation, not collaboration. I think you're right that the Protestant political ethos doesn't care about this distinction, but again that is a matter of reactive feelings and not actual opportunity to contribute. My fault for not being clearer earlier regarding your true statements about the Protestant cultural reaction.