What do you know about FreeMasonry?

Have you ever visited a church of FreeMasonry?
Do you know anything about them?
Any experience with the group?
What is freemasonry even

Other urls found in this thread:

youtu.be/-jTdc04ODU4
illuminatiofficial.org/does-illuminati-worship-satan-or-god/
humansarefree.com/2014/02/young-man-required-to-sacrifice-child.html?m=0
youtu.be/e6Ii9dUKFVQ
youtu.be/Gju2zitktAg
youtu.be/HO4rAYk-420
youtu.be/NagYge8fSJM
files.meetup.com/574112/Permanent_Instruction_of_the_Alta_Vendita.pdf
stichtingargus.nl/vrijmetselarij/ritualen_en.html
crosswalk.com/church/pastors-or-leadership/ask-roger/can-a-mason-be-a-christian.html
bibliotecapleyades.net/sociopolitica/sociopol_brotherhoodss01c.htm
dummies.com/religion/spirituality/freemasons-arent-satanists/
twitter.com/AnonBabble

lodges are different

I got a letter, handwritten, from this organisation. They are secretive and very traditional. They will accept anyone willing to approach their meeting places to learn. I believe they lean toward a Christian lifestyle but not too sure.

It's not as cool as people think but it isn't totally normies tier yet.

I think about visiting a lodge near me and asking a few questions,do you think they will be welcoming?

Got initiated last month

I still don't know wtf is going on.

Yes. To be inducted you have to befriend a member. They will guide you.

One of many Luciferian organizations. They will deny this fact because they're literally bound by a blood oath, but it's true nonetheless.

...

k den

They're a fraternity dedicated to bringing people of all faiths together under a common framework. They're essentially creating a single religion out of all religions by finding the most common or essential components from each, synthesizing them, and re-branding them as part of a single secret doctrine, a prisca theologia of which they are the overseers.

In doing this they can more easily convert members of any existing religion into their worldview by claiming that underneath all the layers of cryptic meaning in each religion is one single truth that no single religion can reveal completely. The logical conclusion to this is that Christianity is not the revealed word of God but simply one piece of the puzzle, and the same would apply to any other religion as well. It's extremely clever and subversive and appeals to the desire of intelligent people to be "in the know" in order to constantly manipulate them into looking towards the order for the truth instead of within themselves as many religions have suggested.

The nature of the omnireligion they are creating is one that is meant to "liberate" man from the "shackles" of divine faith. A Gnostic ideal.

dumb christian...

My Grandpa was into freemason REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

Absolute degeneracy which has subverted Traditionalism in Europe.

I'm currently reading 'Under the Sign of the Scorpion' by Juri Lina. Apparently the Masons were infiltrated and taken over by the Illuminati.

Literally 19th century fake news

Must have been pretty great to be in the audience when Taxil called his employers dickheads for believing him.

Buzzwords.

Freemasonry is many things, but it is primarily derived from operative Masons who dedicated themselves to understanding the works of the Supreme Architect of the Universe; among other things....

bump

It's Luciferian.
They practice child sacrifice and it has been documented on the internet. If you have a single altruistic perspective of life then you would understand that causing pain to others for your own self benefit (violence to please a god including) is against the very foundation of human principle. They themselves know of this and tend to concentrate initiation on members who are willing to pledge themselves by committing atrocious acts. Reading Plato's "Republic" evaluates how the unjust become the most powerful. By murdering a child, they demonstrate what they even define as the greatest injustice as it goes against the very fundamental human principle. That is why they are an incredibly powerful group.

This example is the first layer of their indoctrination, once it goes deeper it becomes inexplicably horrifying.

youtu.be/-jTdc04ODU4

It is a club for shabbos. No amount of shilling, muh uncle/muh dad/muh grandpa/muh charity, traditional this that will ever change what pol thinks about these good goyim. After they stop being useful the kikes will purge them like they did in Russia and France.

Operative Masons were just professional stoneworkers who used a variety of secret signs and symbols to protect their occupation from outsiders. Masons like to boast their legendary origins in the Templars or even further back to the building of Solomon's Temple, but even most Masons will admit this is all entirely speculative. At least that's what they say to the profane.

Speculative Freemasonry didn't really begin to emerge until after the Freemasons eloped with the Rosicrucians in the 17th century and possibly later 16th century, though the distinction between operative and speculative Freemasonry hadn't been made yet by that time. It's the speculative aspect of Freemasonry that deals with studying the Great Architect of the Universe.

They use geometry to try to understand some fundamental principals underlying the fabric of the universe, and to encode their own principals and messages into physical structures or artworks. They seek to rebuild Solomon's temple, but the evidence of the existence of King Solomon as a real historical figure is very shoddy, thus the temple they seek to build is a metaphorical one symbolizing the purpose of the original temple - a place for all faiths to gather and worship. They are building a spiritual temple.

The Bible claims that once the temple is built for a third time the antichrist will have arrived. It's not a stretch to suggest that the Freemasons are working toward nefarious ends if you believe what the Bible claims.

>Traditional European traditionalist organisation
>Subverts tradtionalism
???

>hey practice child sacrifice and it has been documented on the internet
Reported =/= documented. It's been reported that you like parking across two handicap spaces, but without proof, it means nothing.

>What's the opposite of a Kingdom....?

The Freemasons are secretly working towards building organized anarchy.... "chaos" will reign across the face of the Earth!!!

Anyone will be able to do whatever they want (certain restrictions apply).....

MWAHAHAHAHA!!!!!

What you're saying doesn't contradict my post, you're just explaining a different aspect of the order. The evidence I've seen for the child sacrifice is very flimsy, but I still wouldn't be surprised if that did happen during some rituals held for the most trusted members of the order. I don't see how they could conceal that activity if they did it for brand new initiates. Child trafficking is difficult and dangerous and if new initiates didn't like what they saw it would be impossible to kill them all off and get away with it.

Links or it didn't happen. You know how this works...

they always win, because they know the truth. Lucifer is /G\

>The Bible claims that once the temple is built for a third time the antichrist will have arrived. It's not a stretch to suggest that the Freemasons are working toward nefarious ends if you believe what the Bible claims.

>Our decisions are made by the study of data and evidence — factors that can be easily altered by a omniscient creature in order to guide our actions and the future of mankind.

illuminatiofficial.org/does-illuminati-worship-satan-or-god/

See that image? Their chaos has been peeling before your very eyes and this artist's work is taken as satire because so many people refuse to believe it.
It has to be stopped at all costs.

Christ with you brothers whom refuse to succumb to this degeneracy.
Deus Vult!

They were the major backers of the Enlightenment and the French Revolution. Then, they inspired several movements all throughout Europe. I know well the specific case of Portugal but I also do know they did similar shit in Italy and Spain.

They are definitely not traditionalist. Their ultimate goal is to "liberate" Man, which is the type of bullshit that inspired communism.

Unironically, I think every 4channer should try to be a Free Mason. They're very pro-traditional and only men can join. You also must believe in a god and be a good citizen to join. Iys a good place to learn essential life skills from your elders.

Anyone seeking to join should put in a good amount of research into the order and its opponents first.

>Unironically, I think every 4channer should try to be a Free Mason.
Feck no. Too many lazy, whining, uneducated degenerates here.

>They were the major backers of the Enlightenment and the French Revolution.
Enlightenment, yes. Just by virtue of being the kind of group which attracted the scientific minds of the time. But it always condemned the revolutions.
>They are definitely not traditionalist.
It is literally comprised of Christian morality compiled in the 17th and 18th century.
>Their ultimate goal is to "liberate" Man
Nah. Not every man should be liberated.

The Masonic Temple in my city became a church. I don't know where they meet up now.

My apologies, I was trying to add on to it.

My apologies.

humansarefree.com/2014/02/young-man-required-to-sacrifice-child.html?m=0

youtu.be/e6Ii9dUKFVQ

youtu.be/Gju2zitktAg

And the recent one if you go after the 24 minute mark.

youtu.be/HO4rAYk-420

Broken down for a more informative perspective of the 39 minute interview:


youtu.be/NagYge8fSJM

I've heard they like to do some very Satanic things such as child sacrificing, and pedophilia (mostly the higher ups), they seem like bad people to me.

>not every man should be liberated
Doesn't sound very Christian to me.

Protestants

>All those (((testimonies)))
>But no actual proof
Lol.

Deus Vult, bro. If it should be, then so it shall be, but until then only those who deserve should have.

>Yes its a christian based group
>dads a mason
>its actual illuminati, their text is encripted and all documents must be memorized by members

...

Bumping this because this is the most important discussion we can have on Sup Forums ATM because it is the most relevant political issue.

Public face of freemasonry is old boys club business and political influence group.
In private they sacrifice goats to satan to increase in rank and at the higher ranks they do satanic ritual sex abuse and murder of children.
Bush, JFK, Clinton, Trump, Roosevelt all high level masons.

>formed by principles of Anabaptist protestant heretics in 1717
>Pope Leo XIII called it the Synagogue of Satan.
>St. Kolbe said they are run by Jews
>revolutionary replacement religion which seeks to secularize governments
>destroys laws that prevents the promotion of vice
>seeks to destroy the Christian ideal, especially that of the Catholic Church
>read the Alta Vendita
>files.meetup.com/574112/Permanent_Instruction_of_the_Alta_Vendita.pdf

Can you prove that they don't? Otherwise it's your word against mine.

You need to read what they wrote. They definitely did not condemn revolutions. These people killed the Portuguese king and heir in 1908 and started a civil war in Portugal in the 1820-1830s.

they worship baphomet
they lie to get what they want
they are cheap fuckers

Praise KEK

there are more than 175 000 free masons in france, and there is nothing special about that...

freemasons are just people gathering and talking politics / philosophy, their temples in france are not even secret at all

there are no satanic sacrifices or whatever you're thinking...lots of people in my familly / friends knew free masons and saw what they were doing

Fuck that ecumenist crap, I'm a Calvinist.

>>formed by principles of Anabaptist protestant heretics
Catholic operative guilds, actually. With a dash of Rosicrucianism added later.
>in 1717
Nope, over a century prior. 1599 is the earliest known speculative record.

>Otherwise it's your word against mine.
Yea, exactly. Do you not understand burden of proof? Can't prove a negative.

>They
Which "they" are you referring to?

...

It indeed is VERY christian. My God, what do they teach you? To want to "liberate" Man is the most unchristian thing you can do because it is putting Man on a pedestal facing God in the face. Most importantly, it will ultimately fail because of your inherent imperfectability, i.e. original sin. That is, we will fail the "liberation" and create more misery as a result. This should be ringing bells atm *cough* communism *cough*.

Freemasonry is really cool, you just hang out with a bunch of wise old dudes who eat dinner and drop knowledge. Then, if you're a really cool dude, you might get invited into some little side groups if you know what I mean; that's where all the raping happens.

The masons basically own everything that's worth anything that isn't owned by the damn Catholics, Anglicans, Mormons, The guy who invented bitcoin, and Scientologists. They also run all the police units and judges that aren't communists.

To be a mason you gotta believe in Supreme Being, Afterlife and Judgment and I think Free Will or something because otherwise you can't be a really moral person, they know they're like all of law enforcement they did studies.

They're a lot like a cartel in some ways. They are either the enemy or the best friend who knows.

Freemasons

That's because it's segmented like every other organization that has ever existed. They are competing to dominate influence amongst themselves like any other organization that has ever existed.

The lodges in London began as Catholic but quickly were infected with revolutionary ideals where they then altered their Creed to an indifferentist Creed, which caused the hierarchy to forbid Catholics from joining.
The indifferentist, revolutionary ideals were Anabaptist.

To be fair Freemasons have a lot of power, especially in the higher ranks. So it's pretty easy to cover this type of stuff up when it comes to solid evidence. Not only that, but the ones in the higher ranks can just pay news stations or public figures to denounce it as a "conspiracy theory", "fake news" or "a hoax".

Why doesn't Sup Forums start it's own secret club? I imagine an international dedicated group of men could get a bunch done

They are what's left of the Templars after the French King ended their organization

>facing God in the face
lol

Okay. Which ones? You do know there's no central body of Freemasonry, right?

Well no. It was Catholic until 1723, when the first GL constitutions stipulated just Christianity in general, so that there'd be no division among Christians.
The only people who think it's indifferentist are idiots who think it deals in religion (it doesn't).
So the Vatican asked Catholics not to join, because they thought it was a political rival (it isn't).

>To be fair Freemasons have a lot of power, especially in the higher ranks.
What do you think that means, though? Like, in terms of "power" and "higher rank"?
>Not only that, but the ones in the higher ranks can just pay news stations or public figures to denounce it as a "conspiracy theory", "fake news" or "a hoax".
So basically, if everything points to something being a hoax, and there being no actual proof, that to you means that it's actually true?

'facing god in the face' kill yourself Illiterate fuck

>We do not mean to win the Popes to our cause, to make them neophytes of our principles, and propagators of our ideas. That would be a ridiculous dream, no matter in what manner events may turn. Should cardinals or prelates, for example, enter, willingly or by surprise, in some manner, into a part of our secrets, it would be by no means a motive to desire their elevation to the See of Peter. That elevation would destroy us. Ambition alone would bring them to apostasy from us. The needs of power would force them to immolate us. That which we ought to demand, that which we should seek and expect, as the Jews expected the Messiah, is a Pope according to
our wants
John Paul II was a pope attuned to their ideology.
Benedict didn't do much different.
Francis is a pope according to their wants.

I provided sources to my assertion and I do admit they are debatable. I assume from your response time never bothered to look into them. If you feel strongly on your point of view I can understand and agree to disagree. But I must ask you, if you may hold up on your end of the debate by disproving me by the same burden imposed onto me? Any source as I am curious to understand more on the topic.

That's ridiculous. Of course it's indifferentism. Stop the pilpul.
You needn't profess a Christian identity, merely a vague notion of "God". Pike clearly points this out in Morals and Dogma.

Beat you to it. You still understood it, so you're just being lazy.

The idea is that freemasons traditionally focused on self-determination and liberation. That's what they continuously talk about in their writings. This is akin to elevating Man to the level of God. Instead of it being Christian, it is actually the ultimate heresy.

Exactly. It was many groups and they all acted towards the same goal, and ended up coordinating with each other. That just reinforces my point as even with relative independence from each other, these groups worked towards subverting my country.

To get access to a higher ranks you need either a lot of money or some kind of influence. Secondly you must be really good at keeping secrets.

Bottom line Freemasonry is for faggots with small penis.

I have a family member who was in it, I shit he not he got locked up for life for a crime he most likely didn't commit.

When I say "power" I mean control over things like the media, companies, law, prominent figures, etc. This means they can get news outlets to denounce things as conspiracy theories, and hoaxes, even when there's solid evidence pointing other wise. And when I say "higher ranks" I'm referring to Freemasons with connections, high positions in the law, or lots of money.

>I provided sources
Only testimonies, which aren't worth the paper they're written on.
> if you may hold up on your end of the debate by disproving me by the same burden imposed onto me?
Kinda hard, bro. It's disproving a negative. Like if I were to say that you have an Honda Accord in your driveway, you might take a picture of the driveway showing no Honda. But then I could just say that you moved it for the picture.
That's how these baseless accusations normally play out. How could anyone prove that something doesn't happen when the accusers will just say that it does anyway?
>Any source as I am curious to understand more on the topic.
stichtingargus.nl/vrijmetselarij/ritualen_en.html
Do check out the rituals and Constitutions. Might give you an idea of why such claims are contrary to Masonic teaching.

>Of course it's indifferentism.
Like i said. Idiots.
>You needn't profess a Christian identity, merely a vague notion of "God".
That is correct. Because it's not a church. It doesn't deal in religion. Neither imposing one, nor demanding one in particular. It's like saying public streets or carpentry workshops are indifferentist because they don't demand a certain religion for use.
>Pike clearly points this out in Morals and Dogma.
He doesn't, though. And why would M&D matter? We're talking Freemasonry, not the A&AR.

>This is akin to elevating Man to the level of God.
Quite a leap there.

>It was many groups and they all acted towards the same goal, and ended up coordinating with each other.
Again, that isn't how Freemasonry works. This isn't to say that some traitors weren't also members, but you're misunderstanding how Masonry operates. There's no coordination like that between lodges in a state, let alone between rival jurisdictions.

They're all a little too grandiose for my tastes. I mean, having a guild for creators -- I guess would be the best word for it sounds great and all...

But it's just become a circlejerk like every other similar group. They sometimes do good stuff, but some of their members are total nutjobs. Their level of dis-secrecy is also quite interesting, as most secret societies tend to actually be, well, secret. Their method of active recruitment is just attracting the bottom of the barrel nutcases and people of objectively minor success who get grandiose butterflies by being in a conglomerate.

You say it isn't how they work but that's what happened in Portugal, France, Spain and Italy, at least.

And it's not a leap to say that "self-determination" means putting Man at the level of God.

Keep lying to yourself, kiddo. Swearing on a Qur'an to become a Shriner, being taught the intricacies of the Zohar, and being imbued with Gnostic principles--that's not indifferentism or religiously philosophical, at all.

Freemasonry is the Whitest thing you can join. Do it faggot. Unless you are a shit skin, and they won't let you in.

If you're white. Yes

What annoys me most about your posts is that you're giving me a "no true Scotsman" when I point to you what freemasons did in Europe, especially in my country. After the French invasions, these people destroyed Portugal in a civil war, claiming the traditional institutions were "oppressive" and that they were "liberating" Portugal from the shackles of tradition and the Church. From 1820 to 1850, they controlled Portugal and our country became an absolute disaster, in the midst of a civil war, unstable governments, unstable and retarded policies, ruined finances, etc. Then, they pulled the same trick between 1910-1926 and in 16 years our country had 40 fucking governments, bombings in the streets, the Church was persecuted, the state completely indebted itself, etc.

So basically things you don't need Freemasonry for to begin with, and would be made all the more troublesome be including such a group instead of a closed cabal?
>even when there's solid evidence pointing other wise.
But that basically never happens?

>You say it isn't how they work but that's what happened in Portugal, France, Spain and Italy, at least.
Well no. There were plenty of factors at play, but it just so happened that a handful of the people who were going to rebel thought they would join a group which meets privately, even if it doesn't support their aims. Saying that Freemasons were involved in those events is uneducated, because you're ignoring the real causes of them.
>And it's not a leap to say that "self-determination" means putting Man at the level of God.
It is, though. Unless you're an Abcedarian who thinks that making the choice to cross the street is putting yourself on par with God because you made a decision.

>Swearing on a Qur'an to become a Shriner
Shrine ain't Freemasonry, bro.
> being taught the intricacies of the Zohar,
Doesn't happen, sadly. You have to find that stuff out for yourself.
>and being imbued with Gnostic principles--
Also doesn't happen, unless you have a very generous definition of gnosticism.
>that's not indifferentism or religiously philosophical
Nope. Like, literally. Religious belief isn't dealt with at all, ergo it can't be indifferent.

Again, no true Scotsman.

Do you even know what self-determination is? It's not simply making a decision.

>What is freemasonry even
Shabos goy who meet every wednesday to get the dock of the local rabbi up their ass.

They are worse than the kikes, because they are enemies within...

part 2

The lodges where I live have turned into a christian charity club.

Little bit of rituals and shit done still. But largely just events and fundraisers.

>What annoys me most about your posts is that you're giving me a "no true Scotsman" when I point to you what freemasons did in Europe, especially in my country.
Because they weren't actually Scotsmen, just Portuguese wearing kilts pretending to be Jocks.
>hese people destroyed Portugal in a civil war, claiming the traditional institutions were "oppressive" and that they were "liberating" Portugal from the shackles of tradition and the Church.
Yea, see, that's entirely anti-Masonic. The 1st degree even points out that the importance of traditional structure, and that the church and state should be twin pillars of the community.

> It's not simply making a decision.
It is, though. It's making all the decisions. Free will, and such.

>doesn't know baphomet is /ourgal/

And just for a historical note. Just after the Portuguese liberal revolution of 1820, 43% of the parliament and 70% of the people in the government were freemasons. They were publicly saying that they wanted to bring the whole system down and that they did not go as far as they wished because it would upset the majority of the Catholic and very conservative Portuguese population.

>So basically things you don't need Freemasonry for to begin with, and would be made all the more troublesome be including such a group instead of a closed cabal?

I'm not saying you need Freemasonry to do that stuff, and obtain that amount of power. I'm saying the higher ranked Freemasons do this type of stuff, and have the power, and connections to easily cover up their tracks. Hence why there's not that much solid evidence aside from testimonies.

Why Hitler didn't like masonry?

>43% of the parliament and 70% of the people in the government were freemasons.
Which translates to, "People who were keen to get shit moving and took opportunities to seize powers thought that joining a certain club might help them."

>Hence why there's not that much solid evidence aside from testimonies.
That's a really dodgy assumption, bro. Like, you can say anything and just blame it on someone else covering it up. Yea, it might be true, but you can't build a house on sand like that.

What the fuck? You are completely revising history. The Freemasons destroyed the Ancien Régime in Europe. They are not fucking traditionalists. Say whatever bullshit you want about what they claim they are but I'm looking at what they fucking did.
The bullshit you're saying is on the same level as kebab saying that when they were in Iberia they were very respectful of Christians, and everything went fine and dandy. ffs, this shit is absolutely infuriating.

>It is, though. It's making all the decisions. Free will, and such.
So, you indeed don't know what it is.

I know a freemason
He is a total asshole that thinks he is better then everyone even though his only friends are asian gold diggers and his parents.
I could easily believe that he lies about it to seem richer to his asian gold diggers.

Hey Australianon, what would be your rebuttal to this?

crosswalk.com/church/pastors-or-leadership/ask-roger/can-a-mason-be-a-christian.html

bibliotecapleyades.net/sociopolitica/sociopol_brotherhoodss01c.htm

m8, a group is defined by the people within it. There is a strong correlation between being a freemason and subverting your own country to "liberate" it. Again, I don't give a fuck about what freemasonry is on paper. In practice, it destroyed traditionalism in Europe.

I work with one and he's a pathological liar and annoying as fuck. It seems like they are all that way.

all fagots

I live near the North Dakota/Canadian border. In our most beautiful lake, Metigoshe - there is a place that you can only get to by boat . It's a blue Masonic Island. There are blue steps up, blue benches, blue symbols.....But it hasn't been used in many years. We boat up there let the women pee.

Also, these people were freemasons BEFORE getting into the parliament and the government.

>The Freemasons destroyed the Ancien Régime in Europe.
No, revolutionaries did. A few of which took over some lodges. In doing so, they were excommunicated by actual Freemasons.
>They are not fucking traditionalists.
You keep saying that, but it doesn't make it true.
>The bullshit you're saying is on the same level as kebab saying that when they were in Iberia they were very respectful of Christians, and everything went fine and dandy
No? Not even remotely the same.
>So, you indeed don't know what it is.
Apparently i know it better than you, which is why it's odd you keep trying to kick that football, Charlie.

Uneducated fundies who don't even understand the Bible. No big shocker.
Ie.
>It bothers me that Masonry perpetuates the worship of the G.A.O.T.U. [Great Architect Of The Universe], as the one true God
Which isn't true. The term is a placeholder for ones own beliefs. Otherwise there's the risk of imposing religion.
>Masons teach that man is not sinful, just imperfect, and that he can improve his standing before God by living a good life while performing good works for the community and being merciful to others.
It doesn't teach anything like that, beyond the concept of Good Works as the (non-Lutheran Bible) demands.
>while Masons teach that salvation can be gained by man’s good works.
It doesn't.
>It bothers me that Jesus tells us not to swear an oath (Matthew 5:34-37)
Doesn't say not to. Just says not to lie, or to make a promise you can't keep.

>There is a strong correlation between being a freemason and subverting your own country to "liberate" it.
Stronger correlation between doing that and being a revolutionary, regardless of what groups you affiliate with. Take for example all the Catholic revolutionaries in South America. Pretty sure they were going against their faith with such crimes, so i take it you blame the Catholic church just as much?

>That's a really dodgy assumption, bro. Like, you can say anything and just blame it on someone else covering it up. Yea, it might be true, but you can't build a house on sand like that.

I understand that, but knowing the type of people who are high ranked, and the things they participate in, and the power they have, seems like a pretty safe assumption to make.

Also, I just wanted to say. If you are an Orthodox, Muslim or Catholic Christian it is forbidden to be a part of the masonry as it is polytheistic and thereto why they consider Lucifer as a god of its own merit. Of course I would like to hear how this is refuted.

>No, revolutionaries did. A few of which took over some lodges. In doing so, they were excommunicated by actual Freemasons.
More "no true Scotsman" bullshit, ffs.

>You keep saying that, but it doesn't make it true.
I'm giving you the clear example of my country, where they seized power in 1820 and wished to completely destroy traditional institutions in Portugal. You simply reply "oh, those? Those are not true freemasons!!!!!".

>Apparently i know it better than you, which is why it's odd you keep trying to kick that football, Charlie.
You don't know what it is because you seem to think it is merely about free will, which implies that a fucking slave has self-determination.

Yes, and? They were still the ambitious types who did what they thought they needed to.

But you're still assuming with the types of people. It still comes back to proof. You can't say, "well, i heard this one guy was in it apparently, and i don't like him, so he must do x or y"

>as it is polytheistic
Nope. It's non-sectarian. Religion isn't discussed, but left to the individual.
>and thereto why they consider Lucifer as a god of its own merit.
Freemasonry considers no religions. So you could join if you misunderstood "lucifer" to be some kind of deity.

>More "no true Scotsman" bullshit
>bullshit
They literally weren't Scotsmen. Lrn2read.
>I'm giving you the clear example of my country,
I get that, but it doesn't make it true. Do you really think that shit wouldn't have happened if there weren't a few Masons there?
>You don't know what it is because you seem to think it is merely about free will, which implies that a fucking slave has self-determination.
Never said merely. But yea, even a slave does. He can still make some choices.

dummies.com/religion/spirituality/freemasons-arent-satanists/

I found something in which helps your argument Australianon. I want to know, Freemasons accept many different religious sects does it not?