It takes 79 solar workers to output the same electricity as one oil/gas worker

It takes 79 solar workers to output the same electricity as one oil/gas worker.

How is this supposed to fix our energy shortages again?

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twitter.com/AEI/status/860893692365811712
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OP: "Wow I hate job creation!"

Solar creates way more jobs for workers!

WTF I LOVE SOLAR NOW!

Anyone who says that is ignorant of the concept of embedded energy.

but what about the raw resources required to build and maintain those solar plants?

(((you)))
"wow I hate capitalism"

Let's just get rid of trucks and rails and have everyone carry goods around on their backs then. That would create so many jobs!

Its financially unsustainable ..

>being so autistic you name images about your schizo online persona
What a sad life

It takes 79 black workers to equal 1 normal or 2 lazy white worker

Extremely energy intensive, especially the mining.

Solar power is wonderful for one thing. It shows that technology does not follow exponential curves. They follow Sigmoid curves that always eventually flatten out.

Here are the limits of technology. Photo-voltaic cell efficiency over the years.

You can pay 79 Syrians the same amount as one petroleum engineer

That's not really bad if the final cost of the energy is the same.

Yeah and they'll all run off with any equipment you give them.

/thread

Land, resources, all of it.
Nothing is renewable, you're only preventing the inevitable.
I'd rather lower our population and continue using natural gas for a few hundred more years while slowly creating more efficient systems and energy conversion sources.

More jobs for chinks to replace those tools! It's win win!

Solar is the future. Not coal. Deal with it.

>being an user

what a sad life

If more people went solar powered, the more money the solar powered comapnies have to R&D new ways of honing it to make it financially buoyant

Nuclear is the future. It is blindingly efficient, safer, and more environmentally friendly than many of the alternatives.

Everyone should be supportive of nuclear power.

There is one renewable fuel resource. We used it for hundreds of thousands of years.

brainlet

>If more people went solar powered, the more money the solar powered comapnies have to R&D new ways of honing it to make it financially buoyant

Yeah just like The Concord, right?

Nuclear is the only viable long term energy source.

a more apt question is why arent we employing people to do this?

a world where oil is of no particular value sounds much more amenable to reason than this one

Germany is too far north to have a positive EROEI for solar power. You get maybe a few weeks in summer where the charge is more than a drip, and the rest of the year they produce fuck-all.

>implying I give a fuck about coal

Germany heavily subsidised the coal industry for decades because it creates so many jobs. Fucking stupid, but that's government for you.
Maybe if we didn't, we would be way more advanced now and you wouldn't have to post such stupid arguments.

I think the tech just needs more time to grow. It doesnt HAVE to be just solar though. We can evenutally combine it with wave, geothermal, nuclear, and other techniques as needed. I think there are ways of doing this, the techniques and technology is just not mature enough yet.

We should all dig mines with spoons as well, right Mr. Keynes?

frfr, especially when you get on that seawater uranium extraction train. Tfw nuclear becomes renewable

>Nuclear is the only viable long term energy source.

How has that been determined? The world's electricity consumption was 18,608 TWh in 2012. Nuclear was only 10% of that. Have you determined the costs and timeframe for replacing the other 90% with nuclear alone?

>comparing a jet airliner to staving off a potential global crisis in the not to far off distant future

Asia took the nuclear pill. There will be a massive boom with Chinas Belt and Road Initiative, but the US is retarded and will soon have higher CO2 emmissions once the decommissionings begin. Small modular reactors might take off in the west, but not for YEARS due to all the red tape. Sad how you guys are letting that skill set whither up and die.

Lol you're a full blown fucking retard. That and you're obviously a shill for fossil fuel companies. (((pol))) is full of them.

We need to employ ppl

Look at the image at the start of the link. Coal and Natural Gas only help white people. Solar is great for diversity.

>I think there are ways of doing this, the techniques and technology is just not mature enough yet.

Yeah and do you have any experience or technical background that's telling you that, or is it just pop-sci articles and science fiction?

Any power systems engineer would tell you that the cost of building it, and maintenance alone will never give you a surplus in kw/h

>green energy blog says green energy is good

What Wonders Will Cease!

But seriously, get me a real paper.

Seawater Uranium extraction, there is literally 45 billion tons of uranium in the ocean, which is additionally constantly replaced by the geologic cycle of the earth. Could power 1000 human civilizations at current level until the sun goes out.

Renewable resource is determined by time it takes to replenish.

Water
>takes longer to create freshwater than current use
Wood
>takes longer to grow than current use
Wind
>Uses resources that take longer to be created than current use (also other nonrenewable resources)
Oil
>longer to create than current use

No resource, not one is renewable. Not at the moment.

Ethanol is the closest thing. However it would eventually still strip the land of all minerals and create a desolate wasteland where nothing will go.
However, it theoretically could be done.

Water could be a renewable resource again, if we lowered population.
Wood also.

As a Nuclear Physics Major, who is obsessed with Nuclear Energy, I can approve this post

>pretending that both of those things aren't capitalistic enterprises hoping to make tech cheaper for their own goals.

Yeah why did they abandon the concorde when all they had to do was "improve the tech" and they could keep their profitable monopoly on supersonic passenger travel?

Could it be that technology isn't santa?

Job creation is great, but you need to think about how much money is going into this.

If its taking 79x more workers to generate the same energy, and you are paying the workers 20k, then the price for that amount of energy is now £1580000 instead of being £20000.

Math might be a bit off, but you get the gist. More people involved, higher cost to company to produce energy, energy prices go up.

I would like an energy source to replace coal and gas (we'll hit peak coal and peak oil at some point).

Tidal power is better

Germany's solar revolution is pretty common knowledge. And they have a thriving manufacturing industry. God I love how much solar energy scares you fossil fuel shills.

Like it says in the Tao-
>When a country is well-governed, people enjoy the work of their hands and don't waste time inventing labor-saving machines

> "I don't understand economics", the post.

You don't want to create jobs for the sake of creating jobs. That's like trying to push for using scythes and flails for farming, because that will use 100 times more workers per ton of grain produced, than using a harvester.

You have a currently existing method that is break-even?

With that logic not even Hydrogen is not renewable. You're imagining exponential population growth. That's mistaken i think.

>Water could be a renewable resource again, if we lowered population.
Wood also.
That's inevitable. Our only choice is how we get from here to there.

Because if by one mean we have one man and by the other, 79, then it is more efficient to produce by the mean which consumes less resources.
Those 79 guys can be employed in another area of the economy where they'll be more useful for society.

Thoughts on seawater uranium extraction, and the use of molten salt reactors combined with free-piston sterling engines? Could be building 10gw plants in the desert with the only water being used to cool the cold side of the engine.

>mer jherb retard
Lets ban shovels and remplace them with spoons to increase the amount of dirt shoveling jobs available.

What is the cost and timeframe for building enough nuclear to supplant the current energy demands while keeping up with growth? How many new regulatory agencies, laws, enrichment facilities, mines, security, etc etc will it take?

t. keynesian
KYS

GAS AND COAL FTW

EARTH FAGS BTFO

REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

One of the biggest solar manufacturers just went bankrupt besides being subsidised like crazy by my tax money.
The 'solar revolution' is an absolute fake bubble created by nothing but cronyism and subsidies.

I want cheap electricity to gro my marijuana with.

The company with one worker charges less than the company with 79 workers.

Please connect me to the coal-produced electricity.

You wont need any mines (at current uranium demand, we have only a few hundred years of economically extractable uranium). There is 45 billion tons of uranium in the oceans waiting to be exploited kek kek kek

Coal is fucking great until we run out of the stuff. Its a finite resource.

>common knowledge
Yeah that's why i doubt it. Typically the cutting edge of science is very esoteric and not often shared with the public. One has to wonder what purpose there is in convincing the public of something that scientists should already agree on.

Unless they don't. Unless this is just another scheme to sell people moral superiority, and oh look, telsa just came out with a 150,000 dollar roof that Musk Himself says the primary benefit is that it's a STATUS SYMBOL.

He's a physicist, not an engineer. He can tell you if something is possible, but he is completely unqualified to say if it's practical.

How do you extract uranium from the oceans? Is it feasible?

>That's inevitable. Our only choice is how we get from here to there.
I'm just stating the definition of renewable or nonrenewable.

Renewable or (((green))) energy is a myth. As basic science has proven that all things have an apex and eventual decline to nothingness.
Take for instance our abundance of carbon.
It's highly theorized that carbon is actually extremely rare in the universe as most meteorites that land are missing carbon almost entirely.

While silicone has been found in abundance in every meteorite.

I digress, I'd rather lower our population now and have some decency in this world than wait for the eventual decline.

>new regulatory agencies, laws

Fuck off with that shit.
We would probably already live in post scarcity energy had nuclear power not been stifled and regulated to death.

inb4 flame can we all just admire the industrial porn that is the gigafactory?

>taking AEI at their word

why?

Solar is shit such as wind is - why, no sun 24/7

What is the efficiency of that process? If it's less than 60% or so, it's a net energy loss. You spend more energy than you end up gaining from the nuclear material.

>NO SURPLUS IN KW/H
NO SURPLUS IN KW/H
>NO SURPLUS IN KW/H
NO SURPLUS IN KW/H
>NO SURPLUS IN KW/H
NO SURPLUS IN KW/H
>NO SURPLUS IN KW/H
NO SURPLUS IN KW/H
>NO SURPLUS IN KW/H
NO SURPLUS IN KW/H
>NO SURPLUS IN KW/H
NO SURPLUS IN KW/H

>>>>>>DUMBASSES

> Not having a useless roof that costs more than the house itself and will be worthless once damaged, so, negative ROI

That's how you know when someone is from the state nobility these days

Wrong. Pic related.

Coal companies are going bankrupt in America so therefore coal is bullshit too according to your logic right?

Look you have to understand 1 thing. When fossil fuel shills fight this hard against solar, you know it's a huge threat to them.

This is chart from AEI, a huge lobbying group. They got btfo when they posted this on Twitter so naturally the last avenue they have is to take advantage of right wing retards on (((pol))) who will believe anything they are told by their corporate masters.

twitter.com/AEI/status/860893692365811712

Using spoons to dig wouldn't help the planet.

>Solar as jobs creation program
>Interesting angle
pick two

you germans produce most of your electricity with coal, so fuck you

Solar offers a relatively infinitely amount of energy compared to coal and gas. Probably good to invest now.

>When the window fitter job market is saturated

ironic

Both of you are wrong.

Jobs will be obsolete in the next 30 years by way of the robots. So the number of jobs is irrelevant and the economic system is gonna have to get more socialist.

Hopefully its socialism that focuses on the nationality of its people if you catch my drift. Gotta wead out the savages and the inferior because when they get all this free time dumped on their laps and they think Mohamed split the moon in half we are all royally fucked.

>I digress, I'd rather lower our population now and have some decency in this world than wait for the eventual decline.
I wholeheartedly concur, but we live in an age where being a consumer is the average person's only identity. They can only conceive of saving the world through buying products, not by sacrificing and reducing. They'd chimp out in a second if you told them to live on their own energy.

If "If" was a skiff, we could all be sailing right now.

In the same way you'd admire a con artist playing a shell game with his shills, yeah.
>is saving the future in this cup? Ohhh! Too bad! Try investing in these other cups, eh? Try your luck?

They got btfo on Twitter when they posted this.

twitter.com/AEI/status/860893692365811712

Batteries and inversors aren't free, you know?

Hey fag...you should move to Ontario, home of the clean energy fraud debacle...
Energy is up about 80% in 4 years, and the Libs are about to reverse mortgage the province to find a 15% bill relief...
And, after that deal runs out, we get double digit increases for the forseeable future...
There are fewer manufacturers in Ontario now, as power rates are over the top to expensive, so the factories leave putting people out of work.
Clean energy is a scam...

You did not explain what was wrong about my statement.
Because it's right.

Obviously a highly propped up industry is a threat to other industries. Water is wet.

"Wow I love taxes" - you fucking faggot.

>AI loves me,
>This i know,
>Because science fiction tells me so!

Plebs really need low skilled jobs.
Robocars are about to fuck over a ton of people.

New Uranium being extracted from the seawater is great, even if it takes a while to develop the necessary tech to gather en mass, just working towards it is important.
Molten Salt Reactors are an interesting concept to say the least and I look forward to far better minds than mine working on it.
The problem with getting Plants out in the desert like that is the water cost to my knowledge.
The cost will likely be in the billions and would likely have to be a slow conversion process; Slowly taking our Fossil Fuel-based facilities and building new Nuclear ones to take their place. Regulation would have to be intense, we don't want a new Chernobyl! Enrichment in particular is important because Uranium, Plutonium and other radioactive isotopes are finite like fossil fuels so we want them to stretch out how long one dosage can last. Excavation will likely be the most expensive part of the process; It is hard to find and extract Isotopes from the Earth. Security is EXTREMELY Important because Nuclear Power Plants cause so much damage if they are tampered with or fail: ISIS and other Terrorists would likely target them because of the damage causes radioactively, physically, and Economically.

Can't wait till Wynne wins again in 2018.

Any price is worth a self-sustainable and free nation that doesn't rely on others to sustain itself.

Fossil fuel companies get massive subsidies and have gotten them for over a century.

>the robots are coming to cuck me!
>reeeeeeee

Thankfully, she doesn't stand a chance...she and her hoard have fucked things up too much...
But then again, there's all those fucking fags in TO...

>The cost will likely be in the billions and would likely have to be a slow conversion process; Slowly taking our Fossil Fuel-based facilities and building new Nuclear ones to take their place
How slowly? We have to keep up with growth. Construction costs as well, since they're tied to the price of oil and it will start to spike now that peak extraction is behind us. But i'm not seeing hard figures. Got any papers on the subject of cost analysis and timeframe?

This argument is...the more mainstream solar energy becomes the cheaper it will be.

That happens because chinese are too dumb to put their houses away from the thermal power station.

So?

>New Uranium being extracted from the seawater is great, even if it takes a while to develop the necessary tech to gather en mass, just working towards it is important.

What's the current efficiency and why is it that number?

Implying that the extraction of uranium is even a small concern to the amount of energy that can be extracted from it. Currently it costs about double what mined uranium does, so its a safe bet that its no more than twice the energy and resources currently needed to obtain uranium. This cost difference is irrelevant though because the cost of uranium is but a small fraction of the cost per kWh of nuclear power

Henry Hazlitt just resurrected and died again because of this post.

> not showing the fraction of a person to represent nuclear

Fuck all of those industries. The sooner we get over the economic sting of replacing these outdated power sources the better.