Can you guys be honest for once?

Russia tried to hack into and influence the election. They tried to help Donald Trump win out of a disdain for Hillary Clinton, Western / American influence, and belief Trump would be better for their goals.

Can we at least agree on this fucking fact, regardless of whether or not Trump colluded with them or not?

We only get into the realm of conjecture when it comes to whether or not and to what extent Russia was able to infiltrate the Trump campaign. As of now, there is no public, direct, and undeniable evidence of collusion. As of now, there is nothing tangible that could or should be used to justify impeachment or prosecution of Trump on the basis of collusion. We can agree there (though obstruction is another story).

HOWEVER, there is suspicious behavior and actions justifying an investigation, including but not limited to:

(1 )The amount of high-level Trump campaign / admin officials with direct ties to Russia

(2) the amount of communication between high-level Trump campaign / admin officials and Russian operatives and their attempt to conceal it from American intelligence agencies and congress.

(3) The Trump administration actively doing things that benefit Russia. For instance, one of their first actions was an attempt to remove sanctions.

(4) Trump's own actions, including attempts to obstruct the investigation into Flynn, who is the most likely person at this point to be indicted for his behavior, Trump's lies about his involvement with Russian oligarchs and general refusal to clarify (officially) his business ties, and Trump's continued rejection of Russian involvement in anti-American and general refusal to speak sternly about an entity hostile to America and American interests.

Other urls found in this thread:

cnn.com/2016/10/19/politics/election-day-russia-hacking-explained/index.html
time.com/4828306/russian-hacking-election-widespread-private-data/
youtube.com/watch?v=cruh2p_Wh_4
youtube.com/watch?v=bX3EZCVj2XA
twitter.com/SFWRedditImages

...

>Can you guys be honest for once?
And don't know, can you? no.

You're boring

you morons do realize that anyone can pretend to be anyone on the internet? This applies to the entire hacking thing. its called spoofing.

Now we are at where the FBI gets into hot water.

Every Now and then a Confidential Informant will get into Legal trouble. Comey Instructed (Shilled for the CF) his agents to utilize the Clinton foundation as a fast track method to get them off the hook, instead of using the proper legal channels

So now we're being honest that there was no collusion? That collusion has as much evidence as the existence of flying pink elephants?

Okay, then. GG

The CIA has openly decided hundreds of elections for the last 50 years now. Why aren't folks up in arms about that?

...

>Russia tried to hack the election

You don't even know what that means.

Redditors and other leftys were talking about war with Russia for hacking the election. Do you support this idea? That we should hurt Russia in some way?

Please go away. Hillary would have meant open warfare with the Russians in a matter of months.

Being 16, I know you'll have little to zero experience with international politics, protip, the superpowers have been fucking with each other's elections for years.

for example OP is pretending to be a patriot when he's really a seditious traitor.

>Can we at least agree on this fucking fact
No. After Hillary lost and couldn't admit it, she needed a boogey man to use as an excuse. The previous administration knew about Russia's ATTEMPTED meddling and dealt with it accordingly. Jeh Johnson, former DHS sec testified ZERO votes were changed by hacking, before congress. There is nothing to this story of meddling. You sound like a broken record. You lost the election, get over it. In fact, here is a pre-election article where Pred Obama claims it's impossible to hack the US election
cnn.com/2016/10/19/politics/election-day-russia-hacking-explained/index.html

And? Who gives a fuck. They have been trying to influence our elections for years. We do the same in other countries. Remember when hillary was caught on tape saying we should dictate the result of a Palestinian election? Who gives a fuck about any of this shit

Where's the proof it was a USA election so show the damn proof and name the faggots names. Anything else is bull shit!!

Witnessed to smithereens.
Nice numbers, mate.

Hillary, whose cronies have far more contacts with far shadier characters then anyone in the Trump circle, was raking in gobs of dirty cash from every tinpot dictator through the (((Clinton Foundation))), got double-crossed by Russia, and is now astronomically butthurt about it.
The DNC and Pedosta can't protect their most sensitive information from nickel-and-dime phishing attacks, yet want us to believe it's all Donald Trump's fault and only they should be in charge of cybersecurity.
(((they))) now want us to believe that normal diplomatic relations is criminal conduct, and the party that spent the entire cold war as apologists for the Soviet Union now sees the Russians behind every flat tire and broken window.
Can we at least agree on these fucking facts?

>Can we at least agree on this fucking fact, regardless of whether or not Trump colluded with them or not?

I'll agree when and only when the libshits accept the fact that their political positions were formed by Soviet active measures. Own up to that, and then we'll talk about the 2016 election.

I'm not taking this position to call you deluded or insane necessarily. I just need to know if you're sane and reasonable before we try to reason famm.

We have no idea what the extent is of the evidence they have. Obviously that wouldn't be made public. The WaPo story suggests the CIA has people deep within the Kremlin able to verify some of this information, and of course the NSA is listening on every Russian server they can. The extent of the hacking makes it highly unlikely to have been someone with resources smaller than a nation. And various actions by Russian actors in concert, eg a spike in visa applications from Russians (especially those with tech skills), and Russian attempts to "spectate" elections in places like Texas are more than enough public evidence that Russia was trying to change things. If you think that the evidence on the intelligence community's end is simply "digital fingerprints," you are a fool.

And if you are a stupid conspiracy theorist (who conveniently thinks Trump isn't involved in conspiracies): The fact that the vast majority of the actions the Obama administration were taking to defend against the Russian hacking were kept under wraps until after the election give credence to the fact that they had very strong reasons to be 100% confident in Russian involvement. It's not as if this was a claim that was made suddenly after Trump won. It was being made while they were sure Trump WOULDN'T win.

Yes, our election was HACKED.

Yes, we have an imposter, petulant toddler in the White House.

Yes, HRC is the real POTUS.

No, we will not shut up about it until we get a new election.

>the CIA has people deep within the Kremlin able to verify some of this information
there is zero way to confirm this is true without burning the UC. That's the problem with this type of intel

this level of cognitive dissonance.

they didn't "try" to influence your election, they influenced your election and got their man elected.

keep living in narnia bro.

>Can we at least agree on this fucking fact, regardless of whether or not Trump colluded with them or not?

No we can not agree on this fact until you show me evidence of this fact. Also you need to define what you mean by "hacked". Leaked some information that Hillary is getting millions straight to her pockets from Qatar? What exactly is "hacking"?

TLDR the rest desu imo desu desu

>secret evidence
>from people who overthrow democracies for a living (if they elect the wrong people)
>but you can trust us, guys!

I'm not even a Trumpcuck, but this story smells rotten.

>fact
*yawn*

>It's not as if this was a claim that was made suddenly after Trump won
But it was. Again. Here is Obama saying it's impossible to hack the election in Oct. 1 month prior.
cnn.com/2016/10/19/politics/election-day-russia-hacking-explained/index.html
Post election when Hillary (obama's girl) loses, suddenly the election was hacked. It's so obvious it's absurd you can't see it.

Trump is better for Russia than Hillary would have been, that is common sense. Trump is also better for America than Hillary.
This is not a zero sum game.

>they didn't "try" to influence your election, they influenced your election

Technically, they've been influencing our elections since before WWII. Why is this election any different to you? Why care all of a sudden? You don't like the result this time around?

The US deserves it for all the crap they've done to other countries when it comes to influencing elections.

...

Your intelligence community pretends they have evidence to conceal "hacks" made by your own democratic party. Now source everything you said in this thread with proper quotes.

Why does it require foreign hackers to extract the truth from Democrats?
Think about that one for a few years.

>Jeh Johnson, former DHS sec testified ZERO votes were changed by hacking, before congress
He testified there was no evidence of votes being changed. The DHS never fully audited the election systems (and were not even allowed to because the states were being pissy about it) so they can't even be sure.

Also it's very possible that they didn't change votes but changed voter rolls, which we know, according to Time magazine, happened successfully at least once:

time.com/4828306/russian-hacking-election-widespread-private-data/

>In one case, investigators found there had been a manipulation of voter data in a county database but the alterations were discovered and rectified, two sources familiar with the matter tell TIME. Investigators have not identified whether the hackers in that case were Russian agents.

Either way, it's an irrelevant argument. Whether or not they were successful doesn't change the fact that they attempted and will attempt again. Let's see how you feel next time when Putin decides that he wants to support the Democratic candidate instead.

Do I think Russia is spying on us and being sneakily provocative? Hell yes. Do I trust their government or their leader? 100% fuck no. But...
The Russian intelligence services aren't recording and storing every call, text, and e-mail made in the US. That would be our own NSA, which stores all that shit in their yottabyte(!)-capacity facility in Utah.
Putin and the Russian army didn't fund, train, and encourage ISIS, that would be elements in our own intelligence community, some say CIA, but really, who gives a shit exactly who it was (is). It sure as fuck wasn't Spetznaz.
The Russians didn't decide, while US troops were busily engaged in a long, exhausting counterinsurgency, that those very same fighters were the most likely people to engage in domestic terrorism. That would have been Janet Napolitano and Homeland Security.
GRU agents weren't the ones harassing and targeting honest (if a little naive) tea party people. That would have been our very own IRS.
Russian internal security people aren't the ones pulling old ladies and little girls aside at the airport and molesting them - we have our own TSA to thank for that.
Russia Today/Pravda/TASS/etc weren't the ones that told us that Trayvon was an innocent 12 year old, that Mike Brown was a gentle giant, that Bruce Jenner had always been at war with Eastasia, er, been a woman, or that Mitt Romney(!) wanted to kill your grandmother. Our very own MSM was quite capable of that all on their own.
Russia's foreign ministry didn't decide that Libya, Egypt, Syria, Yemen, etc. needed to be destabilized and turned into nightmarish abbatoirs. That was OUR own Department of State.
I put zero faith in the idea that Russia or Putin cleverly rigged our election, but I'll say this: if Putin did do that, even for his own nefarious purposes, and it saved us from a Hillary presidency with all of the above turned up to 11 over the next few years, then rather than hostility from us, the guy deserves a fucking medal.

are you stupid? can you really not draw the conclusion yourself? are you just parroting other trump supporters idiotic ramblings?

if my country influences another country's election it is likely for my country's benefit.

now the inverse is true if it's my country's election that's being manipulated.

do you see the difference? one effects you negatively, and one doesn't.

that burger education. wow. you don't even deserve those numbers.

There is a fact that US creates convenient lies to attack other governments. Your official testifying means nothing here.

I always kek at democracy worshiping burger libshits. Their lack of awareness and moral outrage on the topic is astounding. If their sociology professors didn't tell it to them, they don't want to fucking believe it. And even the inconvenient things to this particular argument like what the US has done in elections in the Middle East, Latin America, Europe and all over the world.. All that shit gets compartmentalized.

To them American democracy is something superior and more sacred (except the electoral college of course).

I don't know of anyone who is protesting better cyber security measures... in fact many people, myself included, wish the DNC had turned over their hacked servers so we could see the vulnerability and prevent future attacks.

But they wouldn't cooperate.

So Trump is flooding the EU market right now with US liquified natural gas to weaken russias monopoly grip on EU natural gas needs, which is one of the most important income factors for Russia.

That's exactly what a Putin in tight control of Trump would make his puppet do. Crush the own homeland economy.

Putin is based. You Americans are brainwashed into hating him because you always need someone to hate, to be at war with. Educate yourselves and learn about history of Russia since Yeltsin left and you will see just how based Putin is. You need to respect the way other countries work.

and your opinion means two things to Americans:

Jack and Shit

Fuck off, leaf

Don't try to reason with conspiracy theorists

I don't have anything against Putin. I think he's a weasel, but at least he fight for his own people, unlike the last 4 US presidents before Trump

>The DHS never fully audited the election systems (and were not even allowed to because the states were being pissy about it) so they can't even be sure.

Top kek. You fucking cuckolds have been blocking any and all voter reform for the past 50 years under the guise of voter suppression. Because in an honest election, an informed citizenry is your worst nightmare.

You have no room to complain about this.

...

>Technically, they've been influencing our elections since before WWII

i don't know what you mean by this. do you mean the USA took such an anti-soviet response that if you were even thought of being a communist, you basically had your career reduced to shambles over night?

i guess that's a form of influence.

also the internet is the answer to your question. soviet ability to gain intel and spread propaganda was limited before, now they do it np.

>they've reached the bargaining stage

Nice blog faggot.

Post proof that they weren't trying to help Hillary. I'm not reading this shit

But it's racist to expect black people to have IDs! They're not capable of getting them like normal human beings!

That is a CNN editorial not the Obama administration. And the first paragraph already points out that the Obama admin accused Russia of hacking into the DNC and voter reg databases.

If you read the WaPo article from yesterday, you'd see that there was a general belief within the Obama administration that Russia would not be able to change things significantly enough that they could flip the results (which at that point they were sure of was a Hillary win), but they were still very concerned, going back to Summer 16. Obama mostly said nothing about what Russia was doing, realizing that he'd be accused of trying to influence the election himself by doing so.

burgers: afraid of knowledge

nice flag, that would look nice on a shirt for the upcoming pride parade.

>Russia tried to hack into and influence the election
Are you referring to the phishing that grandpa John Molesta literally fell for?

Pic related is the russian HACK

how much did the HILLDAWG pay you to try and sell us this shit?

The DNC fully cooperated with the FBI. Neither the FBI nor DNC claim otherwise.

>Russia tried to hack into and influence the election.
proofs?

>(1 )The amount of high-level Trump campaign / admin officials with direct ties to Russia

Really? It's no different from Hillary's campaign. The Podesta group has contracts with Russians just like Manafort had. It's part of their business. Nothing unusual.

(2) the amount of communication between high-level Trump campaign / admin officials and Russian operatives and their attempt to conceal it from American intelligence agencies and congress.

Nothing abnormal. Flynn may have made a mistake or forgotten. I have no idea. Maybe he lied because he thought it made him look bad and there was really nothing there?

(3) The Trump administration actively doing things that benefit Russia. For instance, one of their first actions was an attempt to remove sanctions.

Do you not see how removing sanctions benefits us? There has been large scale political pressures from major member of EU such as Germany (and many other non EU countries) to mend our relationship with Russia.

(4) Trump's own actions, including attempts to obstruct the investigation into Flynn, who is the most likely person at this point to be indicted for his behavior, Trump's lies about his involvement with Russian oligarchs and general refusal to clarify (officially) his business ties, and Trump's continued rejection of Russian involvement in anti-American and general refusal to speak sternly about an entity hostile to America and American interests.

You clearly don't understand what obstruction is. Flynn is not going to be convicted of talking to Russian bro. The only thing he could be convicted of is perjury. As a side not, it seems odd if he is convicted of it and Hillary was despite her blatant lies before congress.

It's odd that so much attention is focused on Russia. They do this every election and so do many other countries. Why isn't there uproar against these other countries? It's a ploy by the DNC to deligitimize Trump, distract from their own failures and illegal activities.

Still don't believe? Here is the image explaining the russian HACKS from the FBI offocial report

RUSSIAN HACKS

NIGERIAN PRINCE

youtube.com/watch?v=cruh2p_Wh_4

Straight from the horses mouth

TL;DR
So what if Russia tried to influence a foreign election. The United States has been doing that shit for the past 70 years.

>Russia tried to hack into and influence the election
There is no evidence of this. inb4 anonymous sources.

>Can we at least agree on this fucking fact, regardless of whether or not Trump colluded with them or not?
Can we agree on the fact that the Hillary campaign accepted money (which is influencing our elections) from basically every other nation on the planet openly and willingly and nobody mentions this?

>The amount of high-level Trump campaign / admin officials with direct ties to Russia
Direct ties to russia meaning "talked to the russian ambassador once" which is a group including literally the entire senate and a large portion of the house

>the amount of communication between high-level Trump campaign / admin officials and Russian operatives and their attempt to conceal it from American intelligence agencies and congress.
This literally didn't happen. Give me an example.

>>The Trump administration actively doing things that benefit Russia. For instance, one of their first actions was an attempt to remove sanctions.
>Be democrats
>Impose retarded sanctions and aggressive military postures 4 minutes before you leave office
>New president naturally undos this autism
>Try to use it as ammunition in baby's first conspiracy theory

>(4) T-Trump isn't playing along with the investigation into nothing! T-THIS IS SERIOUS GUYS WHAT IF HILLARY WON!!!

get raped, end yourself

all this reptilians/jewish elite controlling the world/clintons are colluding with them crap started from russia long before this election. they project their own corruption and thirst for world domination. putin doesn't like hillary or obama because they've called out his rigged elections.

Except when they didn't and didnt hand over the servers in question, faggot.

>propaganda

Top kek. You know nothing.

youtube.com/watch?v=bX3EZCVj2XA

>this is unironically how the democrats win elections
>the GOP was so cucked that it actually worked for fucking decades

Sad!

>[citation needed]

>Can we at least agree on this fucking fact,

still no evidence presented.

Wow. Would be nice if the FBI got to take a look at their servers, huh?

>be DNC
>staff member leaks emails about you being kikes
>try to distract from your massive asshole shit by reviving cold war scare tactics
>lie about RNC being hacked
>lie about wikileaks being connected to russia
>lie about muh intelligence agencies
>tfw not even obama will say there is evidence
in a press conference because he's distancing himself from you
>tfw nobody believes you except media talking heads and college students shilling Sup Forums for a grade
>DNC's face when Trump just ignores you and tweets disparaging things about your wife
>DNC's face when accusing Russia of tampering with a house election in fucking georgia that they dumped 50 million dollars into, setting an all time record for most expensive failure second only to the hillary campaign

Russia hacks the group responsible for shady activity, finds it and makes it public. This makes us stronger so why wouldn't you want it to become public? Of course the RNC wants to distance itself from the nation state behind the hacks. Wouldn't you? The whole thing started out as hurr durr lets hack the DNC, but the end result was a better safer election process in the future. Also, why wouldn't want a republican candidate to win? Have you seen what's happened to Illinois?

>What is a proxy?

Okay I'm going to say this real slowly so you can understand it - obfuscating the origin of your attack is Hacking 101. If it's been "Backtraced" to a Russian IP block, well - it's probably not Russian.

I swear to God I'm so ashamed OP is from my country.

I'll ask you this: Which country do 80% of scans and attack attempts come from?

Did you say China? Ding ding ding!

t. Internet Security Engineer

>Russia wants the guy who empowered NATO
>actively interferes in their middle eastern pipeline project
>keeping China at arms length

>not the other guy who sold uranium to russia
>have established ties to russia that goes beyond diplomats
>willing to globalize america to prop up developing nations

Made me think to be honest.

This
>be serial killer
>man snoops in your house and finds the body parts in your freezer
>WTF THIS IS A HOME INVASION, ARREST THAT MAN
>LOOK EVERYONE PAY ATTENTION TO THAT EVIL BURGLAR

>tfw Obama campaigned for Remain in the UK and no one cried about it.
Please explain this to me. Also, faggots should be thanking russia for exposing DNC corruption. Blows my mind that people are so angry with the outcome that they are willing to brush away the corruption that was uncovered.

>double-penetration puppeteering (DPP)

I dunno I haven't really seen any proof. Maybe they did, but what country doesn't try and influence others for their benefit?

Russia may have over stepped a bit, but USA has crossed the line numerous times in other countries - far more directly.

So I don't know. USA is in a bit of a pickle, either you admit Russia out smarted you and influenced the election of the most powerful role in the world or you admit you elected a person like Trump who had no qualifications and experienced many election ending blunders and still won.

Pick your humiliation.

because we are le allies xDDDDD and obama is like, cool and stuff! Russia are bad guys

HOWEVER, there is literally no evidence supporting your wild assertion.

He does not say it cannot be hacked. He says it cannot be "rigged." A "rigged" election would be one in which someone at the top, ie the federal government, had decided the result from the get -go who the winner was and the election itself was just theater. Doing such a thing is a practical impossibility with the election decided by 3000 counties under the jurisdiction of 50 states each with their own voting systems.

This is completely distinct from hacking into some of the counties where the votes were close in order to switch the result, which is theoretically much more possible and simply a matter of resources and knowledge.

>
*

Provide proofs.

>Can we at least agree on this fucking fact

Sorry, libshit, you don't get to just make up your own facts and proceed from there.

Go on, tell me how the paper ballots in michigan and pennsylvania were hacked idiot

>I'll take sematics for $1000, Alex

It took you long enough to come up with that answer. How quickly you forget about it being impossible to hack when your candidate was supposed to win.

Russian interfered not by hacking but by sapping the will of the American voter. You cant vote for Hillary beceause shes a pizzagating shewitch and you cant vote for Trump because hes a reality star dufus, so why vote? Only 60 some percent of eligble voters voted. Fake News disemminated by the Russians caused Hillary to lose.

Who's servers? Hillary's?

>We have no idea what the extent is of the evidence they have.

Yet there you go, spouting your fat mouth like you know something.

Typical leftard.

fake news only hit the airwaves while we were digging through pizzagate bullshit here. Suddenly out of nowhere the media coined the term.

Most Americans simply feel disenfranchised and disaffected by the modern system, it will be worse next time, Russians or not.

>Can we at least agree on this fucking fact, regardless of whether or not Trump colluded with them or not?

no. you are literally retarded.

What the Russians really did originated in the Frankfurt School, and has destroyed American morals. Read a book :)

Last 40 years, average voter turnout

1976 152,308 81,603 53.6%
1980 163,945 86,497 52.8%
1984 173,995 92,655 53.3%
1988 181,956 91,587 50.3%
1992 189,493 104,600 55.2%
1996 196,789 96,390 49.0%
2000 209,787 105,594 50.3%
2004 219,553 122,349 55.7%
2008 229,945 131,407 58.2%
2012 235,248 129,235 54.9%
2016 250,056 (estimated)[9] 138,847 (estimated)[9] 55.5% (estimated)[9]

It's getting better than that.

SHUT THE FUCK UP THERE IS NO PROOF NOR FACTS TO SUPPORT THIS CLAIM AND AT THIS POINT AT LEAST ONE CONCRETE FACTUAL PIECE OF EVIDENCE WOULD HAVE COME TO LIGHT.
IN EVEN DISCUSSING THIS STEAMING PILE OF HORSE SHIT IT FACTUALLY PROVES THAT YOU ARE FUCKING RETARDED AND NOT INTERESTED IN POLITICAL DISCOURSE BUT WOULD RATHER ENGAGE IN PARTISAN IDENTITY POLITICS.
OH MY FUCKING GOD I HATE YOU SO MUCH
SAGE SAGE SAGE

Sorry sweetie. No evidence of russian intervention has been released outside if political hacks saying "trust us goy". Your narrative is going down in flames!

>Hacking 101
Is phishing considered hacking now?

See:
pls respond

Honestly I hope lefties keep screaming RUSSIANS RUSSIAN PUTIN OMG! because everyone is fucking sick of it. Dems keep losing seats and they'll continue to lose more - screencap this.

>Russia tried to hack into and influence the election.
Zero proof of this so far, but you're all just so sure of it.

If we're being honest, why can't you admit that your Goldman-Sachs-serving, child-rapist-defending, vitriolic whore candidate got caught destroying federal documents to cover he crimes and that's why the bitch lost.

Russia had nothing to do with it.

Please, show me a source. Any source. A fucking Salon article, anything.

Op starts the thread with unproven statement put as a fact, "can we at least agree", lefty dementia spawned rumors, cites no sources, ignores all the valid responses and picks some he can easily respond to.

A shill.

...

My ballsack just clenched in embarrassment for you. Consider how cringey it is for you to go full McCarthyite, a mere four years after King Nig said "The 80s want their foreign policy back".