Woah. So THIS is the power of protestantism

Woah. So THIS is the power of protestantism.

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> Implying any other communion is any less stupid or ridiculous
> Implying wine becoming the actual blood of Christ isn't the most insane and retarded thing ever that literal children could figure out is bullshit but you keep on believing it

My local bottle shop has special communion wine for sale, I don't know what makes it different

>100% freshness
>Bible-only Christians
>"we interpret literally"
>John 6:54-55
>[54] Then Jesus said to them: Amen, amen I say unto you: Except you eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, you shall not have life in you. [55] He that eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath everlasting life: and I will raise him up in the last day.
Nope He meant that symbolically.
>John 6:66
>After this many of his disciples went back; and walked no more with him.
>Jesus didn't chase them down to correct for them what He meant. If He was being symbolic, He literally abandoned them to a false interpretation of what He said.
This is totally what happened.

it has to be blessed by a priest

Not fit to be any better wine.

The same situation as:
>Baptism is not necessary for salvation, but it's a good thing to do
>John 3:3-5
>[3] Jesus answered, and said to him: Amen, amen I say to thee, unless a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God. [4] Nicodemus saith to him: How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter a second time into his mother's womb, and be born again? [5] Jesus answered: Amen, amen I say to thee, unless a man be born again of WATER and the Holy Ghost, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
and
>1 Peter 3:21
>[21] Whereunto baptism being of the like form, now SAVETH YOU ALSO: not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the examination of a good conscience towards God by the resurrection of Jesus Christ.

Nope, nope, it's all symbolic, folks! Walk up to the "altar" (always struck me as odd, it's just a platform, not an altar), say the sinner's prayer and You're In!

>speaking as an ex-protestant here

That happens during mass though, until then it's just wine

who says it has to happen then

holy water is blessed in advance

I'm catholic. My parish uses Thunderbird.

The church
Ghetto

not if you're protestant

I had a "rice box" as a Catholic.

You had to put your shekels in the top of it. wew lad

Anyone here avoid the New Rite (of 1969) like the plague?

Stay pleb

>17.5% ABV
Hot damn, I bet you can really feel the Holy Spirit running down your throat!

>mfw I thought this was going to be a Lord of the Rings cup or something

Catholics interpret that as if "eating the flesh and blood" was too radical for some followers, so they left him and only the TrueBelievers® were left.

>be Ignatius of Antioch
>personal friend of St. John the Beloved Apostle
>sit and learn at his feet
>be ordained a Bishop by St. Peter
>be over flock in Smyrna
>be captured by Romans
>be in transit to Rome for martyrdom
>write his flock in Smyrna
>exhort them to stay away from the heretics (Gnostics) who do not receive Holy Communion
>because the heretics do not believe it to be the actual body and blood of Christ
>earlychristianwritings.com/text/ignatius-smyrnaeans-longer.html
>"wheresoever the Bishop is, let the people be, even as Jesus Christ is, there is the catholic church."
>110AD

Because partaking from a cup used by 10,000 coughing asians before you is more lovable than witnessing your beautiful wife birth your first child or dying valiantly for your people in battle.

when I was forced to go to church (Lutheran) we had homemade chokecherry wine and fresh baked rye bread

choke cherries are yummy fuck you if you're some kind of faggot scandi.

It s literaly apart of God, the more you consume, the more of you is replaced with parts of the universe that are fundimentaly God,

the church is in Finland MN, so maybe a little Finn, and frog, and others

Who needs Christianity, at least in an organized sense, unless its serving some sort of charity. Otherwise its just circle jerking.

Even better is hiking in the mountains and eating wild blueberries.

>tfw had wild cherry trees in your back yard
>and also blackberry vines

St. Peter called it "partaking in the divine nature." (2 Peter 1:4).
As a protestant, I was always bewildered how this was interpreted:
>Therefore whosoever shall eat this bread, or drink the chalice of the Lord unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and of the blood of the Lord."
[1 Corinthians 11:27]
If Holy Communion is merely a symbol, how in the world does a symbol condemn you of something so grave and cruel as Deicide?

500 years of theological blundering has led to OP's pic.

Catholics are true poison. They always fight against the truth.

In small towns churches are more community, taking care of each other. Fuck the gov't, we got each other's backs. Have not been to a church since the last funeral, so things may have changed, but was it growing up.

blueberries, yes, we have plum and apple trees, and blackberries were a pain due to the thorns. but make good jam and wine, and gram's black & blue pie.. damn I want to be 8 again, just for a few days.

>be gnostic
>be lied about by every single church father in existence for keeping the gospel of Judas, Thomas, and Mary Magdalen.
>be killed by roman catholics for not being the politically correct when they attain military force and make the sentence for disagreeing with the church "heresy" death.

One time I used to walk by this one house with a dilapidated peach tree. Rotten peaches all over the sidewalk.

So I picked them because the were only going to waste. Oh my God I've never tasted peaches so good. Not even the right climate for a peach tree.

And then then they cut it down because it was making a mess on the sidewalk.

well, that thumbnail 100% does not match the image i posted.

Gnostics spun off into many sects, such as the Manicheans who encouraged suicide and forbade marriage.
They were always a people either steeped in the hatred of life or riddled with vice and occultism.
I suggest you read the history and development of the Gnostic heresies.
From Simon Magus to Samuel Basnage, to Petavius, to Valesius, to Menander, Ebion, and Cerinthus, etc. These were vile men supposedly preaching the "true Gospel" of an "invisible Church" where only the "true believers" belonged to, subjectively, by holding this true faith--of which no assembly could be produced to hold such a body.
Much like the Protestant conception of the Church: invisible, true believers stretch across 'denominational' lines, etc
Same crap different age.

>Gnostics spun off into many sects, such as the Manicheans who encouraged suicide and forbade marriage.

is that like how the Knights Templar worshiped Baphoment/Ba'al and practiced homosexuality?

>They were always a people either steeped in the hatred of life or riddled with vice and occultism.

So occult is just a word that means "hidden knowledge" the bible is an occult book in itself filled with hidden knowledge (proverbs 25:2) likewise there are dozens of verses in the NT that tell you to reject the material realm, and then again, Christ even tells you directly that if you don't hate your own life, you can not be his disciple.

Luke 14:26
If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple.


1 Peter 2:11
Dearly beloved, I beseech you as strangers and pilgrims, abstain from fleshly lusts, which war against the soul;

is a fine example of rejecting the material realm.

>I suggest you read the history and development of the Gnostic heresies.
I re-iterate, is this like how there's a history and development of how the Knights Templar fell to Ba'al/Baphoment worship?

and you know, I don't particularly care what is said about the Gnostic Theosis, I care about what the gnostic gospels actually say, because the things said in the Nag Hammadi scriptures become quite validated by the bible. and not only that the gnostic gospels are pretty much 100% opposite about what ever you think their scripture say, one of the dirty jew lies the catholic church states is that they think the old testament God is the devil when that couldn't be further from the truth, and they venerate Yahweh as the Father of Christ, and the old testament as Christ's word. the Demiurge has a name, and its Yaldaboath, who is distinctly different than Yahweh.

continued.

The Templar controversy is steeped in the French Crown seeking the lands and riches of their Order. Many confessions were divulged under torture. Besides, Baphomet as we know it, even under that name, didn't exist until the 18th century until Eliphas Levi created the image.
The name Baphomet is a sort of anagram for Baptism of Wisdom (Baph derived from the Greek Baphe meaning baptism or literally to dip in a vat of dye) and Metis from the mythical Greek goddess of wisdom. It's simply a Gnostic cue to those versed in the demonic systems of Gnosis.

Yeah, God established a Church to hold up all truth (1 Tim 3:15, the Church is the pillar and foundation of truth). God is not a hidden God, nor is His truth.
You are conflating rejecting the material universe with rejecting the illicit pleasures of the flesh.
>"And they that are Christ's, have crucified their flesh, with the vices and concupiscences."
[Galatians 5:24]
God Himself became Incarnate in flesh. Flesh in and of itself is not evil. As Genesis says, God saw everything He had created and saw that it was good.

your parish is in the southern ghetto.

I'd go to church every week if the Communion wine was actually just Old English instead

I took communion when I was an athiest but now I'm actually starting to believe did i commit a huge sin? It was Protestant communion and not real wine if that means anything...

Like this degenerate?
youtube.com/watch?v=BY4wx27vC2E
Guess what? He's still there. That's right, he got a "talking to" by the Bishop and everything's cool.

The Novus Ordo crowd are a bunch of neo-protestants that haven't a freaking clue.

Protestant communion is symbolic, even to them. You literally just ate a snack.

>Much like the Protestant conception of the Church: invisible, true believers stretch across 'denominational' lines, etc

so is that any worse than running a cash4heaven scheme? pretty much all those churches you think are divided by denominational lines are all brothers in Christ

the catholic and orthodox churches are the 2 legs of the Roman empire, the latin western leg, and the byzantine eastern leg from the statue of Nebuchadnezzar in Daniel 8. the seat of the church is not in Rome, nor is it in Constantinople, both these places are going to be destroyed.

>Simon Magus
he actually dies in the gnostic gospels from trying to deceive people with sorcery, according to the acts of Peter, he levitated to a high height, peter prayed to God to stop his sorcery, and he fell, brekaing his legs, and being cut in 2, or falling from a tower, breaking into 4 pieces, and having his body kept by nero for 3 days seeing if he would rise from the dead. this is where I shall call you disingenuous, and basically dishonest in an intellectual, and spiritual capacity., because quite frankly thats exactly what you're being.

also I just checked the rest of the names you listed, and not 1 of them has anything to do with the contents of the gnostic gospels

is there a reason why I shouldn't think of you as an idiot?

>be Ignatius of Antioch
>Write letters
>They are not worthy to be in the bible
>Ignatius Btfo

>divided by denominational lines are all brothers in Christ
They have a different faith, even among the same 'denomination' they disagree on fundamental matters. They literally even say "as long as we can agree on the fundamentals." There are no fundamentals. It is all or nothing.
This is very, very simple for anyone to understand, all it takes is a basic understanding of Scripture.

God doesn't change (Malachi 3:6). He is the same yesterday, today, and forever (Hebrews 13:8)
God is truth (John 14:6). The Church is the pillar and foundation of truth (1 Timothy 3:15). The Church is the [mystical] body of Christ (Col 1:24, etc).

It follows that if God cannot change because He is truth, then truth cannot change. Put simply, two plus two will always be four. God embodies all truth, especially metaphysical truth; and gave us the Church to spread and teach this truth. Thus, the truth that the Church teaches cannot change. It can be more fully understood, but it cannot contradict itself.

These protestant sects arose in the sixteenth century by a man who could not control his passions. They taught new doctrines, and continue to teach new doctrines. Thus it follows that either the truth is malleable according to the time and place and Christ is a liar, or these sixteenth century sects and their descendants have no place in the body of Christ where only one truth is tolerated.

They may believe themselves to be of the same Body, but unfortunately there is no authority amongst themselves; they literally vote in and vote out pastors. Truth: voted upon.

Of course those men aren't in the Gnostic "gospels." No one knows the authors of them. They were disciples of Simon and disciples of his disciples.

is that a pudding snack?

>Showing your ignorance
The letters of the Church fathers are not inspired Scripture. They merely show what the early Church believed and taught.

Anyway, you are incorrectly assuming that the Scriptures tell us that the only things that can be believed must be contained in the Scriptures.

it's a pretty shit drop that

>Galatians 5:24
lets see what the verse actually says.

>And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.

the flesh was destroyed, with the affections and lusts. the desires of flesh, and worldly desires hurt the soul. and you're right, flesh is not evil

>As Genesis says, God saw everything He had created and saw that it was good

and then Adam and Eve ate the tree of knowledge of Good AND EVIL.

>1 Timothy 3:15
>15 But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.

yea, and that ain't the catholic church, which spent a literal thousand years killing Christians, and burning the Bible. Roman Catholicism isn't a church of God, it is the whore of babylon.

>The Templar controversy is steeped in the French Crown seeking the lands and riches of their Order. Many confessions were divulged under torture. Besides, Baphomet as we know it, even under that name, didn't exist until the 18th century until Eliphas Levi created the image.

NO KIDDING. so what you're saying is the Catholic Church as a predisposition to lie, and torture in order to falsify testimonies? isn't that exactly what they accuse of the Gnostics of?

and I actually heard that the Baphomet is actually an advanced metaphysical symbol that was originally a Lamb, but was distorted into being a goat.

>It's simply a Gnostic cue to those versed in the demonic systems of Gnosis
Gnosis means knowledge
and like i stated, having actually studied the gnostic gospels in conjunction with the bible, I can affirm that there is nothing "demonic" about them.

2 Peter 1:2
Grace and peace be multiplied unto you through the knowledge of God, and of Jesus our Lord,

2 Peter 1:5
And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge;

infact, why don't you just go ahead and read 2 Peter 1 in its entirety.

contunued

Actually a good idea. Makes a bit of litter, though.

>The letters of the Church fathers are not inspired Scripture

And why not? its not like the 12 disciples wrote all of the new testament ,except a large part by john and paul

>which spent a literal thousand years killing Christians, and burning the Bible
Man you guys really need a new schtick.
>382, Council of Rome, 73 book canon of Scriptures established
>393, Synod of Hippo, reaffirmed canon
>419, Council of Carthage, reaffirmed canon
Heretical bibles were burned--absolutely, as they should be. I still toss KJV's and NIV's in the woodstove. I keep one KJV around for reference on protestant errors.

>so what you're saying is the Catholic Church as a predisposition to lie, and torture in order to falsify testimonies?
The French Crown seized a Catholic Order's wealth and land. It wasn't the Church that did so. Again, pick up a history book.

Oh, Joseph, Oh Mary my goddess, the common people can afford communion!

>God is not a hidden God, nor is His truth.

god hides things all the time, and he conceals the Truth for it is his glory to do so according to Proverbs 25:2

1 Corinthians 2:7
But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory:

Mark 4:11
And he said unto them, Unto you it is given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God: but unto them that are without, all these things are done in parables

would you look at that, Jesus hides the mystery of the Kingdom of God in parables

>>[3] Jesus answered, and said to him: Amen, amen I say to thee, unless a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God. [4] Nicodemus saith to him: How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter a second time into his mother's womb, and be born again? [5] Jesus answered: Amen, amen I say to thee, unless a man be born again of WATER and the Holy Ghost, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
I like how you leave out the next verse
>6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

>Anyway, you are incorrectly assuming that the Scriptures tell us that the only things that can be believed must be contained in the Scriptures.

>ll Scripture is God-Breathed

>10But thou hast fully known my doctrine, manner of life, purpose, faith, longsuffering, charity, patience, 11Persecutions, afflictions, which came unto me at Antioch, at Iconium, at Lystra; what persecutions I endured: but out of them all the Lord delivered me. 12Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution. 13But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived. 14But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them; 15And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. 16All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 17That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.


That is exactly what the bible claims

I'll go with the one with over a hundred verses than the one with one

>Genesis 15:6: And he believed in the Lord; and he counted it to him for righteousness.
>Matthew 7:21: Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. (See John 6:40)
>Matthew 7:22-23: Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
>Luke 5:20: And when he saw their faith, he said unto him, Man, thy sins are forgiven thee.
>Luke 23:40-43: But the other answering rebuked him, saying, Dost not thou fear God, seeing thou art in the same condemnation? And we indeed justly; for we receive the due reward of our deeds: but this man hath done nothing amiss. And he said unto Jesus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom. And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, Today shalt thou be with me in paradise.
>John 3:16: For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
>John 3:18: He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
>John 6:28-29: Then said they unto him, What shall we do, that we might work the works of God? Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.
>John 6:40: And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day. (See Matthew 7:21)

>John 14:6: Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
>Luke 5:24: Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.
>John 6:40: And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.
>John 6:47: Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me hath everlasting life.

>Acts 10:43: To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins.
>Acts 16:31: And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.
>Romans 1:17-18: For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith. For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;
>Romans 3:28: Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.
>Romans 4:5: But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.
>Romans 5:1: Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ:
>Romans 10:9: That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
>Romans 11:6: And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.
>Romans 14:23: …for whatsoever is not of faith is sin.
>1 Corinthians 1:21: For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.
>Galatians 2:16: Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

>Galatians 2:21: I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.
>Galatians 3:8: And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.
>Galatians 5:4-5: Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace. For we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith.
>Ephesians 1:13-14: In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise, Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.
>Ephesians 2:8-10: For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast. For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.
>Philippians 3:9: And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:
>1Timothy 1:1: Howbeit for this cause I obtained mercy, that in me first Jesus Christ might shew forth all longsuffering, for a pattern to them which should hereafter believe on him to life everlasting.
>Titus 3:5: Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
>James 2:10: For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.

The Church decided upon what was going to be in the canon and what wasn't.
See for timeline.

Well yeah, all is revealed through the Church, the pillar and foundation of truth.

When this was written, it was speaking only of the Old Testament as the St. Paul had no idea that his letters would one day be considered inspired of the Holy Ghost.
Secondly, all Scripture IS inspired of God, and profitable for reproof, correction, etc.
What it Doesn't say is "only Scripture" is. In fact, the same author tells us:
>Therefore, brethren, stand fast; and hold the traditions which you have learned, whether by word, or by our epistle (2 Thess 2:14)

Both Scripture and Tradition were held because:
>"But there are also many other things which Jesus did; which, if they were written every one, the world itself, I think, would not be able to contain the books that should be written." [John 21:25]

Join the true church mate

And the Bible does not support sprinling water on a baby's head

Need to believe.
Acts 8
36And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized?
37And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.
38And he commanded the chariot to stand still: and they went down both into the water, both Philip and the eunuch; and he baptized him.

Fully submerged in water.
Romans 6:4
Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
Matthew 3:16
And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him:
John 3:23
And John also was baptizing in Aenon near to Salim, because there was much water there: and they came, and were baptized.

What is required is the matter, form, and intent.
The matter is the water.
The form is the Trinitarian formula (Matthew 28:19)
The intent is to do what the Church does: baptize

>What is required is the matter, form, and intent.

I thought the whole baptism means you drown like in the flood but you are saved by jesus christ and are reborn in spirit

So you're just going to ignore those verses then?

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No it's supposed to resemble Christ's death. burial, and resurrection

Romans 6:4
Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

>It follows that if God cannot change because He is truth, then truth cannot change. Put simply, two plus two will always be four. God embodies all truth, especially metaphysical truth; and gave us the Church to spread and teach this truth. Thus, the truth that the Church teaches cannot change. It can be more fully understood, but it cannot contradict itself.

well, that Truth is obviously not taught in the Catholic Church because you quite frankly pratice every single pagan ritual, and idol worship that has ever spawned out of babylon

>They may believe themselves to be of the same Body, but unfortunately there is no authority amongst themselves; they literally vote in and vote out pastors. Truth: voted upon.

not an argument watch the bullshit flip on you
>bishops literally vote in and out popes. Truth: voted upon

>These protestant sects arose in the sixteenth century by a man who could not control his passions.

so you agree that the catholic church is allowed to sell forgiveness of sin, and tickets to heaven?

I also like how you're trying to attack the protestant church (which I do not agree with, nor follow) when talking to a gnostic, it really speaks to your ability to follow the topic of conversation, and your character, and sow fictional discord among them,.

> They taught new doctrines, and continue to teach new doctrines. Thus it follows that either the truth is malleable according to the time and place and Christ is a liar, or these sixteenth century sects and their descendants have no place in the body of Christ where only one truth is tolerated.

you really like to act pious without having any idea of what you're talking about.

>Romans 6:4
>Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

Yeah this btfos the catholic

I don't really see a problem with it. It's for when pastors go to visit sick or old people, if they can't come to a service. Doubt those things would be used for a whole group of people at an actual service.

If you're not Christian, then why are you posting from the United States, O.P.?

Not at all, I use those verses all the time when speaking to Protestants. There is nothing there commanding to be fully submerged. This nit-picking on this issue didn't begin until the 19th century with charismatic-styled protestants.
Early Christians had various baptism rites; one of the only functions of women deacons was to baptize women so the priests would not receive scandal; and how they did so was at Church, fully nude, behind a veil, in a tub. Orthodox still dip the child's head three times in the water.
This is a non sequitur issue.

This: It is also the New Testament circumcision. Circumcision was the type of the new circumcision to come: baptism.

aye cant beat scripture on that

>There is nothing there commanding to be fully submerged

Let's see
>buried with him by baptism
So are you saying Jesus just had some dirt and rocks sprinkled on his forehead?

>went up straightway out of the water:
>out of the water:
So he clearly was in the water

>because there was much water there:
Fully submerging someone in water takes a lot of water. Sprinkling water on their forehead doesn't

Statues are not worshiped, kiddo. The crosses you hang on your wall aren't idols that you worship, either. They are representations that are intended to lift your mind and spirit to God--it is sad that I need to even say that.

>not an argument watch the bullshit flip on you
>bishops literally vote in and out popes. Truth: voted upon
The voting in of the successor of Peter isn't a function or expression of truth, LOL. Nor is it an act of the Holy Ghost; Hell, even Benedict XVI said this.

We don't even know what Mary or jesus even looked like. You're probably praying to a stature of a random person.

>Statues are not worshiped, kiddo

>Thinks Catholic churches only hold services on Sunday.
>Churches have early morning, often daily services
>Very few people maybe one or two elderly devotees
>20 minutes in and out
>user uses hand wipes on grocery cart but sticks money in his mouth.

I'm not a christcuck so what is this?

Yes I totally agree that when Jesus was baptized in the Jordan that it was deep enough for Him to rise out of.

>Buried with him in baptism, in whom also you are risen again by the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised Him up from the dead
If you can't catch it, St. Paul is using clever language here. "Buried" to "rise again".

When Christ said to go out and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost, I suppose He failed to mention: don't forget to completely dunk them!

Acts 16:33 tells of a convert's entire household was baptized
>And he, taking them the same hour of the night, washed their stripes, and himself was baptized, and all his house immediately.
They also forgot to mention the necessity of being completely dunked.

John 3:3-5, the "born again" discourse. Christ tells us being "born again" through "water" and "spirit". Because, as St. Peter said, "But Peter said to them: Do penance, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ, for the remission of your sins: and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost." (Acts 2:38).
He, too, forgot to mention the necessity of being completely dunked.

This is merely nitpicking.

is it tax-exempt?

>Of course those men aren't in the Gnostic "gospels." No one knows the authors of them. They were disciples of Simon and disciples of his disciples.

man, you missed the point by a mile and you did it in a dishonest way. Simon is called a sorcerer, and a deceiver in the gnostic gospels who uses sorcery to mislead people. He died a liar, with no disciples, and humiliated by Peter and Paul, its Peter's Prayer to God that stops him from levitating, which killed him., and re-affirms that prayer is how you combat sorcery.

>Man you guys really need a new schtick.
ok, the Roman Catholic Church invented Islam in order to weaken the Byzantine Empire, and put Jerusalem under Roman Catholic control.

>382, Council of Rome, 73 book canon of Scriptures established
>393, Synod of Hippo, reaffirmed canon
>419, Council of Carthage, reaffirmed canon

man, it must suck to have your own Logic thrown into your face, watch this.

>They may believe themselves to be of the same Body, but unfortunately there is no authority amongst themselves; they literally vote in and vote out pastors. Truth: voted upon.

> I still toss KJV's and NIV's in the woodstove. I keep one KJV around for reference on protestant errors.

edgelord, no you don't. the catholic versions literally don't hold up to the Septuagint, masoretic, or greek new testaments. the interlinear bible only uses 2 English versions, the KJV, and the NASB, and avoids catholic versions like the plague. and its the only version that stacks Masoretic texts and greek texts

>inb4 hebrew texts were changed
no, they absolutely weren't. the meanings of words might have changed, but the letters are the same all the way through, otherwise it would ruin the integrity of the Kabbalah, and remove its mathematical properties and patterns.

>Well yeah, all is revealed through the Church, the pillar and foundation of truth.
well, that church really isnt the catholic church, they wouldn't burn people alive for trying to read it

>the Roman Catholic Church invented Islam in order to weaken the Byzantine Empire
This is the height of hilarity. I appreciate the banter, I'm going to talk to the fellow that appears to have a grip on reality.

XD

>christcucks make fun of kosher food but buy this shit

You still didn't do this one

>went up straightway out of the water:
>out of the water:

> suppose He failed to mention: don't forget to completely dunk them!
Because they probably already knew

>They also forgot to mention the necessity of being completely dunked.
Because other verses show it. They don't need to say it every time

>The crosses you hang on your wall aren't idols that you worship, either. They are representations that are intended to lift your mind and spirit to God--it is sad that I need to even say that.

it says believe unto my cross, not believe unto my mother. Mary does not lift your mind and spirit to God, only Christ does that.

>The voting in of the successor of Peter isn't a function or expression of truth,

Neither is voting in a pastor, do you see your own dishonesty?

nice job doding the points

>so you agree that the catholic church is allowed to sell forgiveness of sin, and tickets to heaven?
answer the question pleb, its a simple yes or no.
>I also like how you're trying to attack the protestant church (which I do not agree with, nor follow) when talking to a gnostic,

why are you talking about the protestant church?

i get 17.5% for $5 from aldi.
nectar of the neets.

>This is the height of hilarity. I appreciate the banter, I'm going to talk to the fellow that appears to have a grip on reality.

I still think it is nitpicking, this wasn't an issue until recently.
The Greek word baptizo often means immersion, although sometimes it means just washing up. The Septuagint tells of Naaman went down and 'dipped himself' (baptizo) seven times in the Jordan. So there was immersion involved with baptism; but that is not the only connotation.

Such as in Luke 11:38, the Pharisee was astonished to see that he did not first wash (baptizo) before dinner. Now, they didn't immerse themselves before dinner. Mark tells us that the Pharisees "do not eat unless they wash (nipto) their hands, ... they do not eat unless they wash themselves (baptizo), Mark 7:3-4.
So, it can mean cleansing, ritual washing, or full immersion.

What is absolutely essential is that water is used, it is done according to the way Christ commanded in Mt 28:19, and the person baptizing has the intention to do what the intention of baptism is for.

why does pope benedict venerate the quran?

...

Even though your uncle would fuxk you in the ass again while he listens to stevy nicks?

Also, if we take Acts 1:4-5 into consideration...
>[5] For John indeed baptized with water, but you shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost, not many days hence.

Obviously one cannot be "immersed" with the Holy Ghost; in this sense, it simply means "poured out." Acts 2 tells us 3 times that the Holy Ghost would be poured out.

>is that like how the Knights Templar worshiped Baphoment/Ba'al and practiced homosexuality?

They didn't do any of those things. The only thing they were guilty of was setting up the first international bank which Philip the Fair wanted the profits from.

>Only French Templars were affected
>English Templars were arrested but where given weeks notice and encouraged to flee.
>Every other countries were absorbed into other orders like the Order of Santiago, Order of St John of the Hospital, or Teutonic knights.
>The papacy was in exile at Avignon France and Philip threatened the pope to try them.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinon_Parchment
Gnostic's were rejected and lost. Their heresies showed up again in Arabia causing Muslims to pick it up, popped up again with Bogomilism and the Cathars. Fuck off already, your worse than Neopagans.

>1910
>socialists
sorry, that is objectively false. More importantly, why would jesuits be against socialism when they were (and are) its biggest supporers (see salvation doctrine)?

the jesuit order was the price to pay to have qualified, free missionaries willing to work as teachers and comunity leaders abroad. When they were no longer needed they were expelled, persecuted and excomungated.
it was only post-Vatican II that they were accepted back

jesuits are probably the most self aware christian order, they knew they were herectics so they sold themselves again so that their humanist way of thinking is now canon

Jesuits were infiltrated in the early 20th century. They used to be a glorious order, once suppressed when they shouldn't have been, now absolutely should be suppressed. They were very effective in counter-reformation activity.

Would like to stick around but my five kiddos will be awake sooner than I know it.
Dominus vobiscum

1 Peter 3
>21The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:


peter emphasizes here that its not a symbol for washing the flesh from dirt , how can you wash your body with a few sprinkles ? its full submersion

>(not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,)

>Not if you're a heretic.

Fixed.

>They didn't do any of those things. The only thing they were guilty of was setting up the first international bank

the first international bank was not from the knights templar. its not even remotley true that they were the first international bank

Babylon had an international bank that charged high interest loans to the persians, so the persians invaded them
the persians did the same thing to the greeks, so the greeks invaded them
the greeks did the same thing to the romans, so the romans invaded them.

and yes, I understand they didn't do any of those things, which is why I illustrated the point when quoting as a lie

>>Gnostics spun off into many sects, such as the Manicheans who encouraged suicide and forbade marriage.
>Gnostic's were rejected and lost.
I assume you are talking about the Council of Nicea, Constantine is the one who summoned the Council, and they branded him a heretic for being Baptized as an Arian Christian, something else they barred as heresy. the Council of Nicea holds legitimately 0 authority on matters of how to decipher what is and isn't divinely inspired Canon.

> Their heresies showed up again in Arabia causing Muslims to pick it up

this is just wrong, Mohammad was trained by roman catholic priests, there's a reason why the quran has rhetoric that dictates to kill Jews, and Christians, while protecting Roman Catholics. Muslims didn't pick up anything, their pagan religion of moon worship and the Kabbah (there 2000 years before mohammad) was repackaged into Islam with roman intervention.

> popped up again with Bogomilism
don't know anything about that, but Job 37 where it is spoken of the morningstars that Jesus is not an only child. especially with the old testament phrase Beneha Elohim (sons of God) so the idea that Lucifer is brother to Jesus Christ can be backed by the scripture, since someone has to sit at the Left Hand of God.

>For John indeed baptized with water, but you shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost, not many days hence.

Those were the disciples who already had water baptism full submerging