Like when Mark Steyn debated Simon Schama on refugees, he cited the 500 rapes that happened in Germany on New Years and Schama replied "You sure do think about rape a lot, don't you?" And the audience burst into cheers and applause and afterwards when polled the majority at the venue said Schama won.
Or like the Obama-Romney debate where Romney said the Russian invasions of Crimea and Ukraine, state sponsored hacking and natural gas manipulation were causing a crisis and Obama replied "The 80s called, they want their foreign policy back" and everyone agreed Obama blew him the fuck out.
What do you do when being right doesn't matter at all?
>Like when Mark Steyn debated Simon Schama on refugees, he cited the 500 rapes that happened in Germany on New Years and Schama replied "You sure do think about rape a lot, don't you?"
Why didn't you post Steyn's response?
Bentley Adams
>Mark (((Stein)))
Hudson Stewart
Go read Dilbert Man and learn some basic persuasion. Arguing facts is not persuasive. Leftists believe in nothing so they have nothing to really argue for so it's easy to say anything for them.
Chase Thompson
Because Steyn's response was good yet the audience poll at the end still had a majority pro-refugee
Jonathan Edwards
>And the audience burst into cheers and applause and afterwards when polled the majority at the venue said Schama won.
>500 rapes Not what the reports say. One great strategy is not to work with bogus numbers or strawman your way into a point.
Now regarding your main question: watch Shapiro. He's pretty good at forcing the other side to adapt to his pace.
Wyatt Myers
>the audience poll at the end still had a majority pro-refugee
That's not how you measure who "wins" a debate. Steyn and Farage converted 22% of the audience.
Daniel King
This you can't bring facts to this type of fight vs the left The truth doesn't matter past their fantasy future it's why trump won over the rest of the candidates Or else you'd be in jail
William Cox
I would insist that rape is no joking matter and try to IMPLICITLY accuse the opponent of perpetuating the rape culture. Use liberal weapons against themselves so to speak. I don't know if that would work, but women are scared of rape so it could.
Lucas Lopez
>Obama-Romney debate >2012 >Russian invasions of Crimea and Ukraine
what the fuck are you talking about, did Romney use a time machine to prepare for that debate?
Grayson Peterson
>Not what the reports say. T-t-the reports are all fake news covered up by the gubmit who wants to commit white genocide
Andrew Harris
But responding with a stone serious face. Ask why they wouldn't think of rape and the suffering of the victims. Then ask if it's ok to not ever think of rape.
Remember, stone serious.
Sebastian Long
...
Adrian Stewart
>Arguing facts is not persuasive.
Go away shill.
David Ward
It is inane to argue with people who simply want you dead. Educate your side instead.
Leo Hughes
It's racist not to accept refugees. Bigot.
Isaac Robinson
>What do you do when being right doesn't matter at all?
stop being right (wing)
Wyatt Gutierrez
God I hate these people. I would just say jokes are not an argument.
Luke Scott
...
Adrian Clark
if you're ever in a situation where someone can mock you during a debate, you've done something wrong. it means they believe they're ahead while they should always feel on the defensive. if someone is unironically losing a debate and decides to start mocking, just dismiss it instead of chimping out
Ryan Gray
His only rebuttal would be to yell over the laughter and mockery with righteous anger that rape and murder arent jokes. Nothing stops laughter like fear.
In a face to face "debate" in a bar would you mock a nigger with racial slurs? No, because it effectively ends any reasoned debate and starts either an insult battle or fisticuffs. The only people convinced or unconcerned by 500 rapes were the stacked audience. It's an ad hominem tactic used by someone without an argument.
Romney shouldve pierced through the laghter with an angry retort that you are not a serious candidate and dont belong on this stage.
Eli Martin
>"You sure do think about rape a lot, don't you?" And the audience burst into cheers and applause and afterwards when polled the majority at the venue said Schama won.
I saw the debate and I would say that Steyn won. It was a leaf crowd that was like 75% left. But they left the debate at like 55% left from memory in polls. Steyn did a pretty good job, especially in his response to Schama's joke.
You just call out ad hominems when they arise. Dont whine. Call it out briefly and move on.
David Martin
This is already the case. I was amazed to see how far and fast the news of Debbie wass and the Awan brothers spread. No press support but the network Trump voters got the word to almost everyone in a day.
Twas impressive, to say the least.
Grayson Thomas
>How do you win a debate against mockery? >Like when Mark Steyn debated Simon Schama on refugees, he cited the 500 rapes that happened in Germany on New Years and Schama replied "You sure do think about rape a lot, don't you?" And the audience burst into cheers and applause and afterwards when polled the majority at the venue said Schama won. In that case you attack him and every one in the audience >Yeah laugh, that's really funny. I am sure those women agree.
>Or like the Obama-Romney debate where Romney said the Russian invasions of Crimea and Ukraine, state sponsored hacking and natural gas manipulation were causing a crisis and Obama replied "The 80s called, they want their foreign policy back" and everyone agreed Obama blew him the fuck out. I would say >I am sure i am not the only one you made miss Reagan.
Also there are people are home watching, the audience in the studio doesn't really matter.
Jace Cooper
>How do you win a debate against mockery? be witty
David Harris
>You sure do think about rape a lot, don't you?
>Why do you think raping children is funny?
>Oh, come o-
>No, why do you think raping children is funny? Is it funny when a child's anus requires stiches
>I didn-
>Do you know what they do to child molesters like you in prison Simon?
etc etc.
Carter Anderson
>women are scared of rape That's where your wrong, at least for Western women. They don't honestly believe it will ever happen to them. And as a lot of women actually fantasize about rape many will enjoy the momentary consideration that it MIGHT happen, and get a little moist in there panties at the thought. And all the rapes that do occur are worth it to them for that momentary fantasy.
Henry Brooks
You say "I thought this was a serious debate, excuse me." grab your papers and walk out.
Christopher Carter
>How do you win a debate against mockery? if dry facts won't win points then you must adopt some of the tools of your opponent.
>"You sure do think about rape a lot, don't you?" why do you hate women so much, that you don't care about their violation?
Lucas White
>How do you win a debate against mockery? Violence. If they're not going to take the debate seriously, you won't take their lives seriously. Literally.
Nolan Jenkins
Also;
If they go low, just go lower.
Romney should have implied that a "boy" like Obama needs to take the job more seriously, and stop living up to the negative stereotypes voters have of his sort of people.
Milo actually did a really good job of this on Bill Maher.
(yeah, I know, Milo)
They were trying the mockery thing, and Milo started laughing while they were talking, to which Bill said something like, "okay, okay, let's not get arguing" and Milo said something like;
>I'm sorry, but when you bring on these people, with low IQ's...
You could see them start blubbering and becoming incredibly agitated.
Another approach is to do the complete opposite;
The cold stare down - Like you're dealing with a class clown/retarded student.
Elijah Morris
autism
Lincoln Scott
or simply punch them in the gut...
Noah Sanders
Debates themselves are pretty meaningless. Everyone in the audience goes into them on a side and almost never changes their opinion. Also if this is the debate with Nigel Farage, didn't Steyn and Farage win in the end?
Angel Garcia
>refusing to continue to play when other side isn't bound by the rules is autism now
Justin Roberts
Arguing facts is not persuasive (when talking to a liberal.) Actually read the fucking threads before you comment, or better yet just go back to Plebbit.
Asher Miller
Don't forget about when Megyn Kelly btfo. >"only Rosie O'Donnell"
Angel Hall
There's an excellent extended blog post on specifically debating with leftists. It talks about the biological mechanism of "triggering".
This doesn't work for all leftists, but the ones that tend to hew close to emotional arguments will be affected by it. It basically only requires you to make personal observations and use them to greatly unsettle them. The faggot Milo uses it a lot.
When dealing with leftists who aren't emotional snowflakes, you honestly need to be a Hitchens tier intellect.
A great example is Jon Stewart vs. Tucker Carlson.
Carlson caught Jon Stewart out in a moment that SHOULD have destroyed Stewarts reputation. Stewart basically employed the "I don't care" defense, and Carlson didn't have the wit to improvise a continued attack. He just kind of laughed incredulously that Stewart could behave that way.
Cooper Richardson
I repeat, don't strawman your way into a point. I agree with not trusting anything the government has had its hands on - but if you have certain numbers that contradict the "official" statement, you better come out with the sources so your audience can evaluate the truth of your claim. There's nothing more detrimental to your credibility than talking out of your ass.
Joshua Thomas
Reasonable.
Camden Clark
During debates I just yell about how slavery was wrong and white people are racist towards black people. Doesn't matter what the question is. I also make huffing sounds and bang on shit. youtu.be/fmO-ziHU_D8
Ethan Gonzalez
Not true, I used to be a lot more lefty before listening to some of the actual arguments on Sup Forums
Dylan Perry
>How do you win a debate against mockery? If your opponent is left with mockery as their preferred weapon of choice to thank God that you have such a retarded and weak opponent.
Dominic Bennett
That's repeated exposure though where you were being told directly why you were wrong.
Ethan Reed
Debates can't be won in a society which thrives on idiocy and degerancy, user.
What we need is open warfare against the new aristocracy, not more talky talk.
Nathan Sanchez
Well, this is what Mark did, IIRP, and it didn't work.
Gabriel Reed
manuela arcuri if you want to know the source
Nathaniel Gomez
This is probably the best answer you could come up with in that situation, but if the audience really laughs at rapes of 500 people the chances are they're even more edgy than worst Sup Forumsack and aren't going to care about you playing the victim card.
You can say that and then probably leave the interview. Everyone will probably think you're massive crybaby, but there's nothing more you can do in that kind of company.
Gabriel Walker
It is a misconception. Yes, many women fantasize about getting raped but only by a hot guy. No woman wants to be raped by a dirty stinking Ahmed with a smegma-covered cock. Women do fear rape, it's just that western women have been so brainwashed that they are ashamed of it. They think the fear of rape by an immigrant alone is racist. So they don't acknowledge it it even to themselves.
Henry Baker
>This is probably the best answer you could come up with in that situation, but if the audience really laughs at rapes of 500 people the chances are they're even more edgy than worst Sup Forumsack and aren't going to care about you playing the victim card. You just bring up the case of a 1000+ rapes in Rotherham and then you laugh like a mad man.
Then when the audience doesn't laugh you ask them why that example of rape wasn't funny at all when the previous one was.
Aaron Jackson
It's impossible to win a televised debate against leftists unless you're in a conservative-stacked setting. As soon as the (((leftist))) hears you state a fact they don't want people discussing, they will immediately deflect or just pretend the point is irrelevant. The left-wing hosts will then prevent the right-winger from rebutting, thus solidifying in the leftist audience's mind that 'their guy' has won. Of course, when the place is stacked majority conservative things change... but to a leftist this setting is blatant propaganda to be ignored.
Daniel Barnes
Sauce?
Cameron Collins
You may not notice but that's autistic af.
Brayden Hall
Be autistic and just have a laser like focus on the main point and quickly bring your opponent back on track the moment they try to diverge from it. If they keep doing it, trying to steer it in another direction or deflects with jokes, everyone will see them as the bitch they are. Kind of like in wrestling when a coward character keeps jumping out of the ring. Also, I leftist types are EXTREMELY arrogant, like they have this idea that since they are left leaning, they are these intellectual titans and will usually start off debates with some sort of casual joke that it literally on the level of "psshh, nothing personal kid" and all you have to do is give them one quick jab and they get all off kilter and will start operating from emotions
Im in an online political discussion group for a class and I would usually get into debates with this one really liberal guy and he would always lose his shit because I would just stay on target and he would get mad and just start saying "SHUT THE FUCK UP!" which was pretty funny. Also, watch Ben Shapiros videos on how to debate liberals. Remember, the point isnt to convince them, thats impossible, the point is to verbally string them out and crucify their corpse for everyone watching to see. You should eviscerate their ideas not to convince them, but for all the fence sitters watching the shit unfold and to plant seeds of doubt into the minds of those who do agree with them. Also, keep pic related in the back of your mind and never play their semantics shucking and juving games
Jack Kelly
Walk over to the other side of the stage, smash his head against the podium, throw him on the ground, and pull his pants down. When the audience has their jaws dropped in awe, look at them and ask why it was funny when it happened to 500 women, but isn't funny now. Then accuse them of misogyny.
Ayden Wilson
In my experience, the audience's reaction has much to do with your personal bearing, rather than the words coming out of the other person's mouth.
If you react to the mockery, the audience will detect weakness and laugh. If you grit your teeth and maintain your composure, they won't. Picture Donald Trump in a debate. He will always swag it out, alpha as fuck.
Nolan Robinson
Facts are only a small part of the art of rhetoric.
Noah Gomez
>Simon Schama en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simon_Schama >His mother, Gertie (née Steinberg), was from an Ashkenazi Jewish family (from Kaunas, present-day Lithuania), and his father, Arthur Schama, was of Sephardi Jewish background (from Smyrna, present-day İzmir in Turkey) Oh, of course.
Cooper Gutierrez
This is actually true. It's also a kind of badge of honor, so they inflate the statistics and make up events in order to be part of the club. There was a meme going around a fre years back quoting Louis CK that "men are the number one threat to women"--that women rightly fear going on a date with men because they might not come home. Never mind that this is a completely retarded thing to say--obviously murder is not the number one killer of women, anywhere in the world, but common sense has nothing to do with these fantasies.
Brandon Robinson
Here is an example of Milo making negroes angry by throwing their behavior back at them while not getting mad;
>What do you do when being right doesn't matter at all? You be a sophist. Winning debates has always been about who is the best rhetorician. Unless you're in the prestigious ivy league debate circuit, in which case winning is about how fast you can speak and how black you are.
Landon Fisher
I know, but you get to bring up an ever better case of multicultural enrichment just like that.
Anthony Gray
>"You sure do think about rape a lot, don't you?" you make fun of his callousness >"You sure enjoy deflecting from muslim rapists, don't you?" Then hit him with facts and statistics. It's about not getting side-tracked and if necessary yelling over the crowd so they don't laugh about dumb shit for a minute. Another strategy woiuld be moralizing to make the crowd feel bad about laughing >how the FUCK can you laugh about 500 women being brutally raped? together with an evil look towards the audience does a lot.
Cooper Lee
The only reason Trump won was because we have learned to spread our information and memes better than the MSM.
Joshua Butler
Maybe if you look like Muslim you can laugh with the audience at the 500 rapes and say those were the days.
Bentley Ramirez
>German flag >pro rape Hahahahahahhahaha
Jace Wood
>not having a proper response and instead having a sperg meltdown and walking off the stage ashamed isn't autism
>mfw makes a good point but it takes forever and thus is difficult to wade through
Juan Morris
Also known as, subversion. It actually very easy to lead a multikulti zombie in a logical circle.
James Thomas
The reason Trump won is because the media lied so much and was so inconsistent that for some people the media witch hunt was actually something positive.
>If they hate him that much he must be doing something right.
Jason Wilson
It might not work. The other thing to do is to bring their own concerns into it
>You think about rape a lot don't you
>About half as much as your average campus feminist, and these cases in Germany actually happened
Robert Clark
You push the question, this is the same type of hamstering women do. They accuse you of something but if forced to back it up they have nothing.
The trick is you have to engage in it and then engage against it in the same way you would if a woman infantilized you
Landon Garcia
Show them your resolve.
Robert Long
Hence the Milo approach of not even bothering with a debate. Just attacking them and triggering them.
Without a moderator to maintain stability, what you described is exactly what happens - See every Bill Maher episode.
on Q and A they will be given space and time to rebutt.
It's actually amusing seeing foreign guests on there who are expecting a U.K. or U.S. style panel show pull out stupid stunt comments or behavior. The physicists Brian Cox tried to do some Climate Change schtick on the show, bringing out visual cues, and it came off awkward because there wasn't the comedy show atmosphere and quick back and forth/yelling.
Cameron Reed
Once you realize these aren't serious people, you have full latitude to bully the shit out of them.
Harden the fuck up, and you mock them harder than they mock you. Make them cry like the bitch niggas they are.
Our President has made this into an art form.
Jackson Ward
It doesnt even matter, look at this debate between a libertarian editor form Reason vs Rachel Maddow. She clearly has no fucking idea whats shes even talking about and gets taken to the tool shed, yet she gets applauded because she has this snappy little "shut up!" comment.
Because Political Arguments can never be won factually. They must be won morally. Morality is what is at stake in the west, therefore it must dominate your actions and words while on the campaign trail.
Jacob Ramirez
>he sincerely believes a rape joke by a fucking leftist defending muzzies was a outcome positive someone needs to think up defrnses from
Are you litdrally fucking retaded you fucking spastic?
Dont you really have ANY ideas that this stuff would be heaven send to anyone who is moderately intelligent?
Do you sincerely believe braindead libshsit NPCs reaction is the measurement of sucess in a debate?
Fucking hell. I can think of 20responses on top of my head that would end his fucking career and if not severely damage it amd basically taint him forever as a sexist rape apologist pig
You spit on the sacred lamb, rape and women. And youll pay for it
From Steyn's page: >At the start of the debate, the audience voted 77 per cent pro, 23 per cent con. At the end of the debate, they voted again: >The post debate vote is 55% pro and 45% con. The con side shifted 22% of the vote from the pre-debate results. Con wins.
They were debating in the Blue Pill Capital of Earth. Schama could have stroked himself for the entirety of the debate and still won.
Formal debating is overrated Classical nonsense anyway. It's a great advance from fighting with spears, but the idea that two meatbags can come to the correct solution to a problem by blowing air at each other is slightly ridiculous.
And as other anons have pointed out, we've already found the solution: meme harder.
Nolan Lewis
Another one is stealing their positions.
It's something the Alt-Lite does that Sup Forums finds hideously cringe worthy (and it is), but;
>Democrats are the reacl racists!
Is remarkably effective at upsetting them.
In the OP's case, adopting the position that you are the left wing, compassionate, feminist who cares about protecting women's rights and adominshing the "old misogynists" and the audience for finding rape funny, when it's actually deeply traumatic and life altering, etc etc makes them mad. Once they're mad they get flustered in a debate.
Juan Martinez
Thanks, apparently I wasn't angry enough already today Digits observed, by the by
Carson Jackson
>The cold stare down - Like you're dealing with a class clown/retarded student.
This. Either way, the WORSE thing you can do is give them the response they want, you losing your shit and just saying "FUCK YOU!"
Jackson Anderson
notice her circular logic
>BUSH DID IT! >no he didnt, [goes onto explain it in detail] >YEAH BUT BUSH DID IT! >no he didnt >BUSH DID IT! >no, he did something that was similar, but not this >YEAH, SO BUSH DID IT!
I used to think they were just being cunts when they ALL do shit like this, but I think they are just genuinely deluded.
Colton Cox
i love how she couldn't name a single thing she sided with the red team on when he called her out on being a hardcore always blue team player. same for bill maher lol goddamn retards
Isaiah Carter
>Arguing facts is not persuasive (when talking to a liberal.)
But this is untrue.
Aaron Wood
there werent 500 rapes on new years you retard
4 were reported and least 1 turned out to be fake
Justin Torres
>How do you win a debate against mockery? here's a classic example
Kevin Johnson
There will always be a derailing retard in every thread. Always. (((You)))
Austin Smith
The same way Trump did when he was shamed for his "new York values"
You just blow them the fuck out by showing how flippant and absurd their statement was.
Rape should have been easy. I would have brought up one particular example of a young woman that was ganged raped by Muslims and ask if they really think it's funny that it happend or are they just pandering?
Gavin Sanchez
Simple, you wait until the Apocalypse comes and all the idiots who cheered and clapped idioticy instead of facing the facts and their implications die of starvation, disease and violence. And then you go after all the traitors while there is no police and all social services have gone bye bye. Just prepare and wait for the sovereign debt crisis to hit.
And you'll understand why it is not about facts or being right when you are dealing with treasonous leftists. It's biology, genetics and epigenetics (reaction to the surrounding environment).
Bonus tip: become a prepper.
Noah Diaz
Leftists shut down facts by saying they're racist or sexist. Look at the left whining about Miller pointing out that the Statue of Liberty does not mean immigrants welcome everywhere.
Alexander Richardson
>there werent 500 rapes on new years you retard
Think he was talking about sexual assaults
Angel Rivera
>Leftists shut down facts by saying they're racist or sexist.
I have never had this happen in an argument with a live person
Only on internet boards with government shill presence
Camden Rogers
>I would have brought up one particular example of a young woman that was ganged raped by Muslims and ask if they really think it's funny that it happend or are they just pandering?
this. Remember what saul alinsky said, make them live up to their own standards.
Alexander Lopez
What a God.
Angel Hill
Just literally say "not an arguement." And repeat it and don't move on till they give you a real response thats serious.
