Would Germany and the South have been allies if the Confederacy was still around in the 40's...

Would Germany and the South have been allies if the Confederacy was still around in the 40's? Would Jefferson Davis LITERALLY join the Axis?

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That's sort of like asking if the HRE would have participated in the Second Sino-Japanese War. Wars are about politics and economics. Ideological wars are rare, except in civil wars.

>authoritarian state ruled absolutely by a fascist dictator
vs
>fuck off federal government let the states decided what we want

You're retarded OP. You fit right in on Sup Forums desu.

Isn't the confederates libertarians?
Last time I checked it's a huge ass difference between the both ideologies

No. Because the South was allied with Britain/France because of cotton and European industry, while Britain had largely been the traditional adversary for America until WW2 an adversarial relationship that would have deepened if the South successfully broke away.

The North would have been Axis and the South would have been Allied... if either actually joined in.

Jake Featherston

infogalactic.com/info/Southern_Victory_Series

infogalactic.com/info/Jake_Featherston

Please look up the word "Literally" and then Jefferson Davis's age.

To more deeply prove it, the American Nazi Party of the 30's, the German American Bund, was headquartered in NYC: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_American_Bund

No, we'd be helping our pals Great Britain and France kick Hitler's teeth and the boys in Grey would be saving some Jewish qts.

t. Virginian

Southern Victory was great right up until they killed off McSweeney and introduced Featherston as his placeholder.

The series was supposed to culminate in the United States genociding the Mormons but Turtledove's publisher got pissed and he had to re-write it, that's why the second half of the series is so clunky.

Exactly this

>free market, anti-federal government confederates = centrally planned, fascistic nazis
Lol

NYC was also the headquarters for the Friends of New Germany in the 20's and 30's too. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friends_of_New_Germany

So lets recap:

South = Allies

North = Axis

Hitler said he admired Abraham Lincoln for keeping the Union together, so no, I doubt they'd be allies. Hitler might even support the north, unless he saw supporting the south as an opportunity to weaken the united states by keeping them occupied in a war and out of WWII.

Even the Second Ku Klux Klan was anti-Nazi in the 1930s as strange as that may seem.

Thomas Dixon who wrote "The Clansman" (Birth of a Nation is based on this book) actually refused to join the Second Klan specifically because they were anti-Semitic and anti-Catholic.

lel burgers wouldn't fight against their masters

Hitler copied literally every thing from the democrats. He only had the replace the word negroe with the word jew.

I seriously either the United or Confederate States would be interested in being friends with Nazi Germany. Even the most hardline anti-Semites in America, Henry Ford and Father Coughlin were horrified at the Third Reich's excesses even before the war started.

If anything, Nazi Germany would be one of the few things the US and CS would be on the page on.

youtu.be/PbBSsA-WhVQ

Ehhh... Democrats are kinda a mixed bag. Sure, the Southern Democrats had a history of support for Jim Crow well into the 60s, but the Northern Democrats by the 1930s were catering to black voters. Under FDR the two basically formed a coalition to achieve shared goals (improved social welfare), which promptly fell apart during the 1960s.

It depends on the geopolitical situation. If the north and the south were embroiled in a second war one side or the other would gladly accept financial and arms support from Nazi Germany should it be offered. Even if they were in a state of chilly relations, I don't think they'd turn down free money and aid.

Yet Jefferson Davis was an Autocratic leader, and a Democrat.

They put in a draft before the north

The Confederacy would have ended up like Switzerland.

Fair enough, although I imagine relations between North and South would have cooled or at the very least not openly hostile by the 1940s. Maybe a state of mutual suspicion and animosity similar to Britain and France in the late 19th Century, but the Civil War itself was so utterly devastating I don't either country would be interested in repeating it.

Natsoc confederacy when?

Not everything, not even close, but a lot, yes. That's my point

Know your own history.

The Big Lie: Exposing the Nazi Roots of the American Left [Dinesh D'Souza]

Read that or watch youtube vids and come back afterwards.

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Considering that most of the new German immigrants at the time lived in the North, that is most likely who Hitler with side with in N. America if he wanted to side with anyone at all.

We do know that he considered Americans to be a "mongrel" race. But that was likely due to the large number of Blacks in the US. I can't fathom where those blacks would be in the 1940's though. What we do know is that slavery was on the way out as it was no longer profitable, as every other nation voluntarily giving it up without a war can attest. Would they still be in the South, would they have migrated to the Union or to Mexico? Or would they have been sent to Africa? We don't know.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swiss_Federal_Constitution

The Swiss Canton system is pretty much a copy of the Confederate States of America's constitution.

Switzerland is the only nation that implements direct democracy like the US did pre-Civil War

The South would have been another fervently Neutral power.

Contradiction of terms.

National Socialism requires strong federalism. Confederation requires weak federalism.

I honestly would see it going the other way. France and England supported the south but didn't actually commit resources since they predicted a northern victory. If the south did better or won, European powers would've supported the CSA and I think there would be better relations between the Allies and the CSA than with the north. I think the fascist Yankee scum would've had more in common with Hitler.

If you're referring to armed neutrality, I imagine the CSA would've sat out WW1. It would have neither the industrial capacity nor the interest in joining a European war (most Americans wanted to stay out of WW1 until 1917). With WW2 on the other hand, Hitler was simply too big of a threat to be ignored.

The nazi plan to invade the US was mostly trying to revive the confederacy in order to weaken the US government.
Don't forget a lot of southern towns didn't celebrate the 4th of July until WW2.

And yet its clear on pol they have more in common than either do with the left

>Hitler was simply too big of a threat to be ignored.

He didn't have the reputation of being a threat in America until after the war.

youtu.be/TipovTryyvM

Fact Hitler got many of his ideas from the American democrats.

>Would Jefferson Davis LITERALLY join the Axis?
Probably, though it would have more to do with them having the same enemies than with any ideological similarities.
Fun Fact: Gone with the Wind was one of Dr. Göbbels favorite movies.

This
Alot of preWW2 history is tainted by during and post war revisionism and demonization

>everyoneidontlikeisliterallyanazi.jpg

sage

Most likely both wars unless it was attacked. The South's constitution did not allow the President to declare war.

Germany never had a serious plan to attack the United States directly. In fact, almost all of their war plans gambled on the hope America would not become involved.

Even in the case of German-Americans, overt supporters of Nazism were well within the minority and generally limited to recent immigrants. Hell, Dwight D. Eisenhower was of German descent himself.

Not a direct threat no, but the perception of a threat. The Nazis' overt disdain for democracy was so offensive to the average American (and would be to Confederate as well) that many saw them as a threat to democracy in Europe, especially after the invasion of France and the Low Countries. And that led to the fear that if the Nazis were a threat to democracy in Europe, they would eventually be a threat to democracy over here.

This. The South would have been ideologically too different from the Nazis, there was more democratic freedom in the antebellum South than any nation has ever had in the past or present.

Interesting

Well, I wouldn't go that far, but yes. Democracy is intrinsically tied to the American identity. And the Confederacy would have inherited that same spirit from its predecessor. As such, a country governed by an openly anti-democratic political movement would never be seen as a true friend.