I own a small business and I can easily pay an extra 5% in taxes. If everyone had more money I would sell more product and make way more than 5%
Tell me again why universal basic income doesn't make sense?
Also why are we charging people to gain the skills they need to participate in the economy that benefits us all?
>inb4
>sages
>this is a shill post
>ancap memes
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Because dip shits that are poor are bad with money. They will blow it as soon as they get it cause its "free money"l." Dear faggot, if you want free shit move to Venezuela they have it good under communism.
You don't own a business.
there's no such thing as "blowing money" in a consumer economy. all basic necessities are basically free for all here. no one dies of lack of food, water, shelter really.
so anything people spend money on it's just the free market.
selling items on eBay you pick up from thrift-stores is not a real business
t. posting from my brick and mortar electronics repair shop
>no one dies of lack of food, water, shelter really.
You don't watch the proper news outlets apparently.
>so anything people spend money on it's just the free market.
Clearly you are ill informed.
what is inflation?
fucking retard
The poorest in America are the fattest in America...
prices going up is not the same as inflation retard.
If everyone had more money your employees would quit. They don't need your money anymore. They could live off of their basic income without having to work.
> Tell me again why universal basic income doesn't make sense?
Because UBI is just communism by another name, and communism never works.
Op, give me your contact info so I can get in touch with you. I want a million dollars from you, so I can hire a maid, a butler, a personal chef, and a musician. That's four jobs already that we will create, but we can probably think of more ways that people can serve me. We can do great things for the economy together!
Because we are called AmeriCAN not Ameridon't
i have a business already... i have a place to put my money that gives me an ROI of 50% so why would i give it to you?
Is the muslim bull cock market gonna hit even higher all time records there?
If everyone has more money to spend on products the prices of products will increase after a certain amount of time.
That means you have to pay your employees more so that they can afford the same lifestyle. The price for labour rises.
Ergo: Nothing changes.
Owns a company but doesn't understand simple economics.
Whats with this new term? UBI is just theft. Its socialism. Fuck off with this commie shit. Youll all die before this happens.
the value of your money has to go down for inflation to be real. If prices go up it could just be a bubble which will eventually pop and all the value your cash always had will be available to you again... it's a somewhat subtle but important distinction.
Imagine trying to run a small business with 4 employees who you pay $10 an hour. They're young, so they have roommates and they live on the cheap. They pay $500 in shared rent, and have another $700 in living expenses each month. Working for you, they get $1600 a month, but taxes eats 400 of that. So $1200 or so.
Now the government comes in and tells them they don't need to give 160hrs a week for that money. If they can live with 200 fewer dollars, they get back those 160 hours.
What decision will they make?
Are you overpaying on taxes 5% a year to support the economy? Are you donating 5% of your income a year to an organization that helps poor people? Oh, you're not? Then STFU! You just want gibsmedats from the government. You want to steal from your neighbor but you're too much of a pussy to rob them yourself so you beg the government to do it for you.
>I'm a business owner and want to pay more taxes
Sage you go
you're right. 100% correct. yes some people will make the decision to stay home and they would be 100% correct.
they can buy back all of their time for $200 bucks effective they should.
they basically bought 160 hours of work for $1.25 an hour.
In our modern economy no one's time is ever realistically worth $1.25... if someone is selling their time for that much it's because some great inefficiency is happening or scam.
so yea some people arent skilled or productive so they will stay home instead of clogging up the economic gears with their inefficient, unskilled asses.
I would be for sterilizing anyone who lives on benefits for more than 5 years but you can't have everything you want in life can you?
>own a business
>would like to see customer base double
>don't mind paying bit more taxes for that
>UBI
If I as a landlord know that all of my tenants have a guaranteed $1000/mo in their pockets I'd be a fucking idiot to not start charging them more. It just results in inflation. When will commies realize that money is not fucking real and that merely giving people more money does not equal giving them more wealth.
Think of student loans. If your university knows that you have a guaranteed $10k in federal loans they are just going to charge you that much more. The Federal student loan program started in the 90s by Clinton is why college is so fucking expensive now. UBI will work exactly the same way.
I happen to study economics.Let me explain it to you:
In economics, inflation is a sustained increase in the general price level of goods and services in an economy over a period of time. When the price level rises, each unit of currency buys fewer goods and services; consequently, inflation reflects a reduction in the purchasing power per unit of money – a loss of real value in the medium of exchange and unit of account within the economy.
This mean the value of your money is going down because goods are getting more expensive. Thats the very definition of inflation. The RELATIVE difference is hereby the only defining factor.
Please just leave it at that and prepare better for you next thread.
You are fucking retarded if you think paying more taxes will do anything to your customer base.
ITT: people who never have and never will own a small business explaining whats best for small business
I would say fuck off to /biz/ but nah their entire board is more retarded than op's post.
>all these iq50 mongs in this thread flipping out about muh 1000 usd handout = communism.
Your government is already doing this in another way, its called quantitative easing.
Most people will just spend that money on drugs and booze.It will enable so many hard drug users. But they also will probably OD from all the drugs they will be able to buy... sooo... Perhaps it is a good idea?
...
you're 100% correct if we're talking about a closed economy with goods and services and 1 single currency...
however contrary to popular economics we actually have several currencies competing at the same time.
the US Dollar is actually more like 3-4 currencies plus all the other quasi currencies in the economy.
Why does that matter to inflation.
Inflation can happen without prices going up at all.
that's basically what happens when a country pegs their currency to another countries...
in the same way we have a rigged and artificial economy with the US Dollar where inflation is manipulated to stay low... while the value of the dollar is coming down. prices are not rising as fast.
compare the consumer price index to the value of gold and you will see that it's been stable for centuries. So is inflation really when prices go up? or is it really when your money goes down?
So go give 5% of your income away right now
its not a bad idea and it's definitely possible in some (imaginary) circumstances. but it would take a society of decent, virtuous people. which, if you already had, there would be no necessity for UBI. which makes it a solution looking for a problem
It would cost 3.5 trillion dollars to give everyone in the united states a universal basic income per year.
In return, it would only grow the economy by 2.5 trillion by 2025
So you would be spending 28 trillion to grow the economy by 2.5 trillion.
If you support this you are literally retarded and need to be culled from the gene pool immediately.
>I own a small business
>Tell me again why universal basic income doesn't make sense?
lol
I wouldn't mind giving 5% in taxes, BUT I DO MIND giving 5%+50% in taxes
>If everyone had more money I would sell more product and make way more than 5%
Have you failed math? You would have less money so you would spend less to maintain your business and so on. The total money in circulation remains the same.
wew lad, I just hope you don't consider yourself smart...
There is a factor involved in making sure bad people simply don't have more UBI than you. Enjoy the police state that is waiting for UBI.
well obviously we just need to tell the landlords what they can and can't charge for rent.
You know what why don't we just have the government tell you where to live fuck rent all together. Everyone will be given the same amount of money to spend in a month and live for free. It's the only way to make it work.
We should also have the government tell the stores what they should charge for the goods that they make, but in order to do that we will also need to government to tell us what the labor to make it is worth.
Wow this is so easy we just need to have the government control every part of our lives to make this work!
? He's saying he would lose 5% in taxes which would be redistributed to a customer. He's a customer of a different business. Unless you print more money, the total does not change.
underrated
We really need to get rid of you people.
But the prices go up so we all get screwed. Sure makes a lot of sense...to a moron.
As a supposed business owner you clearly don't know shit about microeconomics. Nice larp you fucking faggot. Sage.
He means everyone would spend their UBI on his business
Giving away free money causes inflation witch will make your !one more worthless.
I don't think his math makes sense. Say he makes 100 bucks per month by selling to joe and blow 50 dollars worth of items. The government takes his five bucks and gives 2.5 to each of his customers. Now they spend 2.5 bucks more on his merch. In total he still makes 100 bucks net. If the government just increases the money supply, the nominal values change but the money is just worth less per item sold.
if you give everyone a thousand dollars, doesn't that just mean everything instantly devalues to the point where that extra 1000 dollars gives you absolutely nothing?
i mean, you haven't actually created anything. you're just changing a number on a computer.
You are describing two sides of the same coin. Inflation is a combination of both.
Once the value of the dollar on on international markets is down imports become more expensive. Leading to rising product prices.
If you increase the amount of dollar on the American market prices will rise eventually. This, however, will not happen immediately and take some time.
If you observe historic examples of rising social benefits you will understand that the price level will take time to adapt. But it will adapt to the higher amount of money on the market.
I mean come on dude. It should be obvious to you. Once people will spend more on products domestic companies will raise their prices. Consequently companies will have to raise the income of their employees. You will not benefit in the long run.
Maybe the prices of some imported goods can artificially be kept low through devaluation but that won't have a big impact.
Do you really not see this?
Then just lower your price you absolute mong
It would come from other people getting taxed not just him, assuming they all had an income
If the prices of everything increase, and your amount of money stays the same, then you have less wealth. Because your dollar has less purchasing power now
pic related is where OP gets news
Kill all government programs. Give people basic income. Spend it the way you want. "Free country."
Take the 5% and give it to your employees as bonuses or raise. Duhh
You don't own a small business.
>I own a small business and I can easily pay an extra 5% in taxes
Fuck off, cuck
fuck off shill
That study is moronic. Giving every adult 1K each month until 2025 would cost something like 30 trillion dollars lmao.
>give everyone one thousand dollars a month
>the cost of living goes up by one thousand dollars a month
>"wow we make more money!"
Lad they tried this meme with the minimum wage here in Australia. Companies are forced to give 15 an hour to retards who can't even get McDonalds orders correct.
Bring it.
sooner we get UBI the sooner the economy reaches its logical conclusion and collapses from a dollar more worthless than it is already.
the problem is we're paying for socialism already, but not enough for it to work properly. UBI will never be enough for everyone. One group or another will cry out for more, and they'll get it, rinse and repeat.
if the idea ever gets seriously tossed around in congress and we dont get it there will be no-shit riots. if we do get it it seals the country's fate
I'm ready either way OP, shill as you must.
>would grow the economy by x
What's the maths of this? It sounds retarded to me as surely the price of everything would rise when everyone has $1000 extra per month and you'd end up with actually very little left. Imagine rent prices if the letters knew everyone had an extra $1000 every single month?
>I can easily pay an extra 5% in taxes
ok, why don't you then?
get yur check book out and send it to the IRS
OP let's think about this for a bit. The idea that people should be given basic income guarantee is rooted in the idea that there is poverty, correct? Think about what poverty is - it's a starting place. If you have value, you escape it. There are two fundamental approaches to society a government can have - free for all, no restrictions, no order, just pure social Darwinism. The other is the approach of looking out for the public's best interest. You might think - well so what, that's welfare, right? No, if someone needs wellfare because they're poor with money or made shitty life decisions, you're removing the social and personal consequences of those actions.
You're subsidizing it, you're going to see more of it because consequences have failed to catch up to people. A government wishing to maintain order and work in it's people's best interest must also allow people to suffer if their decisions are poor. They must have a balancing game between trying to help member of society that will actually need it and turn themselves around and cutting off leeches.
Every dispute in politics revolves around some level of these things. Now back to BIG - we have tons of broken homes right now. Which leads to tons of prisoners, and social decay. Is the solution to throw money at them to piss away on escapism or is it to try and fix the family model? Is it a better decision to turn off the tap or just keep trying to empty the water with buckets into your living room?
This is our current situation, the longer you put off turning off the tap, the worse it will be in the long run.
>supposedly owns a small business
> doesn't understand why universal basic income doesn't make sense
Is there a way to bet on bankruptcy?
This
>I own a small business and I can easily pay an extra 5% in taxes.
If you owned a small business, you'd be downright fucking pissed if 5% more of your profit went to Uncle Sam.
>I own a small business
no you don't
sage
>so why would i give it to you?
Why wouldn't you? You just said that paying 5% more in taxes would help your business. Why not pay more?
>If everyone had more money I would sell more product and make way more than 5%
No.
You can't make money out of thin air, you're not the federal reserve.
UBI makes EVERYONE a dependent sucking on the government's teat. It makes them weak when the government denies them the teat.
>import million of foreigners
>give them money
>foreigners spend money
>hey look the GDP grew, surely this is a good policy!
There's going to be inflation unless you're instigating something new that generates capital independently, then taxing that.
So, a tax on automation could fuel UBI, but a tax on stagnant capital generation leads to rampant inflation.