It's at least closer to reality then them blatantly lying.
>Among Indonesia’s most influential Islamic leaders is Yahya Cholil Staquf, 51, general secretary of the Nahdlatul Ulama, which, with about 50 million members, is the country’s biggest Muslim organization. Yahya, who advocates a modern, moderate Islam, recently spoke with the Jakarta-based German academic and correspondent Marco Stahlhut about his religion, radicalism, and the West. The interview, notable for Yahya’s candor, was first published on Aug. 19 in German in Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung. Here are excerpts translated from the original Bahasa Indonesia into English by Stahlhut and provided by him.
>Many Western politicians and intellectuals say that Islamist terrorism has nothing to do with Islam. What is your view?
>Western politicians should stop pretending that extremism and terrorism have nothing to do with Islam. There is a clear relationship between fundamentalism, terrorism, and the basic assumptions of Islamic orthodoxy. So long as we lack consensus regarding this matter, we cannot gain victory over fundamentalist violence within Islam.
>Radical Islamic movements are nothing new. They’ve appeared again and again throughout our own history in Indonesia. The West must stop ascribing any and all discussion of these issues to “Islamophobia.” Or do people want to accuse me — an Islamic scholar — of being an Islamophobe too?
What basic assumptions within traditional Islam are problematic? >The relationship between Muslims and non-Muslims, the relationship of Muslims with the state, and Muslims’ relationship to the prevailing legal system wherever they live … Within the classical tradition, the relationship between Muslims and non-Muslims is assumed to be one of segregation and enmity. >Perhaps there were reasons for this during the Middle Ages, when the tenets of Islamic orthodoxy were established, but in today’s world such a doctrine is unreasonable. To the extent that Muslims adhere to this view of Islam, it renders them incapable of living harmoniously and peacefully within the multi-cultural, multi-religious societies of the 21st century.
A Western politician would likely be accused of racism for saying what you just said. >I’m not saying that Islam is the only factor causing Muslim minorities in the West to lead a segregated existence, often isolated from society as a whole. There may be other factors on the part of the host nations, such as racism, which exists everywhere in the world. But traditional Islam — which fosters an attitude of segregation and enmity toward non-Muslims — is an important factor.
And Muslims and the state? >Within the Islamic tradition, the state is a single, universal entity that unites all Muslims under the rule of one man who leads them in opposition to, and conflict with, the non-Muslim world.
Eli Hall
More interesting than most of TIME garbage? Will the general population be able to gain any knowledge from this?
Luis Ross
Oops first meant to be a period not a quedtion mark.
Isaac Murphy
So the call by radicals to establish a caliphate, including by ISIS, is not un-Islamic? >No, it is not. [ISIS’s] goal of establishing a global caliphate stands squarely within the orthodox Islamic tradition. But we live in a world of nation-states. Any attempt to create a unified Islamic state in the 21st century can only lead to chaos and violence ... Many Muslims assume there is an established and immutable set of Islamic laws, which are often described as shariah. This assumption is in line with Islamic tradition, but it of course leads to serious conflict with the legal system that exists in secular nation-states. >Any [fundamentalist] view of Islam positing the traditional norms of Islamic jurisprudence as absolute [should] be rejected out of hand as false. State laws [should] have precedence.
I would guess that you and I agree that there is a far right wing in Western societies that would reject even a moderate, contextualized Islam. >And there's an extreme left wing whose adherents reflexively denounce any and all talk about the connections between traditional Islam, fundamentalism and violence as de facto proof of Islamophobia. This must end. A problem that is not acknowledged cannot be solved.
Connor Perez
If they actually read the article, read the other two posts I made between the interviewer and the interviewee... It at least exposes them to the idea.
See
Easton Anderson
Maybe they are finally catching on that right wing biased news gets more traffic. Definitely not /ourguys/, and they will likely attempt to subvert the message, albeit more subtly.
Andrew Davis
see the last question they asked in this post and the response is great.
Islamic extremists often paraded severed heads on spikes. Rows of severed penises were often left behind as a reminder to the rest.
Eli Lewis
>Rows of severed penises were often left behind as a reminder to the rest.
What?
Benjamin Davis
>half the board doesn't even like Trump most of them aren't even from this board
Dylan Peterson
>A Western politician would likely be accused of racism for saying what you just said.
>I would guess that you and I agree that there is a far right wing in Western societies that would reject even a moderate, contextualized Islam.
Why always this kind of questions? Leading conversation to topics they want instead of actually interviewing the guy. Is this what they teach in journalism?
Evan Morales
It's leading a question against journalistic ethics? I've never studied it, but I've heard journalists like Richard Lewis say this.
Landon Richardson
I don't know but there is difference between keeping conversation on track and just leading it to yours. It just doesnt make sense to sit down with an muslim scholar and start talking about sounding like a racist politician or the opinions of the far right in the west. Bet they don't interview catholic priests on their opinions on the middle east.
Jace Scott
If Orthodox Islam is violent then so is Orthodox Christianity.
It all comes down to interpretation.
Isaiah Roberts
the general population is illiterate
Owen Robinson
Huh?
Juan Kelly
Using "Orthodox" allows them to begin rebranding as "Progressive Muslims"
Adrian Hernandez
Because the endgame here is one world religion. This gradual infiltration of Islam into the west is not actually the final glorious expansion of the Caliphate, like the muds all think it is. The faucet of refugees is gonna turn off soon, and the media is going to turn on the violent ones. It's why the media has encouraged the terrorism to continue for so long - they're going to turn on "orthodox Islam". They want to breed a cucked version of Islam, like the cucked popular versions of Christianity, cause they want to rule all of the goyim.
Daniel James
Orthodox Christianity is violent as all fuck, m8 > mfw some pretend-Christian argues for tolerance of Islam in my presence
Kevin Green
bump
William Morgan
>Western politicians should stop pretending that extremism and terrorism have nothing to do with Islam.
that's something every kid could figure out. are we surrounded by idiots?
Joshua Morgan
Yes
Gavin Ross
Yes
Camden Nguyen
(((yes)))
Ayden Nelson
...
Zachary Smith
called being OPEN MINDED U FKN IDIOTS
HOLAL AT YO GURL
Cameron Cox
Time is jew news. They are capitulating on the nationalistic western wave. They are not being based, they are capitulating on Islam bad mouthing wave under the Trump era. They hate all goys. White and muslim.
Robert Bennett
>Stahlhut Nice nice
Justin Diaz
because
Wyatt Hill
kek
Tyler Scott
Bit hard to say Islam is peaceful when many top Islamic scholars (actual scholars, not the "mickey mouse causes cancer" retards) are publicly declaring, arguing and presenting evidence that Islam currently has a problem with violent fundamentalism.
All it does is show how intellectually dishonest the Western media is that decades of Islamic violence in the middle east and two decades of Islamic violence in the West had nothing to do with Islam until Muslims and favored minorities said so
