How does free market capitalism protect its consumers from monopolies and collusion of price fixes?
Since competition is undesirable for a business owner, wouldn't their ultimate incentive is to be a monopoly? have 100% control over a valuable of resource and how its sold?
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true monopolies cant form without threat of violence
anyone who is not efficiently using a resource will eventually get usurped
in theory*
Natural monopolies?
It gives the consumer the choice of where they spend their money. Don't like monopolies? Don't buy from them. You're not helpless.
>Doesn't everyone want to be a monopoly?
Sure. Doesn't mean they'll ever get 100% control, in a competitive market. If someone gains 100% control over something, it wasn't that desirable or people weren't competing.
A monopoly will tumble if no one buys from it.
How about a sewerage service monopoly?
Just an FYI, supply v. demand isn't solely applicable to capitalism. It's applicable to the three major economic systems.
You can't have a monopoly without a goverment.
Septic tanks? Or just haul the shit on your dune buggy(no roads) to what used to be a national park but isn't anymore because there's no gubment.
Someone needs to compete or they'll continue to be a monopoly. As the consumer, you should invest in the smaller company, if you want it to be able to compete against the monopoly.
Monopoly's only advantages are these: larger coverage area, already funded, can lower prices
You, as the consumer, shouldn't allow yourself to be baited by a monopoly's lower prices since you know fully well that the moment the smaller businesses go tits up, they'll just raise their prices again.
As for the state employed monopolies, like Waste Management, there's even less we can do about those. Those are the sort of monopolies I worry about myself, since it takes more to get the government to get off its ass and do something than anything else.
This.
Also, how is OP not supposing there is all of a sudden no other competitors? The drive to become the monopoly in and of it self becomes a market, thus, competition.
Pic unrelated.. But also interesting
So in the extreme worse case scenario, what happens if an entity 100% owns a means of production such as clean water system or usable land?
Wouldnt the consumer still be indirectly coerced into using their products by necessity?
It terms of it actually happening, the only direct example ive seen this happen is airlines collaborating together to raise the price together so they all mutually benefit from higher margins from consumers which is technically screwing consumers over.
Its not like a competitor company can magically conjure a new plane to compete. wouldnt it get even worse if the planes are patented?
>Don't like monopolies? Don't buy from them.
I don't think you understand what a monopoly is
You can eliminate and deplete competitors of necessary resources, thus making it easier to kill them off.
With plentiful resources, monopolies have the luxury to grab the attention of other suppliers and convince them not to supply to competitors, thus weakening them indirectly.
I essentially agree with you, only the natural monopolies (utilities, electricity, roads and ISP's in some areas) tend to be an issue
You need laws against anti-competive practices.
Liberations claim you don't need this, but hey are the dumbest creatures on earth and can be safely ignored.
Yeah, you'd have to go out of your way but you could still withhold your funds.
>It's not like a competitor company can magically conjure a new plane to compete
That's a tough one because it can happen, depending on what the product is. In our case, air travel - you could invest in a smaller company that promises to give fairly priced transportation or you could find other means of transportation (land/sea)?
There's almost always ways around it. It's a real pain but once you get used to it, it feels a lot better than bowing down to a corporate giant.
Amazon is a monopoly you can't see because it hides behind the internet. You can't see the Kmarts, Gamestops and other locations going out of business and getting replaced by Amazon because its all online.
So now what?
>or people weren't competing
Uh yeah. That's kind of the point of a monopoly.
What a coincidence. I don't think you understand what a monopoly is either.
You can grow vegetables, raise animals, dig a well, bury/burn your own garbage, you can do all sorts of things without a monopoly. You're just too lazy to figure it out for yourself.
>B-but monopolies own so many things! It's impossible!
I'm not buying anything from Nestle because I dislike them illegally pumping water out of California on an expired license. In order to do this, I need to find out what they sell and simply not buy it. They're a big company (not monopoly) so it's a pain but there are always ways around it.
If it came down to it where one company owned every fucking thing in the country (god forbid), I'd suggest you fucking move.
Anazon isnt a monopoly. They are simply dominant. Google is more a monopoly than amazon and they certainly aren't a monopoly.
Yeah, generating your own energy could be a huge pain in the ass. Solar panels and cutting back on your use only help so much.
Also, how could this be a free market? In a free market, surplus is maximised, so there is no reason that the competitor should be able to trade, because there's less surplus.
>le "build your own roads" meme
Well done, you found a fault in your theory.
See because its online you are a fucking fool and refuse to believe. Exactly their plan boot licker.
>Monopoly exists
>No one can ever try to compete anymore, since monopoly exists
Uh, yeah. Seems like people have given the incredible monopoly Mythical status. Can't do shit once the monopoly exists. It's game over, man! Just hide under the covers and pretend it's not happening!
Instead of, you know, figuring out what YOU can sell and selling it.
I promise, if you offer to sell someone something right to their face and their interested, they'll buy it out of convenience. The monopoly uses this same tactic but can't physically follow you around and offer you shit. You have to go to them. That is why advertisement is so important to them and they pay so much money for it. They bombard you with "buy from us, we have this" to get you in the door.
Beong online makes it even less of a monopoly
>Ebay and craigslist exist, among others
>Bing and duckduckgo exist, among others
>yet I'm supposedly the one in the thread that doesn't know what a monopoly is
Alright, I'm out. Sorry if my incredibly simple suggestion triggered anyone but sometimes, instead of going to wal-mart, maybe you should go to the mom and pop store, BEFORE they're shut down. Or maybe you could try being the mom and pop store? Who knows. I'm just tired of consumers acting like a bunch of beaten wives.
>He can't put rocks in the dirt
You're just a fucking moron lol
>yet I'm supposedly the one in the thread that doesn't know what a monopoly is
You got it
Still says amazon is not a monopoly. How about that eh?
I think you get the strongest correlation with crime rates if you use Gini coefficients
People don't give a shit if they're rich or poor, they care if there are people out there who have more than they do.
The few monopolies that have existed throughout history (that weren't government enforced monopolies) lasted for very little time and drove down prices in order to try and maintain a monopoly, be it unsuccessful.
How does free market capitalism protect its producers from consumer exploitation and collusion of price fixes?
Since high prices are undesirable for a consumer, wouldn't their ultimate incentive is to collude with all other consumers and not buy anything unless it's literally free? have 100% control over my money and labour and how its sold?
I think you meant to respond to this guy I was initially agreeing that Amazon and Google are not monopolies, since those other companies I listed still exist. Check ID next time.
Because Amazon is NOT a monopoly, they're just big and successful. I already listed other companies that compete with them, so there's literally no way Amazon can be considered a monopoly yet. Try reading that link I gave you, if you disagree.
I think you'll find I said they are not a monopoly.
Regardless of my previous (valid) shitpost - a monopoly is impossible to spot unless it is there by government mandate, and there is no way to spot monopoly prices from "competitive prices".
If you want to look at what happens when a large firm attempts to buy out competition, look at Rockefeller.
Good grief, lad. Lol
>You can't have a monopoly without a goverment.
Literally every group of people forms a government. So I guess monopolies form from groups of humans.
>being so confused what the other thinks that you fight for 50 posts
you two are retards of the highest order
THROUGH COMPETITION. This is one of the most critical characteristics of capitalism...competition. If a single company is dominating an industry or product, it's just a matter of time before someone else wants to profit from this new innovative product/service. As competition increases, you generally see prices decrease. The only way companies can sustain a monopoly today is with the assistance of government regulations.
>That's a tough one because it can happen, depending on what the product is. In our case, air travel - you could invest in a smaller company that promises to give fairly priced transportation or you could find other means of transportation (land/sea)?
The larger companies will force airports to refuse to carry the smaller providers, force aircraft manufacturers to not sell them aircraft, and fuel suppliers not to sell them fuel.
Hard to compete against an established cartel that has connections to other businesses that are also in exclusive deals with the cartel.
Competition is not something businesses can just opt out of the same way you opt you of buying a product
You can form a monopoly or cartel though.
>The only way companies can sustain a monopoly today is with the assistance of government regulations.
With all the other regulations that protect completing businesses. Remove those protections and you can hold onto a monopoly for a very long time. Cartels even longer.
It's hopeless. Liberatians are allergic to critical thought.
>It's hopeless. Liberatians are allergic to critical thought.
True but I like to see what garbage justifications they spew up when confronted with something that can't hand wave away. They always sound so condescending when they do.
once the roads and feds are gone, who's gonna stop the top competitors from using their earnings to create their own system to impose on everyone else, friend?
You can't have a monopoly even without government regulation because the moment you try to hike prices under your monopoly someone else will come in with normal prices from around the world and you'll lose it.
Also, you can't have cartels because if even one person breaks the cartel you will lose BILLIONS of dollars to him and again, it's a trillion dollar prisoners' dilemma game, if you try to hike prices you will get outcompeted
>You can't have a monopoly even without government regulation because the moment you try to hike prices under your monopoly someone else will come in with normal prices from around the world and you'll lose it.
So it's impossible in a world without government for one company to own every production or have exclusive deals with the producers of the chain of resources to make a good?
>Also, you can't have cartels because if even one person breaks the cartel you will lose BILLIONS of dollars to him and again, it's a trillion dollar prisoners' dilemma game, if you try to hike prices you will get outcompeted
If one person breaks the cartel they lose the price premium the cartels offer and may face the rest of the cartel going into competition collectively against the one. If one cartel member is large enough to break the cartel then they will form a monopoly.
Either way without laws to stop it companies form either cartels if they are many, or a monopoly if they are few, or if the cartel mergers.
Create their own system? Define "system." What and how would they do it? Simply because "feds" are gone does not suggest laws disappear as well.
Give some examples of these "protections" and how they benefit competing businesses.
>free market cuts by 55% North Korea's fuel supply
>free market can't find terrorist accounts founding terrorism
Free market is a scam favouring few rich in control, everybody else just runs the hamster wheel, hoping by hard work and lots of dick sucking to make it to the top, not by competition.
That's all folks.
The very competition does. You could try to make a monopoly on something, but the moment you start enforcing your will on your own products, people will find another company or means to acquiring their goods and services.
Eventually, they either have to play ball and loosen their grip, or go bankrupt and be replaced by another company.
Google is learning this lesson the hard way.
>Give some examples of these "protections" and how they benefit competing businesses.
Should I just post antitrust laws, or do you object to a particular one and would like to talk about that?
Idiot. We see free-market capitalism every day...when you go to the store to buy food, food is priced based on a free-market system. The MARKET dictates the prices of these goods and services. Any business can charge $100 for a candybar. But is that store going to sell it? No. Why? Because the market is not willing or able to buy at that price. FREE MARKET = no government intervention.
Now you're getting it
Patents are pretty neat.
Lots f random pro-competition laws. Like a large company can't abuse its position by refusing to work with anyone who deals with a snall new competitor for example. Or can't drop it's prices to well below cost price with the intent of bankrupting competition, knowing it can take the losses longer.
Oh, cartels are almost always flat out illegal too.
It varies from industry and situation, but these laws are pretty cool.
Okay, so you think antitrust laws protect businesses?? LMAO again monopolies exist BECAUSE OF GOV'T REGULATIONS. Now the gov't needs to create a law (antitrust laws) to protect businesses from monopolies, which exist because of gov't. They create more laws to prevent someone they caused. Price-fixing/collusion won't exist when the barriers to entry is easier for competing firms to enter the market because if 7 companies agree to set a specific price, an 8th company can produce a product at a lower price, the consumers will conduct business with the 8th company because they price their product/service lower than the 7 other colluding companies.
Yes, it's impossible to own the entire earth, and it takes a completely absurd, astronomical amount of money to corner the entire world, the whole world's money can't buy all the means of production. Also, producers have to compete with other producers too, and like I said you can't own the world.
The price premium is good for customers, it lowers prices heavily, and if the price is still higher than normal prices the entire cartel gets fully outcompeted by even one or two businesses.
There's no free market, there's just preferred market by elites, which is dollar, English and has to be non-critical about competition, which is like the same like saying don't compete, but suck dick. We have a fresh example of this just today:
yahoo.com
So USA is saying that if RT and Sputnik want to air in USA they have to register as foreign agents, but when we watch American television all across the globe, i guess they don't need to register as foreign agents. Don't make me laugh, free market is nothing but exploitation in favour of foreigners, it's total destruction of native culture, native race and native economy, then comes war and workers need to rebuild everything, but elites just move elsewhere, that's the only thing free market ever was and ever will be. Free market is 100% a scam by simple fact allowing private bank accounts in other countries, can't be more obvious that it's hiding crooked corruption and trying to escape own country of business. So we created this EU where we monitor money, but then allow rich people to hide money abroad, is a total pointless system, which only controls poor people, only poor people and worker class have to follow laws. If that wasn't enough that elites hide money and don't pay tax by hiding money abroad, they even get their taxes reduced in the corporations by government, since they own government of free trade. Free trade government ain't no government, it's a lap dog for elites.
Google operates in a business that has very low entrance cost into the market. Very literally a one man company could grow and scale up to compete with them.
You can't start making a nuclear reactor as a hoby and expect to compete with Hitachi.
So your out is if we didn't have a government a monopoly couldn't form, and the protections against monopolies that governments enforce are stupid if only we had no government we wouldn't need anti trust laws.
>Yes, it's impossible to own the entire earth, and it takes a completely absurd, astronomical amount of money to corner the entire world, the whole world's money can't buy all the means of production. Also, producers have to compete with other producers too, and like I said you can't own the world.
So explain Alcoa who had as close to all the aluminum production in the world under their control as to make no difference.
They didn't even engage in anti competitive practices they just did it better than everyone else.
What law of government made that monopoly?