The discussions we have had on Sup Forums have persuaded me that the Greeks were correct in believing that the Latin Christians had deviated from the teachings of the early church fathers.
As such, I am going to begin the process of converting from Catholicism to Orthodoxy. But I have a question for Orthodox people: is it okay if I keep going to Catholic confession while I am converting? I have some habitual sins I am struggling with and would like to keep going to Catholic confession so that I may begin life as an Orthodox Christian with a clean slate.
That's a complicated question for most people to answer. You should ask your orthodox priest.
Noah Murphy
no bro talk to orthodox priest follow the prayer rules fasting etc from true faith, get spiritual father monk if can, imho
Mason Young
There aren't many differences between Catholic and Orthodox religions. It's mostly about when the holidays are and Orthodox didn't modify the bible that much compared to Catholics (I'm not Orthodox anymore, but a Deist though).
Grayson Powell
Thanks bros.
Eli Morales
Why the fuck do you faggots LARP about fairy tales that divide people.
Noah Gonzalez
Michael cerularius literally ended communion by charging the latins with heresy just for using unleavened bread and different days for fasting.
David Jones
I'm sure it had nothing to do with the Bishops of Rome declaring themselves the exclusive representative of God on earth.
John Hernandez
Yes, because society is doing much better off with these "fairytales," right?
Jacob Baker
First of all, Roman Catholicism is literally what the first Fathers did. You might remember this one guy, Peter, that was the first among apostles ... who literally founded Rome with the literal task by Christ who said he would build the Church on Peter's back (note the word play in the original, Greek, version where Peter is Petros and the stone is petra - both words mean stone).
Furthermore, I'm not even trying to convince you to stay catholic (although it would be very nice), because in my eyes we (Roman catholics) as well as the orthodox are brothers ('member Eastern catholics exist, which literally accepted the Pope but kept everything other specialty, including the byzantine rite/Chrysostom liturgy/married priests/special theology -- apart from the filioque, of course) and we shouldn't shit on each other so much in times where Christ and the whole world is threatened by un- and anti-christian scum and heretics/blasphemers like all the protestant sects including baptists etc..
And regarding your confession: As far as I'm concerned, you need the right intention for confession (among being actually initiated into catholicism). If you can confess when you want to convert ? I don't know. You better go to your priest right now and talk to him about that matter. Because confessing under fraudulent circumstances and with the wrong intention is actually very sinful. So have an open talk with him and go from there.
Other than that, I hope you make up your mind and stay with a church which is in communion with Rome. But if it's orthodoxy which you are going for, I wish you most success and I truly hope for you to receive salvation when the day of judgement comes.
God bless you and may he guide you on your way !
Oh and PS: For those kinds of questions and further discussion, I'd refer you to the christian board of 8ch. We're pretty active and I think you will have fruitful input over there.
So long, God bless
Nolan Cooper
I mean the Roman See, not Rome itself, of course. Sorry, bad wording
Wyatt Perry
You're a complete asshole. You're like the guy who keeps relapsing on heroin and every time he tries to clean up goes right back to it. No self discipline. Don't go back to confession until you're ready to actually stop yourself from doing those things.
Kayden Thompson
And you're uncharitable beyond measure. There's no reason to not confess something which you relapse back to time and time again. It's only problematic, when you go to confession with the intention of doing it again after you confessed, but now can receive the Holy Eucharist. Stop rejecting the sinner for being weak. Hate the sin he's committing and lend him a helping hand to overcome his sin(ful behavior), rather than insulting him for being what he wants to not be anymore.
Brayden Richardson
I'm sorry, but we have had this discussion over and over again on Sup Forums with the same result: it turns out that Catholicism has no basis to justify Papal Supremacy other than a few quotes from the fathers taken out of context and a sloppy interpretation of Matthew 16:18 which can be easily picked apart. Once you have reached this point, Catholics just try to change the subject or shut you down.
Read the account of a Spanish Catholic monk, Paul de Ballester, who woke up to the falsity of the doctrine of Papal Supremacy. It didn't take much research for him to discover how weak the case is for the papacy and once he realised this the Catholic Church made his life hell:
Catholics are evil beings. Molest children, helped nazis, want migrants in europe, cucked europeans to be too tolerant.
Orthodox is the way of the based man. Defend against islam, stand in church instead of sitting like a woman, eat and drink heavily on religious occasions.
Owen Sanders
I can tell from this answer, that you're just out to do exactly what I advocated for to not do anymore. Apart from that, there aren't just "anecdotal quotes from Fathers out of context". Literally all of them accepted the Pope's supremacy as vicar of Christ - East and West, throughout the ages. Hell, the Easterners even used the filioque for over 600 years BEFORE they declared it heresy. What you think are reasonable reasons to not be in communion with Rome are mere political feefeees. The schism even was about to be undone in the 1450s but then the Easterners got pressured by the Turks/Ottomans so they turned away, again. Anyway, I will not discuss this further here. Go to /christian/ if you want an honest discussion.
....which in turn means you are not allowed for catholic confession, because you already are orthodox. Thank you for ignoring literally the whole post except for the first paragraph.
God bless you, may he make you more charitable and less of a politically-driven ego-guy.
Evan Cooper
Catholics were killed off by the nazis to the tens of thousands. Also glad child molestation is exclusively a thing of catholicism. Oh wait, there are others, too. In literally every confession. Baptists are even worse when it comes to that - where a whole parish was HELPING pedo priests molest their children. We don't want migrants either. We want to help creation. But when the limits are reached, then it's enough.
You literally have no clue what you're talking about. Especially your third sentence is a display in unknowingness unmatched. The orthodox stance regarding islam is the exact same as the Roman.
Say it like it is, you like them, because of asthetics and that's fine, but don't mix up profane and divine things and condemn stuff that is not even real. Note that 99% of things catholics are being shat on are actually protestant feefees, but people don't know the difference between catholics and protestants.
Ian Gray
The consensus within the Orthodox Church was that the outcome of the Council of Florence was appalling and the delegates had their arms twisted to make a preliminary agreement with the Latins in exchange for military support. The delegates who signed the decree were treated as traitors to the faith. And what did cucking at the council of Florence accomplish? The Turks still took Constantinople five years later.
Most Orthodox people consider the filioque and the other items separating us to be heresies. Catholics always try to downplay these issues. But the Orthodox are still very passionate about sticking to the tradition and the truth at all costs. They haven't had their Vatican II moment where they just say 'anything goes, let's open some windows'.
Levi Edwards
I converted by going to the consulate and asking for a visa to visit the monastery republic. I was told I have to be orthodox christian, and I said okay, I'll be one, and the guy touched my head and smeared some oil, spoke some word and gave me a piece of paper saying I'm now orthodox. Easiest conversion of my life. Cost like $20 though. Kikes.
Jackson Gray
Killed by nazi? Fucking inbreed go google ndh catholic priests. Basically the whole croatian nazi state was supporter by its clergy. They had priests raising their hands next to corpses and did forceful conversions on others.
Sick organization that used famines to buy followers with food.
Liam Cook
>Peter... who literally founded Rome top lel
Also christianity used to be 666 warring factions not agreeing on how to properly practice this martyrdom cult, until it was unified in Constantinople by whatever the council was called. It wasn't an organized religion back then, people would add whatever pagan practices they locally have to it, and not agree on Jesus' godhood, or if private property should exist, or if women had souls, etc.
You can't talk about christianity before said council said what stays and what goes, and it was organized and defined. Else you include shit like stoning adulterers, mandatory vegetarianism, refusal to own property, and insistence that the more you suffer physically and mentally in this life, the more pleasure in the eternal, martyrdom, etc things that were later refused.
Modern christianity, even catholic, is descendant largely from the organized version, and that is from Constantinople. The real split came later, not as early as you paint it.
Jonathan Hill
Are you aware of what you're doing ? I'm literally calling for brotherhood and you just continue obsessing with literal political feefees and stuff does not even influence your daily life - I go even as far and say: not even the life of the clergy, except they're profound theolgians and discuss these things. That is sad. Sad, because we have so much in common but you just can't stop stroking your ego with "consensus here", "catholics downplay that" and all that jazz. It's a shame that you rather want no unification - which is btw a heresy in itself, because it was not what Christ intended, but a unified Church.
Jackson Taylor
Orthodoxy is the ultimate cuck religion
Daniel Williams
You are still a sheeple if you believe that a a certain denomination is somehow going to give you something the others don't. Religion is a tool. A useful tool, but once you stop properly using it and start unironically worshipping - you are lost to the world.
Noah Nguyen
In Germany the nazi party got a lot of their votes by being the protestant christian party, in opposition of the then successful southern catholic german party. A lot of the volunteers for the nazi paramilitary government organizations (that weren't the army) were protestant zealots and they did spooky shit in Poland.
Justin Williams
Ah I now understand. You think that, because a priest does something, it means that is approved by the Church ? You're, quite frankly, a massive idiot. And that's all I'm gonna tell you.
>>Peter... who literally founded Rome Yeah read the additional post right below that one doofus.
>You can't talk about christianity before said council So Christ didn't practice properly with His apostles ? intredasting Overall I can just say - and I won't discuss further after that - that you should stop being self-indulging people which consider it more important to stroke their egos than reaching nearer to God by practicing right and re-unifiying the Church, which is said to be one holy catholic and apostolic Church. Not 2 branches accusing each other of heresy - while there are (as I mentioned above) Eastern Catholics, which practice exactly orthodox, but submitted to Rome.
Political objections, nothing more.
James Davis
You sound hurt, Germ, need a bandaid?
Kevin Lopez
Orthodox aren't Christian
Gavin Reyes
>So Christ didn't practice properly with His apostles ? intredasting He forgot to upload his routine to Youtube, so we have conflicting eye witness reports, and things needed to get organized from there. As I stated, and you can easily confirm with a bit of research, much pagan lore and rituals were considered christian before that organization, and all claimed that Jesus told them so.
>overall i am right, you are wrong, and thats that i wont discuss further I accept your surrender. May you be more gracious in defeat in the future.
None of the modern christians are "christian", the church was castrated and made impotent after religious conflict and the absolutism of the european empires. It was inconvenient and was killed, all these compromises added up over the centuries to remove it completely from its original intention. Doesn't matter either way, its a placebo, and still works for tens of millions today as it did in the past.
Grayson Murphy
Latin Catholic Church was conceived as a political tool.
Their irreversible descent from heavenly and spiritual affairs began with the rise of Charlemagne, who intrumentalised Roman Bishop and used it as political and a tool of conquest.
Once the Roman Bishop ordained the layman illiterate Charlemagne, and once he CROWNED the SECOND Emperor, it was all over.
Converting Christians (forcibly) to Catholicism is another sign of heresy, not to mention adding dogmas well into 19th and 20th century.
Worship of Mary, Angels, Saints and Relics comes as a no surprise then, not to metion investiture etc.
Catholic Church was a tool and a means to legitimise feudalism society and great social inequality, the arbitrarness of hereditary rule and monarchies, noble rights etc.
Matthew Edwards
I'm not hurt. I'm embarrassed. The Pope is literally cruising through the East, getting the patriarchs on a table and work on at least a kind of brotherhood in this twisted and demon-infested world, and all the laity is doing is to stroke their egos about how XY in year Z did V and how that's the reason we're heretics, not them. It is a SHAME. I can't believe that people obsess with political objections rather than being near to each other, because we have to battle degeneracy and outright satanism.
Anthony Russell
...
Logan Perez
It is neither surrender, nor anything else. These discussion have been held to the millions and in the end everyone thinks he's right and the other is wrong. Which is futile at best. I advocate for brotherhood, not for shitflinging. It's obvious you're pro the latter. So go about your life and have a nice day.
Jordan Sanchez
Catholics aren't Christian
Joshua Perez
You have a Roman Catholic understanding of sin, but in reality sin is not confined to categories. Greek is the original langauge of the NT, and sin there is called hamartia, or "missing the mark", because only Christ is perfect, and every time you fail to live up to his ideal you sin; those sins are not any less severe than the explicitily defined sins (that you probably struggle with), or at least we have no way to compare them. So there is no reason to wait with converting to Orthodoxy, since you will never be free of sin anyway, you can only sin less and less.
Orthodox believers sin too, you won't be any less welcome because you sin.
Julian Carter
Outdated headwear is no substitute for making an argument.
How many times are you going to reply, saying that you won't reply anymore? Additionally, you talk of unity and organization, and at the same time insist that the faith is that of one particular pretender out of the herd of many at the time, while dismissing the unified and organized (for a time) christianity after the council. What you want happened, and catholics ended it. Now you shit on it, while at the same time wishing it happened again? But of course you only want unity under your own terms, a conquest rather than an alliance. Keep walking away, boy. It suits you.
Nathaniel Rodriguez
Ignore meme flag.
Jonathan Lee
If you are going that way, you have to admit this interpretation is basically the pagan greek virtue system. Doing so you get access to extra literature and philosophy to explore, arguably better than the christian one from the period.
Landon Morales
Catholic/Latin Ecumenism can be seen in those early wars against Arian Christians, in Catholic sponsored conquest of Christian Slavic states such as Moravia and Balkan Slavs which were obvisouly baptised by Byzantine missionaries (Glagolytic script and national language religious service).
But nowhere is Catholic Ecumenism more apparent than in Crusades, especially the Fourth and Northern against Novgorod and Rus, in Union of Brest, in Drang nach Osten and repression of Catholic Poles and the Catholic Church contempt and assistance in eliminating Serb identity and presence in modern day Croatia, Bosnia.
The Orthodox and Middle East Christian have every right to hate Catholics and Protestants.
They have been their enemies since forever.
Logan Morris
>the whole world is threatened by un- and anti-christian scum >un- and anti-christian scum
You mean the papacy?
>Because confessing under fraudulent circumstances...
I concur. He shouldn't even bother confessing to a Catholic priest anymore. Just go to an Orthodox Church straight away.
Nathan Ward
>supports orthodoxy >deus vult flag
Aiden Peterson
I said I would stop discussing exactly once. Furthermore are you fucking retard aware of the fact that I'm not saying "BECOME CATHOLIC OR DIE" but "we're so close to each other, let's be brothers in Christ instead being divided over theological things that are best discussed by theologians and not by the laity" ? No you ignore that, because you obviously just want to troll people. Congratulations, you got me.
Thank you for laying words in my minds. God bless you, may he make your heart charitable.
Lucas Ramirez
>is basically the pagan greek virtue system
No it's not, because Christ followed the laws of God, and not just some arbitrarily defined 'virtues'.
Carter Scott
Laying words in my mouth*
Jeremiah Phillips
>i will totally stop responding >keeps responding
Okay. And if you want unity, why do you insist that such unity is made on your terms, instead of rehabilitating the already existing in the past union? Christianity was organized and unified, under Constantinople, and it was Rome that ended this. You are the bad guys.
Anyways, may your chosen skydaddy keep you healthy, so you can live long and see even more religious conflict brought about by purists.
Benjamin Wood
Admittedly, the Orthocucks are the only Christians to work so hard at deciphering the meaningless gibberish of the church fathers, New Testament, and Apocyprha, that they could glimpse at the irreligious divine.
So good job user. Maybe in five hundred lives, you’ll see this idiocy was at least a small step in the right direction.
Jackson Bailey
>we're so close to each other
Being 'close' to salvation is not enough. Strait is the gate.
> Catholics > battling with degeneracy and satanism Most of degeneracy in western world can be tracked to the Catholic chirch, that has become the wellspring for it
Jayden Gomez
You are just mad your cult lives alone in the woods dressed like necromancers, while theirs fucks delicious boipuss in rich golden temples in big cities.
Jaxson Campbell
>the greatest accomplishment of Catholicism is backstabbing other Christians
at least you show your true nature
Lincoln Bennett
orthodoxy is shit for slaves
Angel Brown
How is life as a Non-Russian blasphemer in Russia?
Blake Phillips
It used to be, when it had any power. Now its a nice hobby for easterners too dumb to pick up philosophy, and a nice fetish for outcast westerners looking for something different. Harmless and traditional to us, while exotic to them. Also of course part of world heritage and culture, history, etc. Don't diss it.
Jeremiah Stewart
...
Chase Scott
...
Jordan Rogers
Stop fetishizing hats, its idolatry. You pray to the fedora for salvation whenever confronted, you should play to the lord instead.
Bentley Morales
>going to church >fucking "redpilled"
Jonathan Bennett
Shut up. That guy is fucking dumb and butthurt over the Jasenovac and is still butthurt over getting BTFO by Turks.
Caleb Rivera
When we sin, we become more empty?
Justin Ross
>christianity is shit, it makes you a slave with shitty morals, it teaches you that you should be happy with what you already have and not better yourself, not getting rich and powerful >that's why the jews got all the banks because in christianity you couldn't lend money if you were a christian
Jeremiah Rodriguez
Usury is really bad. Religion aside, I wish we did more to prevent it. Loans allowed for big wars and big scams, and interest on them ensures the next generation suffers too.
If we kept to spending what we can afford, individually and as a country, we'd have less issues. Of course everyone has to agree to do that, else the country next door takes 10 loans and destroys you economically or militarily.
Joseph Johnson
There was a saying in Constantinople, "better the turban than the tiara". There's a sense in which this was true: the Muslims weren't interested in forcing the Christians to believe in heresies, they just wanted to rule them. But Latin conquest was always about bringing the Eastern Christians into line with what they believed to be the correct liturgy, religious tenets and prayers.
Jack Hughes
Christianity is copy pasted from Plato just FYI. Platonic love for example.
Ryder Kelly
My main beefs with Catholicism are not canonical but material. You've had popes knowingly aiding paedophiles and you've currently got a pope preaching heresy.
Isaac Gray
But this is at also the heart of the matter in our theological disagreement. The Orthodox do not believe that purgatory, the Immaculate Conception, and under what circumstances the Bishop of Rome can be considered to be promulgating flawless theology are all matters of theological speculation (THEOLOGOUMENON), and should have never been dogmatically defined under pain of excommunication as the Vatican has done.
The Orthodox approach to dogma is more sane IMO because they do not wish to pass canonical definitions on articles of belief which are not necessary to salvation because such a definitions would unfairly exclude people from communion and create rifts. The timing of when the Virgin Mary became immaculate is one of these things. Ordinary Catholics from the first millennium would be considered automatically excommunicated from Rome if they were alive today because the Vatican's core dogmas have changed over time. The same cannot be said for the Orthodox Church.
Bentley Russell
While it's unnecessary and optional for Catholics to be baptised to become Orthodox, you can still undergo an Orthodox baptism, which is the ultimate cleanser of sins. If you are converting, then you may confess to an Orthodox priest.
Austin Reed
You say that only because the romanian orthodox church steals money. Praising Jesus Christ is red pill stuff.
Easton Harris
Money doesn't make you happy. We can't have a morality based on might makes right. It needs to be nobler than that. The Jews who follow the Talmudic ends-justifies-the-means ethic are hated by God. Judge them by their fruits. The Jews spread pornography, drugs and alcohol everywhere they go and they create nothing, they just spend their time in monkey business - growing money by investing money and screwing people over. You never see Jews who work on farms or serve in the armed forces. They have no honour, no magnanimity. God has given them over to their demons.
Sebastian Baker
It doesn't matter if you go to catholics or orthodox curches. Reading the Bible and understanding it is what actually matters.
Connor Gonzalez
>greeks >correct
Orthodox Christianity is a joke and never did anything useful >Inb4 Byzantine Empire lol The only great thing has come from the Ancient Greeks. Think about it
Camden Parker
>Money doesn't make you happy.
Money does give you greater access to resources, including the all important TIME, but also travel, recreation, security, etc. The more money you have, the less you need to work, and you can visit foreign countries more often and for longer, seeing the pride of the world, famous buildings, cultural events and lectures, etc. Modern life is stressful if you have to worry about money, so having enough to not worry is a big increase in your happiness.
Henry Johnson
John Paul II deserves to be blamed for gross negligence in his failure to act on the issue when it came to his attention. He just swept it under the rug and pretended the survivors who petitioned him weren't there. Chaos Frank was a fool to canonise him. But Pope Francis is a pure leftwing political operator - he knew he had to canonise JPII to keep the conservative cardinals from revolting after he went ahead with his plans for the church.
The thing about Catholicism is that it does not teach however that Popes have to be saints. It teaches that the popes cannot teach error when they are speaking from the chair of St Peter. The jig is up when you can prove that one of these Popes has taught heresy when acting in his official capacity as successor of St Peter.
Connor Ross
More Christian, less Greek patriotic.
Documentary on monks quotes: organicallycooked.com/2016/02/greece-with-simon-reeve-bbc.html >As for that quip by the monk: "Orthodoxy without Greece can survive but Greece without Orthodoxy cannot survive", keep in mind the bullshit that the gun-toting priest from Crete said about nationalism in the first part of the BBC documentary
Ryan Johnson
listen here, drop all the catholic stuff, for real. it's heresy plain and simple. catholicism is a scheme. all of the catholic practices are phony, i can't believe people fall for it/let the guilt run their lives into the dirt.
Ian Moore
You can go to the Orthodox confession that is done by a special priest called an Inquisit- , I mean a Confessor and serves as a mentor, you can also do an anonymous confession if you have to but it's not very common. This is the best advice here get a monk spiritual father, they deal with our souls best than anyone.
Bonus point if you can go to Mount Athos and have a monk greet you by your name before ever seeing you before (Holy Spirit) like they did to a relative of mine and more.
Dylan Bell
Having enough money to buy food, put a roof over your head and pay the bills is all you really need. The problem is that when you begin earning beyond this you face temptations to buy things which are unnecessary and indulge in a more luxurious lifestyle which then traps you in a debt cycle and so you always need to be making more money. We need to learn to live simply to stay free and happy.
Samuel Davis
Nonsense, brother. Forget Catholicism, it is corrupt ( has no Logos), let this man be saved .
Noah Fisher
Debt is a western thing, people here are mostly very careful to never owe money. It isn't normalized yet.
Still, more money does allow you to be happier, easier. It just buys you time and security, both are important.
Gavin Jenkins
Look at your 'priests' on your pic, they are indecent faggots.
Brandon Howard
Praying to Mary when Jesus himself said not to sort of is a deal breaker...
Isaac Thompson
Except you can't understand the Bible on your own, you need the guidance of a church for that.
Charles James
>Catholics™ They believe you cant go to heaven just for your virtue without church. They believe you get Stuck in purgatory unless you pay them to pray for your soul when yoyre dead They believe you can pay them to obsolve your sins Thats the most important difference. AFAIK Orthodox practice confessions too but in a different fashion.
Thomas Cooper
Idk if you've noticed, but the world is p. shit m8
Lincoln Morris
Orthococks is the most liberal branch of Christianity in the USA. Something like 70% of them vote democrat and support open borders. I don't know where people got the idea it was some kind of trad paradise.
Christopher Reed
Yes goyim, remain roman Catholic, where the dogma literally states that Muslims and Jews are to be respected and treated like brothers.
Eli White
>That's because not enough American Orthodox, convert pls.
Ayden Roberts
>Greek Orthodox Metropolitan Lashes Out Against Gays: “Spit on Them, Beat them Up, They Are Not Human” >A Greek Orthodox Metropolitan of the Church of Greece is under fire for comments he posted publicly on his blog, lashing out against gays and atheists. In an angry rant he encouraged his readers and followers to “spit on them” and “blacken them” with violence, stating that they are not humans. pappaspost.com/greek-orthodox-metropolitan-lashes-out-against-gays-spit-on-them-beat-them-up-they-are-not-human/
Ok. Fags are disgusting and all that, but they are hardly a huge problem when compared to billions of subhuman shitskins being allowed to freely enter the country. And the Orthococks here still vote for the Democrat platform, which includes the most deranged faggotry, so your couple of anecdotal evidence do not refute the polling data. I have my own anecdote btw. The local Orthococks nun here was actually campaigning for Bernie.
Josiah Cook
Would that be because of the Middle Eastern ones voting to let more of their family members come over?
Dylan Howard
>america is collectively a degenerate shithole REALLY?!?!?!? >blames orthodox in america Like pottery
Joshua Ortiz
I'm not a specialist to answer your question but my advise is to go full orthodox and don't be afraid of the face to face confession it can be very relieving just make sure to find a good priest to confession a good place for your first time is athos in Greece
Angel Stewart
Protestcucks actually believe this. >I think this passage means something else than you think >eff off, heretic >no, fak u, I'm making my own church
