>In the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Amen.
Praise be to Christ, our Lord. Let's help convert Sup Forums to Jesus so he can help them to stop masturbating.
ITT: We discuss all things Christianity including theology, history, the Bible, the saints, etc.
Any and all denominations that profess belief in the Trinity as defined at the Council of Nicaea (325 A.D) are welcome (Eastern Orthodox also get special privilege of not being confirmed heretics in this thread).
"God became man so that men might become gods." - St. Athanasius of Alexandria (334 A.D).
>Verse of the day:
"There is no fear in love. But perfect love drives out fear, because fear has to do with punishment. The one who fears is not made perfect in love. We love because he first loved us." - 1 John 4:18-19
I'm going to sleep, I will pray for you my Christian bro.
Hudson Long
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Lincoln Parker
Christianity is what turned squabbling tribes of savages into the most advanced countries in the world. At the same time though, its tendency to focus on the ideas of guilt, forgiveness, salvation, and penance are unhelpful to Western peoples, balanced out in the past by the good will Christians from across Europe shared with eachother until the reformation of course. To a lesser extent the religion also promotes an equality of men, because all men are equal to God until they make themselves unequal. This is problematic because it makes it more difficult to organize societies hierarchically as they ought to be.
Despite all these issues, I would say one would be shortsighted to reject Christianity outright. At this point it is a part of almost all European idenities (Least of all perhaps for the Scandies) to at least respect Christianity and the benefits it has given us (Of which there are many). What I'm tempted to do is reject the moralizing of Christianity while keeping the cultural idenity. There's just one problem with that though: it doesn't make any fucking sense and it makes me a hypocrite.
Jose Wood
Reminder: Cathlodox burn in hell.
Ephesians 2:8-9 8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
>in b4 James 2 dead faith Yeah its dead because its non-productive, but not non-existent. Faith is for Jesus, works are for mankind. Men can't see our faith so they understand us by our works. Dead faith is still faith.
"saved through faith" well it looks like you don't have to do any works. "gift of God" you don't work for gifts you just accept them otherwise it isn't a gift. "not of works" well that's pretty clear you don't need to do works. "lest anyman should boast" just like the guys in Matthew 7:21-23 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.(see John 6:38-40 for the Father's will) 22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? 23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. It looks like those people were boastimg and relying on their works "done many wonderful works" AND they had faith "in thy name". But Jesus still told them to fuck off. Looks like relying on your works like orthodox and catholics do has you NOT enter Heaven
Brayden Watson
Men are equal before God in the spiritual sense. Earthy inequality's and hierarchies are abound and have been seen in Christianity.
Cameron Gonzalez
Ok Protesatan, you do know Orthodox Christians wrote the Bible write? You're going to hell heretic.
Tyler Murphy
>Every Christian from 325 to 1517 is burning in Hell Cool religion
Kayden Rivera
FPBP!
Christian Evans
WHAT UNITY!
Jaxon Brown
nice cross you got there sweden
Isaiah Gutierrez
Why not be neither an atheist/agnostic degenerate, nor a Christian, nor of a foreign religion? Go for NeoPlatonism, and leave the "thou shalt pacifism and universalism", and the theological contradiction within all Christian sects, behind.
Samuel Walker
Protestantism is Liberalism applied to Christianity, in every sense of the term. The idea that there is not a perscribed hierarchy (or its de-emphasis), that anyone can make it to heaven through their individual effort, that the traditional practice of a religion isn't important in keeping , these ideas are all fundemental to Protestantism and the reek of Liberalism.
Eli Miller
NeoPlatonism has been adapted into Christianity by Augustine.
Julian Morgan
WHAT UNITY! COOL! I don't give a shit about your christcuck shit retard I just know that this war has been going on for centuries thanks to jews and there christian slaves
Jace Nguyen
>I have no interest in learning Good to know
Benjamin Perez
Go back to bleddit you r/atheist faggot.
Gavin Allen
trust me i've learned enough. I already know of the differences if you want to have a good discussion go to /his/
nice its the lebbit user calling someone else a lebbit
Wyatt Perry
Christianity is not a religion
God always ministers to each soul on a personal one on one basis.
Liam Jackson
christianity is a relgion you dumby. you got some weird preconceptions
Camden Brooks
And Pseudo-Dionysius, who majorly Catholic and Orthodox. But Neoplatonism seems like a position from which Christianity can be sifted, positive from negative, wheat from chaff. No evolution versus Adam and Eve awkwardness necessary either.
Alexander Rodriguez
*influenced
Logan Gray
And to aid us in this, we are given a collection of writings made by a very small number of men 1900 years ago, and are told to abide by its contents. Doesn't sound democratic to me. Sounds like you're looking for Buddhism with a Jesus twist on it.
Carter Campbell
NeoPlatonism fits well with Christianity.
Daniel King
There is one and only one legitimate Bible. The KJV.
Caleb Scott
thats a false church
there is only one Church today which has thrown off all of man's traditions and abides only in the Word, exclusively
Believing in 3 gods, yet think you're an Abrahamic religion. Believing that pacifist that said not to fight back. Was actually a warlord and meant fight back cleverly. Believing in a religion that think having wealth is bad, and somehow think you should have wealth. Christfags are among the most retarded folks out there. Above communists, slightly.
Jordan Lewis
Any Catholic converts to Orthodoxy here? I used to be a trad Catholic. Now I go to a Greek Orthodox parish.
Xavier Ward
Take this shit to /his/ at least there you can have this discussion.
Michael Allen
A religion with no traditions is shallow and will die a swift death. What Protestantists attempt to do by this is create a philosophy out of something which cannot be made philosophical.
Ethan Hernandez
Yes, but I'm saying there are benefits to being a Neoplatonist but not a Christian. I was a serious traditional Catholic for 6 years, until the theological impossibility of squaring traditional Catholicism with Vat.II and what's followed made me abandon it. The difficulty, the awkwardness of squaring robust, unapologetic racialism and fascism with Christianity was also a problem. Now no longer, and I'm hoping, with much more study, that I'll find that Neoplatonism provides all the benefits of Christianity (afterlife, imperative to rise above nature, etc.) without the negatives. (And I love Evola, but Hyperboreans and all I just can't throw in with).
>Christianity is what turned squabbling tribes of savages into the most advanced countries in the world. That is Islam, retard. Christianity took the most advanced countries and made them weak and backwards.
Luke Wood
>stop having any interesting discussion at all >btw have you heard what this latest SJW just said >it's really goofy you guys!
Dylan Perez
Are you refering to le Dark Ages meme? Because the greatest period of Christian fervour across all denominations happened at the same time as western country's greatest height of power and influence.
Samuel Richardson
take it to /his/ if you want an interesting discussion
Ayden Turner
i didnt say no traditions i said "man's" traditions those which were entirely of mankind's conceiving
see: Matthew 15:3-6 and ESPECIALLY: Mark 7:9-13
Grayson Cooper
how about this too? based Anderson!
Gabriel Bennett
>Sup Forums is not for interesting discussion
Anthony Cruz
God Bless But choas has risenith in countries and we have to fight back and chrsitanity won't help us or take up arms for that matter. @CrimsonLight191 on Twitter.com
Blake Robinson
What the fuck Erik
Noah Morris
Do you have evidence for your belief system OP? I would genuinely like to hear it.
Ayden Campbell
>Are you refering to le Dark Ages meme? Because the greatest period of Christian fervour across all denominations happened at the same time as western country's greatest height of power and influence. K, let's check out what you said, goy. Before Christianity, Rome ruled Europe, and conquered Arabs and Africans. Greeks stopped a massive invasion from Persians, and conquered Arabs and Africans. Post Christianity. Arabs and Africans conquer Europe, and hold to some of it for hundreds of years. Scientific achievement falls so far behind. After reformation, and the state removing Christianity from office or changing it, Europe is back to top dog. Conquering Arabs and Africans and jumping leaps in science advancement.
Matthew Rivera
>islam Weh lad you are a dumb cunt
Jonathan Rodriguez
Its for politics and current events not religion. Take it to /his/
Jordan Walker
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Adrian Perry
Ad hominem is not a rebate.
Landon James
Oh cool so you are refering to memes then. If you think science and technology regressed in Europe from the Fall of Rome to 1517 you are a dumb bastard indeed. What did Romans know of chemistry (i.e. alchemy), navigation, astronomy, and physics that Europeans didn't know of in 1490? Nothing.
Lincoln Johnson
The Generals are the only redeeming factor of Sup Forums Wasting my entire adult life on Sup Forums have taught me this.
kill yourself
Gavin Davis
>ITT learn to be a total beta No thanks
Jonathan Ward
Generals are usually shit the only good one is /nsg/ but I'm not talking about generals. Go make a general >>/his/
Adrian Jackson
>Go make a general >>/his/ No. You should just leave the thread and go read the latest "heyhoo listen what this whacky sjw just said" thread
Hunter Brooks
First, your constant ad hominem shows that your argument is weak. Second, you're creating a strawman argument to create points I didn't make. Third, you didn't debunk a single point I made. So, your argument is utter trash.
Easton Edwards
Stop crying and take it to /his/ where you can have your discussion.
Austin Cook
Heretics like you go to hell. NeoPlatonism has now become inseparable from Christianity.
Liam Taylor
>take it to /his/ where you can have your discussion. Never.
Josiah Morris
so you want shit up Sup Forums with slide threads all day kike?
Asher Moore
Christ-chan isn't Protestant. You have no right to use her Protesatan.
>generals >slide threads mental illness is no joke
this is what 99% of Sup Forums is without Generals
Jace Phillips
>rebate
i sprayed milk
Brayden Ramirez
The resurrection.I refer you to biblical scholars who, whether believer or non-believer, acknowledge the strong case for it. Start with E.P Sander, he's a pretty liberal scholar, but puts high historicity on the resurrection. Advance from there into both conservative and liberal camps, and you will usually find them both making good cases for the resurrection,
Justin Jackson
do not confuse catholicism with christianity
Matthew Green
Here is how this thread will go, so newfags can save time for a better thread. Nonchristians will come in and make points against Christianity, and btfo the arguments made by Christians. Christians won't debate, they will just ad hominem, strawman, and move the goal posts. In addition, they will horribly take out of context everything to fit their narrative. Their is a reason Christians have been getting rekt on the net since early 2000.
James Ross
>this is what 99% of Sup Forums is without Generals stop. you just get here from the election or something? just fuck off to /his/
David Nguyen
You're the one who started the argument by calling me a retard, retard. Did you not say scientific achievements fell behind in post-Rome Europe? Or you not consider chemistry, navigation, astronomy, and physics sciences? Every other point you made was empty because it boils down to "wide-spread belief in Christianity = weak country" when this is obviously not the case because Christianity was believed in and spread in its most radical way when Christian people ruled 80% of the planet.
Benjamin King
>just fuck off to /his/ Religious/Spiritual/Cultural general threads have been on Sup Forums for years upon years. They're not going anywhere newfag.
Logan Smith
Who else unitarian universalist here? Pretty much the only valid interpretation of christianity imo
Blake Roberts
>Christianity is not a religion correct i couldn't agree more now lets make it pay taxes like any other business
Elijah Flores
Good God, LOL. I'm sorry I wasted my time.
Chase Martin
K, name a single break through in chemistry, navigation, astronomy, or physics sciences that was invented in Europe by a Christian between 600- 1400 A.D. In the meantime, we can see that two Christians kings burned libraries because books are the work of the devil (the library of Alexandria among its victims). Hindering science because that is not godly. And again you didn't remind Respond to how Christianity didn't defend Europe from being conquered.
Aaron Young
Christianity is a religion of heaven, not of earth. You are supposed to suffer on earth, to enter paradise. That is why early holy Christians would give up their wealth and live in a suffering state. That is why early Christians wanted to be thrown to lions. Jesus really meant love and pray to your enemy, he really meant being rich is evil. He wasn't saying the reverse in a clever way.
Landon Turner
"Yes, goyim, suffer for now and later you will have a paradise I promise."
Jesus or Karl Marx?
Cameron Campbell
>You have to abide by my arbitrary cut off dates even though the Medieval era isn't over Da Vinci, Copernicus, both active at the height of Christian involvement in the state. >Respond to how Christianity didn't defend Europe from being conquered. Christianity is the only reason Europe wasn't conquered. Do you think a pagan Italy would have lefited a finger to defend a pagan Byzantium in 1095? Would various pagan countries have banded together to stop Turkish invasions to defend people who they don't share a faith with? Not likely. If Europe never became Christian it'd have become Muslim instead.
Carter Cruz
>says works play no role in our salvation >tries to claim that Catholics and Orthodox will be damned by their wicked works
what
I don't know what you are, but according to Protestant theology, we are all depraved and we all fall short of God, and it is a folly to think that any work we do can justify ourselves before God. Christ's death meant that we could enter heaven just by having faith in him. This means all Christians are going to heaven. Because even if Catholics and Orthodox do unsavory works like corrupting Christ's teachings and idolatary and that, they are still as depraved as everyone else, and their belief in Christ justifies them.
Catholic theology puts far more emphasis on free will and says that our faith and works are intertwined.
Your bizarre theology seems to put forth that works play no role in our salvation, except for the work of saying that we are saved by faith and works. That is some sort of "unforgivable sin" that Christ's death can't wipe away. So your theology isn't really "sola fide", since there are SOME select works that influence our salvation.
Either way, you have managed to find a theological framework that allows you to think like a protestant, but at the same time, say that the Christians you don't like are going to hell.
Matthew Harris
>This means all Christians are going to heaven. Catholics are not christians, they follow a false gospel
Ryan Thompson
Sementics.
If you define a Christian as anyone who believes that Christ is God's son and he died for our sins, the Catholics are actually Christian. But you could come up with some other definition and exclude everyone that doesn't belong to your particular branch.
If the Protestants are right, and sola fide is true, than anyone who has faith in Christ is going to heaven.
Benjamin Wood
It clearly states in the bible if you follow a false gospel you are damned,Catholicism is a pagan religion. It is the whore of babylon in Revelation
Logan Wright
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Brandon Brooks
...
Asher Adams
Catholicism is by definition always following the correct gospel, because it is the only church with the authority to decide what are the correct gospels.
Camden Diaz
So you agree that the work of following a false gospel can damn you; that faith in Christ isn't enough to wipe away that sin. And if there are works which we can do that can damn or save us (other than just simple faith in Christ), then your beliefs are more in line with the Catholic Church's.
Catholics believe that God gave us free will to live according to his word or to reject it. And we can be saved by relying on the subtle graces that God prompts us with. Believing that it isn't a case of elevating our own free will above God, or "semi-pelaganism" as Proddies call it. But more about respecting the free will that God gave us and understanding its role in our salvation.
I'm not sure what you are (obviously, not a Protestant, since you theology is way out of line), but my point is, if you accept sola fide, you need to accept anyone who has faith in Christ is going to heaven.
Ryder Clark
The Bible was literally created by the Catholic Church ya dingus.
Chase Brooks
>Catholics believe that God gave us free will
false gospel,God has chosen some to be saved from his foreknowledge of them
Ayden Gomez
Nice, keep going
Justin King
I will actually look into this. I am an atheist.
Ryder Mitchell
>John Calvin knows more about Jesus than the Apostles that actually met him
Zachary Long
>God has chosen some to be saved from his foreknowledge of them
The Bible unambiguously states that God desires the salvation of all men, not just the few he chooses.
This denial of free will and the belief in God electing people came from the philosopher Augustine of Hippo, who, while brilliant and church father, was notorious for incorporating gnostic philosophy into his writings.
What should I believe? The Bible, or some pseudo gnostic philosopher?
Josiah Phillips
>What should I believe?
For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren. -Romans 8:KJV
Matthew Phillips
The word predestination only occurs 4 times in the Bible, and they are used in contexts that require extrapolation to fit it into the Calvanist definition.
John Calvin based his views on grace and predestination on the writings of Augustine, who in turn, based it on gnostic philosophy. The Calvinist managed to extrapolate and interpret a few select passages of the Bible to support it.
It was using the Bible to support a belief, not deriving a belief from the Bible. The Bible in its entirety supports the idea that faith can save you. Not being on some list.
Juan Allen
Your concept of freewill is not gods concept of free will
You follow the false gospel of Aristotelian logic and so cannot read the bible as a spiritual guide
Carson Hughes
You follow extra-biblical "gospels" as well, such as predestination, since it isn't explicitly supported by Christ or any of the Apostles. Only "alluded to" like the extra-biblical beliefs you claim Catholics or Lutherans hold.
Anyway, I refuse to believe that salvation comes down to a coin flip. It makes no sense
Ryder Perez
Good read.
Cameron Adams
I better go to sleep. Have to get up for church.
Carson Ramirez
>You follow extra-biblical "gospels" as well...since it isn't explicitly supported by Christ or any of the Apostles
Jesus saith unto them, My meat is to do the will of him that sent me, and to finish his work. -John 4:34 KJV
Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will -Eph 1:5 KJV
Jeremiah Ramirez
what a wicked title in its mere word sequence alone
unbelievable let me translate that title:
>"why Christians should support those who perpetually continue to crucify Christ *fully willingly* as a matter of their chosen lifelong faith in their abject denial of him"
Benjamin Morales
The sacrifice of Christ was planned from the start. He intended to die on the cross.