Do you support their independence and their right to vote?

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No

Can we talk about this another time dad? We're having problems of our own over here.

No ones gives a shit about a shooting in the US. It is a daily trivial occurrence.

no. theyre a bunch of whiny liberals that think the same way as the faggots who think that californias secession is a good idea.

Right to vote, yes, but legally and not the way they did the things.

Independence, no.

>right to vote
Voting should be a privilege, not a right.

And no, Catalonia should not have independence.

I can't understand leftists. They say "remove the borders" but they keep supporting separatist movements on the whole world.

Not talking about that, I'm talking about my two scoops. TWO SCOOPS DAD. WHY WONT YOU LOVE ME?

Yes

they have to get independance,

don't get full british or 1776 might happen again.

Yes. People have a right to self-determination. Fuck globalisation, fuck these police states. We must support nationalist movements regardless of their current politics.

Governments can be changed with time but if we continue this path we are on we will soon live in a global corporate super state. Fuck that. Independence and nationalism.

>Right to vote, yes, but legally
Voting is legal at all times. How is it illegal? It's just the spanish gov calling it "illegal" because they don't want them to leave.

I support their genocide

Can we have a vote in my neighborhood and declare our own country?

Wouldn't you be raped and hung for that in Turkey?

I support their right to make the decision, but I think it's a bad idea to actually secede, although they should be allowed to make that bad decision.

No, their nationalism is based con victimism and being morally superior, they want to be a open borders pro refugee multicultural society with literal commies on government, not real nationalism, fuck them

why are catalans such bitches? this referendum was the political equivalent of Barcelona football. they may be good on technicalities, but fuck what a bunch of babies.

MİT contacted

There is a deeper behind the scenes operation to all of this.

>It's just the spanish gov calling it "illegal".

Its just about respect our laws and constitution that all the spaniards (including the catalonians) voted. They have democratic ways to change the laws (and probably they got enough support to win desu), but they prefer the bad way.

oh shit, user better run

Sure if you had a large enough portion of the population. However just because you are a new nation doesn't mean you will not be instantly attacked by some nation that completely surrounds your nation, massively overpowers you and has legitimate claims to your clay.

That's the trick for a new nation to be successful you need enough population that other nations will take an interest in if that group was attacked.

Spain needs to be sanctioned by other nations for attacking it's citizens for trying to vote on something.

>they want to be a open borders pro refugee multicultural society with literal commies on government
No sauce at all
Also, Spain is pretty much multicultural already

We had our referendum to leave the UK without any problems. There is no "law" that specifies that regions can't have a vote to leave. Total bs.

No and never will, never will allow some red fucks get a single inch of clay. If they did it legally at least I could have a bit of respect, knowing the current situation of the current government, but I despise them with all my guts for not only doing it illegally, but also because their blatant lying and mediatic victimism, I find it despicable.

Actually it's because we voted such thing around 40 years ago and ironically the catalans were one of the most supportive about that. Not that long ago there was a vote for changing the constitution, not only because the catalan separatism movement (not that noisy back in the day) but because other reasons more, like the economical and juridical protection of politicians, that could interfere legally with some corruption cases. It was overwhelmingly voted 'No' to change that. After seeing that they couldn't get it by legal means because their petition was denied, they throw a national-scaled hissy fit and went all illegal withouth thinking of the consequences that their actions could carry.

just look into it. the main party promoting the referendum is the catalan socialist party. also other associations supporting the vote include radical feminists, communists, pro lgbt groups...

The thing is, Spain is not UK and Catalonia is not Scotland, so

>There is no "law" that specifies that regions can't have a vote to leave

That is in your own country, not in Spain.

If they want to be free they have to pay with their blood, that's the Chad way.

Scotland referendum was "granted" much like the brexit one. Politicians at the top wanted once and for all get rid of those issues. Scotland turned out well for them (thanks to a lot of psychological terrorism) and Brexit, well, from Cameron's point of view was a disaster.
Personally I think Spain should have allowed them to vote years back when only 15-20% of Catalonia wanted independence, and then repress any further claim by saying basically, you had your chance, now fuck off.

I do for do a cleaning of lefties in the whole country and then go back again as whole country as usual.

Yes there most certainly is. Scotland required a Commons Vote to hold the Referrendum.

You guys should demand that Space Station Launch pad Cameron blurted out he was going to give you money to build as a bribe to get you to stay. That would be awesome.

also yeah, the United Kingdom is technically a Union of different countries. Spanish constitution ensures autonomy for every region, but it also states that there is only one country, and that is Spain.
There is also one article, 155, which states that in cases like this one the government can "withdraw" the autonomy status of a region.

Yes. Anything that weakens Spain is good in my book.

They reject immigration from mexico or south america beacuse they are spanish speaking countries so their push a lot of african and muslim immigration
Also Artur Mas promised to build the biggest mosque of Europe to the muslims if they get independence
Also they got the CUP on the goverment, check about them, literal commies anti capitalism anti eu, pro ocuppation, anti family values, etc

If you are Kurd, then it might just happen

Fuck yeah!

They can't do it legally because your mary sue constitution prevents it.

Catalonia =/= California
They just sound alike.
Better comparisons: Navajo Nation, Alaska, Hawaii...

Fucking this right here.

Yes because fuck Spain.

Outside of Sup Forums, I keep seeing Catalans called "racists" for voting to secede.
Funny how propaganda adjusts based on the targeted audience.

Not at all actually... Those are indigenous populations that, for better of worse, were 'conquered' (read: civilized) by Westeros. They have a claim on that land.
The history of Catalonia is strictly intertwined with Castille's. There were marriages, unions and wars... but Spain has always been a country. It was one of the first European Nations (in the modern era sense) to emerge out of the age of discoveries.
Catalonian nationalism is a made up story created by socialists in the1800s. Now it's exploited by the elite in power (see: Pujol family), in the name of Ultra-capitalism (mass immigration and appeal to leftist 'ideas', state run by oligarchs).

Outside and inside of Sup Forums, they dont stop to demonize people from diferent zones of Spain, they have a big superiority complex and also they hate a lot of catalonians just for having parents or grandparents from other zones of Spain (they call them Xarnegos)

Except that, when will it ends? You're advocating for de-evolution. Do you want to go back to Medieval Italy, city against city agains city, in endless war?
These problems, are inherently western. Big players like China and India, with huge populations and a lust for power, can only profit from division. Europe must unite, to survive.
Read about the battle of Lepanto.

>Xarnegos
>tfw you get called 'Manolo'
Are the catacuck shills asleep? I miss their retardation.

They are planning the next move of their propaganda. Showing how demonic is the Spanish gov to the kids in a tv show isnt enoguh.

>the next move
There is no next move, they don't really want independence, they want state-funded full autonomy.

The central government is already negotiating through some bishops. There will be a deal, screencap this.

Why did the retards in the goverment order the riot police to beat the voters on Sunday? Aha, because president Rajoy is a MASON and he had previously arranged the plot with the masons in ERC.

Confederations of city states of philosopher kings, my man.
That's where it goes.

Huh. Funny.
Sounds kinda nationalistic.

Nobody on Sup Forums supports this independence.

Nobody wants europe transforming into a 1000 state zone.

Catalan separatist here

I don't support the right of vote unless we before change the constitution. Also our catalan goverment is commie and extremely nationalistic (in the bad way).
Viva España

No they are commie faggots they don't even want to keep Catalonia racially homogenous of only Catalonians they want niggers and hajis there. If it was rightwing and they didn't want a racially diverse country then I probably would support them.

>you speak for Sup Forums
>I am not on Sup Forums

I support whatever brings war faster.

Nice doublespeak

>Nationalistic
They love shitskins, so it's only hate towards other Spaniards, aka whites.

What is it with Iberians and their natural lean towards communism/socialism?

So Catalonian referendum and Brexit do have things in common.

They want to have and run their own country.
>We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. That to secure these rights, governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed. That whenever any form of government becomes destructive to these ends, it is the right of the people to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their safety and happiness.

Every American should support them.

The article that says Spain is only one nation was writen by the military and handed over to the "fathers of the constitution" in a sealed envelope. The Constitution has that article only because we were afraid of a military coup.
Also there is nowhere in Constitution that limits the content of a referendum, its literally Madrid just saying "lol not now not ever".
Meditate on that.

Why would I support fucking commies there are commies in the US that want to succeed should I support them too?

Actually, they consider themselves white, & you are full of shit.

The only thing they have in common is that they're leaving something, in the case of Brexit it's leaving the EU and in the case of Catalonia it's leaving Spain. I wouldn't say brexit voters love shitskins and hate the rest of their own country whom are their own ethnicity, unless I'm missing something. A more fair equivalent is Scotland I think.

No.
This perverts the idea of referendums.
If I was Madrid I would not have interfered, the outcome would have been much different.

Look at my flag. Do I look like I care?

>they want state-funded full autonomy
Please, nobody wants Madrid's money here. Madrid wants our money. what are you on about?

Catalonians are white, yes, I didn't say Catalonians were shitskins, I said that they LOVE SHITSKINS from Morocco, Africa, and etc, which is an objective truth.

>If I turn this into an ethnic thing maybe I could distract people from the fact that borders are imposed and secession it's always an option.

Other countries need to fuck off.

They are not seceding for left/right reasons, but to be sovereign in their own land.
They tried to do all pf this peacefully and legally, and have been trying for years. In favt, they weren't even going to secede, but Spain won't allow them sovereignity in their own land, or respect their laws.

You're overthinking man. I thought that both Catalans and Brits love shitskins and hate whites. Which they do.

>subjective

When you know they said that they are going to expell the spanish army but all the weapons, equipment, aircract, ships and so on will remain in catallonia you realize this is total bullshit. They know perfectly well they can't secede, so they either have other reasons to do this or they are just batshit insane. I am talking about the politicians of course, the normal people really think they can do shit.

How are you going to expell the army? After the message of the king, even if Mariano gave the order to take the army out of catallonia and leave everything behind (which he obviously won't) do you really think that he won't tell the opossite to the immediately subordinated generals?

lmao, you guys are deluded. Even in a paralell dimension when you had FULL international support you would trigger a war, end Spain, turn catalonia to ashes and destroy the european union causing a socio-economic crisis all around europe. If it wasn't for the fact that everyone would backpedal before that.

This is a dead end and as I said, they must have other reasons to do this.

Nor should we.
This is why war is desirable.

Recount with 80% resident voter turnout with international poll watchers. I'd accept that.

The EU has drained the power and influence out of the "super nations" of the 19th and 20th century (Britain, France, Germany & Spain etc) and as a result ancient regions and patriotic allegiances are starting to rise again.

We're going a long way backwards.

And are you supporting commies in the US that want to secede from the US?
It's the American thing righ?

So basically US vs Britain, then.

Can you claim it by force? If not then you have no rights.

This guy talked about the hate of Catalonians towards the rest of Spain (rest of Spain and Catalonians are the same ethnicity), I was merely stating the fact that this is not nationalistic at all since they love non-whites and hate their own brethren. Catalonia is Spain and it will remain so forever. This is not an Ethnic thing, since Catalonians are the same ethnicity as the rest of Spain.
It's objectively true.
independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/barcelona-march-refugees-protest-spain-more-160000-people-thousands-catalan-a7587996.html
Perhaps, but I don't mean Catalonians in general, I mean more like Catalonian separatists, hence why I compared these to pro-Brexit voters.

What the fuck are you talking about?
This is literally the creation of an ethnostate.

>what are you on about?
Just look carefully at what Puigdemont does and says. You will find the answer if you are autistic enough.

I support their right to leave Spain if they don't like it.

They dont have any army, it would all be civilians.
Thats why it would be a convenient war.

An Arab ethnostate perhaps, considering they're circa 7% Muslim, they will be an Islamic State in no time.

No it isn't you fuck they have announced that anyone of any race can be a Catalan they want niggers and muzzies there do you get that in your fucking head that is not a ethnostate.

Spain is leftist as fuck & taking in refugees.
Stop trying to spin this as a left/right thing when you know damn well it's globalist vs nationalist.

The jew gets it. Might = right, everything else is living out of reality.

If this is going to end up in a clusterfuck it's not because of catalonia seceding. Its Madrid hostile reaction. There is literally no sane reason why catalonia and spain would not be able to live in amicable and friendly terms side by side. We dont hate you 1/10 of what you hate us.
I do agree that we still dont have the numbers to sucede ( i'd say 70% in favor would be more like it).
But we both know that even if 100% of catalans wanted to sucede the attitude and response from Madrid would be the same: NEVER.

People have a right to self-determination under the UN Charter.

They do not have the right to ignore the laws of their country.

A legal referendum could have been performed. The Catalan regional government could have appealed to the UN or various EU legal institutions for relief if they believe they were unjustly denied.

They declined to follow proper procedures. As a bureaucrat, I have no sympathy for people who refuse to fill out the paperwork. It's not hard.

>they don't have any army
Yeah, that's what the Redcoats thought, too.

I support their right to get shot by the police.

Dont try to teach us about our own country, yank.

Gas the Catalans!
Civil War now!
Arriba España

They want to reeive immigrants in THEIR OWN COUNTRY.
How the FUCK do you not understand that Catalans running their OWN COUNTRY is fucking nationalism?

The West taking your mindset is what enabled Indian and Chinese domination in the first place. Without our capital they would still be backwaters.

>Globalist vs nationalist
i cant even...

Just for your information, Spain has only taken 1.980 refugees.

>But we both know that even if 100% of catalans wanted to sucede the attitude and response from Madrid would be the same: NEVER.

So as I said, you can't do it. You don't have the force. It doesn't make any sense. What is your plan? What are your hopes? You know you are done, and the politicians know it way better than you. Why do they keep this circus up?

Bite me, shitskin shill