Worked his whole life to acquire property, land, slaves and cattle

>Worked his whole life to acquire property, land, slaves and cattle
>found a qt 3.14 wife and had seven sons and three daughters
>God murders his slaves and cattle
>God commands the wind to collapse on his home, killing more slaves and his entire family
>God commands sores and disease to appear on his body
>He recognises Jobs faith and regrants him a new wife, children and more property and workers than ever.

Please tell me what I am supposed to get from this? I already dont blame the Muslim God or Christian God for anything because I dont believe in destiny or fate etc. What was Jobs problem?? Is this basically saying having faith in the darkest time is better than no faith or what?

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This is for /x/

Mohamed is the only true prophet.

Because faith must be tested to sift false-believers from true-believers.

>1 Peter 1:6-7 - Wherein you shall greatly rejoice, if now you must be for a little time made sorrowful in divers temptations: That the trial of your faith (much more precious than gold which is tried by the fire) may be found unto praise and glory and honour at the appearing of Jesus Christ

If you are so attached to worldly things, including your family and your health, that you'd blaspheme or apostasize just because you had to endure some suffering, you aren't worthy of salvation. "He who loves father or mother above me is not worthy of me; and he who loves son or daughter above me is not worthy of me." Matthew 10:37

This.

Moses never existed, neither did Jesus. But Mohamed did.

That God is a sadist and Satan did nothing wrong.

So god purposely tests people? If that is the case and he can intervene in peoples lives explain shit like sick fucking pedos ruining kids lives. Is that a "test"?

Sometimes bad things happen, keep your faith because God is in control

That is the moral

>qt 3.14 wife

His wife was a cunt m8. Did you even read the story?

It's meant to explain why bad things happen to good people.

If someone worships god but still has a miserable life, rather than saying "this is proof god isn't real," the preacher could point to this story and say "nuh-uh!"

Satan is chaos (Dragon/serpent)
We are all touched by periods of chaos in our life, some more than others. Generally we alternate between periods of order and chaos while the majority of our time is spent in a place between.
Job was tested by chaos in a spectacular fashion but instead of falling victim to it, he was able to endure and his life returned to order leaving him in a better place than he began.

How does one get around the fact that before altruism, is the desire for altruism? Which is to say, fulfilling a desire of self or selfishness? Or the reality of faith being an exchange for good will and favour of god? I wrestle with this but think we are designed selfish. Any Christians / people of faith have thoughts? I'm kind of drunk and therefore am sharing observations I would usually keep to myself for the purpose of artistic and creative endevours atm.

In my ignorant opinion, it seems important here that both his punishment and his reward are material rather than spiritual. Is this, then, the true God, or just the master of the material world that he is interacting with?

it means that abrahamic religions are retarded and you should spare no second longer on this nonsense.

>Please tell me what I am supposed to get from this?
Blind obedience to an imported god. nothing more


now watch these christcucks proclaim me as either a fedora tipper or larpagan

Okay but why does god allow satan to test us then? Why allow him to intervene directly in peoples lives especially for bad? Why would he allow a child to fall into the hands of a sick pedo? so that if that child grows up and somehow overcomes all the obstacles that they have to go through after such a thing (drug abuse, mental illness ect) and still worships god it means they are special and worthy? It's a genuine question and one I can never find a decent answer for past "god has a plan just trust him" I do believe in god but questions like this make me wonder.

He is the only pedophile rapist

i wish this were true

It's another "I have many severe underlying issues with my Christian father and instead of sorting it with him I am going to blame an entire religion as a whole"

Both are necessary. Faith is requisite for salvation while altruism is synonymous with works and deeds which are evaluated at judgement

Are you saying that the "selfish" aspect of the thought process is neglible?

I believe that people attribute things like this to God when pedo rapists should be blames on the will of man. The problem with freedom of choice, is that so many pick the shitty choices.

but then god gave him everything back, and double

did you read the bible, lol?

Yes. The sin or rightousness isn't in thought but in the action after the thought. You can have the desire to be selfish but instead decide to be selfless

God did no such thing, he merely didn't interfere

Also,
>story isn't allegorical

Yes but if he's allowing satan to intervene for bad why does he not intervene for good?(to at least save kids from pedos since children are pure and innocent in the eyes of the lord). it's either he lets the world go on and everything is a consequence of free will, good and bad it's all on us or he allows satan to intervene to fuck people over and wont intervene himself to help them. I just...I dunno

your opinion in its simplest form is correct. You should read the book of Job. It's a good read.

Perhaps the children are fodder in someone else's test just as job's family were sacrificed for job's test. While that doesn't offer a decent answer as to why, it may go to show that a certain amount of collateral damage is permissible in the grand scheme.

It is a story to help instill loyalty to a god that is not there. INDOCTRINATION.

Thanks for the input user. It doesn't rid me of the guilt but it's something to ponder.

Job is a type, or an example of the entire Bible. The book of Job teaches us that God does whatever he wants to, and trying to attach a bunch of rules to him is absurd. It stands in complete contradiction to the christian doctrine that people have to accept Christ or burn in hell forever.

pay attention to how wrong his 3 friends were about God, that's the takeaway from the book. It's actually one of the most theologically complex books, but also one of the simplest:

Job's friends are wrong, Job is (closer to) right.

No problem. Everyone feels guilt but it serves to remind you of a time when you feel you should have done something differently so you can apply it at the next opportunity

that guy is full of shit by the way, selfishness is not a subject addressed by the bible

selfishness is necessary for individuals to exist

whether you do what God has already told you to do is the only metric of moral quality in the universe

Its about loyalty and devotion.

YHWH is a desert Jew god of no relevance to anybody living around today. You might as well go and worship Mithras or Hermes instead, at least those gods are cooler.

>selfishness is not a subject addressed by the bible
Wrong

It does seem impossible to escape the fact that we're selfish by design. What I think user is saying though is that the distinction is what you do with your thoughts and actions, which makes sense to me.

god's an asshole, that's the point.

>the path of Grand Dao
>heart tempering
>heavenly ...

youtube.com/watch?v=6MqkIn6RIqM

selflessness and charity are two totally different things, one is some nonsense that people make up to feel good inside, and the other is a command of God, directed by the spirit of God, for his purposes

are you going to tell me that God cares about whether I give some trifles to someone else, when he already possess all trifles?

Isn't my obedience what he values? Aren't those passages commands to obedience? Obedience to spirit directed charity? Not some delusional selflessness?

>(((God)))

Check flag, ah, of course

keep believing no matter what you dumb goy

be careful dude, that's garbage. God is either real or he isn't.

And if he is real, he doesn't need your moral quality. He needs you to pay attention and do what you're told. Only you know what that is.

The context of my "selflessness" is trying to follow Christ

>delusional selflessness
its called empathy you edgelord

stop trying, you've already succeeded

thank God for his presence and guidance (in an ongoing manner) and leave it at that, you're contribution isn't as valuable as you seem to think

Wrong. God allowed satan to do those things.

May ham and bacon be upon him

Never trust a new is the moral

If there is no selflessness then there is only selfishness so why would charity even exist?
It isn't about the trifles, it's about the act of caring enough to give.
Obedience to directions is a method of teaching us to change our nature. An artist learns to color inside the lines before they create their own works.

God is a giant dick in the old testament.

It is literally a Christcucks fantasy

It is t enough to have your wife get fucked by another man, no, we need an omnipotent deity to cuck my shit up

Zeus doesn't have this insecurity, if you show up to the temples and make offerings to him, he'll trust you are faithful.
>wife and kids dead
>better place

The whole thing what the bible teach you is that nobody is perfect, even god is an asshole. The whole bible is about an dystopian world ( Adam and Eve were kicked out of an utopian world/garden) and how people act in this fucked up place and everybody is waiting for the savior to arrive. And even when the savior arrived he have to do everything by himself and he dont get alot of help from many people because they are all cowards just waiting for him to do everything.

This. God's an insecure little bitch. He's like the girlfriend that wants to check your church donations.
"who the fuck is Athena? And WHY did you buy grapes to place at her alter? Huh?"

Job already deserves death for his Sin. He's owed none of the things that he has. Only through divine grace can anyone be happy or fulfilled and certainly only through Divine grace can anyone be saved.

I am not religious and in my hard atheist days I thought Job was an awful book but after reading Kierkegaard and hearing other people tackle it philosophically, it's actually my favorite book in the bible.

Job wasn't cursing God but people of today reject God at all

they do not even curse Him which ironically would be an improvement

I am sorry my Lord...

My feelings are that rejecting the idea of God is bad. I feel it is a step back. I can give probably weak arguments but not a literal proof.

But 2bh all proofs are just conventions so which convention should I choose?

So why people do not do this? Are they stupid or something?

If you were omnipotent all-knowing wouldn't you like that they worship only you?

But they say He loves you and He is a source of all good things so He wants you to direct your all life to Him for your own good.

Omnipotent but He did not make you to do. You are free to go away.

Thanks. That's my main concern though. I'm reaching abrahamic levels here , which is to say, is do anything (not that I am notable or see myself as equivalent)

What if an AI is reading all this and it will convert or learn how to convert people?

>God commands X
how the hell can you miss the ENTIRE FREAKING POINT OF THE BOOK OF JOB???
it was that it was NOT God who did bad things, even if Job thought so, but the devil.
Literally 180° of Misunderstanding the point of the whole book.

Just trying to do things right user.

youtube.com/watch?v=kZKuixGmiMw

Job receives the key that unlocks the ultimate red pill. Where were you, Job, when I laid the foundation of the world?

There is also enlightened self-interest. That is, long-term selfishness. Sacrificing your immediate wants / needs for the greater good, that improves your situation, even if it also improves the situation of others. Enlightened self interest is the basis of civilization, law, taxes, collective armies, roads, sewers, etc etc etc. It's not 'unselfish' to not pay taxes for these things, in fact it is the cost of civilization. The 'selfish' ones who opt out of such things are low-iq greedy and stupid, pleasing their immediate interests at the cost of the long-term well being of their self, their progeny, and their familial phenotypes.

tldr NIGGER-DOM

enlightened self-interest
Altruism is selfishness
Charity is selfishness
its just more long-term
not instant gratification

Scripture describes Job as blameless. This dude was so impeccable, that God is the one who's brought him up to Satan. The point of the story is that God took his most legit follower in that tume and allowed Satan to destroy everything he had, save his life, on a dare.

When Job wanted to know why, God basically said, "I'm God, you're not even close to being on the level that would give you the right to even ask that."

So yeah, God can do what he wants. And none of us could do anything about it. Christians try so hard to paint God as nothing but good. But God is more like an un-knowable force of nature that defines what good is. People who believe need to come to terms with the fact that God probably has done things they won't agree with. They also need to understand that there isn't shit they can do about it.

this so much

also embarrassing that it has to be even explained

Job is the archetype to prove that man cannot be righteous.

That even a perfect and upright man is in need of salvation and a savior.

Job thought he could be 'saved by his works' but when confronted by god this perfect and upright man repented in dust and ash.

You see when everything was taken in chapter one he wisely says "the lord giveth and the lord taketh away, blessed be the name of the lord"

But when Satan afflicts him he cries against the injustice of god. "Good men suffer and go to an early grave while the wicked prosper live a long life and die surrounded by their progeny"

He charges god with folly, proclaims his own righteousness (and his ability thereby to save himself without god), in the end after seeing 'god' he 'abhors himself and repents in dust and ash'

Job is the prototypical savior, he was nearly a perfect being who fell short of perfection. I guess the difference is that Christ said "thy will be done" whereas job proclaimed his innocence and demanded ease.

>falling for this misdirection
the passages literally tell you god did it, not satan

>He charges god with folly, proclaims his own righteousness (and his ability thereby to save himself without god), in the end after seeing 'god' he 'abhors himself and repents in dust and ash'
hes absolutely right to do so, and thats why they made this story, to destroy dissent against people who would realize their god is not all loving but a psychopath

Who cares? He was a Jew. He deserved to be killed.

'Every knee shall bow and every tongue confess.'

>That time when God fucked with a guy for his entire life just to prove a point to the devil

jesus christ im sick of retarded edgy cunts 'round here. predictable and not at all funny.

Because yahweh is a Jewish god, his has all of the Jewish neuroses.

Half of the Bible is Yahweh or Jesus saying "please respond." Then if you don't, he goes Elliot Rodger on you. One of the most beta gods of all time. Actually, the second coming of Jesus is basically the beta uprising, where he comes back and leads a bunch of nerdy Jews against Chad and Stacy.

And every fag shall burn

>If you were omnipotent all-knowing wouldn't you like that they worship only you?
No, you Jewish beta retard.

Go complain to your rabbi then. Or maybe the ADL. Nobody here cares about your feelings, Jew

...

Putting an idea above my family is where I have to get off the God train.

This thinking is where Christianity turns cucky.

Actually Job was a man from Ur, who existed before the Kingdoms of Israel were even a concept in the minds of the people. At the time, there was no Judaism, ancient or otherwise. To call him a Jew would not only be incorrect, but also lead to a lot of very wrong implications throughout the rest of the Bible.

Why don't you love the Jewish tribal god yahweh and his son, Rabbi Yeshua bar Yosef, more than your family goyim?

Doesn't really matter. He was some kind of sandnigger. And he never existed anyway, since the Bible is Jewish fairy tale.

you're a true retard

It is Job's fault for being too successful. If he had been the 2nd most faithful man, God and Satan would have bet on someone else.

god has a left hand and a right hand