How do we reverse the destruction of nature? Say what you will about the Indians...

How do we reverse the destruction of nature? Say what you will about the Indians, but they had a land ethic greatly superior to our own.

Other urls found in this thread:

livescience.com/7725-lost-forests-america.html
saveamericasforests.org/pages/educationrtfacts.htm
ran.org/how_much_old_growth_forest_remains_in_the_us
news.mongabay.com/2014/09/canada-russia-brazil-lead-world-in-old-growth-forest-loss/
senseable.mit.edu/treepedia/cities/los angeles
americanforests.org/magazine/article/north-american-forests-in-the-age-of-man/
blogs.scientificamerican.com/cross-check/thanksgiving-guilt-trip-how-warlike-were-native-americans-before-europeans-showed-up/
youtube.com/watch?v=zfFL4kgkD60
twitter.com/SFWRedditGifs

Plant more Indians in the ground.

bullshit map

could we borrow a cup, I think we used up all of ours.

Ever wonder why forests feel cool but not awe-inspiring jaw-dropping jizz-instigating magic? That's because 99% of the forests around you are paper mill plants and not real old-growth forests of 5000+ year history.

Natives clear cut so many forests it started a mini ice age.

>trying to deny it

This.

>livescience.com/7725-lost-forests-america.html
>saveamericasforests.org/pages/educationrtfacts.htm
>ran.org/how_much_old_growth_forest_remains_in_the_us
>news.mongabay.com/2014/09/canada-russia-brazil-lead-world-in-old-growth-forest-loss/

This map is complete and utter bullshit. Most of the Southeast, east coast is completely covered in massive fucking forests. California is literally half forests. The US has one of the highest tree planting and greenery than any country on Earth. We literally make deserts green. Every city in the US has a massive program for greenery, it's mind blowing. We literally line every street with fucking trees.

senseable.mit.edu/treepedia/cities/los angeles

>cause numerous megafauna to go extinct
>good land ethic

That map is referring to OLD GROWTH, not general forest cover. There is barely any left in North America in general.

Old growth forest, user. Also, lol at thinking planting random trees in cities does anything. It's just a way for modern people to feel good about themselves for "being green."

What they did is nowhere near what took place after the Industrial Revolution.

>americanforests.org/magazine/article/north-american-forests-in-the-age-of-man/

The only way to protect Old Growth and the Ents is to enact the whte ethnostate. Whites are the only ones who care about this shit.

We are actually doing pretty good all things considered.

The native land ethic was two fold:

1. Massacre enemies, occupy their land, rape their women.

2. Kill all animals in sight until your tribe is near starvation, then go back to step 1.

If you want old growth then buy land and protect it. No one else gives a shit.

SAGE

What the fuck is "old growth"? You ever driven outside the city limits. There are thousands of miles of "growth" out there.

"Old-growth forests are natural forests that have developed over a long period of time, generally at least 120 years (DNR definition and consistent with definitions for the eastern United States), without experiencing severe, stand-replacing disturbance—a fire, windstorm, or logging."

there is more old growth than that. not a lot, mind you, but certainly more than is shown on the map, especially in coastal areas.

t.oregonfag

>What the fuck is "old growth"?
Environmentalists buzzword to try to make you feel bad for existing.

>How do we reverse the destruction of nature.

Eliminate population growth.

Its really that simple.

But the Capitalist system won't allow it until we've reached the carrying capacity of our technological and ecological limits. And then we fucking ravage the planet as the population comes crashing down.

On a lighter note.

How do you reverse the destruction of old growth forests?

>Wait 100 years lmao.

this implies that old growth is good

>they had a land ethic greatly superior to our own
No they didn't you civic cunt. They didn't impact it because they never developed because they're fucking savages. And it turns out they did impact by slash and burn tactics.

THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS THE NOBLE SAVAGE

Nobody is saying they dindu, but they didn't impact the land like modern man has.

>They didn't impact it because they never developed because they're fucking savages.

Only a pleb in [current year] could assume that was the only reason. The Greeks knew about steam power but never gave a rat's ass about using science to advance tech and economics, because they thought it was unworthy. They thought there were higher things to concern yourself with. Look what the obsession with these things has done to this nation and Europe.

Yes, this is the price of civilization, get over it fag

The Greeks never turned this into a practical engine because they needed the next two thousand years of metallurgical advancements in order for such a thing to become remotely practical, not because of the motives that you made up in your head and ascribed to them.

Old growth forests don't burn as harsh and the tree's bark is so thick that only very few die from fire. Logging the old growth out and preventing the brush and the young shit from burning is the cause of unnatural super hot fires. The fires get so hot near me that DNR had to spray seed around because the fire cooked the fireproof seeds in hundred acres at a time.

Plus old growth looks cool and shit.

>purely materialist conception of history

Pleb. Nobody made these motives up, it's a fact. The Greeks were patricians, unlike modern beta bois arguing over tax policy 24/7.

>americanforests.org/magazine/article/north-american-forests-in-the-age-of-man/
as that article points out, there's a huge ambiguity of what's considered 'old growth'. It's somewhat arbitrary. Do you take it from pre-Columbus or pre-Clovis?

As an aside, I like how in the The Walking Dead it show the trees gradually taking over. I nkow that in the unlikely scenario of a mas human extinction in the eastern seaboard of the USA, the forest compostion would be hugely 'un-natural' and influenced by previous human activitie such as introduction of exotic species, but gradually ecosytems would emerge that would mirror those of pre-human settlement.

>I-IT'S NOT OLD IT DOESN'T COUNT
>I ONLY CARE IF IT'S FIVE GORILLION YEARS OLD

Any kind of engine requires amazingly skilled craftsmanship. We didn't have motors up until 200 years ago because engines require molding and geometrically perfect shapes. For example the motor cant hold compression if the piston and cylinder aren't perfectly bored and polished.

>they had a land ethic
Shitskins of all races never had any sort of "land ethic", not 1000 years ago and certainly not today. The only difference is that back then they didn't have the technological means or population size to be environmentally harmful in any meaningful ways; today they do.

Old growth cedar and and Douglas Fir can be thousands of years old.

It's too late, baby, now it's too late.

...

Of course, but my main point is that the Greeks never pursued tech the way that people today do. They concerned themselves with greater things.

>destruction
It’s growing back just fine, leave the city some time.

though we really did try to make it
something inside has died and I just can't hide and I just can't fake it

>They concerned themselves with greater things
>implying there are things greater than muh GDP growth, muh inflation, and muh unemployment rate
seriously, wtf dude

They also didn't live in a laissez-faire market and were basically everybody relies on technology to survive. Being a craftsman or an academic was a luxury.

old growth forests regrow and become old growth with age. Most of the newer growth forests in the west are in national and state parks and no longer forested....give it some time it will be back.

OP's image is false, there are more trees in america now than 100 years ago due to investors planting godamn forests because people cut down so many trees.

Thanks, free market

Burn it

Old growth forests take hundreds of years to grow back. I don't see the logging companies not touching that. Although it would be great. I live on the WA-ID border and we get smoked out every year due to the logging of old growth and then preserving the young growth. The woods get so thick and clogged with shit that seeds burn up in the fire and then we have to reseed thousands of acres of land.

You have to accept that you can't keep what we've got now.

If you can say goodbye to your modern life, you can undo a great many sins.

>New trees
>Old growth
Cmon its not that hard

Let's just accept the fact that as white men nature is our bitch. All we have to decide is how to manage our bitch. Do we want old, virgin forest, or young, sexy, slut forest?

I really, really like this analogy.

nut-up or shut-up Castro, everything dies. Maybe if there were fewer LIMPs there would be more room for trees

We didn't worship it to the point of letting undergrowth build unchecked, in the Eastern Woodlands, unlike whites. Annual burning of vast forests is good for it.

And we peemacultured (long before that term was coined) so much of it that early English settlers waxed poetic about how park-like the eastern woodland was.

When you get everything from a forest, forests are valuable. And so you learn to manage a forest.

White hippies,OTOH, worship the forests and mismanage them in search of some mythical "pristine" state.

Anglos are an invasive species of pest animals.

Lol but we whites were the ones that mostly cut all that shit down during the industrial revolution before DESIGNATED CUTTING FARMS

I should have said misleading, but who really gives a shit? Per-acre young trees will produce more oxygen anyways and tree oxygen production is negligible anyways. Th e only real concern would be running out of wood and we have that covered.

Much Mopar!!!

Everything you said is both true and a non sequitur. Your internal combustion engine isn't comparable to a rudimentary modern steam engine, much less Heron's engine. Hell, I built a working steam engine at age 8. Let me tell you, tight tolerances and perfect mating of surfaces was way outside of my wheelhouse back then.

>motor
>engine
>motor
>engine

How we know you're an ignorant faggot.

Young growth burns like pine needles or tall grass in the dry season. It also burns extremely hot.

Can someone explain the cup meme? I've been gone for about a week. Death in the famalam, couldn't really browse /pol in the hospital, wifi had it blocked.

What trees live 5000 years?

Sigh...who GAF about old growth? We have douvle the trees now than then. Old growth trees utilize very little CO2 due to age and hardening of the veins. New trees are far better for the environment.

mmhmm yeh, gimme that hot young forest baby! burn baby burn!

We're already reversing the trend. It's gonna take a long time to gain in old growth acreage. But the amount of forest in the US was increasing until EU "green" regulations increased demand for wood in the south

Yes i understand that a motor refers to an internal combustion engine and I used it in place for engine when I shouldn't have. That being said, the steam engine uses the same principle that an internal combustion engine uses. High pressure pushes a piston and drives the crankshaft.

I find this hard to believe. Our old growths have diminished, it's true, but that picture shows Washington as completely bare when most of the Olympic Peninsula is old growth forest

There are more trees in the U.S. today than when Columbus arrived faggot

More sarcasm pls. Also you didn't make a homemade steam engine unless you bought a kit or machined the parts.

can you even read the thread you faggot?
>OLD
>GROWTH

I used to feel this way, until I spent some time backpacking through the Hoh rainforest in western Washington. There's so little of it left. The timber and paper industries are fine to use new growth for their livelihood. Save the old trees. It really is worth it.

...

>backpacking
how do i get into this desu

Young growth = fire hazard

>Land ethic
When will the noble savage meme end? They were sure willing to sacrifice land for guns and horses.

you want to go

Where do you live? Buy a large hiking pack and find a trail. I would do long day hiking trips first though so you understand what you're getting into.

It's called "resource management", and it's what civilized and intelligent peoples do.

Find someone to go with at first. If you're not /fit, get into hiking shape by hiking. To backpack you're going to be carrying a tent, water, and food and crapping in a hole you dug. Also you need bear bags that seal up airtight so they can't smell it, and you hang your food from a tree at night (great for getting weed through the airport as well, but you didn't hear that from me). Anyway, basically just find some people who are doing it, and have done it before, and go with them. If you have to do it alone, do something easy first. I won't go into all the stuff you need, you can look it up. Water filter, food, and headlamp are all key.

i live on the cumberland plateau in tennessee
thanks

Redwoods can. The old cedar grove near me has 2000 yr old trees

The Indians also genocided each other at every opportunity.

But I do agree we need to protect nature areas.

>The Indians also genocided each other at every opportunity.

Entirely false.

Yeah, because we know all about which forests were burnt down, knocked over, or otherwise destroyed in the 1620's PNW. Bullshit map is a bullshit map and at the very least suffers from an inconsistent application of the definition of "old growth."

Vikings raped and pillaged Christian communities in history.

It all makes sense now.

Thanks OP!

Actually we do know what is old growth and what is not. You can visbly tell when you find an old patch too. A popular attraction for hikers in Idaho is old growth Cedar groves. They're all mapped out and I've been to a few. The trees can be thousands of years old and 20ft in diameter at the base. They are pretty impressive. Also everything that isn't labeled as a wilderness area on the map has been thoroughly mapped by cartographers ecologically and geographically.

Seattle used to be home to giant Sequoias (redwood) just like the ones seen in California. They were all cut down.

That's called "progress", niggers

>Old growth forest, user.
The map's still bullshit.

that moment you realise than human already chopped the trees on the entire globe at least one time in history. just think about it. we are such an inspirational race.

>tfw you read it and realize it's completely correct but most people will never wake up to that fact and it will just keep getting worse and worse

I keep telling everyone Idaho is underrated for camping.

By revolting against the technoindustrial system

Also this is now a Ted Thread
Deal with it, technophiles.

Entirely true.
blogs.scientificamerican.com/cross-check/thanksgiving-guilt-trip-how-warlike-were-native-americans-before-europeans-showed-up/

There's much more evidence that they regularly tried to wipe out neighboring tribes for control of the land.

>Idaho
Beaners, trailer park degenerates, refugees, and mormons

>tfw old people ruined everything magical and wonderous in the world before you were even born. Then the boomers finished it off by fucking up the housing market.

We kind of did a bad job of managing it if we must used absolutely all of it in like 400 years

nigga buy a backpack and walk out your door

Each nation had a different approach they didn't have the same approach. The Mayans were avid farmers who used slash and burn liberally while the Aztecs and Incas were very strict with responsible farming coinciding with strict environmental law. But likewise I agree it is a shame with all the destruction of beautiful forest.

thats what you think, bucko

ya, it had nothing to do with Maunder minimum, fucking leaf

"land ethic"
That's not a thing.

They literally burned everything. When smallpox killed them all the excess carbon caused the temperature to drop.

who cares
the indians didn't have "land ethic", they were just too stupid to understand how to use the land to suit their needs, aside from forcing buffalo off cliffs at near-extinction levels

CO2 is a vicious beast, look it even changed rotation of Venus and ate a stripe on Jupiter. You don't mess with suck dark powah:
youtube.com/watch?v=zfFL4kgkD60