Who are freemasons and why are they regarded to Christians as heretics?

Title

Just would like some information from a "reliable source" Im not exactly sure myself

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en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacques_de_Molay
youtube.com/watch?v=s9nrTNTfAlc
youtube.com/watch?v=NiRdKqH-zJ0
youtube.com/watch?v=vdY5BcsFzy4
youtube.com/user/PromienieNet/playlists?shelf_id=3&view=50&sort=dd
youtube.com/watch?v=L777RhL_Fz4
youtube.com/watch?v=vBFuEo0Jzd8
youtube.com/watch?v=PGueIrB6htg),
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wanna swear an oath of loyalty to some shit when you don't even know what it is?

They say that about freemasons because they believe jesus was just an ascended master over what Christians believe is that he is the only sun of god. In the end, they all worship Saturn.

Some say they worship gold. I'm not sure what to believe.

They are the most condemned sect in the Catholic Church's history.
And if I'm not mistaken, Catholics are the only Christians not allowed to join.
This.
No Christian worth his salt would ever take an oath to have their throat slit for telling their secrets.

It's literally a fedora tipping cult of people, that rely on financial support from one another. Role-playing and 'brotherhood' are also a part of their existence.

Masonry is religious indifferentism. Basically, that all religions can lead to God.
A Muslim can become a Mason as easily as someone who believes in Jesus as God or as easily as a theological Satanist. The only (external facing) requirement is that one believes in a supreme deity.
Practically speaking, most Masons I know are Deists, Agnostics, or Atheists.

Because the Vatican mistakenly saw them as a rival, and you should know how fear based the Catholics are.

>Masonry is religious indifferentism. Basically, that all religions can lead to God.
Nope. It doesn't discuss religion at all.
>Practically speaking, most Masons I know are Deists, Agnostics, or Atheists.
Then they aren't legit Masons. Probably LDH or something.

>Catholics are the only Christians not allowed to join.
They can. But then the church can legally excommunicate them, if they want to go to that trouble (they don't).

The square and compass looks like an animal trap.

All goes back to templars hiding money from the catholic church and being persecuted for it

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacques_de_Molay

Nowadays "International DeMolay" is the youth feeder into masonry and Jacques de Molay is viewed as a martyr who died by horrific torture without revealing secrets.

>Nope. It doesn't discuss religion at all.
Their philosophy abounds with religious indifferentism.
>Then they aren't legit Masons. Probably LDH or something
Shriners and 32nd degree Scot rite.
>They can. But then the church can legally excommunicate them, if they want to go to that trouble (they don't).
I wasn't talking in terms of personal ability to join. A *good* Catholic doesn't work with or join organizations are historically an enemy.

That's not even remotely what happened with the Templars. The King of France wanted to rob them because he was indebted to them thanks to his shitty financial and political decisions. Then they buggered off to Portugal where they still exist.

>Their philosophy abounds with religious indifferentism.
False. It's just philosophy.
>Shriners and 32nd degree Scot rite.
First of all, those aren't Masonry, but either way, they couldn't be atheist or agnostic if they were in legit Masonry. But yes, fake ones like LDH have their own versions of the appendant degrees.
>A *good* Catholic doesn't work with or join organizations are historically an enemy.
That's probably true. So there's no concern with them joining Masonry, since it has never, at any point, been an enemy of ANY church.

Research the following:
Hiram Abiff
Isis and osiris
The light of illumination
The eastern star
Man as god
Occult rituals
Initiation rites

Anyone is allowed to join as long as they acknowledge the existence of god. It is not particular to any specific sect and even deists could join.

A lot of the ritual is based on the the eastern sun/western sun etc.. but "sun" and "son" are arguably misrepresented in the bible to begin with.

nothing about saturn.

only oaths i had to take were basic shit like "be a good person in the community"

basically boyscouts tier

Are you that Aussie that always starts these threads then gets upset when people point out they are propagators of indifferentism and secularism?
>First of all, those aren't Masonry
Right, they're members of the local My Little Pony Club. Not Masons at all.
>That's probably true. So there's no concern with them joining Masonry, since it has never, at any point, been an enemy of ANY church.
Now you're just ignorant of history.
Such as in 1917 when the Masons were brandishing standards of Bruno Giordano and images of Lucifer standing with his foot on St. Michael the Archangel's head, protesting in St. Peter's Square hollering "Satan will rule on Vatican Hill and the pope will be his lackey."
No, Masons were neevveerrr enemies of the Church. That's all just mythical nonsense, anons, go back to sleep.

Don't believe it. When I was in philippines the compass g symbol was all over the Catholic cemeteries

the brotherhood is extremely loose and most lodges have no/little contact with each other

more of a fraternity than a cult and they do a lot of good for their communities between hanging out and drinking beer/playing golf

In South America there is also a huge infiltration of Masonry in Catholic circles; there is also a big infiltration of Masonry in Knights of Columbus here in the US.
Which is why I left the KofC.

You arent a real mason, you are in one of the front groups that basically exists as public relations.

Mystery Babylon

Never started a thread on Sup Forums. And i wouldn't get upset by lies.
>Not Masons at all.
That's right. They're people pretending to be Masons.
>Now you're just ignorant of history.
Nope. You're just ignorant of motivation and organisations.
>Such as in 1917
Was that a bunch of Masons, sanctioned by their Grand Lodge in accordance with the UGLE doing a Masonic activity? Or was it a bunch of dudes who were pissed with Rome and happened to also be part of a group Rome told them not to be part of?

sounds like a false flag from catholic fags that wanted to demonize any organization that distracted you from putting your money in the collection plate of their church

Play Ultima 7 and you'll know what they are about.

>thousands of people perform generic rituals about being a decent person, hard working, strong family, good to your community
>but secretly they are super evil and dont even know it

if you want to know what goes on at your local lodge stop being a fucking autist, talk to one of them and you can go see for yourself

desu you made a mistake leaving KofC. there's a lot of cross contamination, sure, but it's mainly old veterans feeling nostalgic for their childhoods. no one socializes anymore, so they join all the fraternal groups they can to reconnect to others

you aren't representing what the societies were founded on, but it's legitimately a nice time to bond with men in the area. of course, this is only if you're from a smaller town. i love being home to hang out with the guys from my KofC chapter. they talk about the war, shit they've been doing, and we usually just spend time fundraising for local stuff. it's like a male girl scouts. (boy scouts actually have physical activities) i would never join the manhattan chapters for example.

Read a book nigger.
>Secret societies of America's elite.
Lazy fag.

Shriners are Masons. That's just a fact. Saying they aren't would be as stupid as me saying the Shia aren't Muslim. Or the Rotary club isn't associated with Masonry.
It was sanctioned by the Grand Lodge; the same lodge that raised funds to build the statue of Giordano Bruno in Rome.

>Shriners are Masons.
For the most part. But it isn't itself Masonry. And they're actually proceeding towards taking away the requirement to be a Master Mason to join, so anyone will be able to, like how it is in Arkansas.
>Or the Rotary club isn't associated with Masonry.
Well, it isn't. Same with Lions, Elks, Buffaloes, Kiwanis, Columbus, etc.
>It was sanctioned by the Grand Lodge
Source? Violating their obligations to fuel a riot is very different than putting forward money for a well earned statue. Much like in DC, though it's soon to be torn down by the liberals.

They are some good guys; true. Yet, the Catholicism they profess is something different than what was always professed.
Girl altar boys; extraordinary ministers of Holy Communion; Communion in the hand; etc, etc.
I most certainly do not want to take part in their Corporate Masses where the altar is crowded by women pretending to be priestesses in their distribution of Holy Communion.
Other than that, they are good guys, even if some of them don't see the problem with also being a Mason.

"know yourself" is a pretty good indication of the heresy they serve
as is the life of aleister crowley
I think the lower degrees have a completely different worldview revealed to them though

They are ecumenists. "Religious freedom" began in masonry. So did constitutionalism.

>Communion in the hand
Never understood the objection to that. Feels more personal that way. After all, the the Disciples at the Last Supper weren't waiting there like baby birds.

>"know yourself" is a pretty good indication of the heresy they serve
Do explain how that's supposed to be heresy.

Would you rather prefer the current trend? Where Catholics are forced to import filipino priests because no one else wants to be a permavirgin or if they do they just diddle kids

It's not that they're heretics. It's their esteem and potential worship of Lucifer. If I'm not mistaken, they do not equate Lucifer with the devil & in fact, deny that the devil even exists.
I had a few go-rounds with my late FIL over this. He was Scottish Rite.

I don't have a source with me. We have the writings of Benedict XV speaking about the politics of the day, how Masons were attempting to whip up a revolution to expel the pontiff. It was also in the local paper during that time as it was reported on and pictures taken.
Since I'm not at home, I don't have access to my library.
The abuse scandal derives from Bishops allowing homosexuals into the priesthood, which is in disobedience to the Vatican. Such as in the John Jay College report of 2012 to the USCCB, 81% of all abuses were homosexual in nature.
Of all the abuses, around 60% were perpetrated by laity, not priests.

An astute observation, user. Classic double bind.

Not actually discussed. That would be the realm of religion.
>they do not equate Lucifer with the devil
You ought to read the Bible.

>We have the writings of Benedict XV
But not an official source? Because the propaganda of the opposition is rarely accurate.
>The abuse scandal derives from Bishops allowing homosexuals into the priesthood
Were they gay to begin with, or did the forced celibacy make monsters out of men?

it is like having a "young boys only" sleepover and the only parents there are fags

i will stick to my more secular views of the world. enjoy your kiddy diddling and sending your money to a pope that just gives it to muslim illegal immigrants

They were gay to begin with. Celibate vows doesn't make one gay; otherwise why would Christ Himself promote celibacy?
>"For there are eunuchs, who were born so from their mother's womb: and there are eunuchs, who were made so by men: and there are eunuchs, who have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven. He that can take, let him take it."
>[Matthew 19:12]

You really don't know how it works, do you. Besides, according to insurance payouts in the US, secular institutions are 8 times worse off than Catholic & Protestant abuse combined. Enjoy your secularism.

>mistakenly saw them as a rival
>mistakenly

What do the three assassins who killed Hiram Abiff represent?

Since you're sworn to lie, I'll spill the beans.

The state, the church, and the mob. Those are the three enemies of the perfected man and the (((great work))). Judeo-masonic infiltration and subversion has been chipping away at any religion (save secular humanism) for centuries.

There is a catholic version of the masons though

>All goes back to templars


It goes back before even recorded history... or so Masonic scholars claim. Templars are just the first group to bring this ancient mystery religion to the west. The Jews had already codified it in their Talmud in their days in Egypt. It's the same religion, symbols, and goals.

Read Manly P. Hal, or Mackay, or Pike. Their (((secrets))) are there for anyone who wishes to see.

>They were gay to begin with.
Source on that?
>Celibate vows doesn't make one gay;
No, but a vow of celibacy doesn't make make a man no longer a man. They're still going to have needs like any other human, and it's pretty rare for desperate men to not abuse their positions.
>otherwise why would Christ Himself promote celibacy?
That doesn't read like a promotion of celibacy, but of castration. I mean, that would certainly be one solution to the problem...
Besides, that passage is about divorce.

>What do the three assassins who killed Hiram Abiff represent?
Unworthiness spoiling things for the worthy. In the US, they have added to it, by giving them names and changing the strikes. So they mean ill thought, ill speech, and misinformation.
>Since you're sworn to lie
Source?
>The state, the church, and the mob.
On that too. Because that's pretty anti-Masonic.

Yea, Knights of Columbus. They do good work, and i'd recommend them over Lions or Rotary. But ultimately, they're just a poor man's version of Masonry, for those who want to wear a sword. You're not going to get the good stuff of the Craft, or the good charity stuff of Lions.

check out conspiracy theories involving Albert Pike and his "Morals and Dogmas". It`s the best advice. In short it tells how every degree under 33 is just a joke and how Lucifer is God. Heresy at it`s finest ! Read the Bible to understand Jesus` message and don`t believe the stupid alchemy or gnosticism bullcrap. There are plenty of videos about Morals and Dogmas on youtube.

links:

youtube.com/watch?v=s9nrTNTfAlc

youtube.com/watch?v=NiRdKqH-zJ0

youtube.com/watch?v=vdY5BcsFzy4

U have a long way ahead of you. Stay strong!

In short:
Freemasonry practices Luciferianism. Lucifer represents not only deception and the wickedness of sin but also the ambition for the accumulation of "sacred" knowledge. They also view Lucifer as a guiding spirit for giving humanity knowledge (see: The Forbidden Fruit).

They're heretics because they literally oppose the church or the spoken word of our lord and savior, Jesus Christ. Christ gave his life for us as a testament to his love.

random guy with text written beside his face.jpg

THNX BRO REALLY DEEP. NO WAY THIS COULD BE FAKE

You're too far gone already, aren't you?

>Pic
Look at the source on it. It's bogus.
>or so Masonic scholars claim.
They really don't. Everyone accepts that Anderson was a bullshit artist.

How so?

Was once a great institution back in the day,then lost all its initiation abilities, then was revived in the 1850's, then lost all its power once again when Kikes completely infiltrated it and made it a tool for zionism.

You can learn a lot about history and eroticism. by reading much of their literature, just don't trust them now.

youtube.com/user/PromienieNet/playlists?shelf_id=3&view=50&sort=dd

Manly P Hall was perhaps the wisest man of the 20th century; A mystic first and a mason second. In several of his lectures he mentions that Judaism is essentially worship of the Demiurge (material) and that we lost our ability to defend ourselves when the Church failed as an institution and the Reformation happened (though being a mystic he was starkly against the Catholic Church anyway).

This.

TLDR: masons are secular and bible thumpers think anyone that doesn't read the book the same way as them are LITERALLY the devil

Download the book as pdf. Use search button to find specific passage. Stop shilling.

youtube.com/watch?v=L777RhL_Fz4

You know the book is an anti-Masonic magazine, right? Nothing in it is actually from Masonry.

>secular
*Non-sectarian.

...

Its very doubtful that more than 2% of the people criticizing Morals and Dogma or any of Pike's or Hall's writings have actually read them or if they have, understood them.
Masonic philosophers and the philosophies themselves are acknowledged as personal individual thoughts and are presented more for the purpose of questioning and consideration. None of these things without citation are presented as actual fact, but consideration of possibilities. To be a Mason is to constantly question and learn.

This is completely incorrect and hilarious. We open the bible and pray every visit. Most men in are Christian or Catholic.

Look at me i use logic to determine what is good and bad, unlike those Christians who use the Bible. Ugh.

Is this satire?

Well, you clearly already know what I'm talking about
I don't think what you think to be true is true though, based on what I've seen in my life

Jesus was a carpenter, not a faggy architect

>Well, you clearly already know what I'm talking about
If i did, i wouldn't need to ask.

same question... its like he is admitting he is a fucking retard no better than those in the middle east that flay themselves based on ancient thousand-year-old mistranslations devoid of logic

Morals and Dogmas has been a must read by the masons at the time. There is also Aleister Crowley, Manly P Hall and many others that say the same stuff. What now, show me how one or two masons don`t agree with that or there is something more to that idea? Duuude, they are not supposed to tell you what is happening inside the lodge. Dammit why is it so hard to understand that these are the elites and the rulers that Jesus talked about in the New Testament as worshipers of fallen angels?

youtube.com/watch?v=vBFuEo0Jzd8

Nah, i don`t buy that. They lie dude. Do more research.

satire. There is no truth in mystery schools.

>Morals and Dogmas has been a must read by the masons at the time.
It's been recommended for members of the A&AR (not Freemasonry) in the southern jurisdiction of the USA. Just because it's a good commentary on those degrees as used to be practiced there.
> There is also Aleister Crowley,
Not a Mason, and kind of a shitty occultist. Let his own branding get in the way of his philosophy.
>Manly P Hall
Not a Mason at the time he wrote. Bit fantastical for some.
> Duuude, they are not supposed to tell you what is happening inside the lodge.
Why not? We even have tv shows produced by UGLE explaining stuff like that now.
>Dammit why is it so hard to understand that these are the elites and the rulers that Jesus talked about in the New Testament as worshipers of fallen angels?
Because it isn't, and doesn't really match up, even though you want it to?

they are one of the secret societies making yp the illuminati. the others include the vril, scientologists and ,overwhelmingly, JEWS

Been a Mason for 10 years now. Haven only managed to get halfway through the 40 pound book that is M&D. I don't know many Masons that have managed to find their way through the whole thing. It's ridiculous in size and not a very easy read even if it were smaller. There were many Masonic philosophers as philosophy and science are very highly regarded in Masonry. The only universal truths that are acknowledged in every regular lodge are that there is one God and that bettering yourself as a man will lead to a better society. Everything else is readily questioned. It's very easy to pick through a tome as big and complex as Morals and Dogma and grab what appears on the surface to be nasty things, anti-Masonic movements have been doing it forever. It wasn't written to be a book of eternal truths. It is philosophy. Plain and simple. It doesn't mean there aren't some people that subscribe to that philosophy, but that's a personal decision, not an institutional one. The same nonsensical arguments have been made for centuries and are the source for most of what that guy is talking about, that and a vivid imagination.

>To be a Mason is to constantly question and learn.
kek
>boomer masons
>questioning their kike masters
shit is empty and shallow as fuck these days. you want the real secret society? it's called old Sup Forums / current Sup Forums

Try reading Bridge to Light and Clausen's Commentaries on M&D first. Helps get you through that victim of comma abuse. The latter even has pictures.

>boomer masons
Yea, they're dying off at least. But by golly they're putting up a fight to keep ruining shit.

you guys really have been shilling the crap out of the free masons

>It's been recommended for members of the A&AR (not Freemasonry) in the southern jurisdiction of the USA. Just because it's a good commentary on those degrees as used to be practiced there.
Why would you recommend a "magazine" that promotes that Jesus is the devil (Lucifer). Yeah give it a more deep meaning. I fucked your mother. But it`s not that i actually mean i fuck your mother. See where i am getting. The New Testament said that these types of lies fool people astray.

>Not a Mason, and kind of a shitty occultist. Let his own branding get in the way of his philosophy
pic related

>Not a Mason at the time he wrote. Bit fantastical for some.
yeah, sure........

>Why not? We even have tv shows produced by UGLE explaining stuff like that now.
I am sorry did they ever said what they talk at meetings?

>Because it isn't, and doesn't really match up, even though you want it to?
Jesus stated in Revelation that the leaders of the world would lead astray the people.(tell me which group of people has a huge political power in this world?) If not the leaders then who are the people who promote satanism and the coming of antichrist?

>boomer masons
Not THAT old. Gen X at least but yeah still old.

>shit is empty and shallow as fuck these days. you want the real secret society? it's called old Sup Forums / current Sup Forums
Agreed on many counts. It's not a shadow of what it once was. May never be again. But the Lodges have vast libraries for those that still find interest in these things. The lodge is only where we meet. The rest is on us to build individually. No joke, old Sup Forums and Sup Forums really is a similar mindset to what brought me into Masonry in the first place. Free thought and the ability to question are vital tools in bettering ourselves and the world as a whole.

>Why would you recommend a "magazine" that promotes that Jesus is the devil (Lucifer).
I wouldn't? Nor would the Scottish Rite anywhere.
>pic related
Might want to read those articles. He joined a fake lodge in France, and a fake SC in Mexico. Then he tried to go to a real meeting, but threw a tantrum when they wouldn't let him in because he wasn't a Mason.
>yeah, sure........
Have you read it? It's decent stuff, but he was clearly on something at the time of writing. Or i'm just used to more down to earth esotercism.
>I am sorry did they ever said what they talk at meetings?
Yes. That's most of the show. Four episodes of it. Called "Inside the Freemasons" produced by Sky1. You can find it all online.
>(tell me which group of people has a huge political power in this world?)
Bankers comes to mind first of all. But really any large corporation, or advertising body.
>If not the leaders then who are the people who promote satanism and the coming of antichrist?
As evil as those leaders are, they don't really do that. Might be bad for business.

There is a God. The famous argument. I believe in A God and not The God because there is more than one religion in the world. Remind me, what are the first two commandments out of ten that God gave to the hebrews through Moses? Are they : "1.I am the Lord thy God, 2 Thou shalt have no other gods before me" ? Masonry is NOT promoting Christian values. Period.

So basically believing in egyptian mysticism, entering in elite groups of people (btw: youtube.com/watch?v=PGueIrB6htg), having a master that stands to the east and is portrayed as the dawn (rev 9:11 Apollyon), believing that there is more to saying there is only one God (first 2 commandments) will make me somehow more faithful twoard Jesus? It`s a yes or no.

>gnostic-ish rich families primarily in france masquerade as templars to extract relics and knowledge during the crusades
>return with a bunch of ancient jewish, egyptian, mesopotamian myths and "lost knowledge".
>translates and deciphers said loot and suddenly thinks theyre hot shit
>goes full gnostic sperg mode and thinks this world is hell, we're all trapped by a blind/stupid god and that lucifer tried to awaken man to that fact among others
>believes they know the "word", which is the true name of god
>believes that they can astral travel and shit
>thinks theyre now a continuation of old mystery schools
>gets persecuted in france for said beliefs among other things
>gets BTFO and disintegrates
>remnants turns to construction just like their beloved patron Hiram Abiff
>reorganizes as freemasons, most of which are deliberately kept out of "the know" of the most super duper secret knowledge.

Masonry isn't promoting ANY religious values. It's not a church. That is for the man to decide where his heart belongs. I don't recall God telling Moses that Jesus is God either. There was no Christianity before Jesus. Just because it doesn't promote Christianity doesn't mean it isn't dominated by it. The Boy scouts aren't a Christian organization either, does that mean they worship Satan?

good read

>I believe in A God and not The God
I think something is being lost in the translation here, because you're contradicting yourself.

>So basically believing in egyptian mysticism
Whut.
>entering in elite groups of people
Always good to be in good company.
>having a master that stands to the east and is portrayed as the dawn
Not really portrayed as the dawn, but i guess if you want Venusian symbolism, that's up to you. And "Worshipful Master" is just an old fashioned term for president, basically.
>believing that there is more to saying there is only one God
That's up to you.
> will make me somehow more faithful twoard Jesus? It`s a yes or no.
Yea, it might. Can you really call yourself faithful if you've never investigated your faith, or the world around you? If you haven't, you're not faithful, just lazy or scared.

Your average low degree answer. We are not religious, we are bunch of dudes who want to do business together and become better men. That`s all. Oh, the obelisks, the ancient egyptian mysticism, the sphinxes, the fact that we have to swear on the Bible when initiated? Nah, it`s all for gags.

>Oh, the obelisks, the ancient egyptian mysticism, the sphinxes
Source? Because apart from a few buildings having design choices, those things aren't really in Masonry at all.
>the fact that we have to swear on the Bible when initiated?
VSL of your choosing. Bible is default because it used to be exclusively Christian. Your religion is your own business. All that's asked is that you have one.

Never said it was all for gags. Thought is thought. It's contradictory to be so far against a marketplace of ideas while posting on one of the last available marketplaces for free ideas. You've convinced yourself of one side of the story while not doing the same due diligence for the other. Look up the word allegory for a start. There were gifted and blessed men in the world well before Christianity. Why shouldn't there be interest in their ideas as well? Are you advocating that we erase the thoughts of the world because a council of a church decided what should and shouldn't be included in the Bible? You are of course aware of Constantine aren't you?

Or just actually read the Bible. pic related
It`s ok to believe to say there is more than one God as well the opposite. It`s opinion. But the fact is that according to the Bible i am 100% right to say there is NO other God than The Father, The Son Jesus Christ and The Holy Spirit. Yeah i am faithful. I am not lazy, i learn about other religions but that doesn`t mean i have to believe in them. As for masonry, it`s anti biblical for the sole purpose it promotes egyptian symbolistic, the existence of a god (free of interpretation). Here is another antibiblical group gay rights, nazis, commies (antifa).

>it promotes egyptian symbolistic
again, look up "allegory"

Ur like those muslims that say not real islam.
Sphinx at the entrance and on the roof, Washington DC temple.

>It`s ok to believe to say there is more than one God
...Unless you're Christian, in which case monotheism is kinda the point.
> but that doesn`t mean i have to believe in them.
No one is asking you to?
> As for masonry, it`s anti biblical for the sole purpose it promotes egyptian symbolistic
First of all, no, it doesn't. Like anywhere in Craft Masonry. I doubt that would be anti-Biblical, anyway.
> the existence of a god (free of interpretation)
Yes and no. Any time mention of deity arises, you're putting your own views over the framework.

I specifically mentioned that a few buildings have Egyptian motifs. That one is actually Scottish Rite, not Craft Freemasonry. For which a better example would have been Petersham (but you'd still be wrong).

Constantine is a debunked argument. I`ll give links if u want. Fact is that the parts of the Bible that were taken out were because of the date in which they were written. What remained was in the time interval of a generation 50 years. Enough for a apostle to write it down. The other were 200 years after Jesus`s death and ascension to heaven.

You lack depth in your argument considering the fact that even Islam worships the same God we do. The muslim claim is that their religion is a continuation, not a different God. It isn't hard to find pagan religious remnants in Christian symbology. Read a book, find history. You can love or hate what you choose, but looking from inside a tunnel you only cheat yourself instead of strengthening your love of Christ.

Is that so? Look harder. Try the Book of Enoch for a start. It's even mentioned in Genesis.

Pure freemasonry is not a religion. It is more like a philosophy.

There are some christian addtions (scottish and york site and some local systems as swedish masonry), but it has nothing to do with religion, it only requires a member not to be atheist.

t.a freemason

So because we see it we don`t get it. U guys are better than magicians. Part of the problem is that you swear an oath on the Bible and have no faith in it. you don`t see boy scouts swearing on The Bible.

It`s a nice book but it is not mentioned as a book is mentioned as a character.

>So because we see it we don`t get it.
Not because, but it seems to work out that way. There are some lodges in Gothic style. Others in traditional Japanese style. It's just what the builders wanted that building to look like, but it has no bearing on the ceremonies inside.
>Part of the problem is that you swear an oath on the Bible and have no faith in it.
Source? Because no one is selecting the Bible to be obligated on if they don't have faith in it.
>you don`t see boy scouts swearing on The Bible.
Okay? And?

Hah, beat me to it.

Be honest, have you read the Bible fully?

Why swear an oath on the Bible in the first place????? You said it is not a religious group, why bother with one`s faith in all this philosophical mess?

The book itself, or at least the writing of it is mentioned in Hebrews

Obligation. And it's considered to render promises binding.
And it's a handmaid to religion, so it's somewhat religious. Just non-sectarian. So there's no proselytising, but religion is very important in it.

the one you buy at a normal shop that happens to have a Bible.