(I'am a white guy who wants to correct the record on the white black IQ hoax). Friendly reminder: His argument was literally "I don't like them, so they must be inferior". He actually said that, because he was conceited as hell. Charles Murray has also been disproven with his own statistical evidence by James Flynn and his colleagues: there is no evidence of hereditary racial differences in intelligence, only statistical averages, which are not empirical proof. Even Steven Pinker has said that there is no reason a prior to assume such differences exist, because human genetic diversity is mostly genetic drift with a few modern evolutionary adaptations, like lactose tolerance.
So do we (white people) not even understand what we are saying, or are you (racists) losers that use convenient numbers to hide the fact that you have less societal worth than people in demographics you apparently looks down on? (As a white person) racists,grow up.
hello there Schlomo how's your work going in the Brussels?
Jackson Edwards
OP is absolutely KVETCHING
Mason Hughes
You're trying to avoid being one kind of hateful, destructive idiot by being a different kind. I don't see how that helps.
Jason Hill
> believing that niggers are on the same level
You are talking about shitskins that rape infants because they believe it cures AIDS
Gabriel Harris
It's one of the most self-evident things on the planet if you just look at it objectively.
Owen Lewis
>blacks are as smart as whites >still can't compete in a job market despite lower requirements and quotas fuck off Schultz and take all those doctors and engineers with you
Aiden Murphy
>no evidence of hereditary racial differences in intelligence That is a lie. What you mean is that no amount of science showing intelligence is genetic will every be accepted by antiwhite pieces of shit like you.
Hunter Martin
...
James Lee
Seriously, a coincidence? That is your argument?
Isaac Wilson
Flynn's an egalitarian (re: idiot) and his only evidence against the prevailing consensus is (1) that mulatto Germans born to American G.I.s are as intelligent as their white peers, which is a stupidly small sample group and Flynn himself admitted there were built in IQ barriers that made it unreliable, and (2) 8-month old infants don't report a gap, which is not surprising because they're 8 fucking months old.
There are two possible scenarios here and as a third-party you need to reason which is more probable. Either (a) Murray is both evil and propagating lies, while Flynn is a truth-spreading hero of social justice, or (b) Murray is a dispassionate scientist sharing the truth, regardless of how painful it is, while Flynn is propagating lies under the belief that they are harmless and the alternative could breed social unrest.
Also let's not forget how the other component of that, culture, is so consistent among races yet different between them due to the past 400 years of little to no intermixing and the reality of self-segregation even to this day?
see and respond to and
Charles Scott
From the Humane Genome Project: "DNA studies do not indicate that separate classifiable subspecies (races) exist within modern humans. While different genes for physical traits such as skin and hair color can be identified between individuals, no consistent patterns of genes across the human genome exist to distinguish one race from another. There also is no genetic basis for divisions of human ethnicity."
Justin King
When whitey has to travel to an entirely different continent to dig literal fucking holes in the ground, so that the indigenous population of that continent will discontinue the practice of walking 50km everyday to collect water from either contaminated sources or stagnant pools, the IQ disparity, regardless of its legitimacy, is virtually irrelevant.
Isn't it important that we consider our role in oppressing these people when speaking of their current status?
Gabriel Cook
Has there even been a study that shows blacks have the same average iqs as whites? Seems pretty unanimous, the only thing they can try to argue is that it isn’t genetic yet every study shows after childhood there is a strong correlation with their biological parents
Lucas Diaz
These claims rest on several big assumptions:
1. That IQ is a measure of some kind of objective intelligence, rather than a measure of the skills needed to excel in 21st century Western society (a controversial claim).
2. That there are genetic differences between "races" big enough to explain the IQ difference.
3. That IQ is more dependent on racial genes than environment (or: if environment affects IQ, then the differences in IQ by race should still be significant after controlling for the environment).
Increasingly, evidence has been suggesting that environment plays a large role in IQ. This started with the discovery of the Flynn effect — the realization that national average IQ scores were increasing over time at a rate much faster than could be explained by genetics (and, interestingly, ethnic minorities were often making the biggest leaps).
Relevant to this discussion also is Eric Turkheimer's study of twins separated at birth and raised in different socioeconomic environments. The study found that environment mattered more to the development of IQ in the poor kids than it did in the rich kids. Essentially, some degree of genetically-determined IQ exists, but the degree to which it develops is dependent on how intellectually-stimulating their environment as children is.[73] Other explanations, such as the stereotype threat, racial discrimination in the education system, lack of funding for schools in poor areas, more talented teachers avoiding teaching at schools in poor areas, and even differences in diet have been offered.
Isaiah Morgan
> australian > white
Pick one
Ryder Barnes
What role? I didn't have a fucking role. I never owned slaves. I don't think any of my ancestors did in the US.
And the lives of those lands colonized by whites is immeasurably better than before. And whites still pour tons of money into Africa to save their ungrateful black asses. Just look up PEPFAR
Jason Campbell
Clearly untrue as they can determine ancestry through autosomal DNA and clusters of genetic similarity that match ethnicities
Samuel King
Read "The Bell Curve" you fucking faggot
Austin Brooks
>That IQ is more dependent on racial genes than environment (or: if environment affects IQ, then the differences in IQ by race should still be significant after controlling for the environment).
Thankfully we have twin adoption studies that demonstrate just that
Cameron Miller
>whites invented art, philosophy, science for thousands of years >niggers still have mudhuts and sticks
lmaoing @ ur life senpai, anything a black has now that isnt a stick or a mudhut was given to him by the white man, prove me wrong.
Joshua Kelly
...
Jaxson Bennett
That's obviously being misused.Genetic evidence makes it readily apparent that there are no sudden "breaks" in human variation. Instead, there are merely gradations ("clines"). Otherwise, it should be simple enough to point out substantial breaks in the following graphs of genetic variation of the human species.
Isaiah Turner
Yep that’s the one, as the children age iq becomes more accurate and is most strangely correlated to their biological parents
Christian Reed
Same thing.
Jeremiah Collins
>mazeltov
Grayson Barnes
Ethnicity isn't the same as race.
Joseph Jenkins
See lewontins fallacy, biologically distinguishable population groups exist and they match what we know as race, on a more detailed level genetic similarity also correlates with ethnicity. In fact these differences are so significant between the races that forensic anthropologists can determine it with near perfect accuracy by looking at skeletal remains
Isaac Howard
I never said it was, just that we can, for the most part, distinguish them through looking at autosomal dna
Samuel Robinson
How convenient you ignored the last paragraph of my post.
Nicholas Adams
...
Leo Roberts
Your last paragraph only looks at childhood iq, when they monitor as they grow up iq correlates most strongly to their biological parents, I assume you left that part out because you are either ignorant of the facts or you don’t like the conclusion. Probably the latter since you don’t mention how inaccurate childhood iq measuring is
Elijah Hall
>Barely literate post with fucked up grammar and unintelligible sentence structure >Guys listen to my thoughts on IQ
James Morgan
Here is a question for you, ignoring reasons why, do you believe whites on average have a higher iq than blacks?
Jason Williams
Such confused shill bullshit. >separate classifiable subspecies (races) "Race" doesn't have to equate to "subspecies." Do populations which come from different places differ in meaningful ways genetically? Yes, obviously. >different genes for physical traits such as skin and hair color can be identified between individuals Doubletalk. They can be identified *between populations* as well. >There also is no genetic basis for divisions of human ethnicity. How do we figure ethnicity? Is it not by such traits as skin color? As is this not heritable?
Elijah Rivera
Are you familiar with the correlation between poverty and IQ?
Zachary Howard
It’s mostly lewontin fallacy , also if you are curious look up cryptic species and species problem.
Samuel Sanders
Sorry English is my 3rd language.
Nolan Bell
How about you answer my question first. I would like to see you state the following:
Whites on average have higher iqs than blacks
Brody Perez
>Are you familiar with the correlation between poverty and IQ? poverty is the effect, not the cause
Leo Sullivan
Aw yes, Lewonton's fallacy. This is a quote from Edward's 2003 paper who found by looking at how gene loci are correlated: "probability of misclassification falls off as the number of gene loci increases". It is notable Edwards in his paper does not dispute Lewontin's statistical data on various blood polymorphisms, writing: "There is nothing wrong with Lewontin's statistical analysis of variation, only with the belief that it is relevant to classification". As a result, as Jonathan Marks (2010) explains, there is no "Lewontin fallacy:
"Geographical correlations are far weaker hypotheses than genetically discrete races, and they obviously exist in the human species (whether studied somatically or genetically)."
What Lewontin (or Marks) and Edwards are discussing are two completely different things. Of course genetic correlations exist which can pinpoint someone's geographical ancestry, but as Marks asks: "What is unclear is what this has to do with race", and concludes: "Lewontin's analysis shows that such groups [races] do not exist in the human species, and Edwards's critique does not contradict that interpretation" (emphasis added). What this means is that Edwards is re-defining the race concept to a far weaker hypothesis, which is not how race is commonly understood in biological taxonomy: Fujimura 2014 writes:
“”[I]f one wants to measure the meaningfulness of differences between groups with different geographic ancestries, one needs to use a “proportion of variation” approach. This approach compares genetic variation among individuals within groups to the genetic variation between these groups. Ironically, Edwards’s (2003) reported findings confirm Lewontin’s (1972)."
Christopher Price
Maybe that explains why you’re having difficulty understanding works written in English.
Asher Cruz
Somehow it is acceptable that negroes are statistically better at some sports. The statistics that they are worse at brain sport but are unacceptable. What is wrong with you? Facts are not racist and ignoring them leads to disaster.
>genes that determine racial traits exist >there are no gene patterns that separate races I call this bullshit.
There are studies that absolutely support 1 2 and 3.... 1 isn't controversial at all.
Increasingly evidence shows environment doesn't effect iq, you're literally just wrong. The Flynn effect is probably an artifact of nutrition and opportunity, and it's slowing down. Also all of this is going to be settled in the next 5 years when we find the distribution of it related genes across racial groups. It's already begun, and so far the race realists are correct.
Jaxon Murphy
Glad we could agree on this statement:
>Edwards argued that while Lewontin's statements on variability are correct when examining the frequency of different alleles (variants of a particular gene) at an individual locus (the location of a particular gene) between individuals, it is nonetheless possible to classify individuals into different racial groups with an accuracy that approaches 100 percent when one takes into account the frequency of the alleles at several loci at the same time.
Nolan Nelson
No, faggot. Even left entirely to their own devices, niggers always have and always will live in total squalor, regardless as to whether or not the white man is present. They simply cannot maintain any respectable level of civilizational development; and even when the white man is generous enough to construct a civilization for them, once whitey hands it over to niggers, any development achieved by the white man's endeavors is quickly dragged right back into barbarism, squalor, dysfunctionality, and technological illiteracy.
Connor Nelson
I'm a white goy too lol
Caleb Torres
Is it not at least possible logical that Poverty and all its related concerns require so much mental energy that the poor have less remaining brainpower to devote to other areas of life?.And as a result, people of limited financial means are more likely to make mistakes and bad decisions that may make worse and perpetuate their financial problems?
Jaxon Walker
That's literally how speciation works...
Cameron Anderson
So blacks don’t have lower iq because they are poor, well we knew that already based on iq tests between different races in the same income
James Harris
>bad descisions >not stupid kek The absolute state of mental gymnastics.
Ryder Bailey
Answer the question, do you believe blacks have lower iqs on average than whites
Wyatt Hall
>Flynn effect Has the Flynn effect produced a reduction in the racial IQ gap yet?
Jaxon Flores
The concept of time doesn't exist in the zulu language unlike every other culture.
David Wright
It appears that some factors implicated in sporting success are heritable (e.g. height), and therefore will be more or less common in groups with common ancestors. However, in many cases, these do not correlate closely to race (the Dutch are the tallest nationality, despite stereotypes about black basketballers). There is not a simple pot of genes that corresponds to each race, so you can't assume a member of a race will have a given gene. And there are few clear cases where genes define sporting success: even factors like height are affected by nutrition, medical facilities, etc, and distributed across races.
One well-known genetic factor is the gene ACTN3 associated with fast twitch muscleWikipedia's W.svg fibres, which are greatly beneficial to sprinters and basketball players amongst others, and such genes are particularly common in west Africa.[93] The frequency of the optimum (RR) genotype is 0.25 in Asians, 0.36 in European whites, 0.60 in African-Americans, but 0.81 in African Bantu.[94] This is perhaps the clearest and best known example of sporting behaviour where genetic variation is connected to race, although even then it relates to a particular population rather than an entire race in the old-fashioned concept. The relative frequency of the gene in whites and Africans does not fully explain the fact that 77% of National Basketball Association (NBA) players are black, and blacks have 83% of NBA court time.
Henry Cruz
I don't care about your theories. All that matters is the results that we keep finding. The results keep reflecting a black/white IQ gap. No amount of rationalization can change reality.
Owen Wilson
There’s ask the MAOA 2r allelle which leads to what we call chimp out behaviour, blacks have it at about 5% whites and asians under 0.0001%
Do you believe whites on average have a higher iq than blacks?
Connor Bennett
Why did they not civilize, and get colonized and enslaved then?
Evan Rodriguez
user, are you by any chance not having enoug spare mental power right now? Or are you just dumb?
Andrew Brooks
You're confusing speciation with genetic drift. They aren't the same thing.
Did you even bother to read the article?
Jaxson Cook
Do more difficult financial circumstances lead to cognitive deficiencies? Yes I strongly believe as has been found in thousands of academic studies that there is a strong association between the two. Does it not make sense that a person’s cognitive function is diminished by the constant and consuming effort of coping with the immediate problems of having little money, such as scrounging to pay bills and cut costs. Thus, a person is left with fewer “mental resources” to focus on complicated, indirectly related matters such as education, job training and even managing their time. The idea that black people are a different subspecies and have a 70 average IQ is ridiculous.
David Young
Science has proven gorillas have a higher IQ than the average negroid. They were able to test the gorilla which could communicate with sign language. She had an IQ of 80 whereas the average IQ of the pure black negro is 60 to 80. Whites have 100 average. Also harambe we must never forget.
Sebastian Clark
So you are saying you do not believe blacks have a lower average iq than whites? Do you have any studies at all that show all races doing an iq test and getting equal results?
Xavier Myers
To be fair, she was a very smart gorilla that knew sign language
Jack Baker
Interesting given that five of the top ten wars in regards to death toll involve China.
Jacob Long
>Increasingly, evidence has been suggesting that environment plays a large role in IQ. This started with the discovery of the Flynn effect — the realization that national average IQ scores were increasing over time at a rate much faster than could be explained by genetics (and, interestingly, ethnic minorities were often making the biggest leaps).
wat
Evidence as far back as 2013 shows environmental effects drop off over time, virtually disappearing in late teens/early 20s. Most early large-scale IQ studies covered subjects younger than this.
War isn’t chimp out behaviour, unrelated are those based on percent of population?
Isaac Morales
Just as as i said. There are genetic differences in negroes and caucasians and some of the differences make one of them statistically better at something than other. In sports or in math.
Adam Moore
You're putting the cart before the horse. Like so many mentally deficient shitlibs, you suggest that economic disparity is the cause of cognitive differences of races. You know what would make a lot more sense given human history? Cognitive differences of races being the cause of economic disparity.
Owen Ross
Nah, I'm pretty sure that Bantus just haven't evolved three digit average IQ's, this is by far the most congruous explanation for observed reality.
Eli Parker
The opening of the silk road due to the Mongol invastions dramatically increased the wealth of European powers and the Ottomans closing of trade forced European trader to explore and discover alternate trade routes.
Aaron Cox
>hes wrong because he doesnt like blacks >arguing that a statistical average is wrong because its a statistical average, while using a statistical average as your proof fuck off with this bait schlomo give us some actual proofs, not anecdotes, and then come back.
Jeremiah Wilson
Clearly it is the case, look at any other racial group. Jews faced extreme discrimination for years yet they perform well on IQ tests and are some of the wealthiest people
Gabriel Mitchell
Africans has plenty of incentives to improve their lot from the beginning of their history, could have invented a wheel long ago but didnt
Eli Gonzalez
Again, why didn't africans civilize and develop their own trade routes? You can keep trying to get away from reality, go ahead, exhaust yourself.
Cooper Thompson
OP got BTFO and left. Muh Flynn effect. All recent studies show that IQ gap has stopped diminishing.
Jaxson Sanchez
lel
Camden Flores
Whether it's hereditary or cultural doesn't change the fact that their scores are still 15 points lower. Just because the statistics offend liberal pigs like yourself doesn't make the data false.
Ayden Jackson
>The idea that black people are a different subspecies and have a 70 average IQ is ridiculous.
Why? We have bred Chihuahuas from wolves in a few thousand years. Bantus and Eurasians have been evolving separately for at least 100,000 years, more if you count divergent archaic admixture.
Jack Sanders
No rivers
Jackson Diaz
Those aren't the only types of environments that I was referencing. There are also micro-environments like Epigenetics. This studies the way in which factors outside of the DNA itself alter the way in which genes are expressed. Resembling Lamarckian genetics, epigenetic effects can be remarkable enough for a mouse to pass a specific fear response down at least two generations (F3). In humans, increased risk for cardiovascular disease among African Americans is hypothesized to result from genetic expression modified by in utero experience of maternal stressors. Epigenetic effects might tie socioeconomics to future IQ, explaining some portion of controversially observed racial differences.
Samuel Cooper
You can use estonians as an example. 700 years of slavery and the pisa tests of 2015.
Jayden Ross
>The relative frequency of the gene in whites and Africans does not fully explain the fact that 77% of National Basketball Association (NBA) players are black, and blacks have 83% of NBA court time.
No one here (except Nazis?) is a total racial/genetic determinist. What you're telling me is that African American are 1.6667x more likely than white Americans to have fast-twitch muscle fibers, and that they are about 3.34x more likely to be NBA players (if we assume that the other 23% of NBA players is white). That's a very reasonable gap, if we assume that people like me who *don't* have talent at moving their limbs quickly give up practicing basketball at an early age and people who do have that talent enjoy a positive feedback loop from their practicing.
And to segue: people who are making the arguments you're making are playing a sort of double statistical game: you're using the fact that strong correlations aren't even stronger to imply that the correlations aren't that strong after all.
Also: One can accept the proposition of a "breakless" distribution of genetic diversity across geographically separated populations and still argue that the degree of difference in intelligence between people from different parts of the world is significant--scientifically and culturally. You don't have to have different "races," in the biological definition, to have significant variation between historically separated populations.
Pic related shows rather small differences in inter-group IQ--with more variation between the members of a geographic-historical group than between these--but still...shows differences, that have great effect on the group's functionality in a complex society.
Blake Gutierrez
It’s pretty funny, both of the people here try to argue how it’s not genetic but they will refuse to the end to simply state “blacks have a lower iq on average compared to whites” despite the implicit acknowledgement of that in their arguments
Julian Gomez
>What is unclear is what this has to do with race", and concludes: "Lewontin's analysis shows that such groups [races] do not exist in the human species, and Edwards's critique does not contradict that interpretation wew lad
Funny how Africans are oppressed by the same epigenetic factors at all times and in all places. It's almost like they actually are just retarded ape-men.
