Taxation is theft

Prove me wrong Sup Forums

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Unless the rich are taxed.

Meh. Fee for service is perfectly fair. The real problem is collectivism.

Unless said rich acquired their wealth through other unlawful means(making deals with governments to regulate competition, be a politician, work directly for the state) it's still theft

You get taxed regardless of whether you do or do not use the service
Your tax money will fund pathetic public schools even if you study at private ones
Plus you never signed a contract or had the option to not sign it

And those are all problems of collectivism. Please learn to read.

Explain
I get how paying for other people's education would be
But even if taxation was maleable and adapted to the services you use it1d still be compulsory

This. I'm fine being taxed x percent but i should be able to choose what it is my money is funding.

Taxation is just a byproduct of our Corrupt privately controlled fiat Banking system

Ummm the money is printed by the government too and only has any value if there is a system in place to enforce it.

So what are you going to do about it?!Nothing....ok then it does not matter.The weak should fear the strong,the government is strong and you are weak thus he can robb you with no consequences.

op just got told

No
Gold is not printed by government and has been used as currency
Printed money is supposed to be worth gold
Them forcing you to use their worthless printed money is another problem, not something I should be thankful for

A mandated exchange is not theft just because you don't verbally agree to each specific transaction

I can't. Taxation is theft, period.

>What separates rape from sex? Consent
>What separates a theft from a purchase? Consent
>What separates robbery from taxation? Hurr some social contract you never signed
Statists are idiots. Depsite believing that government is stupid they think government should be here and take their money when they know government doesn't know how to spend shit.

What I'm doing is trying to get people to understand this
When a majority of people stop being sheep thankful for their "free stuff", something's more likely to happening

Assuming that taxation is theft is theft then inherently bad?

"Just because you dont agree with a transaction it doesnt mean it's wrong"

anarcho-capitalism is literally "hey guys I'm in high school and have never had a job" the ideology.

>unlawful

but there are laws to support taxes
if you want to say immoral, sure

"Supposed to be"
Sadly you know we left the gold standard a long time ago. Even the shit Nixon ended wasn't a true gold standard. Real gold standard ended when the Great Depression started and those bastards seized gold.
Now we have narcissists who think they can control the economy and print money accordingly. Fucking scam.
I encourage all of you goys to read "what has the government done to our monies" by Murray rothbard (pbuh)

Render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar's

If you don't like it move.

>But even if taxation was maleable and adapted to the services you use it1d still be compulsory

OMG - you'd have to pay for things?!

Wait... isn't that the OPPOSITE of theft?

You took out the word verbally you dumbshit
You IMPLICITLY agree by obeying he laws and reaping the benefits of a taxpayer
You don't VERBALLY agree so hence your butthurtness

i agree the jews who run the fed collecting money for jew families should be taken out.

Trump get off your ass like OP said and send seal teams to take those kikes out!

youtube.com/watch?v=fasTSY-dB-s

Its all a sham at the end of the day and comes down what is "agreed upon". Does gold (shiny stuff) have any inherent value or does it just look pretty.

>I cant make the argument so watch this video that does it for me

Yes
Even if you steal to save someone etc, you would still have to pay for it

To be fair about the graph, tariffs are just a fancy name for a special kind of taxes. At least it tries to repel part of the burden on foreigners.

Damn it, here's the proper picture

...

>I can't take the time to watch a video therefore I win

Does this include excise taxes and tariffs?
How do you fund an armed force to defend the entire nation with?

No I dont implicitly agree
"Hey dont smoke weed or i'll shoot you. Hey you didnt wanna get punched therefore you agree"
Just showing how a state is just the monopoly of cohersion and violence

...

>having to pay for a service that the government forbids other people from doing
>not theft

If the government offered services and allowed others to offer the same services, I wouldnt oppose it
But you seem to not know how a state works

Bit why? Taxes are in some cases good, so if we assume that taxation is theft then it follows that theft isn’t inherently bad.

Not a christcuck

Honestly only the worst pleb wouldn't want to live in

If you were offered the choice at birth to either be a part of the agreement or not you wouldn't be bitching
The fact that more people than not have developed "citizenship" to accrue these benefits attained in this agreement to their posterity does not give you a logical reason to call that theft
You can bitch about how might makes right all you want but that's the ultimate end of every political philosophy even yours retard

Tbh I’d rather have the government own heavy industries than do taxes.

>law is just what the state says
If they write being white is unlawful would you denounce whites?
A state can only enforce their opinions, laws are natural and logically deduced

Whatever, Negrolover

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Yeah being a NEET fed by government benefits is the true adult and logical ideology

>-Anonymous

Private security or militias
Why you would wanna defend people from the other side of your continent is beyond me

>Implying Sup Forums doesn't make good quotes

Problem with this argument:

If taxation is theft, then there could just as easily be types of theft that aren't immoral or unethical.

It's fucking pedantry. We could have the same shitcocking argument about, "is taxation rape" or "is taxation a health supplement".

Theft is indeed inherently bad
Technically killing all humans would be good for the nature therefore killing humans is good
Huh?

i like how the definition you posted contradicts your claim. taxes aren't unlawful, they're part of the system. if you wanna play within the system, you accept the rules.

You can ban blacks from your property, no ethical problem
But enjoy living in 56% land

So is profit

You aren’t giving any justification. What if I said that private property is inherently bad?

Yeah, I mean free roads, what did that do for us? Would make much more sense if a town had to pool together to build 300ft of the 1400ft highway they need to be connected to humanity. Logical!

The only reason your idiotic ideology persists is because all the benefits and advantages of the alternative have become so commonplace you mistake them for normal society.

Yeah charging what I want for my property is theft
Might as well try to prove me property is theft

Civilization is based on monopolized violence, this shouldn,t surprise you.

> Theft is indeed inherently bad

Selfishness is "inherently bad".

Being against taxes is selfish.

Therefore being against taxes is bad.

See, I can make stupid arguments too!

what gives you the right to own it?

of course its theft

What is the service the government offers that there is not private competition for?

SS - IRA
Highways - Airplanes
Public School - Private School
Police - Private Security
Courts - Mediation
Military - Mercenaries

Unfortunately some of those things are not economically feasible for most members of society so as a group of people in a geographic region we try to provide an option. It is not a nefarious plot.

>governments regulate road building to the extreme
>how would you have roads without government? haha checkmate

Selfishness is not inherently bad
It's in fact, the only thing you can be
Selflessness is impossible
Helping others is just a way to satisfy your selfish ego

Who makes and enforces laws?

You know, the things they invented in the bronze age.

Private companies? Land owners?

That's called Despotism, I believe.

>Private security or militias
Who would likely prioritise the protection of the guys who pay their salaries over everybody else.
>Why you would wanna defend people from the other side of your continent is beyond me
What? Are you arguing against the concept of countries? If you're so disinterested in what happens at the other side of your ex-country, then that makes it very easy for individuals to come together and decide they want a government again. Or for an outside entity to invade and simply take away land.

Let me rephase, how would you handle people (internal or external) who would reduce the amount of land occupied by ancaps?

And aan you answer this please:
>Does this [theft] include excise taxes and tariffs?

The fact that it's result of my work
That I did with the body I have
>then buying doesnt give you property rights
you worked for the money/someone worked and wanted to give it to you
>then workers deserve all they produce
all they produce... with the owner's tools

>dat projection
Time to go outside, josh

>laws are natural and logically deduced
pretty marxist of you to devalue language with your own definitions

The Government provides the enormous money it costs to build infrastructure. You are suggesting we don't do that anymore, and instead roads and other important things we need, like say, the fucking sidewalk, are all owned by private groups.

So if you want to go to work, you have to travel through someone else's land, which they can deny to you.

Meaning you have no right to free travel anymore. Ever. You can be trapped in your own home if the sidewalk outside is owned by a group that has banned you from using it.

It. Doesn't. Fucking. Work.

I mean all this muh freedum shit pisses me off sometimes, but holy fucking shit where is an American patriot to kick this cunt in the twat?

what about land?

> Selfishness is not inherently bad

Oh sweet christ you are missing the point.

>Who would likely prioritise the protection of the guys who pay their salaries over everybody else.

If they dont protect costumers there are no sallaries, so

>Let me rephase, how would you handle people (internal or external) who would reduce the amount of land occupied by ancaps?

>Private security and militias

I'm against the concept of a state, if you wanna have a American community where everyone deliberatly loves their community and wants to protect it, i dont mind as long as nobody's being forced to pay for it/be part of it

And yeah, both are also theft

Do you know how contract bidding works? Yes, there ARE examples of corruption (always are). But in general, they put into public record the dates for accepting bids, and they are compelled to accept the lowest bid.

So, aside from your officials choosing the lowest bidder for a contract that is up to public standards of safety and durability - there's not much difference.

Are you going to pay a plumber to connect your house to the reservoir? HOW? The pipes have to go through 1800 other people's property! No, you pay a plumber to connect your house to the city's water main - because any other option is fucking stupid. You don't collect enough rainwater to wash your piss down a toilet, let alone drink, shower, and do laundry with.

And what ABOUT your piss, shit, and bathwater? (though I suppose for ancaps it's pretty much the same thing). You gonna have a kiddie pool filled with sewage in your backyard, are ya? Where are you going to pipe it? Who will check the envpro laws for dumping site? What if someone on the way to the site doesn't want a pipe through their land?

FFS - own land before you put too much stock in your dumbass opinions.

since taxation fits neither definition provided by you it can not possibly be theft

Built a house or planted something or whatever that is result of my work, the land it occupies is mine as long as it's still there
Obviously you cant claim land because once 10 years ago you had a house there

Ah, and none of that has anything to do with being born in the country you were in, and the protections and opportunities it provides.

Is the Congo a nice place to grow up?

>avoiding all the cogent arguments
Fuck you ancap cunts, you can't even debate
What a boring fucking thread

why does planting something make the land yours?

you consent to taxation when you choose to be a party to our social contract.

Theft implies you are being stolen from. That is wrong. The money you pay in taxes belongs to the government, you agreed to pay them. If you don't pay, then you can get your wages garnished or get thrown in jail (eventually).

In before "But I never signed anything!" You don't need to sign something to be a party to a contract. For an example, imagine you went into a resturant, ordered and ate a bunch of food, and walked out without paying. Would it be "theft" if the manager stopped and asked you to pay your bill? Of course not. now just imagine the restaurant is the USA and it's government is the manager. Taking things without paying for them is the real theft, which is what people who don't pay or avoid paying their taxes are doing. They are stealing from the nation.

Is rent theft? Upkeep and maintenance on your car?

if you build a fence do you own the land the fence is built on or the land encircled by the fence?

Fuck off, proxyfag

> If they dont protect costumers there are no sallaries, so

Not true.

You can sell pretty horrifyingly awful water if there is literally no way of getting water anywhere else.

You don't have to "protect" your customers if they have been reduced to feudal serfdom, or worse.

I almost wish for your future to come about, so you can petulantly whine as this wonderful kingdom of yourself you've built on the tiny bit of land you have is choked to death by its neighbours.

You have fun with your plot of dirt. They'll buy the land all around it and you'll starve or sell.

But you can leave the evil taxman just as you can leave Google banning hate speech.

Name a point where we are given the choice to not participate in the social contract.

Who makes and enforces Laws?

Answer.

when you are born
isnt that the one of the rights of man in ancapistan?

"Governmente provides"
No, retard
The government either steals from you or companies that will charge more because they are taxed
YOU PAY FOR IT REGARDLESS
Plus it'd all be cheaper if government didnt regulate and tax technological advance

Yes people can deny you acces to their sidewalk
Which is a fucking terrible thing to do
Anyone who traps someone would be ostracized by society and boicotted
Plus if a property is already trapped, you cant get there. And if you use a way to get out of your house, for example, its already your property as well
So trapping would not happen often and if youre stupid enough to get trapped, it'd be punished

Pretty sure you can choose not to be obligated to pay any taxes.

Just be homeless. No tax on that AFAIK.

Any other option but leaving the country - you are obligated to pay for the protections and obligations the country has provided you.

I'm in agreement with this - I should be able to choose where my money goes.

That said, fuck all (if any) people would pay in to the welfare state.

Nobody makes laws
It is logically and ethically wrong to damage/steal/etc someone's property
Going from that point, you can have private justice systems so people would agree on what the compensation or punishment but not what laws to make
You can't just create a "No hate speech" law and go suing people (which is something the state does, be thankful loyal citizen)

Obligations that include owning land I worked for and isnt owned by the state cause it didnt do anything there
Protection from retarded shit that would be better on private justic (which the state outlaws)
The state either gives you shitty services or services that are solutions to problems it created

>felonious taking
>unlawful taking

This is why taxation is not theft. A "taking" is occurring, but it is neither felonious nor unlawful.

>Taxation is theft
This is only true if you are not dependant on the society around you that YOU depend on, whom in turn depend on taxes to sustain its stability and infrastructure.

In other words, Taxes are only theft, if its not being used to defend your rights, or give you public services and utilities in return.

Since a substantial amount of american tax-assets go into bombing desert-hovels in the middle east, and arming "moderate rebels" that actually want you dead, you do have a solid point.

The land the fence is built on
Unless you do something else with the area encircled
You cant just fence 2000km2 and call it yours

"Natural law" has not been part of our jurisprudence in the USA for over 150 years.

For the same reason building a house makes the land yours
Cause what you planted is a result of your work and people cant go and take it/damage it

Your parents made that choice when they decided to have you here. But don't worry, once you turn 18 you are free to live outside of our society (innawoods), or move to another nation with a tax code you agree with. Those are two options available to you to avoid this crushing burden you call the social contract.

Now if you are upset about the fact that you cannot live here, use our infrastructure, and pay nothing for it, well that's just too fucking bad. Go try being a freeloader in Switzerland and watch how fast they chuck your ass out.

By the way, our founding fathers were not fans of taxation either, but even they knew it was necessary. As Ben Franklin said, there are but two certainties in life, Death and Taxes.

Ancaps sure can be a bit retarded from time to time, Although I must admit, even I am impressed that this intellectual rot has survived so long in what is supposed to be a "red-pilled' board like this one.