Christians.....isn't lucifer the good guy?

God created us to be his own personal wind-up toy.

Lucifer gave us consciousness and free will

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Lucifer is just an angel of God. The accusing angel or Hasatan/Satan

Satan doesnt exist and neither does Yahwah.

He's not talking to you, philistine. Learn to fucking read.

Fucknoff jewidh cultist.

Only if you are a jew. God bless.

Lucifer isn't anything really - he is used to obfuscate and elevate Satan into something he is not. Read the book of Job and you will see how retarded the "Lucifer" or "King of Tyre" bullshit cross-references really are.

Will you have faith in Yahwah at the sword?

Then take up Judaism

God created Satan for a purpose, which he fulfills exactly as designed. Just like you - flailing with your questions and trying to rustle jimmies.

If you are Christian will you oppose Crucifixion, you have faith you will meet yahwah, yes?

Yahwah is not God and the Bible is not holy, yeshwah is also not God.

You should be able to see the beauty of a naked women without making your thoughts impure.

But user, that wasn't his argument. He didn't say the God in the Garden was YHWH.

YHWH and the God in the Garden could easily be two different gods.

And either way, Lucifer/Satan/Serpent works within design. An omnipotent God would be able to see the Fall coming. So either God isn't, or its all planned.

>Satanists claim to worship Lucifer, bringer of light
>Don't bring light into the world, quite the opposite in fact

It's almost like they're full of shit

Orthos might say that God always had a plan for us in the Garden of Eden. Eating a fruit for which humans were not yet ready proved toxic and put humans under a reign of death. Lucifer didn't give us free will. We ourselves acquired a botched version of our existence, and we have terrible consequences like a dog who gets into a box of chocolates.

The Bible is not truth and ia not holy.

LE PICKLE RICK MEME FAGGOT

WOW LOOK AT MY SUPERIOR REASONING, LOGIC AND I FUCKING LOVE SCIENCE

IM PICKLE RICKKKKKKKKK

But Lucifer and Satan aren't interchangeable, they're separate entities. I thought Satan (((seduced))) Lucifer and then seduced Eve when he was disguised as a (((snake))). Lucifer surely represents the gullible goy who foolishly acts as a useful idiot for (((Satan))), they're representations of what we face on the land (Jews and their misguided goys who believe they're doing good).

In b4 Satan had a unibrow.

I will also be called satanist even if I deny the entire cult including the jewish cult deity of satan.

God surrendered his omniscience in order to give us free will. The only way to test if this had worked would be via defiance of God. A serpent (not Satan, nor Lucifer) told eve to defy God, and eve told Adam.
God gave us GIFTS for this defiance, rather than punishments; though some can scantly tell the difference.
Fast forward.
God give up his omnipotence to save us, by dying as a man.
Fast forward.
God pours out all of his wrath onto the earth in the days of final judgement.
All that remains of God is omnibenevolence, and we join him in heaven for all eternity.

Normalfags don't realize the Bible is more about God growing up than humans.

We weren't ready for it yet.

Honestly, the Lucifer story reminds me of the Greek myth of Prometheus, who brought fire to humanity out of pity for their squalid condition, only to be punished by the Gods for his transgression. In fact, the Sunni conception of the fall of Lucifer is somewhat similar to Prometheus as a tragic hero.

God didn't create you gullible goy.
Jews created god for you and kept lucifer for themselves.

>the book of Job, or the one that proves what a huge fucking asshole the abrahamic "god" is

Did anyone rape or murder in the garden? Did anyone fuck and murder their infant children in the garden? Did anyone drop bombs to melt, burn, disinigrate and tear apart innocent women and children in the garden?

Also:
>I'm naked
>therefore I should cover myself
Doesn't sound very logical to me. Nothing in the garden (save themselves) could pose harm to them.
What is the chapter and verse that supports your theory that luckier gave man critical thinking?

Yeah and what the fuck good did that do you, huh?

Well, he talked Eve into eating from the tree of knowledge. I think that right there is the definition of acquiring critical thinking.

Adam almost killed lilith because she wanted to be on top during sex

>I don't understand it, so it is wrong
Fedorable.

Get married.

>oh shit a talking snake
>better do what it says
>I'm so clear-minded and logical

Are you rusing me right now?

BECAUSE bro it allowed christopher poole to stead a website idea and setup a cancerous web nest

>Lucifer gave us consciousness and free will
Wrong. God gave us free will. Lucifer didn't like that. Lucifer hates us because we are God's preferred creation, made in His very own image, as if to create family rather than servants.

>some bullshit from "Paradise Lost"
Chapter and verse or GTFO.

that meme is wrong. the snake in that story did not teach critical thinking at all.

None of that is true you retarded cultist, the torah is garbage, trash.

Sauce?

Well wait, doesn't that just support the claim further? Before the apple, they could be easily manipulated because god didn't leave them with the ability to think and act for themselves, he just reasoned that he is god so they will listen. After the apple they got kicked out of eden and built the whole world.

It's also not necessarily lucifer but an enemy god that took the form of the snake

The old testament, judaic format

It's almost like every religion is full of shit
t. Edgy atheist

Suffering is not evil. It is just a sensation. You get hung up on "muh starving african babies." and "if god love me, why did my girlfriend leave me?"

Grow a pair. Comfort is not the purpose of life. Without fear, there can be no courage. In the absence of doubt, there is no faith. Perseverance can only grow from pain. There is no strength without adversity.

Suffering gives us the opportunity to display virtues. Virtue is a greater positive value than suffering could ever negate.

Why did adam let her eat it?

It doesn't support your claim that a snake getting eve to eat an apple = critical thought, nor that's critical thought was granted to them by it (as per >naked is bad)

Well the whole point of God keeping Adam and eve ignorant was so they could develop and become worthy of the trees of knowledge and life. The serpent ended their development prematurely and ruined God's plan.

>gave them free will

He can’t have given us free will. Because choosing to obey Lucifer is proof that they already had free will.

Don't Christians constantly denounce the Old Testament though whenever atheists point out all the murder and shit that proves Christianity is no better than Islam?

Eh, he talked them into it. That's the same, or close enough for me. I feel like this is just semantics at this point.

It's also rather telling that they always use it as a club to beat Christians, but haven't a word to say about the jews.

>Lucifer gave us consciousness and free will

Satan is just an angel, how can he create anything?

Not only that but it was God that gave us consciousness and free will. This is why man is created in the "image of God".

That being does not exist OP. Check 43alleys YT video on the subject. Totally manufactured by Christians. Jews had no concept of such a being in the OT.

That's true, but you have to remember that we aren't allowed to call out the Jews because then we're antisemitic Nazis, whereas if you call out Christians you're defeating the oppressive status quo. Plus I've never met a jew and don't really end up arguing with them anyways.

>implying the jews weren't just trying to keep the existence of their master a secret.

The Jews are talking people into cutting their genitalia off wholesale, how does being talked into something mean you are thinking critically?

I swear you must be rusing

And again: illogical during, illogical after: where is the foundation of your presumption?

It is actually pretty arguable whether or not God has free will, especially before creating us.

In the story lucifer doesn't really teach anything, eating the fruit does. But leaning right from wrong comes with the requirement to then do the right thing all the time, which no one can reliably do.

Basically it's a story of how you're born innocent to the world and as you grow up things get batshit.

He talked them into eating the apple. the apple provides critical thinking ability because it provides knowledge. How are you not getting this?

He's not a good guy, just a better guy. Satan is willing to do either good or evil to achieve his own selfish ends, while god does neither good or evil because he doesn't have any selfish ends. If you want there to be a possibility of good in the world, Old Scratch is the way to go.

How are you not getting this? What is the first thing they do after eating the fruit? Can you explain the logic behind this action?

>Christians.....isn't lucifer the good guy?
lol. no.

>God created us to be his own personal wind-up toy.
Spoken like a person ignorant of Christianity.

>Lucifer gave us consciousness and free will
Incorrect.

>1 post by this ID
exactly what I'd except from someone like you.

>Read 2 pages of the Bible
>Discern the bad guy is the good guy
The state of comprehension of the left

Is he the good guy since he punishes those that disobey God?

To add: knowlEdge and critical thinking are not the same thing at all. Any idiot can tell you 2+2=4, how many people can run the derivations of why that is true from scratch?
cs.yale.edu/homes/as2446/224.pdf

Leave it to a commie to side with the fallen.
Of course you agree with the idea of someone taking another invention and creation because you don't think it's being used right.
If he made us, so be it we are the wind up toy

>causes all the evil & decadence in the world
>goes against god himself
>father of all lies
>good guy
Idiot, we where better off without free will

Why wouldn't God have free will himself? If God never had free will how can one of this own tiny inferior creations give an even tinier creation what his own creator doesn't have? See the problem and the contradictions?

He answered, “I heard you in the garden, and I was afraid because I was naked; so I hid.”

They made themselves clothing, of sorts, to protect themselves from the elements, and from a ridiculously magical being they have no way of understanding. Shame aside, I say this is critical thinking in that it let them understand what a threat was, and they tried to devise a way to protect themselves from said threat.

So here's what we're up to now
Meanwhile, in the Bible:
>lucifer wasn't in the garden
>women have never been willful
>humans have never been thought slaves
>there was no "tree of critical thinking"
But hey, thanks for starting a Christian thread anyways.

>say something edgy about satan
>use some special name for satan nobody ever heard of
>level up your autism

>muh I don't believe in the Bible but here's my philosophy based upon the bible.

Are all atheists retarded?

>I have to believe in a fairy tale to write my own fan fiction

Why were they afraid to be naked before god, as they had been so far with nothing to fear? Undos like the opposite of critical thought.
Why did they clothe themselves in a temperate garden with nothing which could harm them(save themselves)? Seems like the opposite again.
Why would you perceive the person who formed you and a comfy world devoid of danger (save yourself) as a threat? Are you seeing a pattern yet?

After eating the fruit, the began to act illogically and in ways that defy critical appraisal.
Consider me thouroughly rused, I hope I gave you enough (yous) to last a while.

To note you pointed to this post Without addressing it.

>has them eat magical fruit from a tree called knowledge of good and evil
>as soon as they eat it they realize they've been running around naked like a couple of retards for their entire lives
no, I'd argue he did as advertized. Adam and Eve were literally like a couple of dumb animals before that

>why were they afraid to be naked before god
Because with knowledge comes shame, and god wore clothes. It was a learned behavior.
>Why clothe yourself in a temperate garden with nothing to harm them
Because shame, and because if god did it, why shouldn't they?
>Why perceive god as a threat
Because god outright threatens them with death if they eat from the tree, and they ate from the tree. In a last ditch effort to not die they told the truth and were banished for their trouble. The also would have understood that god lied to them, as eating from the tree didn't kill them, so maybe they thought god would be the one to kill them. Fear seems like a natural response.

Critical thinking is problem solving. "There is weather, so I should protect myself from it with clothes" is critical thinking, especially given the scope of the story seeing as no critical thought had come before.

so where are we at on the big 3 being jewish psyops to control the masses?

Explain the "logic" behind being ashamed of being naked in front of your god after him seeing you naked an hour ago and for your entire life up to that point.
>god wore clothes in the garden
Chapter and verse please
>I'm scared god will kill me
>I should talk to god so he can't find me
Again, not seeing the "logic" here

You... uh... pointed to it AGAIN without addressing it... again....

>oh shit it's cold, better just cover my genitals since the rest of me is unaffected by temperature.

You have some serious fucking mental problems user.

>kikes hate christians and want to make them atheists
>kikes hate muslims and want to make them atheists

It's pretty much a non-starter.

Go away retard, if you cannot entertain an idea without believeing in it then your IQ is probably in double digits.

This

>tfw you could be in the nude joyfully spending time with a qt virgin but instead you have critical thinking

Joyfully spending time in the garden of eden that is.

>Because with knowledge comes shame

This goes to show you have no idea what you are talking about.

>(1 Corinthians 8:1) ...we know we all have knowledge. Knowledge puffs up,...

>1 Cor 8:1 - We know that we all have knowledge. Knowledge makes people arrogant, CEB

>1 Cor 8:1 - All of us know something about this subject. But knowledge makes us proud of ourselves,CEV

>1 Cor 8:1 - It is certainly true that “we all have knowledge,” as you say. But this knowledge only fills people with pride. ERV

Knowledge doesn't bring shame, it brings pride. This is as retarded as saying that beauty brings shame! NONSENSE!! With beauty comes NARCISSISM. Where do you think Narcissism came from? From Greek mythology where a beautiful man fell in love with his own beautiful reflection in a pond and starved to death. Where do you think the archetype of the arrogant genius like Lex Luthor, Dr Doom, and Professor Moriarty came from? It comes from the COMMON FACT that intelligence makes one arrogant and prideful.

When Adam and Eve ate the fruit their eyes opened and they became ASHAMED, not prideful, not narcissistic, not self-absorbed. This alone proves that they gained no rationality and critical thinking. On the contrary, this made IRRATIONAL and UNREASONABLE.

You've struck upon the primary difference between Aryan and Semitic theology, between the Logos and the Demiurge, between Humanity becoming a celestial civilization as opposed to being enslaved and entrapped upon this planet (i.e. Plato's Cave).

Good job.

The Bible is just an allagorry describing how man obtained consciousness, lost it, then regained it.

I did address it. Your point was that knowing 2+2=4 is not critical thinking. Knowing the derivations isn't critical thinking either. Critical thinking, again, is problem solving. They have a problem, they solve it, that is critical thinking. My example was that an understanding that the elements can be harsh is the problem, the clothing is a solution, thus it is critical thinking.

The story doesn't say they covered their genitals, it says they made coverings. Feel free to interpret that however you like, but it sounds an awful lot like "made clothes" to me.

Maybe god doesn't wear clothes, but we know that nudity is seen as shameful for worshipers of abrahamic religions, and god is a character created by jews, so it would stand to reason that god would wear clothes.

I really don't see any of those characters running around with their dicks flapping about. Clearly some amount of shame (or decency, if you prefer) comes from knowledge. Even if it isn't shame, with knowledge also comes practicality. Naked is vulnerable, unprotected. If they feared death maybe they thought clothes would do something to protect them.

This is all backed up further by the fact that god himself gives them better clothes made of animal skins when he banishes them.

You didn't get rid of his omnipresence.

okay what do u think is the maximum velocity of santa's sleigh?

>.isn't lucifer the good guy?
nope.

I give up, I leave you with some advice and a proverb:
>You are so desperate to be correct, you are doomed to be wrong. Take comfort in being wrong and you will soon find yourself more correct.
>Seest thou a man wise in his own conceit? there is more hope of a fool than of him

>omniscience
Genesis 3:9 And the Lord God called unto Adam, and said unto him, Where art thou?

I don't see how that applies to me since your concession means you're out of arguments, which on the internet means I win.

Not that it matters, this is essentially arguing my little pony canon as far as importance goes.

This has been one of my questions for years. Lurking for answers.

lucifer wasn't an angel he was just the king of assyria. satan isn't the boss of hell either.

>I really don't see any of those characters running around with their dicks flapping about.

Absolute nonsense at this point. You're just trying to damage control at this point.

>Clearly some amount of shame (or decency, if you prefer) comes from knowledge.

Knowledge of what? That's what YOU don't understand. If you're talking about critical thinking, understanding, and higher thought then you lost the argument. NOBODY is ashamed of themselves for being a genius just like NOBODY is ashamed of themselves for being gorgeous. High intellect and beauty brings PRIDE and NARCISSISM. Not shame.

>Even if it isn't shame, with knowledge also comes practicality.

Shame in itself is IRRATIONAL. Why do you think Geniuses like Albert Einstein was ugly and didn't come his hair? You and I comb our hair because we suffer from an irrationality called insecurity. He didn't. Geniuses don't care about their physical appearance beyond basic hygiene because insecurity and low-self esteem are IRRATIONAL and UNREASONABLE.

> Even if it isn't shame, with knowledge also comes practicality. Naked is vulnerable, unprotected. If they feared death maybe they thought clothes would do something to protect them.

You're just making this all up as you go along. By the time Adam and Even sinned, Adam was already around 100 years old as a naked man the whole time before the fall. He died at 930 years. Eve was young but Adam was around for decades up to a century naked. Why would Adam wait up to an entire century to finally come to the conclusion that he needed clothing? You' just putting yourself in a deeper hole.

>This is all backed up further by the fact that god himself gives them better clothes made of animal skins when he banishes them.

Why would God wait for an entire century to come to the conclusion that Adam needed clothing for protection when God gave him the natural protection he already had?

yes, Satan is the one true lord unless you're a shabbo goy