Okay, so I've spent the last few hours arguing with the "anti-net neutrality" (NN) side of Sup Forums, and here's what I've gathered: >Anti-NN Sup Forums doesn't like NN because it's the government exerting control over private companies, which is socialism and bad. >Anti-NN Sup Forums may also concede that the government affords these same companies the ability to stomp out competition from their respective regions, which is also socialism and bad. >Anti-NN Sup Forums hates socialism, and wants to get rid of the socialistic policy that protects consumers because they think it's a step towards eliminating socialism and the free market will sort itself out. >Anti-NN Sup Forums does not acknowledge that literally no one at the FCC, Comcast, AT&T, etcetera have any intention to relinquish control of the market, and that the majority of Americans will not have a choice in ISP regardless of the outcome of the NN repeal.
Are half the people here so delusional that they think AT&T&Friends/The FCC/The White House want a free and open market? Or are they just so short-sighted that they don't care that they're just removing one weight from a delicately balanced scale of a system they hate, shifting more and more power to people who will readily fuck them over and support the ideologies that they're strictly against? Or is their ego so invested in right-wing politics that they literally just subsist off of anything that gets shat out by the capitalist masses?
I think I speak for most when I say your hard work is you're a faggot
James Kelly
just officially declare the internet a utility and there would be no need for this debate at all
Aiden Reed
This, also people don't understand bandwidth
Cameron Cruz
You should give two fucks what the idiots here think, let them live in delusion. Obviously their guy in the White House has proved to be another corrupt politician.
Robert Mitchell
I oppose Title II (euphemistically and erroneously called "net neutrality" for propaganda purposes) because:
-it does nothing to prevent internet censorship -it is basically acts as a subsidy to jewgle and netflix and facebook, all monstrous anti-white corporations that heavily censor speech on the internet -with Title II in place, the chances of getting better legislation that actually protects legal speech on the internet is drastically reduced -it gives the FCC power to determine who is allowed to be classified as "common carrier," which acts as a barrier to entry favoring large ISPs that have the money to lobby to determine common carrier classification regulations (locking in ISP monopolies at the Federal level rather than the local level)
Probably more, but these are the main ones. Title II is not what we want for this, and does not even address the main concern spread on plebbit and zuccbook by the astroturfed pro- Title II google propaganda, namely freedom of speech on the internet
Google, supporter of Title II, is worth more than all of these companies put together and has much more pull in government. As are the other richest corporations in the world who all support the misnamed "net neutrality" (title II)
Cameron Flores
It should be that simple, but it never is.
Jack Barnes
>-with Title II in place, the chances of getting better legislation that actually protects legal speech on the internet is drastically reduced Isn't this far too optimistic?
>-it gives the FCC power to determine who is allowed to be classified as "common carrier," which acts as a barrier to entry favoring large ISPs that have the money to lobby to determine common carrier classification regulations (locking in ISP monopolies at the Federal level rather than the local level) Why do the ISPs want it so bad, then? You seem to agree that these ISPs WANT to have monopolies. Why would they actively support legislation that would jeopardize something their ability to monopolize? Because fast lanes are going to be so profitable that they no longer need their market share?
To be clear, these are legitimate questions. I'm not trying to "gotcha" you.
Josiah Evans
>here >them >their
Jayden Myers
The problem with the NN debate is that 90% of Sup Forums doesn’t understand what it actually does. It doesn’t have anything to do with censorship and the “payment plans” people talk about are flat out lies. All it really does is give more power to the feds.
The megacorps, Jews, globalist elites all want NN. Even the prince of darkness himself, George Soros wants it. Do you think they suddenly have your best interests at heart?
Wyatt Adams
>and that the majority of Americans will not have a choice in ISP regardless of the outcome of the NN repeal. They also say it helps smaller isp start businesses and grow faster. We need better all around infrastructure, which would come with more competition. I've had Comcast which was pretty shitty. Time Warner, nothing but problems with that. Charter spectrum is where it's at 10/10 ISP.
Interesting enough Rush Limba is anti NN. It's not just Sup Forums people.
The main thing I learned about NN is that no one knows wtf they're talking about. I researched it for 2+ hours and can admit that. People I talk to make it clear they read a huffpuff article and say: >muh internets
Ethan Myers
Title II is 400 fucking pages, don't pretend like you have a clue what it does. The very fact that I have NEVER seen anyone try to explain wtf it is despite everyone everywhere screaming about it non-stop is evidence enough that it's a scam.
Logan Green
Yeah no you're making shit up too. At the core of this issue is that ISPs are wringing their hands because the bandwidth they sell isn't actually meant to be used to its full capacity and people streaming means for the first time they're in danger of being called out on not having bandwidth in the amount they claim to be selling. So now they're crying to the government through Pajeet, who is fighting to give ISPs the right to change data trafficking such that they can prioritize these streaming services without upgrading their infrastructure. This has the side effect of slowing down everyone else, particularly at peak times. Google and the rest don't want it because even though they'll get faster speeds than their competition the ISPs will have them by the balls for extortion money to also be in that fast lane.
Blake Hernandez
>desperately kvetching to help google and plebbit save more shekels lel
Kevin Kelly
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Jayden Cruz
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Aiden Perez
This. The last time we passed a bill this long granting a massive increase in government power because of what it sounded like it'd do rather than what it'd actually do, we got the Patriot Act
Henry Jones
while i do not disagree with you, i do have to give consideration to the fact that these monopoly service carriers do invest and outlay critical infrastructure for customers to access the internet. Why sholdn't they have some say over carrier classifications and regulations of the the isp's which seek to utilize that infrastructure? If an isp does not like it they can always invest in their own infrastructure. As for shaping/slowing data to companies like google and socialist-facebook, making people pay more to watch leftist-tube and marxis-twiiter, yeah im soo going to care about that. I game, i torrent, i Sup Forums - if they stop vpn and want to charge more for gaming and websites like Sup Forums ill just go without. that is my choice. No one is forcing me online no one forces me to download torrents and no one forces me to on social media. pay or don't play. why should companies reek massive profits from the internet without contributing to the infrastructure that allows them to reap these profits? IF isp's decide to charge for certain online services it will be the ones that make massive profits and reap massive benefits from the the infrastructure top isp's out lay.
Levi Hill
Do you think Comcast, Time Warner, et al have your best interests at heart. Not everything is black and white. Sometimes Sup Forums and the Powers That Be can agree. Sup Forums needs the internet to be free of ISP fuckery in order to facilitate its mission of foiling globalist.
Nathaniel Thompson
This. You can tell how little the left knows about this topic by how angry they are at it. threatening Pai's family, call muh senators, non stop shit posting about it on fb. The signs are all there.
Matthew Stewart
NN is shit because it's a patchwork fix for the fact that the internet is litteraly the worst implementation of itself. If and when it becomes so corrupt that no one wants to use it for it's price the engineers will get their shit together and create a system that does it much better. The technology for it is there anyways so it's not like it's a problem. NN only gets in the way of replacing a system that is just giving a retarded amount of power to the government anyway.
Sebastian Smith
Doesn't the government often pay these companies to develop said infrastructure?
Ethan Hughes
A retarded amount of power to isp's, ad agencies, and ddos attackers I might add.
Jeremiah Ramirez
Good luck, this thread is filled with newfags. They tried the same shit 5 or 6 years ago and everyone hated it, but once they remotely threaten Rick and Morty streaming suddenly every consumer has to pay for faggots streaming shit at night.
James Hernandez
>Isn't this far too optimistic? No.
>Why would they actively support legislation that would jeopardize something their ability to monopolize? Because fast lanes are going to be so profitable that they no longer need their market share? Because they already have monopolies at local level and will take the increased profits in the short term. If they start to face more competition they will flip.
Joseph Harris
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Jonathan Harris
sometimes ISPs will contract with towns to develop infrastructure in their town for free. The catch is that the local government wont allow other ISPs to enter the market for x amount of years.
Easton Morris
they contribute yes but its nothing other companies don't or not eligible get for creating tax paying jobs. im drunk and i never get drunk so im taking shit lol i really have no idea about this NN shit.
William Robinson
The left knows absolutely nothing about every single topic they argue, though. It's the biggest part of what makes a liberal a liberal. They argue however a jewish comedian tells them to argue, they think however a jewish celebrity tells them to think. They have zero free will or understanding of quite literally any of their pet causes. Not a single fucking one. They never have. That's why it's impossible to debate one. They lose their mind and start screaming -isms to shut conversations down as soon as you get one off their jew-written scripts.
Hunter Kelly
Don't worry. The tech has become a lot more refined recently thanks to the work on crypto-currencies and some advancements in the field of signal processing. The pieces are all there it is just gonna take some vc money and it will be in business.
Ayden Nelson
I don't trust big corporations as far as I can throw them... but I trust the government even less.
Repealing the 2015 regulations doesn't fix the underlying problems that led to this legislation being passed in the first place (government sanctioned monopolies, traffic throttling, bad business practices, etc) but it does stop us from signing away what little power and influence consumers have left over to the Fed and making an already bad situation even worse.
Cameron Mitchell
>Do you think Comcast, Time Warner, et al have your best interests at heart Do you think google, facebook, et al have your best interest at heart? See: Facebook and google each are worth more than all the major ISPs combined.
Zachary Jackson
>muh sneaky Illuminati semites you tell 'em, champ.
Justin Diaz
These are really good posts, especially the first one. I don't get how people don't understand that collectively lobbying our government to protect our interests is the only defense we have against corporations trying to fuck us over. Stop moralizing it about what they SHOULD be able to do, Comcast sure as shit doesn't care about your consumer rights.
Evan Rogers
>netflix was a huge burden no proof
>comcasts exists because they are the only decent choice 0.05 rupees
this imbecile has no idea what comcast does to squash local isps: "Support other internet services to make [comcast] lose customers and revenue"
fucking joke when Comcast has already litigated local ISPs out of existence
Elijah Roberts
I don't know much about NN because i'm too lazy to look up all the court cases and their impact but I admitted that to a friend and his wife and they were all: >muh internets Me: >Yeah I actually don't know a lot about Title II Them: >what's title II?
Caleb Allen
Protecting idiocy kills innovation.
Luke Gomez
Of all the countries in the developed world we should be literally the last nation to give advice for good internet infrastructure
Jason Moore
can someone explain whats happening in this pic
Ethan White
there is no innovation in letting monopolists corner the market through government lobbying
Jose Roberts
Google values its liberal public image and Mark Zuckerberg is a narcissist.
Lincoln Cook
facebook and google -- do they regulate how i access the internet?
do i have to pay them a fee to access the internet?
are you arguing about something completely different?
Alexander Reed
>muh sneaky Illuminati ISP the jist of your argument
Angel Brown
The internet is what won trump the presidency, its how he can get his message to his base.
He wouldnt let the ISP's stop anyone from being able to read his shitposts at lightning speed.
Easton Rogers
>do i have to pay them a fee to access the internet? yes. you cant be racist very high price for some
Juan Evans
I hate net neutrality because I'm a dirty jew and our media monopoly is threatened by free streaming and things like netflix and gaming. So, to keep CNN and NBC solvent, and maintain our influence over the goyim, we're going to have to shut it down.
t. dirty jew
Brayden Scott
>all mega-corporate "progressive" talking points aren't a cover to make more money how's that bluepill taste?
Caleb Thompson
>"Companies want your money" is the same as "a decentralized group of people loosely related by where their great*4 grandparents lived five generations ago control the media."
Benjamin Diaz
>corporations trying to fuck us over See:All the biggest corporations in history support "net neutrality."
Benjamin Walker
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Jordan Jones
it's the same old tired retard/shill bullshit from these people
Google and so on can start buying censorship/throttling of their competitors wholesale from comcast once net neutrality is out the window
so rather than magically increasing competition online because reasons, we're actually going to get a full on monopoly by the likes of google and faceberg as they go SHUT IT DOWN on everyone competing with them
And what are startups to do? Pay money they don't have to the ISP to beat google and facebook?
There is no actual common sense or critical thinking being applied just HRRR MUH FREE MURKET FREE MRUKET MARKET FREE FREE CORPORATION DICK IN MY ASS IS FREEEEEE
Joseph Gray
Net Neutrality is an alien intelligence test. If you oppose Net Neutrality, your society is not advanced enough to handle the advanced memes and bantz that an internet produces.
Jaxson Ramirez
It's nothing important, the ISPs have to be open if they throttle something and the FCC is allowed to hold them to their promise not to block or throttle legal content (they already revoked this promise btw).
Of course they support it, they don't want to pay Comcast "fast lane" fees. That doesn't mean it's good for me and you, because without upgrading their infrastructure the only thing being in the "fast lane" means is that everyone not paying the fee is slower.
Jaxon Richardson
what the fuck are you even talking about
if you want to be racist, go set up your own stormfront website
Nolan Bailey
>facebook and google -- do they regulate how i access the internet? Yes. See daily stormer. They have been kicked off of over a dozen registrars, at the behest of google, and have not had a stable clear net presence for several months now.
Dominic Thomas
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Austin Thompson
>because reasons Back to plebbit
Lincoln Stewart
google requesting is not the same thing and comcast enforcing
You're on like three different levels of false equivalence here and I find it incredibly hard to believe that anyone by a paid shill could ernestly hold such a position.
Justin White
>go set up your own stormfront website See:
Jaxon Long
The reason they can corner the market is because it's a market with tons of exploitable problems which are going to be properly exploited when the government gets their hands out if it. The internet is shit, built like shit, using old as shit technologies. Tons of the problems of the internet come from those facts: adocalypse, censorship, isp throttling, copyright abuse, etc.
This will just speed up it's distraction and replacement by a better system THAT WE ALREADY HAVE THE TECHNOLOGY TO OUT IN PLACE WIDE SCALE FOR VERY CHEAP. The idea that NN is our last bastion of hope is something only Jews, shills, and brainlets are pushing.
The reason Google is pushing so hard is because if this infrastructure change goes through they get instantly invalidated, the same goes for Facebook. ISPs will also get invalidated but they don't have any options left except play for the short term.
Luis Gonzalez
>google and so on can start buying censorship how will google censor a site it does not own
>get a full on monopoly by google and faceberg how can they get a monopoly on how you access web information if they dont own that content
what are some examples of google and faceberg setting up a monopoly on whatever? they are used because they are popular -- they charge nothing for their services -- but you have to comply with their rules of conduct -- if you don't like that, you're free to set up your own website or search service
Easton James
What regulation has been abused, exactly?
Colton Scott
>google requesting is not the same thing and comcast enforcing Yes it is. Google has enough power to pressure these registrars that it is essentially the same thing.
Evan Peterson
Like a broken record I have to repeat this over and over again, and it still doesn't get through to you morons.
When net neutrality is gone Nothing stops google from paying comcast To throttle google's competition And google's competition is not as big as google So they cannot afford a counter payoff Google actually gets legitimized methods to censor the internet as simply "doing business" And you support it because you hate google and think net neutrality repeal will hurt them But it actually just gives them the ability to conduct even more censorship
Kevin Wright
See: Google is a natural monopoly.
Aaron Myers
Wow it's almost as if you are describing the exact defense of anti-NN regulations, but in reference to search engines and news feeds. I think you understand that though so I'm just giving an explanation for the brainlets to chew on.
how did google break the internet to prevent me from using my internet access to get to stormfront?
what if comcast decides stormfront is a terrorist front? do you think the isp can block the website from their end?
Evan Wood
They’re afraid to be against trump now that they’ve invested so much into it
Grayson Long
Then what's happening here
>homeralwaysdotheopposite.jpg
Ian Taylor
Title II does nothing to fix the core problem though. It only makes it worse. And with title II in place, it makes it much harder to get any decent legislation passed that would address the core issues.
Michael Morales
Stormfront is different, I think he meant Daily Stormer.
Brody Rivera
How it's not already makes no sense.
Wyatt Garcia
what does it monopolize when there are other search engines like bing and yahoo?
are you talking about youtube? i don't watch cute animal vids or le edgy teen selfie rants
Logan Lewis
can you explain how throttling is realistic and why the FTC wouldn't do anything about it?
Robert Bell
No it is not essentially the same thing the registrars went with it because nobody likes the content of the stormer and they didn't want to get castigated in the wider media as 'that registrar that lets nazis use their service', not because google made a request that they never have to follow
Comcast on the other hand is already outright admittedly and openly planning on throttling you. It's a hop/skip/jump away from internet censorship, and comcast is run by the same people running MSNBC, timewarner the same people as CNN
And yet you would call those channels fake news and attack them for openly lying to you and the general public
but somehow we have you arguing in favor of CNN and MSNBC controlling what websites people can access online, and you cannot actually articulate any reason WHY you think that's a good idea except "it will hurt google!"
In spite of me pointing out that google not only plays along with the same kind of censorship game that CNN and MSNBC do, but that this repeal of net neutrality actually gives google a way to buy censorship and throttling outright so they can forcibly censor rather than just 'request' censorship
I cannot understate how goddamn fucking stupid you are. You have a room temperature IQ, you dumbfuck.
Anthony King
Just like all regulations it's the big companies like Comcast that can afford to comply with them, while upstarts and smaller competitors cannot. NN is the same way, it forces the carrier to charge the same no matter the size of the object being shipped.
Evan Cruz
agreed 110% i still have not switched over to NBN because i fucking want fiber to my home. Ill bet 110 dollars when i do switch to nbn the copper from my home to the DP will be shit and i will have massive packet loss and huge ping. Before i went to 4G internet for home i would be lucky to get 3 Megabit per second with 160 ping on ADSL 2
Jacob Evans
>how did google break the internet to prevent me from using my internet access to get to stormfront? Again, see daily stormer. Familiarize yourself with this case because it is obvious you do not understand what is going on.
Title II does nothing at all to protect speech on the internet.
Julian Foster
>make internet utility >govt subsidized for all the niggers on welfare
Brayden Kelly
This right here.
Easton Garcia
Google is not primarily a search engine company, retard.
Cameron Bennett
>Hur Durr the dumb libs just two the party line and never think for themselves >The_Donald faggots LITERALLY want to repeal net neutrality because it's a vaguely right-wing or 'Trump-approved' position This is extremely embarrassing.
Eli Cooper
>can't the government access your browsing history regardless of NN or no NN? >can't multibillion dollar companies who are essentially monopolies at this point just charge whatever the fuck they want? >i am free
i bet anything there's going to come a time where ISP will offset cost of communications maintenance and expansion with government contract which will eventually lead to free mandatory internet
Liam Wright
my apologies, but didn't go daddy deregister daily stormer... what does that have to do with google
can't daily stormer find another registrar? and what does that have to do with google "throttling my internet"
Austin Evans
Fuck no, utilities are heavily regulated by the government, and they're all shit. Look at what the FCC did to TV, radio, and telephone lines. All of it is pure dogshit. The internet is ALIVE and vibrant, and it's done perfectly well for the last 30 years without the Feds getting their dirty hands on it.
I'm gonna say this once: We don't need to go crying to daddy government every time there's a potential issue in the marketplace.
Nicholas Evans
You really don't understand how the internet works.
There is no difference between an old comcast fiber line and an upstart isp fiberline - actually the new guy probably has better hardware and software that enables more bandwidth, lower latency, and higher throughput if anything
Good christ this is like talking to retards who think the internet is a series of tubes
Ethan Howard
They're just Comcast shills eating ass online without the realization that soon they will be out of a job.
James Cook
>the registrars went with it because nobody likes the content of the stormer and they didn't want to get castigated in the wider media as 'that registrar that lets nazis use their service', False. You think Albanians give a shit about anything like that? Or Anguilla? No. There is more that Google can do to force them.
Hudson Morris
I'm not familiar with Daily Stormer, but a distraction tactic people keep doing here is bringing up the unrelated issue of censorship by domain hosts in response to NN. I'm guessing shills because it's been pushed extremely persistently in spite of being explained many times they're unrelated issues.
Grayson Roberts
>people selling their morals and ethics out for a dime
I honestly consider this lower than being a whore
there isn't a word that fully encompasses just what this kind of person is
Brody Brooks
> it forces the carrier to charge the same no matter the size of the object being shipped But user that's not the case. Otherwise you wouldn't be paying more for a higher bandwidth.
Eli Hughes
i mean just imagine how dark everything would get if people suddenly got bored of the internet and stop using it. the government would shit itself when it can't tell what the population is doing.
Oliver Morgan
Comcast and Time Warner do not have our best interests at heart, but they are driven by the profit motive, which lets us consumers keep them in check to a certain degree. We have ZERO control over the government.
Xavier Lopez
If facebook, google and amazon are the big bad pro-fed bogeyman in all of this then why are none of them going black like they did for SOPA? Why would a bigger industry then the ISPs let this slide out of their favor?
Because they're in bed with the ISPs and they will get the fast-lanes.
You know who will get throttled? Sup Forums Who else? Anybody with an unpopular opinion.
NN doesn't hurts the internet monopolies because startups will have to pay a premium to not get throttled. Therefore it means less competition. Have you ever fantasized about FB going out of style like myspace and having the 'berg lose all his money? Kiss that dream goodbye.
Jordan Ward
>actually the new guy probably has better hardware and software that enables more bandwidth, lower latency, and higher throughput if anything Lol what? where do you live? the "new guy's" internet is slow af and goes down if lighting strikes two states away.
Brayden Gonzalez
You don't seem to understand what title II is, dipshit. FCC regulating what is and is not a "common carrier" is a hard barrier to entry. As of now, ISPs only have soft barriers to entry.
Oliver King
so what are your actually afraid of?
what will google monopolize?
daily stormer according to (((news media))) was removed by the registrar, godaddy -- what does that have to do with google monopolizing things and restricting my access to a website taken down by its registrar?
Benjamin Nelson
Even if google can price out their competition it's not something they want to be forced into doing because frankly google is already winning by leaps and bounds and NN being repealed would just mean them having to shell out a bunch of cash to the ISPs to maintain their current speed.
Landon Butler
>some bad thing could possibly potentially happen >we need daddy government to pre-save us >flag