How much of the Major and the other main character's stories am I missing if I ONLY watch this movie and Innocence?
Stand Alone Complex and Arise dont look half as philosophical or beautifully animated. Please tell me I dont need to see them and I can end the series after these two movies.
Just watch the hollywood remake
SAC is very good. Stop being a faggot.
SAC and the first movie are the only ones you need to see.
If you want philosophical stick with the movies, SAC is more geared towards Section 9 missions but still retaining smart dialog and some complex themes
SAC is great, you should at least watch that
Skip all of that malarkey and read the manga
They are all good really, you'll want more major by the time you finish the movie.
I will only watch SAC on one condition,
if you can explain WHY Major isnt a loli like she became after the first movie. Is SAC a bridge between the first movie and the second? If so why isnt she child sized when her big titty body was destroyed in the first movie?
Is this b8?
2 different universes/timelines, same characters.
Not that hard to figure out.
This faggot
Don't watch it then nigger, fuck off
The hell is Arise then? I thought SAC was a bridge between the first and second movie and possibly showing how Major "disappears" into the net since Batou in the second movie said she disappeared somehow although she was still with him in her loli body from the first movie.
So youre saying SAC is a "what if" universe? Then what is Arise, a reboot? Sorry for the questions and thanks for answering.
If I remember correctly there is an episode where she uses a younger body.
Different interpretations of the manga.
AKA different universes
DUH
Arise is a 3rd universe
The 1995 movie and innocence were the first animated interpretation of the manga.
SAC was the second.
Arise the third.
Is not that hard.
>Stand Alone Complex and Arise dont look half as philosophical or beautifully animated
Being less "philosophical" than Innocence is a benefit.
that anime not familiar for meh..
SAC is totally different. Oshii's subdued style is very distinct, and I'd almost say the movies have more in common with Sky Crawlers and Jin-Roh than with SAC.
But it's worth it. Give it a few eps, especially if you haven't been spoiled yet.
We are the laughing guy
Why the fuck redo the same shit 3 times? Even if they are "different interpretations". It's kind of underwhelming.
>third universe
Are you fucking kidding me? So there are TWO "what if" timelines? I hope the three Majors dont meet up in some scifi based movie and we can just pretend the other timelines dont exist. Sounds ridiculous. So you're telling me SAC and Arise have no relation to the first and second movie? In that case thanks I guess I dont need to spoil 2 beautifully written films with shit shows pandering to ecchifags. The first two movies seem to handle Major as more than just waifumaterial, but an actual being going through existential crisis. Then again I never saw SAC or Arise.
Arise is not between either of the two, it's before all of them. You also don't need to watch it, it doesn't have much to offer.
None of the separate series (movies 1 and 2, SAC 1st + 2nd + Solid State Society, Arise) are actually sequels. They're all different works inspired by the same source material. Which is why certain scenes are sort of repeated between them.
The first season of SAC is my favorite GITS thing besides Innocence. You'd be doing yourself a disservice if you skipped it. Some of the episodes are a bit on the side of cyberpunk CSI, but most of them have something more to offer. And the overarching storyline is great.
Oh god, don't remind me about "Half the script is literally philosophical quotes" the movie.
Thanks. I'll check out the first GitS season but Arise looks like they just wanted an excuse to make Major look like a teenager.
Bro, it's not a multiverse. It's what said. Different interpretations of the manga.
I get you're trying to draw attention to your thread which I don't mind because I'm a big fan of the series.
Regardless, I encourage everyone else in this thread to check them all out and decide for themselves.
>I never saw SAC
>shit shows pandering to ecchifags
wew user
>multiverse
What does that mean? That all timelines are canon but seperate?
well Arise feels like a sequel becouse it shows how the group gets together, I think is a way to protrais the mayor as a younger person.
The movies are best as standalone unconnected things. You only need to watch Solid State Society (the SAC movie) to see this.
Doing the thing as a TV series gives us in depth explorations of the character's personalities in a way that would never be possible in the movies. It also allows more exploration of ideas that couldn't support a full movie, but can support a single episode.
Arise didn't need to happen, it's a pretty shitty cash in.
>sequel
I meant prequel
>sequel
Meant prequel
They're all separate. It's not even a canon issue.
Just different takes and interpretations over similar characters and settings.
I refuse to watch any of the CGI movies because they look like utter shit. I don't know why they continue to go with that look when no one liked it the 1st time.
also to be fair, the original film was boring as shit. Waaaay too much dialogue and 2deep4u bullshit. It really isn't worth the trouble of seeing.
what did you expected user? robofights?
Does Puppet Master show up in SAC or Arise? His character goals are some of the most interesting ive ever seen. I ship him and Major all time.
Also would you count Loli Major as their child? Isnt she literally a fusion of them?
>Puppet Master
there is a better puppet master on solid state
something less boring as fuck especially considering many consider one of the best anime films of all time when it really isn't.
what would you say about Akira?
There's no single canon. They are all their own thing. So is the manga, which none of them are actually using the timeline of. It just happens that GITS is a really nice universe with a wealth of ideas to draw on and some strong characters. It was also very popular, which helps.
Akira's plot was a complete fucking mess, but it at least was nice to look at and had exciting moments. Just like GITS though I consider it grossly overrated.
Ghost in the Shell is vastly overrated. It has some nice visuals and themes, but half the film is spent doing nothing, just moving slowly, which can't be justified when your running time is only 80 minutes.
Read the manga first.
>Ghost in the Shell is vastly overrated
I bet he thinks Love hime is a masterpiece
>dude muh philosophy
Kill yourself but before you do watch SAC.
not the same guy but it is. people in the thread gives reasons to why it is. It's not a very entertaining film. It drags for way too long. I don't see how you can call something bair when it's more than a reasonable complaint.
God anime fans are so fucking autistic.
>It drags for way too long
That's wrong.
Also, 1995 is the best of the franchise. SAC is good but not as good - and for diff reasons.
1995 was philosophical but not nauseating like Innocence
>GitS
>too long
>That's wrong.
except it does. Most of the movie is talking. Not that I have a problem with scenes involving talking, but when it's about shit I don't care about, it becomes incredibly obnoxious. I find myself sitting there for long periods of time waiting for something to happen. It is a slow dull film.
Did she consent?
For the discussion about the GitS movie, it's shit and don't let any entry level faggot, Sup Forums crossborders or clueless ''critics'' from the west tell you otherwise.
It sure has nice animation for the time and a fucking amazing OST, but that is. Almost nothing happens in the film and not in a K-ON sense where things do happen but are not of much importance, in the case of GiTS it's really nothing happening at all, which is why the movie is boring as fuck. As for the ''philosophy'' part, there's some pretty cringe-tier parts like the boat scene and the overall theme of loss of identity isn't even properly explored, it's just handled at a surface level.
I could name tons of better anime films and will never understand why GITS got so much praise. It is because westerners find appealing, like cowboy bebop? It's the theme of gender identity that our medium loves so much?
>It sure has nice animation for the time
Eh, not really. It's basically on the same level as Patlabor 2.
>It's basically on the same level as Patlabor 2.
Which basically confirms what I said
The first two Patlabor movies look fantastic, user. That is praise for GitS.
So is she a child of Puppet Master and Major or merely Major pregnant with the code of Puppet Master which she will use to "birth" new life inside the net fusing her code with his?
Personally, I think the ending of Innocence implies that its Major. For example, Batou asks "Are you happy the way you are now?". In my opinion I think that means he is asking if Major is happy being changed by Puppet Master with the new power of being able to journey through the net. If it was a "child" of Major and Puppet Master then he wouldnt ask the child that question since the child was naturally born a powerul being able to journey through the net like her father the Puppet Master.
Daily reminder this shit captures everything GitS was and more
So what's a deep movie to you then?
Also
>our medium
>Most of the movie is talking
Underage plz
This and Angel's Egg are the worst Oshii films
>defending long drawn out dialogue scenes in an animated film
don't be a faggot. he's right.
Angel's egg is great though. confusing, but cozy as fuck.
Completely backwards taste, never post again.
The manga is a lot of schlock and technical jargon, SAC is more just a paramilitary circlejerk with some philosophy thrown in, and Arise just sucks.
>Girl walks in
>there's a brown guy
>the city is dark
>there's some statues
>religious symbolism
>the girl wants to protect the egg
>girl encounters guy
>the two go to girl's house
>girl falls into the abyss
>movie ends
>masterpiece, AOTD 10/10
you're missing one thing the major has a ghost so by fusing with the puppet master she's V2.0
It pushed the medium beyond what had been exhibited before. Yes, it's not Hegel, but the themes it explored, namely cyborgs, identity, memory, the vastness and mysteriousness of the net, all played into the massive paradigm shift the mainstream was experiencing in the 1990s and early 2000s, and reach into the modern era because we're still coming to grips with the philosophical issues an ever increasingly technologically advances society poses. It doesn't have to be a fast paced or action packed movie because each dialog scene provides a new idea to explore and the slow pacing gives the viewer time to contemplate and understand these ideas. Your criticism that it is so underrated might be valid if it didn't inspire essentially all of the philosophical-techno movies of the late 1990s/early 2000s (matrix, and potentially avatar come to mind as some of the "biggest names" of what it inspired).
You're only a contrarian because you're not looking at the fact that every movie that "did it better" (if they even did) came out after it and was inspired by it. It's like saying "lol the beatles are so boring I've heard this 1000x times", when the beatles are THE REASON YOU'VE HEARD IT 1000 TIMES!
it's in no way the greatest film ever, but it is cozy as fuck and pretty to look at.
To add on, these ideas were not necessarily /new/ at the time, certainly not to philosophers or computer scientists, hell some of them date back to the 1800s (locus solus is a pretty on the nose reference in the second film), but they captured these ideas in an artful way at the exact perfect moment when the public was becoming aware of computers enough to become receptive to them. The only thing that comes close is maybe NGE but it has some inherent weaknesses created by the very nature of it being a series instead of one movie that prevented it from achieving this idea. Plus the ideas that it dealt with were more esoteric and non-relatable.
So yeah, it's a pretty great fuckin movie
As far as I am concerned the Ghost in the Shell adaptations (anime,movie,games,the scarlett johansson movie) are different timelines that are good on their own but will never be the same as the original manga.
I still don't get how the man that directed most of Patlabor OVA1 and the first movie also directed Patlabor 2, GitS and Innocence.
Ive never understood what a "ghost" is. Isnt it just another word for "soul" ?
Doesnt that mean Puppet Master has soul too?
It's as though his producers gradually gave up on trying to restrain his sophistry.
puppet master is a magical AI only humans can have a ghost I think its a soul GITS never really did dive into wtf a ghost is other than it can't really be copied kinda
The ambiguity is kind of the point, imo.
What is a soul, what is a ghost, what is a mind?
We have no answers in real life (concrete answers, obviously half of philosophy and religion has "answers"), and this is reflected by the ambiguity in the films. It's an important question to raise when we consider the possibility of "uploading" someone's brain data, does their "essence" go with it or is it lost? Is a new one created or can it only be imitated, a simulacra that may outlast its originator.
GiTS addresses all these questions and more without getting into the wordiness of it. 2/3 of post GiTS cyberpunk is just living in its backyard
The last sentence in the middle paragraph is literally SOMA. Play it if you want existential crisis.
>>defending long drawn out dialogue scenes in an animated film
I don't see how this is inherently bad. Can you explain?
Every thread.
The entire first movie is basically dedicated to dismantling the notion that humans have some sort of intangible quality that makes them inherently superior to AI.
Did Motoko agree or was she forced?
GiTS '95 is good, Innocence is indefensible trash, and SAC is better than both.
>philosophical
Kill yourself.
I watched those two movies and then i tried watching SAC but it got too boring for me and the second movie tried to hard to be deep. I still love the first movie though.
...
It's because of Kerberos Saga. It's Oshii's lifework, a hardboiled political / military crime/drama thing. See: Jin-Roh: The Wolf Brigade. Basically at some point Jin-Roh started turning everything he worked on into Kerberos, so all his stuff starts to look very same-y. He just strips all the levity out and shoehorns in future politics and military stuff. This kinda worked for Ghost in The Shell, which I agree is overrated but still a great film, but it was indefensible for Patlabor. His best work in this category is, of course, Jin-Roh.
You must be 18 to post on Sup Forums.
>What is a soul
Doesn't exist.
>what is a ghost
Literally just a thing made up in GiTS.
>what is a mind
"The element of a person that enables them to be aware of the world and their experiences, to think, and to feel; the faculty of consciousness and thought."
>does their "essence" go with it
No such thing.
>Is a new one created
The idea of some sort of "essence" of the mind is so fucking retarded, it's like centuries outmoded.
>a simulacra that may outlast its originator
Fucking kill yourself.
GiTS doesn't even address these questions. GiTS makes up the convenient idea of a "ghost" specifically so it DOESN'T have to be bothered with answering any of these questions. Thematically GiTS ('95) is about evolving beyond the current stage of human development via a digital catalyst.
I love how triggered elitist autists from Sup Forums always get whenever you mention anything related to philosophy in Japanese animation.
This film is by far the best thing related to GitS and it's barely related to GitS.
Oshii really did something amazing with the mediocre source material.
I'm a bit GITS fan but SAC is shit
You seem like a pseud.
Bold proclamations that something doesn't exist are a sign that whoever you're talking to isn't nearly as read as they think they are.
Not really. SAC is praised because it's a bog standard political drama with lots of exposition, easily relatable characters and features Major at all times because she's the familiar mascot. People rejected Innocence because it's "not GITS", despite being better than SAC with a fraction of SAC's runtime.