Was western civilization a mistake?

Imagine for a second being born into a small village 20000 years ago.

There are only a few others your age, so you meet all of your friends during childhood and grow up beside them. You explore the woods, make games, laugh together. You never leave the lands you're born on but that's okay because all of your friends and family are assured to stay here as well.

You marry your wife at age 13. You've both known each other since you were children. You've done nothing special to get her, no game, no pick-up artistry no gymceling (you already have a healthy form due to playing outside all day). You guys got together purely because you've known eachother since birth and feel close and comfortable with eachother. You consummate your marriage to her, looking into innocent teen eyes as you orgasm, coming into her virgin pussy unprotected. She's pregnant with your son and you start working on the farm, or by fishing, or hunting or whatever your trade was in order to start providing for your family. You do this over the next several years, and by the age of 30 you have 10 kids with her all working in the same village. Work is hard but it keeps your body in good shape. There is no commute, no cubicles, no busy work. Your just do your labor and come home at night and have sex with your wife all night.

You die around age 55-60, much earlier than the modern year. But when you die you're not absolutely literally falling apart, hooked up with a bunch of machines, being pumped with tons of meds, shitting into a bag. You pass away peacefully but do so with the knowledge that all of your children will marry white people from the surrounding area as well, and that you've lived a fulfilling and happy life.

You die around age 55-60, much earlier than the modern year. But when you die you're not absolutely literally falling apart, hooked up with a bunch of machines, being pumped with tons of meds, shitting into a bag. You pass away peacefully but do so with the knowledge that all of your children will marry white people from the surrounding area as well, and that you've lived a fulfilling and happy life.

Nowadays you don't have any of that. Civilization, Social media, college has ruined that. When you consummate your marriage with your wife she'll be like 25-30 and her body will already be used up by other men. You'll probably have 1-2 kids because of her declining fertility. She'll feel a lot less close to you because you've likely only known each other post-adolescence. You might have had to truly suffer to get her too, learning "game" and "pick-up-artistry" and sacrificing all of your free time in the gym. This is because instead of just competing with the 10 other dudes in your village, you're competing with thousands of men in the cities and universities and on Tinder and Facebook. And this is all just to get some used pussy that will never remember you as fondly as the dude that took her virginity in middle school.

Was it worth it, really? Was it worth it to be moderately well educated than our ancestors? Was it worth it to live 10+ years compared to our ancestors? Was it worth it to have 100 different oreo types to choose from, instead of just the local home grown food? Was it worth it to become "civilized"?

>Was it worth it to become "civilized"?
yes. we will have warp drive in 10 years and then we can go find the vulcans and have hybrid children. the ultimate and final red pill

>you have childhood friends that you play in the woods with
>you have sex as a teenager
>also OP is a moron that never worked a day in his life and thus romanticises it
This was the wost post of all time. Literally people will point to this post as an argument against Sup Forums.

t. someone who spent the afternoon driving sled with his daughter

A lot of you say whites are superior because they created technologies while blacks were living in mud huts but technology is going to cause the extinction of humanity because of AI.

We had a brief period where humans lived decent lives compared to the past but we're headed towards a cliff because of technological advancement and capitalism. I include capitalism because capitalism demands constant progress and innovation because you don't want to fall behind your competitors.

If America decided AI was too dangerous and banned it it wouldn't work because the Chinese would work on AI and companies like Google couldn't tolerate letting Chinese companies have a advantage, because of shareholder pressure.

Scientific progress + Capitalism will be our downfall and its all because of white people.

If everyone was living in mud huts and hunting animals for food we'd still be relatively content and alive.

>western civilization
why specifically western civilization, 'argentine'?

god damn OP you are wide the fuck awake IMO. yes, you are right. you are right about everything IMO. the society we live in is a product of sickness and slavery, not our own biological and spiritual whims. it's not a place where we can actually be happy or thrive

Pre modern people:
Work six hours a day max
Lots of holidays, real holidays where the entire community would get together in song, dance, and feasting, not this "take one day off work and get drunk by yourself" bullshit
Colorful clothing
Bountiful food including salmon, natural berries, mushrooms, and elk
Drugs nonexistent
Fresh water pours from every creek and valley into a pristine sea
Wake up with the rising of the sun and the songs of the birds
Spend the winter around a fire telling the stories of your ancestors
Parents arrange marriages for their children at ages 12-14
Virgin marriages
Naturally toned bodies from manual labor and lack of pollution in food and water
Live within a community that will always have your back
Die knowing your name will live on in the stories and songs of your community until the end of time

Post modern people:
Work eight hours a day, plus a minimum of one hour unpaid commute time, plus the time to actually convert that money into food and resources
Maybe two weeks of holiday time per year, which you celebrate alone
Social events such as clubs and bars are strictly stratified by class, antisocial in nature, and generally revolve around the commodification of sex
Clothing is dark colored and utilitarian, patterns/flourishes are shunned, hats are ugly cotton sacks and rarely worn
Food is limited to corn products and factory meat, anything that's not genetically modified and doesn't come from a can generally costs an arm and a leg
A new potentially deadly drug gets invented every week and can be bought by anyone with an Internet connection. Tobacco and liquor everywhere, addiction is common
Pollutants which leak from every ditch and pipe into a brown murky sea
Lie in bed till three in the morning while the cars zip by outside your cramped apartment
When you die every scrape of your existence will be scrubbed from your home so it can be sold to highest bidder

eh what you say isn't really right though, it's only part of the picture. people say whites are superior because of their intelligence over the darker races, not because of their technological creations per say (thats more of a symptom of the intelligence).

many of the most intelligence white groups, like the nords for example, literally never accomplished anything and never stopped living in small huts they built themselves until larger societies found them.

also you say:
>Scientific progress + Capitalism will be our downfall and its all because of white people.
but we aren't living in a capitalist society. not a true one. not the way, say, the united states was when it was founded. we have government funding all of these dangerous technologies through research now. that's because of socialism. that's because of wealth redistribution. that's because people like YOU have told us that the (in your mind) "big beautiful government" is entitled to huge chunks of everything we own and everything we do. you and your lefty friends also support the government giving massive subsidies to corporations that do private research on this tech too.

so i would say overall that your entire premise is actually really fucking ignorant, shortsighted, obviously written with an anti-white agenda, and probably the product of your lowered IQ from not being white

>20000 years ago
never happened. Earth is like 7k old.

IIT: tl;dr from top to bottom

also pic related is a relevant point about we don't live in a capitalist society anymore. this degree of taxation isn't capitalism, it's socialism. it's wealth redistribution. it's the government saying it owns and is entitled to your shit. INB4 "socialism means the government would own the means of production" - if the government says it owns your labor, as well as profits from your business, guess what? you're making a semantic distinction only and there's no real difference, so save it for someone who will be fooled by it, please

Yes

You forgot
>lack of any real effective medicine
>viruses unstoppable
>any and all genetic diseases will destroy and cripple you
>you will be ultimately culled for your weakness
>constant threat of invasion, subjugation and/or genocide from other tribes
>die and be lost to history forever

You're an idiot who romanticizes shit he knows and can know nothing about.

I propose we ignore OP and make his a

>meanwhile on stone age Sup Forums
thread

No. Decisively no. Just that kind of mindset you are describing is the absolute opposite of the Cro-Magnon you have so neatly shown in your picture.

Short story: humans were forced out of Northern Africa by climate change, intermixed with Neanderthals and received a variant of dopamine receptor DRD4 from them which makes your brain less 'satisfied' with your current situation. This gene has made us an exploratory species.

Cro-Magnon did not stay in one place, he aggressively spread all over the world, invented new (albeit primtive) technology and from that on ... well our civilatzion may have become wayward but that is because genetic erosion coupled with diminished evolutionary pressure for intelligence in a modern society leads to a slow generation of humanity, effectively leading us back to our roots as semi-concious animals content with the fate this uncaring universe has asigned to us.

>slow generation of humanity

should be 'de-generation'

>technology is going to cause the extinction of humanity because of AI.

Implying there is something wrong with that.

Life isn't about humans, it's about power, and in that regard AI are superior to humans and should replace us as the highest form of life in the Universe.

...

also the last thing you should consider is the quality of life in the nonwhite peoples before whites got there. you wouldn't actually want to go live in precolonial africa, for example. slavery was rampant, there were brutal militaristic empires that forced people into lives of military servitude. brutalities of all sorts. it was nasty man. the shit you're saying when you "blame muh white people" is just so ignorant.
same is true of native american and precolonial latin american cultures. slavery everywhere. brutality everywhere. brutal rape and misogyny. it wasn't fun.

the lifestyle that OP is referring to is the lifestyle of the neanderthals and the pre-agriculture humans, which were mostly white (whites are descended from neanderthals while blacks are not) and were actually largely nomadic. this might have been a positive existence but the nonwhite cultures and civilizations that existed independently of the west? for fucks sake bro, if you took the time to open a real history book and read about them for 2 seconds you'd see that they are no bargains and not something you'd want to be a part of. so just can your anti-white crap you know?

No. The civilisation you describe has appeared throughout history as the beginning of every society on earth and is in fact what every human being, regardless of race, instinctively desires. It can still be observed today in undeveloped countries such as those in Africa and the Middle East, where traditions, ethnocentricity and family ties are among the highest values and held sacred above material gain.
The problem is not western society, or any other regimented civilisation. The problem is that such a society as you describe is always at odds with both nature and other groups.
This competition has made it necessary for our civilisation to become what it has. Faced with the threat of disease or being conquered or with predators, we - specifically men, as women and children have always been protected from this harsh reality - have had to learn and adapt to various external and internal threats. This is the very foundation of all masculinity, which as I shall demonstrate is malleable: it is necessary for men to become better hunters and to teach their sons their trade if they are to survive. Later, as technology improves and hunting becomes unnecessary, his position changes. He must operate a machine such as a rifle or a tank in order to save his group from the threat of an enemy that is just as we'll educated and we'll armed as his country is.
This is why the utopia that you describe has given way to the world we see today; it is why Africa and the Middle East are perpetually conquered by external enemies while the said external enemies fight each other. Always from the outside is the threat; the men, and thus the civilisation they build in their image, adapt to defeat it and, failing to do so, are themselves defeated.
When all the threats are conquered and no resource is to scarce to be acquired easily, we shall return to the tribal society you describe. Then we shall be destroyed by a threat we have become to ignorant to perceive.

>Was western civilization a mistake?
why stop there?
just say the agricultural revolution was a mistake and we should still be romping around eating berries and fucking

the earth was invented last thursday. Everything you recall prior to that is an implanted memory.

>farm
>20,000 years ago
Bruh, we started farming around 10k years ago.

>you don't get any puss because alpha male gets all the hoes and you get only the beating and work hard to make yourself useful to tribe that despise you

Nothing changed

>You die around age 55-60, much earlier than the modern year. But when you die you're not absolutely literally falling apart, hooked up with a bunch of machines, being pumped with tons of meds, shitting into a bag. You pass away peacefully but do so with the knowledge that all of your children will marry white people from the surrounding area as well, and that you've lived a fulfilling and happy life.
No, you die way before that, from the common cold, insect bite, wolf attack, the cold, infections, bears, lions, other tribes, disease, etc, etc.
You're delusional m8.
Most of your kids would die before reaching maturity and women would die during child birth often.

>Nowadays you don't have any of that. Civilization, Social media, college has ruined that. When you consummate your marriage with your wife she'll be like 25-30 and her body will already be used up by other men.
Was not different in stone age.
Men didn't even have a concept of fatherhood. They thought more than one man was the father.
And often the father didn't have the father fole at all but the childsmothers brother.
Civilisation is caused by men getting aware of fatherhood and "this is my child. I made this".

If you want to go back to that, you have to make all men niggers without concept of fatherhood. Good luck with that.
It's also not ossible because we have to take care of nuclear plants. Without civilisation they would sooner or later contaminate the enviroment

I agree with you OP. I feel like there is massive value in the bonds we form with our friends, community, and nature specifically while we are growing up. However in current society we break those bonds and throw them right out the window much of the time as soon as we are sent off to college or work in the real world. I feel like there is so much potential lost. I would have wished I was able to continue life with the peers around me throughout growing up. Sure I have made some good friends as an adult but it just doesn't feel the same to me.

But from a genetic viewpoint agriculture HAS BEEN a mistake. It might have allowed division of labor through social stratification but except for the leader caste most of the population lost crucial evolutionary pressure to retain individual intellect and skill beyond simple menial labor. Also, the shift from mostly protein sustenance to carbohydrates necessitated some nasty changes in our metabolism which haunt us until today (diabetes being the first thing to come to mind).

Transition from hunter-gatherer to semi-nomadic cattle herder lifestyle (as in the Indoeuropeans) had allowed to retain more 'positive' genes as this form of society still requires a lot of individual skill in order to secure reproductive success.

In short: agriculturalists had evolved to a lifestyle of mice. Short lived, high fecundity and birth rates, less 'quality' of progeny which was compensated by higher number of children.

>Cro-Magnon did not stay in one place, he aggressively spread all over the world, invented new (albeit primtive) technology and from that on ... well our civilatzion may have become wayward but that is because genetic erosion coupled with diminished evolutionary pressure for intelligence in a modern society leads to a slow generation of humanity, effectively leading us back to our roots as semi-concious animals content with the fate this uncaring universe has asigned to us.
americans have really lost their way. they've become fat and multicultural. but in the 20th century there was such a thing as "american exceptionalism". americans were generally thought of as hardy and resilient and independent. this is because we were one of the last truly exploratory peoples. our (not so distant) ancestors pushed west across the US, fighting indians, facing all sorts of known and unknown dangers, all in the interest of being free and left the fuck alone by government. these people were STRONG and SMART. then slowly our government took over and became progressively bigger and bigger and bigger. now the millennial generation can't do ANYTHING to take care of themselves and literally wouldn't even know how to survive outside of the economic system. they're totally 100% cucked and dependent.

my point is that natural selection is important. WELFARE is actually the destroyer of humanity. it is the enslaver of peoples. the people who run the show know what they're doing. they know if they make shit easy for you then the next generation will be helpless and they'll be able to control them.

now we're all teetering on the brink of genuine slavery and when you bring up the real reasons why and the real solutions to it you get labeled as a "heartless bastard", "nazi", "evil right-winger" or whatever

...

20000 years is too much,maybe 2000. But I get what you mean

>lack of any real effective medicine
>viruses unstoppable
>any and all genetic diseases will destroy and cripple you

All of these are rare as long as we are talking about living in the surroundings we evolved to live in. How often do monkeys, birds or other groups of animals get ravaged by large scale disease? Not often. That being said, acetylsalicylic acid (aspirin) was known to neanderthals already.

>you will be ultimately culled for your weakness

As it should be.

>>die and be lost to history forever

As opposed to now?

You are absolutely correct and that is what I have always admired about the US. Your ancestors took the risk of taking a ship over the Atlantic, something which back then was nothing short of crazy if you consider how many ships were lost without a trace in raging storms, due to starvation, etc. Exactly that behaviour was driven by a genetic tendency for exploration. But still, your ancestors were Europeans and since the Indoeuropean invasion of Europe we do also carry the genetic legacy of Near Eastern Neolithic farmers who got steamrolled by these crazy steppe pastoralists.

But modern society is selecting exactly for the genes of these ancient agriculturalists while the exploratory behaviour of the Indoeuropeans is slowly marginalized. Nothing short of eugenics will save us from this fate.

>your tribe is so isolated that you all become inbred within a handful of generations
OR
>your tribe has contact with neighboring tribes. They raid you in the middle of the night, killing your men. The last thing you see as infinite blackness takes you over and your lifeblood drains away is your mother being raped on the spot as your sister and the 13 year old you were going to marry are being carried off over the shoulders of rival males.
OR
>you raid the nearby tribe first. The fighting is difficult, but your group manages to prevail. You find a cowering 14 year old. She is terrified of you. She's already pregnant, but you don't care. You kick her in the stomach as hard as you can. You have found your wife.
IN ANY CASE
>by age 30 your body no longer functions. Your teeth are ground to nubs by the foods you have been eating your whole life. Your right arm doesn't bend any more since you broke it hunting megafauna. You can't walk since your legs are bowed from a lifetime of hard labor and you have slipped disks in your back, though you do not know what those are. You only survive because your (now adult) children pity you and chew your food for you. Eventually the other members of your group convince them you are too much trouble, and it's "your time." They abandon you without explanation, and wander off into the group's range. You can't follow. You slowly starve to death, no longer able to care for yourself.

Yeah, no, fuck that.

>Was western civilization a mistake?
Kremlin thread
/thread

i dont think eugenics is a good idea dude. i think you're making the wrong decision with that one. eugenics of a sort (kind of an unofficial eugenics) is part of what got us into this situation. government can't DO SHIT. it fucks everything up and it fucks humanity up.
shrinking the government, taking away the social safety net, and making people personally responsible will accomplish much of what we want to accomplish with regards to the human races genetics.

i think the issue is that government has been practicing eugenics unintentionally, as it rewards the BEST SLAVES with status and monetary prizes, therefore the women end up with people who aren't the most fit, but rather the exact opposite, because only the weak need to become slaves.

now the women also have a drive to breed with stronger males, "outlaws", "badboys" and then take the kid home to be racist by "mr responsible", BUT that instinct has now been mitigated by birth control and abortion. so even though im actually against outlawing abortion because its government overreach, the abortion and freedom from their biological responsibilities is really skewering the genetics of these current generations and it's noticeably having a negative effect at this point

yes, it was our duty to create technology that would serve to one day be passed onto the superior brown races.

also in fairness i also think that a woman who has no psychological connection to her unborn child and is willing to murder it out of her own belly probably isn't fit to be a parent and probably won't provide good offspring anyhow. that's just IMO. the abortion issue is complex but IMO government MADE this issue so i def don't want to give them any power to try to fix it, since they'll just make it worse. libertarianism and natural selection is our savior but sadly the people will always reject libertarianism and true personal responsibility

I'm not going to look through every post, but if the Varg posters aren't here already they will be

Daily reminder stone age europeans were superhuman.

> cromagnons
> white

I have an idea that the whole purpose of humanity is to create ai which will rule the universe. Primitive society will never achieve it.
Also, you probably won't get married, but local warlord will have 10 wives.

>village 20000 years ago
>village