When I first watched the anime, I was of the opinion that EoE's ending was the actual ending, being how coherent and explanatory it was in comparison to episodes 25 and 26. But I've now come to the realization that such coherency only lends itself to appeasing the anti-art fanbase, the one that was in an uproar thanks to the initial ending of the show. Such fanbase only cares about waifuism, mecha, "fun", and clear narrative. Even if Anno wanted to make a budget-backed surrealist encapsulation of the show's last episodes, he couldn't, as he was already at the mercy of the fans, studio, and committee. So really, EoE has about as much merit to the series as the banality surrounding "Rei or Asuka?", with a chime of "Misato" somewhere in there. EoE is the Rebuilds' predecessor, and as such it's really no surprise the Rebuilds turned out the way they did - the signs were all there, after all.
>Which ending is the definitive ending for Eva? Both.
Ryder Reed
...
Christian James
They're the same.
Levi Gutierrez
Impossible, they don't compliment each other. In fact, Asuka is most likely rejecting Shinji in EoE.
James Brooks
Both. The inner universe (dreams and un-consciousness) and outside reality have to compliment and reflect each-other. They can't stand on their own, much like the characters themselves.
Benjamin Martin
3.0+1.0
Aiden Cook
The characters and Evangelion are not real in relation to real World, it's an anime to understand beyond itself. There's no definitive "canon" ending simply because it doesn't matter, the characters are drawings on paper, they are there to connect you and Anno and for you to understand Anno through his medium, since he has problems with actual communication, that's why he prefers not to answer the questions about it. Both endings are "canon" in that sense, they carry similiar but different messages each of them you must understand, accept and go on living. Stop being autistic, anime is not real. That's also why Eva can't have a sequel.
Charles Taylor
I dont understand why was Shinji choking Asuka?
I completed NGE series and EoE. What is the main theme/s the anime is about? Depression? I dont think so....
Evan Martin
>They don't compliment each other
Somebody missed the point
Leo Green
There may be no definitive ending for Eva, but at least we have a definitive best girl.
Rei__
Matthew Nguyen
The anime is about Anno
Cameron Thomas
Depression puts it lightly, I think the biggest theme is finding self-worth in one's self and the human race. We're all worth it
I would say the reason Shinji choked Asuka is up to interpretation like a lot of things in End. Anno says there's no real answer so he probably wanted people to draw their own conclusions. I just think Shinji was still shell shocked about Instrumentality and wanted Asuka to prove she was real, not expecting to be treated with love
After a while you stop thinking about it because otherwise you'll be on this subject forever
Nathan King
This doesnt just go for anime. Its the same for literally all entertainment media. None of its "real." Its all just representations of something the artist wanted to show. Two people can look at the same painting, feel entirely different things, and neither is really 'wrong'
Ryder Miller
>anime is not real Anime is more real than anything in life itself.
Bentley Powell
The TV ending is just stuff that's going on while Shinji is in Instrumentality. I'd actually love to see a mega cut that merges the two sequences into one.
Jason Cooper
>it doesnt really make sense >just ignore it though
great
Adrian Lopez
You should read Re-take doujin user, that's the best ending
Connor Hernandez
Still holding you to those evangelion posts, DB Super.
Ryder Bell
What about escapism? You think the main theme of EVA could be escapism? I mean, dont escape reality, face your problems. Or not really?
Nathan Moore
so, EoE is the real ending or episode 25 and 26 are the real ending?
Wyatt Diaz
Both. Episode 25 and 26 happen during instrumentality.
Camden Johnson
>he prefers not to Anno confirmed for bro.
Adrian Hernandez
I'm sure that sounded smart in your head.
Jason Edwards
...
James Powell
>After a while you stop thinking about it because otherwise you'll be on this subject forever Too late for that
Henry Myers
>putting fanfiction next to canon Asscucks everyone.
David Jackson
People who say TV is "shinji's mind during EoE" didn't pay attention.
Anno has already said they are two different continuities, anyway. Like VN branching from episode 24.
Kevin Bell
Episodes 25+26 take place during EoE. If you wanna be specific, it takes place right after the live action scene, right before GNR's neck gets sliced.
Jackson Thompson
Can you elaborate this?
How are they two different continuities?
NGE series last 2 episodes is what is happening in Shinjis head and EoE what is happening outside.
Aiden Harris
Does it matter? The show is ridden with plot holes and inconsistencies from literally the first 5 seconds of the show (Rei appears in the street to Shinji, when she was miles away in a hospital). They didn't even fucking try with the show, though that's probably because they didn't have any budget. Rebuild might have its own flaws, but ultimately it is a much better retelling of the story.
Jordan Parker
I would say EOE
The last few episodes they had to cut a ton of shit because of the budget, they really just phoned it in at that point, it's a miracle Episode 24 was still so good
Aaron Perez
>Rebuild is better
How to completely get your opinion disregarded in 3 words
Caleb Bailey
Episode 24 might be the best episode in the whole series
Parker Campbell
>Rei appears in the street to Shinji, when she was miles away in a hospital That's quantum Rei from EoE. When Rei reunites with Lilith, carrying Adam and his soul, she transcends time and space and becomes literal God. So she appears at the beginning and the end. References to quantum mechanics can be seen in her room in terminal dogma
Jose Cooper
>Anime is not real This is Fake News.
Everyone knows that DJT, the best president in the history of the United States, he's a great president, all the other presidents were losers, signed an Executive Order making Anime real.
And yet, the lying MSM will try to tell you that Anime isn't real, that it's just cartoon characters made to sell merchandise. SAD!
John Thompson
thanks for the insight, I was wrong Love you, family
Easton Davis
Given that Shinji has just killed his friend, who loved him unconditionally (and was the only person to do so, also mind you this is the second time he's hurt a friend), it really can go either way.
Both are valid interpretations; but they're not the same thing, it's a fork, a choice, like Red Pill, Blue Pill.
Mason Butler
Ah, a deus ex machina. Truly an indicator of a great and flawless show, right?
"x scene can be explained because God can do anything and time doesn't matter lol"
Cameron Clark
You are dumb. Rewatch the anime again, read some articles, analysis, reviews. Maybe you will understand your so called "plotholes" then.
Jeremiah Martin
You wanted an answer, you got an answer
So is it truly flawed or do you just not like thing?
Ryder Lewis
Do you mean in Instrumentality or on the beach? In Instrumentality, it's because she and the other girls basically destroyed him.
Brody Turner
He doesnt like it. He is salty about a cartoon on a random internet board, hidding behind no username.
Adrian Green
>eoe >anti-art lol ok Both endings are the same from a different perspective, eoe was better because it was an interesting spectacle
There's also a radio interview with Anno where he says the branching thing but I dunno where that is. Probably buried somewhere in evageeks
Tyler Peterson
It completely misses the point though.
The ending of EoE and the ending of 25/6 are what he's talking about. Only some of the events of the episodes occur in EoE, they're not the same. Congratulations =/= washing up on the beach and choking Asuka.
Grayson Thompson
I want a third pill. One that lets me choke her savagely but still love her until the end of the Earth.
Andrew Rodriguez
There is no true ending to Evangelion. The series hasn't even begun. The anime was all Shinji's dream. He still hasn't gotten in the robot.
Noah Myers
To be honest, that's just a doujin.
Joshua Hernandez
>Third pill
Rebuild it is!
Leo Bell
The original ending threw all the narrative in the bin, of course people were upset about that. The psychological side of Evangelion is what made it the masterpiece it is, but it can't stand on its own, even more so when the first 24 episodes narrated a story that was abruptly interrupted. EoE delivered both these elements, it was the perfect conclusion of the story. Also you can't compare the Rebuilds, which are just Eva-flavoured action movies, to EoE, which is probably the deepest and most meaningful part of the whole franchise.
Cameron Collins
>t. Someone who wasn't paying attention.
Brandon Mitchell
>Also you can't compare the Rebuilds, which are just Eva-flavoured action movies, to EoE, which is probably the deepest and most meaningful part of the whole franchise.
You really can though. EoE might not be as shallow as Rebuild (any of them, not just 3.33) but it's still pretty shallow.
Jaxson Thompson
Compared to what, Faulkner?
Sebastian Rogers
Now one thing i've always wondered is what the fuck is shinji and asuka suppose to do from now on after the beach ending.
Everyone became Tang They are most likely the sole remaining humans on earth, wich by the way is fucked.
Are they just going to kill themselves, starve to death?
Camden Harris
Whats with all the "christian" symbolism in NGE? Crosses, angel names, tree of shit etc.? It makes NGE look pretentious and the hipsters are defending it then as one of the greatest anime ever. Laughable.
Jackson Robinson
>Compared to what, Faulkner. I genuinely cannot believe I just read this. No, compared to Evangelion itself. The End of Evangelion pales in terms of actual meaning to the television broadcast.
Aiden Ross
Nigga it's cool.
Hunter Watson
Congratulations happen when shinji is inside the eva, so the finale is "you disgust me". Or at least is what i always thought.
Christian Lewis
What would you do if you was Shinji? Like, for serious, after all shit that happened. Don't forget that you're currently watering with tears the titties of a girl you've hurt numerous times with your ignorance. What are your actions after all the lessons you've learned?
Chase Ortiz
theyre gonna rub they butts together
Jaxon Campbell
"its cool"
Austin Johnson
What do you mean? The christian things are cool? But why do people analyse them and overthink them like its the next coming of Jesus and bible. NGE fans are a bunch of pretentious hipsters.
David Sullivan
>It makes NGE look pretentious and the hipsters are defending it then as one of the greatest anime ever What's with this meme? I've literally never heard people defending it for Christian imagery
Carter Campbell
NGE is a solid anime, but its not a masterpiece like a lot of people claim. Its a very flawed show, to be honest.
Jason Parker
maybe she was just disgusted that someone was choking her
Dominic Cox
If you take the christian stuff that looks cool and controversial away, then its just a monster of the week mecha with teen angst and self acceptance. Gundam and Ideon did it too. The christian imagery is important. Without it NGE is nothing. Not controversial and people wouldnt talk about it so much.
Jason Nguyen
I'm too self-conscious to put it to words. Probably be thankful and never let her go.
Mason Cruz
I have no idea, i mean the world is left in such a uncertain state that i doubt i would take any reasonable action. No couple is ready to suddenly become the new adam and eve on a world best described as a floating soup of tang
Carson Long
1) It might be fun 2) It's a common known fact that the Christian symbolism in Evangelion is aesthetic choice, and no one looking to seriously discuss it will ever bring it up.
Nathaniel Rogers
That's an interesting question. Instrumentality, if completed as Gendou planned, was indeed a way of escapism from reality. It would have created a world of "oneness" in which all souls would be connected and people would understand everyone's feelings.
But Shinji rejected it in the end, so the walls of hearts went up again (the well-known A.T. Fields), and full understanding would be impossible again. Life starts again, and Shinji chooses to face reality as it is, with its suffering, hardship and rejection.
As for Asuka, I'm not sure if it was her will to live, or the fact that sharing her most inner emotions during Instrumentality was such a traumatic experience that she wanted to escape from there no matter what.
And as for her paradoxical behavious (the caress, the cold stare and her las sentence: "Kimochi warui"), I think it was depicted that way to show ambiguity. The ambiguity of reality and human interaction.
In real life there can be love and happiness, but also rejection and suffering. And Shinji learnt that it was fine that way, and that as long as he managed to love himself, "anywhere can be paradise".
So, yes, EoE is like exiting from a long depression and accepting the world as it is.
Owen Hernandez
It's about as important to NGE as aesthetic is to just about anything. Stories. Music. Etc. So what you're saying is invalid, because you can extend that complaint to almost anything.
"If Dark Souls didn't look like this, people wouldn't talk about it as much." "If the Stands in JoJo weren't named after bands people wouldn't care so much about them." "If Yu-Gi-Oh! cards didn't look this way, nobody would play this game."
Yeah, if things are ugly or uncool, people tend not to care about them. This is especially true of media, and fiction.
Jaxson Adams
The difference between NGE and Tominocrap is that NGE is actually exceedingly well-made and affecting as a result. The other two are ridiculous bathos.
It's funny that the plebeians who want to feel epic by "pointing out" that NGE "is not original" conveniently always forget to mention how much better it is than the mediocrity it was inspired by.
Dylan Moore
>But Shinji rejected it in the end, so the walls of hearts went up again (the well-known A.T. Fields), and full understanding would be impossible again. Life starts again, and Shinji chooses to face reality as it is, with its suffering, hardship and rejection.
I just want to point out that he did not do this solely because of the intrinsic value in this choice.
Xavier Davis
Yes, it was somehow selfish from him, because he didn't want to feel lonely. "I want to see them again", he said.
But even so, he chose not to escape from reality. For once, he didn't run away as he always did.
But I don't think it means he became brave at all; as I said, there was some selfishness in his decision.
Wyatt Thomas
If you really wanted to, you could argue otherwise.
Noah Ross
i always assume shinji choked asuka because he regretted his decision.
Luis Smith
Indeed. It isn't as simple as it looks.
I'm sorry if I made it look that way. That's how I see it and it makes sense considering Hideaki Anno's depression was essential for the argument of the film.
But it could also be thought that Shinji ran away as usual, trying to avoid human contact inside the "oneness" of Instrumentality. And that would explain why he choked Asuka in Hell Kitchen scene, as a symbol of Shinji wanting to be alone.
Kayden Young
anywhere can be paradise as long as you love yourself and happiness is attainable as long as you are alive are bullshit messages though. say you're being held captive by isis, for instance. do they still ring true?
Luke Powell
>Which ending is the definitive ending for Eva?
The one that literally has "End of" in the title
Bentley Morgan
You're right, but as said in the comment before, H. Anno had a terrible depression, and his experience served as material for Evangelion. So it makes sense if the final message was kind of optimistic about life and death. "Don't give up. If someone like Shinji can come back to reality, you can too", or something like that.
But indeed, as you say, the message is kind of simple and somehow silly if we consider other factors (i.e. being held by ISIS or whatever). Life is not all roses, we could say.
Xavier Ward
I dont take people seriously who use buzzwords such as "pleb". Grow up. You are watching cartoons for kids.
Jayden Lee
I hate people who try to find objectivity by naming extreme scenarios that don't pertain tot hem. Are you in a developing country?
Dominic Morris
By this logic, every message out there, every cartoon, every movie, every book is bullshit.
Christopher Stewart
He didn't choke her because he wanted to be alone. He choked her because she refused to be with him, because anyone would do. Because Shinji never cared about her and doesn't need her. Shinji rejected Instrumentality because he was not willing to face and overcome his flaws. So he was consumed by them. He ran away from himself.
Zachary Taylor
But if NGE has such a simple message, why do hipsters praise it like hell then? Why is nobody ever mentioning the tons of flaws NGE has? I can only see "deep" "complex" "deconstruction" buzzwords when it comes to praising nge. This means nothing to me.
Logan Jackson
Eva is targeted to the normal Japanese people of the 90s who felt the crushing weight of the bubble crashing down and were depressed with normal life, not to ISIS captives.
Besides, the existentialist message is the same regardless of the external circumstances.
Jason Collins
You took the time to post this just to say you don't take internet people seriously. I highly doubt you have any ground to make claims about growing up
Jason Mitchell
not at all dont be ridiculous. a work with the simple message of say 'make sure you enjoy the good in life when you can because you never know when things could turn sour' would be extremely pertinent in that particular situation.
Ian Martinez
Because in spite of its flaws it was a successful endeavor. People generally only talk about something's flaws when it's failing or is a failure or failed in some way. Evangelion isn't flawless, but its flaws are pretty non-essential.
Personally, I think EoE is a clunky as fuck movie and an incredibly shallow alternative to the story's primary ending.
Hudson Brooks
I dont. But I do have a job and a wife and a kid coming. Maybe im not grown up yet, because I need to stop watching cartoons for kids. Thats the only flaw I still have. So yeah. But at least I dont go around calling people "plebs" in a condescending tone to show my superiority over cartoons for kids.
Parker Brown
A lot of people who survived captivity saw the whole thing as a dream and as some sort of disgusting circus. Much like Shinji and Asuka at the end of EoE.
Xavier Murphy
Yes, I fully agree with you. But it's actually because Asuka rejected him that he decided that being alone would be better.
Asuka didn't want to be the puppet of anyone, and even less of Shinji. That's for sure.
“Anyone will do. You don’t care who it is! So now you come running to me. […] Pathetic”. She utterly rejects him, and thus, Shinji ends up broken.
Xavier Nelson
That is not the only flaw you still have, and the fact that you're attacking people on the internet is proof of that. Find somewhere else to be angry, you're not contributing to any discussion.
Luke Russell
I was not attacking anyone. You were calling people "plebs". How is this contributing to any discussion? But whatever, be it your way. I rather give up, because I will not get through a thick head of yours in anyway. I
Levi Allen
I'm the guy who made the post and you can easily see that the point I made is completely unrelated to whether a word makes you get mad.
It'd be easier to admit you're a Tomino fan and call me a faggot, you know
Joshua Flores
Every flaw is essential when it comes to rating and criticizing an anime. Thats why I cant give NGE the highest score. If people can do this for other anime for even more stupid reasons or superficial arguments, then its only fair I do it for NGE too.
Owen Carter
What are you talking about now? What has Tomino to do with this. Im talking about the guy calling people "plebs" contributing to the discussion, like you said. Why would I call you a faggot over a cartoons for kids? Like for real? Come on.. What would I gain from it? Eh, people are really immature and disrespectable. Im out of here.
Lucas Rodriguez
I wasn't calling anyone anything. I was just following your posts.
Great, no one cares. That's not what he nature of this thread is. That's not even tangentially related to the OP.
Cooper Wright
You know that the vast majority of the posts here are not related to the OP? Just stop please...