Why do people have such a big hatred for "whiny" protagonists like Ikari Shinji, Ouma Shu...

Why do people have such a big hatred for "whiny" protagonists like Ikari Shinji, Ouma Shu, Igarashi Ganta and Amano Yukiteru?

Aside from maybe Yukiteru, I find these guys' whininess to be understandable for the most part.

Not everyone's a whiny little bitch like you, OP.

Shit taste mostly. A lot of people here watch anime as wish fulfillment and characters who are seen as weak or whiny they do not want to self insert in. There are also the autists that get mad whenever characters act irrationally like actual humans often do.

Agreed. Who would like being thrust into a situation like that.

They often say that Shinji is weak but he is quite strong actually. He runs away but he always returns and does what he has to do. He fights the most important war in the history of mankind with only 2 other 14 year olds.

This.

I'm really inclined to believe that people who shit on Shinji haven't watched EVA and just do it bebcause of the get in le fucking robot meme.

It's because these dense fucks don't realize that the characters are supposed to be normal human beings. Often even in their teens.

They expect every MC to be like Naruto, Goku or whatever battle shounen MC is popular nowadays.

Because people find whininess annoying. Being understandable doesn't change that.

>implying most people who find whininess to be annoying weren't whiny teenagers at some point

I don't see how that changes anything. Plenty of people dislike their past selves, just as they dislike their current selves.

Cause people watch cartoons to have fun, not to reevaluate their life or empathise with someone.
Fuck, even Christ had doubts about dying, even though he knew what was going to happen afterwards.

Because the average human being is a fratboy at heart and can't stand emotions that are anything besides "dude, lol xD"

So, how would you fix these types of characters? They're usually teenagers who are already established as socially awkward people and get thrown into a world-changing conflict they had no intention of taking part in.

Expecting them to be all cool and rational with the shit they go through is pretty stupid.

I didn't care about fixing anything. The question was answered. People find whininess annoying. There's nothing wrong with that and that doesn't mean there's something wrong with the character.

Some are born great, some achieve greatness, and some have greatness thrust upon them.

Because they see themselves in them. And no one wants to be Shinji.

There are various types of cartoons for various purposes, not all of them are supposed to be mindless fun.

They self-insert. They are the cancer of the community.

Also there aren't just two ways of dealing with something. There isn't just "whiny" and "cool and rational". These threads always attract people who think in binary. Most of Sup Forums gets their lessons on human nature from anime so it's not surprising.

I wouldn't be so sure about that if I were you.
Shinji was surrounded by women and had friends who really supported him. Also, his suffering had meaning. He was sacrificing himself for something he considered important, and ultimately became a better person because of it.
What if your suffering was completely meaningless and there was no larger narrative? What if it all really returned ti nothing, because you were worth nothing to begin with? What if the only thing worse than cosmic, existential horror was horror for no purpose at all?

Because they want an easy fun and not thinking about life concepts such as decision making, depression, evaluation of their actions, its effects on other people.

They want to self insert in a mighty Gary-Sue (wich make 99% of shounen MC).

That's why people watch anime and not films or read books. Because they want to self-insert in a perfect world, where the godlike MC wins unconditionally and power of friendships solves all the problems.

Also Shinji best girl

>whiny
what is this, 2005

There are worst characters now

>his suffering had meaning

For 99% of the series, it didn't. At all. Not until the final scene of the final episode.

Yukiteru has literally no character development tho, he starts out a whiny character and ends up a character

*ends up a whiny character

>Surrounded by women
You mean a terrible guardian with alcoholic problems and pedophilic tendencies?
A girl who is twice as fucked up as he is and constantly abuses and uses him?
Rei is ok though I'll admit

>They self-insert. They are the cancer of the community.

Honestly, quite a few Shinji anti-fans like the OP describes seem like they're actively refusing to self-insert - and using that as an excuse to feel better about themselves. After all, they explicitly aren't using him as an avatar of themselves; which means that they don't have to think about any of Shinji's flaws and weaknesses beyond "LOL, (don't) get in the fucking robot."

I thought this was so obvious that Anno even plays it off as a lame joke when Kensuke and Toji tell Shinji that he should be happy living with a total babe.

It did. He was fighting for his life, proving to himself he can take responsibility and be better than his cocksucker of a father. There was also something about protecting the city he lived in. I'm sure anyone who's got a cop in the family is able to relate to that.

There's a difference between self-insert and understanding the character. Not that I'm disagreeing with you, just saying that Shinji's life doesnt seem ripe for escapism (although there are depressed neets who find it cathartic to imagine living his shitty life)

I remember Shinji and Ganta to be fine, but Shu and Yuki are poorly-written characters who just change according to what the plot demands them to be at the moment.

Nobody wants to watch normies do things. That would be the worst show ever.

Kensuke represents 90% of the otaku who watch the show when he spouts dumb bullshit but they still fail to get it

Yukiteru is the worst offender of this desu, his childhood and life was overall good for the most part and then his parents divorced, after that he was another lonely shut in. He pretty much starts out whiny and doesn't stop until the last volume or two when he flips his kill switch and starts being a slight badass.

It kind of sucks too because his first world self seemed much more likable, when he was shown Yuno's memories of him in the first world he was actually manly but I guess the author was like "Nah I gotta make him a pussy". At least he ended up getting best girl in the end, I didn't even mind the ending/redial.

Yeah, thats true for the first half of the show. Then he's told he needs to kill his school friend. Then Rei dies and destroys the city. Then he has to kill the only person who's ever given him genuine affection. Everyone ends up deceiving him or leaving him. At this point, he would prefer being dead, which is how Misato finds him in EoE. So I don't see how any of his suffering ends up being meaningful

Ganta shouldn't even really be here desu, he probably had the worst experience of them all.

> Be Ganta
> Chilling in class with friends
> All his friends get blown to pieces and he get's thrown in prison
> Edge wonderland full of autists and psychos
> Has to kill every other second and see people ripped apart
> Supposed new prison friends tell him to kill his self
> Depressed or stressed 99% of the time but mans up and Ganta Gun's everything in the face
> Slowly dying towards the end of the series but keeps it rolling and beats down Shiro to save her
> Ends the series running around school happily and still sees best girl

>Suffering is good it makes you a better person!11
No, it just makes your life worse

pic is of someone who's suffering clearly had meaning. Very mentally stable and all-around great individual

In the context of Eva there's really no alternative to it. The characters not being able to run away from the source of their suffering is kind of the whole point.

Yeah, he really grew as a person in that scene. All because of that trauma :')

Not defending Yukiteru, but Shu's shifts in character didn't happen out of the blue.

At the first couple of episodes he's a 17 year old who pretty much admits he's somewhat autistic and has very little self-confidence, then he gets thrown into a fight between terrorists and the evil government just because he happened to stumble upon his terrorist/singer waifu. So he accidentally gets a new power that allows him to pull weapons from inside people's souls or something like that, and the terrorists now want him to do their bidding because of that power.

People usually get mad because of him refusing to join Gai and his group at first, but honestly I don't see why he should. They are seen as terrorists, he had every reason not to trust them so quickly, even if the government guys are assholes. He also gets betrayed and sold to the evil government by his own friend from school, after he gets saved by the terrorists he still doesn't trust, he has to use his power to do shit that may cause a lot of deaths should he fail, and slowly starts to grow into a more confident person. Until he's forced to kill his friend's brother, then he goes back to being insecure and depressed, but with his friends' help he mans the fuck up once more.

Even though Gai died, he still didn't really go back to his whiny self from the first episodes either. But when he had to become a leader and take responsibilities for all of the lives on the isolated school, he gets indecisive and Hare, his best friend and possible love interest, dies because of that... and because Soda is a retard, of course. Seeing that things aren't about friendship, but about fucking survival instead, he becomes Hitler to ensure everyone survives, only to get betrayed by the same people he saved.

Which is why Asuka is with him in the last scene
Poor Shinji

He shoulda kept the Hitler personality and killed all of the fuckers who betrayed him

because people don’t need to watch anime to see a little whiny bitch fall on the ground and give into despair

Well, technically, Zombie Gai killed most of them before Shu would get the chance.

Arisa deserved to fucking die, though.

At least the guy in Valkure knew who he was coming back to and could expect something good from it. The universe just said fuck you to Shinji.

I genuinely felt bad for Ganta after Nagi died, probably one of the best portrayals of depression I've seen in anime.

Why do we hate Subaru again? Isn't he sort of just the Shinji of isekai?

Because Shinji is pathetic but not stupid. He's extremely insecure and has low self esteem and hates himself, so the things he does are reasonable for his situation.

Subaru is capable and not depressed, but plot is literally driven by "oh look, I did another stupid fucking decision even though people told me exactly what to do" which is just extremely lazy writing. And then he says, "Nothing goes right, the world is such a cruel place, what am I doing wrong?"

Literally do what other people tell you what to do. Simple fucking shit.

so shinji is all three
nice

Yes but when it's little girls everyone eats that shit up

>normies

They aren't, really.

Fair enough. I haven't watched Guilty Crown since 2012 and I don't remember much of it, but I'll take your word at face value.

Shinji's being a whiny fuck is pretty acceptable desu. For one his mom died basically right in front of his eyes, two his father essentially hated him because he took most of his mom's attention away, and three he was an antisocial fuck who had no one to lean on for his emotional issues.

He wanted to get close to his father and establish a relationship but he called him useless all because he didn't want to step into a robot and fight aliens that essentially wanted to destroy the planet, gee he sure is a pussy. My only issue with Shinji is too many people say "No you have to relate to him, self insert yourself in his shoes"

>too many people say "No you have to relate to him, self insert yourself in his shoes"
Yeah, what happened to just watching a show about a character?

Honestly when I think about who I was when I was 14 Shinji did pretty fucking good. I doubt I could've adapted if something like that was forced upon me

I agree, I probably would have offed myself. Regardless though people need to chill with the self inserting shit, it's been a plague around here lately.

I thought Yukiteru would eventually develop into his first world version, but oh boy was I disappointed.