Why are Democrats opposed to a Southern border barrier?

How come? This is completely illogical. The wall costs as much as an aircraft carrier group. And Democrats vote for the aircraft carrier groups.

Why are Dems so afraid?

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I think the reason is because Dems see it as a waste of money that won't solve the illegal immigration problem. They'd rather crack down on employers who hire illegals.

Democrats are literally the slave class. They use third worlders to populate their servant industries and they rely on them for votes. Democrats would not hold any power whatsoever if there were no niggers or spics.

An aircraft carrier group is useful, a wall just fucks with labour markets

Tag mein bruder, was geht?

If they allow the wall their base will go crazy. Their base is already mad that they aren't fighting for all illegals to stay.

Because it's raycis

youtube.com/watch?v=cuaDUArBeVQ

Watch this and then seethe with rage whenever you see a democrat say the wall is racist after stating they wanted a wall a few years ago.

>They'd rather crack down on employers who hire illegals.
So just do both?

It is like climate change. You can invest in wind and solar ... but you can also build more nuclear power plants and e-car infrastructure. Why does it have to be one or the other?

If the wall brings 0 nothing, it is still a jobs program exactly for the American workers which Dems say they want to give well paid jobs.

because it would be a huge political win for trump.
this by the way is true of infrastructure aswell. democrats usually want it but now that trump is in office they will most likely oppose it on some stupid grouds.

You of all people OP should know that it has many parallels with the berlin wall-
Also, a wall would be ineffective. People will still cross. An aircraft carrier would be.

>They use third worlders to populate their servant industries and they rely on them for votes.

More reason to get compromises on DACA, Salvadorians and other Latins from him. Trump is offering amnesty to 3-4 million of potential Dem voters.

If I get this offer, I take it if it costs 18bn only.

>it is still a jobs program exactly for the American workers
>Kraut economics
If you aren't a better candidate for the job than a Mexican then you don't get the job.

>If they allow the wall their base will go crazy.
Most Americans want illegal migration via the border to stop.

>they'd rather crack down on employers who hire illegals
Haha nice one. They'll say it to your face because they don't want to look terrible to white working class, but They have little motivation to actually enforcing it. (i.e. Obama admin)
Illegal immigrants help prop up numbers both long term (anchor babies) and short term (illegal voting) for blue voting demographics. Why do you think they fight so hard against Voter ID laws?

Its the 7 stages of acceptance. The dems are now on bartering.

yeah jus tlike the berlin wall. the wall that only went through one city. while the rest of the border was called the deathstrip..... just like the mexcian-usa border wall you know the thing that is build to keep people out not to keep some german commies in. but yeah a lot of parallels.

>Dems see it as a waste of money
wasting money is not a concern of liberals

Because Trump wants it

>You of all people OP should know that it has many parallels with the berlin wall-
And what would those be? Are Mexicans all US citizens? Are they communists in Mexico? Is the US occupied by Germany? is Mexico occupied by the Soviet Union?

>Also, a wall would be ineffective. People will still cross.
So? People will still cross. But fewer. Or are you saying fewer people crossing isn't the goal?

Israel build a continuous border fence. Guess what, they have close to 0 crossings... after tens of thousands before the Southern border fence.

Israel now needs to deport 40,000 black Africans which came over the Southern border illegally before the fence went up a few years ago. But in the last 3 years, no one came illegally via the Southern border thanks to the fence. So the fence pays for itself, because those 40,000 have cost Israel billions already.

>If you aren't a better candidate for the job than a Mexican then you don't get the job.
It is a government contract. I am pretty sure the companies which get the contract will have to have measures in place to make sure only Americans or green card holders get the jobs.

They need mentally handicapped immigrants to replace the ones we red-pill.

They’re upset for the same reason voter ID makes them upset.

They’re filthy communist rats.

Yeah, it helps us. Not everyone is an Island.

Here's what will happen
Dems will "buy off Trump" with some symbolic wall
Get Trump to sign a Daca amnesty in return
Once he's out of office, the new Dem president will tear it down Berlin wall style with much pomp and publicity

Asians vote Dem in higher rates than spics. Every non-white racial group in the US votes Dem

wall will hurt the feelings of Mexicans.

Walls work, that's why people have been building them for thousands of years...
see

>dems are mostly sheltered city soyboys or sterile technology nerds
>most dems only ever interact with hip third generation immigrants who run hip food carts
>this makes them enlightened
>republicans are mostly working class blue collar people whose livelihood is directly threatened by illegals
>this makes them racist

The US government probably shouldn't be spending too much currently but if they are why not invest in more vital infrastructure?

Your entire countries lifestyle is propped up by cheap labour from Mexico. Just wait for all the Amerilards losing their shit because Wallshart has to raise prices.

The wall helps defend our people our culture and our lands.
I would think that our brothers in Europe would understand what is at stake!

>They'd rather crack down on employers who hire illegals

Which is why they support sanctuary cites.

>Federal judge in San Francisco blocks Trump's decision to end DACA program.

Trumptards btfoooooo

Remember when Pelosi got swarmed by illegals on her press conference? If any of Trump demands are passed with Democratic help, it would that x10000. They would rip Dems a new asshole.

A wall now means less votes for dems 15 years down the line i guess

A wall is useless and fucks with wildlife. Drones/more border security will do the trick for way less and be 20x more effective.

It's all about the votes

Democrats don't want DACA.

They like African blacks, Muslims, and Chinese more than Mexicans.

They ain't trading 800,000 Mexicans for nearly obliterating African, Middle Eastern, Muslim, and Asian chain migration, lotteries, diversity immigration.

Hardliner Mexicans want amnesty for all.

African, Muslim, Arab, Indian, Korean, Chinese immigrants don't want their immigration perks abolished in exchange for 800,000 DACA spics.

Spics are getting played by Democrats. Their best shot for DACA is keeping congress Republican, to be honest.

If congress goes Democrat, they ain't getting shit.

>federal judge rules against the constitution
bruh

At what point dose it become morally acceptable to being removing judges who refuses to affirm their oath of office?

because Democrats are the globalist party. The lack of a southern border is the US' version of "taking in refugees".. there way of diversifying the US. also votes, obviously

>Why are Democrats opposed to a Southern border barrier?

because they can only obtain votes illegally.

gizmodo.com/13-fascinating-farming-robots-that-will-feed-our-future-1683489468

agrobot.com/

engadget.com/2017/09/07/farm-robot-harvest-hands-free-hectare/

intorobotics.com/35-robots-in-agriculture/

cnbc.com/2016/09/16/future-of-farming-driverless-tractors-ag-robots.html

No. We don't need them. They eat more in welfare than they put back in taxes anyways. they don't really help us.

C'mon dude I'm all for immigration control but the wall is a meme. It would do fuckall to actually stop it when most illegal immigration is overstayed visas and shit, not border hoppers.

-Exactly. They are hypocrites. They pretend to care about it, but leave it unaddressed because the demographic gives them free votes.

Its because our democrats only care about the short term and not the long term. They are willing to give out whatever free shit they can now so that they can stay in power just a little longer. It all really started with FDR and the creation of the welfare state. As soon as you get someone hooked on the government teet its almost impossible to get them off even if they realize its in their best interest.

Democrats have realized they cant depend on white working voters anymore since they sold off all their jobs overseas. So now they are depending on the brown vote. They will promise free shit to anyone brown to get their vote. It is their hope that the brown horde will out breed the whites and they will take control of a democratic country this way.

The wall would be seen as the ultimate victory for trump as it was his primary campaign point.

Because they see illegals as a potential voting block. Sure as shit if they get citizenship, they will all vote Democrat for the gibs. It doesn't matter if it's the Republicans who give them that citizenship or not. The more illegals they can shuffle across the boarder before they get their amnesty, which will happen whether we like it or not, the more voters they get. A wall slows the flow illegals and thus in turn limits the number of potential voters. But the ultimate concern for the Democrats is DACA. If they can manage to even get the smallest concession on that from Trump and the Republicans, it will be abused massive to legalize as many illegals as they possibly can. Reagan made this mistake, and they're hoping Trump will too. Because if he does, the Republicans will cease to be a national party.

>They eat more in welfare than they put back in taxes anyways
Plenty of jobs won't ever pay enough in order for workers to net pay tax. Society wouldn't function however if every job with a salary below $40k simply wasn't done tomorrow.

Labour markets can decide when it makes sense to automate, not governments and walls.

>Hispanic democrats want to keep the border open for illegal crossings for practical reasons
>White liberals have been conditioned to see a wall as racist
>Optics of striking a deal with Trump, particularly on his biggest campaign promise

>A wall is useless and fucks with wildlife.
This is incorrect. Any rodents actually make it through a double fence barrier. The current fences have animal passage ways which are large enough for snakes, mice and even wild pigs walk right through.

Nope. The contracted company itself may be 100% American but they have a habit of getting subcontractors from Home Depot and Walmart parking lots to actually do the work. Why pay John $150 a day when you can get 5 Juans for the same price?

There base isn't most Americans, it's illegals, niggers, faggots, muslims, commies, and criminals. Basically every misfit piece of shit that wants free shit and no law enforcement.

It's already acceptable, a hundred years ago it wasn't unusual for Congress to impeach judges for being stupid cunts. When they all got into the child raping game they stopped.

>It would do fuckall to actually stop it when most illegal immigration is overstayed visas and shit, not border hoppers.

Does a Southern border fence mean you cannot implement a better visa system?

Seriously, sometimes I do not get American arguments. In Germany, pretty much all illegal migrants come on the ground via the border, because it is impossible for people who want to come illegally to arrive via planes. There is literally no reason to hand people visas when you know they will overstay them. You can hand only visas to those people who have financial security. They will not overstay visas.

Also, the problem of ovestayed visas seems to be by majority one of Canadian/European origin.

>Why pay John $150 a day when you can get 5 Juans for the same price?
Because you should go to prison for 20yrs if you employ people who are illegally in the country? How is that so hard to implement?

In Germany, despite the large influx of illegal migrants, it is virtually impossible for illegals to get a job in the actual economy. Simply because every single employee has to be registered with both the tax office and employment office and his documents are double checked with the federal databases. An employer would never try to employ an illegal, as he could face fines and even lose his license, which is economic suicide. As we have a high minimum wage of 9 euros (around 11 dollars per hour) using a lowly motivated illegal instead of a Pole or Romanian makes zero sense.

>A wall is useless and fucks with wildlife.
If it's useless then it shouldn't affect wildlife, so I don't see a problem..

>1. The U.S.-Mexican border is already well defended, and a wall won’t improve the defenses. The United States now spends $3.7 billion per year to keep some 21,000 Border Patrol agents on guard and another $3.2 billion on 23,000 inspectors at ports of entry along the border, a third of which is already walled or fenced off.

>2. The cost of Trump’s fence would be a whopping $25 billion on top of this.

>3. There’s no way Mexico will pay for it.

>4. There’s no reason for the wall anyway because undocumented migration from Mexico has sharply declined. The Department of Homeland Security’s estimates that the total undocumented population peaked at 12 million in 2008, and has fallen since then. According to the Pew Research Center, the overall flow of Mexican immigrants between the two countries is at its smallest since the 1990s.

>5. There’s little or no evidence undocumented immigrants take jobs away from native-born Americans, anyway. A new analysis of Census data finds that immigrants take very different jobs than Americans. In fact, the United States already allows a significant amount of legal immigration from Mexico under the “guest-worker” program –1.6 million entries by legal immigrants and 3.9 million by temporary workers from Mexico over the last 10 years – because farmers can’t find enough native-born Americans to pick crops.

Of course, Trump lives in a fact-free universe designed merely to enhance his power and fuel his demagoguery. But you don’t have to, and nor does anyone else.

Well, what about a fine on anyone who employs illeigals....

a prohibitively expensive fine.... that funds ICE?

> because farmers can’t find enough native-born Americans to pick crops.

So slave labor is morally acceptable if it means you can have cheap avocados?

Maybe it's actually super effective?

6. Not everyone who speaks Spanish is Mexican. Without a doubt, the vast, vast majority of people who illegally immigrate across the Mexican border are from Central America.

7. More non-Mexicans than Mexicans were apprehended at the U.S. border - and the the number of Mexicans has been declining. From 1.6 million in 2000, by 2014 the number dwindled to 229,000 (a decline of 85%). If you want to stop illegal border immigrants into the U.S., the best (and least costly) policy would be to cooperate with Mexico to capture these immigrants as they flee Central America and find a solution for either housing them in Mexico or returning them to their country of origin.

8. Illegal immigrants are not "stealing" more jobs every year. Since 2006, the number of illegal immigrants working in the U.S. has stabilized at about 8 million. All the new job growth over the last decade has gone to legitimate American workers or legal immigrants working with proper papers. Illegal immigration is not the reason some Americans do not have jobs, and blaming illegal immigrants is a ruse for people who simply don't want to work - or refuse to upgrade their skills to make themselves employable.

9. The states where illegal immigration is growing are not on the Mexican border. The states with rising illegal immigration are Washington, Pennsylvania, New Jersey, Virginia, Massachusetts and Louisiana. Texas, New Mexico and Arizona have seen no significant, measurable increase in illegal immigrants. And California, Nevada, Illinois, Alabama, Georgia and South Carolina have seen their illegal immigrant population decline. A border wall does not address the growth of illegal immigrants, as to the extent illegal immigrants are working in the U.S. they are clearly not in the border states.

Good leaders get all the facts. Bad leaders jump to conclusions. They base their actions on outdated assumptions.

Sure, why not!

A job is a job. Sorry, you see some job as a slave labor.

1. $3.7bn and $3.2bn isn't really a lot, is it? Compared to other expenses those are rounding errors.

2. And this is also not a lot compared to other security measures and defense measures.

3. Yes, correct. Mexico will not pay for it.

4. It has actually not sharply declined. It is still quite high. The decline is in the number of people apprehended, which may or may not correlate with the people who actually make it to the US unapprehended.

5. Actually, there are countless studies that show low skilled labor is not required for a future US economy. In Germany, many studies show that unskilled immigration costs Germany 400 billion in the next 10yrs.

>paying someone below minimum wage to work in conditions that violate labor laws is acceptable because a job is a job.

Yet they want to flood sanctuary cities and outlying communities with muh transient workers

The biggest problem is that the wall was never about border security.

Donald Trump’s wall is about dividing Americans – playing upon the racial fears and anxiety he has drummed up and amplified to rally his base. Trump’s wall is a political campaign promise that he has to fulfill to keep his base happy. Trump’s border wall is trying to solve a problem that doesn’t exist.

Rest all are talking points.

To be honest I haven't seen many Americans working in a field. They don't like to do it period.

>Border security will do the trick
>a wall is useless
Is border security AND a wall not effective, Shareblue?

They don't like to do it for the same reason farmers here use euros on holidays for fruit picking. They're desperate for money so farmers can treat them like shit, pay them below minimum wage and violate regs like providing them with drinking water or toilets.

when the rich control the system its impossible to implement

ask yourself what is justice

Justice is the ability of the strong to impose its viewpoints on the rest of a populous.

>Donald Trump’s wall is about dividing Americans – playing upon the racial fears and anxiety he has drummed up and amplified to rally his base. Trump’s wall is a political campaign promise that he has to fulfill to keep his base happy. Trump’s border wall is trying to solve a problem that doesn’t exist.

I agree that the Trump barrier to the South is politics. But sorry, it is not JUST about politics. In 2006, a bipartisan bill authorized hundreds of miles of Southern border wall. That was done to stop illegal migration. And it partially worked.

Again, it works in Israel, I have no doubt that it can work in the US again. And no illegal immigration is better than illegal migration.

>ask yourself what is justice
I don't know what that is.

Here in Germany an employer who is caught employing several illegals will lose his license, will then lose his business and go bankrupt. Typically that means he is expected to use his rifle or handgun to kill himself.

After all, our bankruptcy law makes funeral cost a preferred cost to pay from the bankruptcy estate.

here is america an employer who is caught employing illegals is slapped on the wrist with small fines and due to our revolving door policy in politics he has people in the government covering for his ass if he is caught. The worst case scenario for any business caught with illegals is that the illegals get deported and then replaced with new illegals that they have to retrain.

Mexicans don't have to come work in the US

Trump’s Wall Costs $21 Billion; Illegal Immigration Costs $148 Billion Yearly—Do The Math

nationaleconomicseditorial.com/2017/02/24/cost-trump-border-wall/

Go fuck a kangaroo, we're building a wall and you're keeping your shitty refugees

They don't wanna do ANYTHING about illegals. Come on.

>it works in Israel, I
Oh wow a country is able to defend a 150 mile long boarder.

Gee so fucking amazing.

>Oh wow a country is able to defend a 150 mile long boarder.
>Gee so fucking amazing.

Hmmm, a country with 1/40th the population of the US and 1/60th of the GDP can defend a border 1/15th of the length of the US Southern border.

That means it is ABSOLUTELY IMPOSSIBLE for America to do it, no?

Honestly just get over it, build the wall and move on holy guacabowle

It's just a friggin pice of wall

Dems are afraid that it will work, driving down crime, drugs, people smuggling, cartel activity, illegal migration costs in the southern states which the dems will have no way to spin that shutting out Mexicans is actually good for America.

This is not honest

>Oh geez, a national government with trillions worth of federally authorized world class super soldiers securing a national border? Lol no way man, that's impossible

They know the real problem with walls is not that they prevent people from getting in, but stop people from getting out. If there ever is a dictatorship here, you would not be able to escape with a wall in place. Our own citizens would be stuck and once it's up, it's here to stay. I'm surprised Sup Forums would support the wall honestly. Don't they know it's meant for them, not the mexicans?

Stops a major influx of Dem voters

Which is depressing, because immigrants believe the Democratic party's lies and hollow promises, and act surprised when their only thrown peanuts

>Being afraid of a police state when you can have body armor and half an AR15 mailed to your front door
Even in CA, all you have to do is register the lower receiver and learn how to take apart your rifle.

>Airplanes and work visas suddenly stop existing

You're really activating my almonds. Please tell me more about how my countries immigration system works kraut.

So now your advocating more than a boarder wall?

How much is this going to cost?

>A wall is supposed to be 100% secure
It's symbolic, he campaigned on it and he won. Welcome to a non-Communist country where Obama had Lavoy Finicum killed using American tax dollars.

>fuck it let's just do nothing
a glow in the dark CIA nigger shows up

Gigantic waste of money. Walls literally don't work.

Less than not having a wall.

He campaigned on it and won. Nuff said.

Next.

illegale Immigration brings them votes over the Long term.

Symbolic.

He campaigned on it.

He won.

Decision made, now focus on which brownies to not deport.

>focus on which brownies to not deport
why take the risk, ALL OF THEM

That would make us as bad as jews.

Europe has an argument to deport all non-whites but also an argument to cuck themselves into oblivion. America arguably should share NA with native Americans and legal patriots.

>would make us as bad as jews
Not if the kikes are in camps, or just 'go away' for real this time

They can't get more voters with the promise of amnesty

If you get rid of the illegals they will be hard pressed to win an election again

Same reason they don't like Voter ID ...because republicans like it
Simple as that

>let them stay dont enforce borders
Do you like law and order? Do you think the State should enforce and recognise legal rights that it has enshrined in law?

If you don't then by all means piss on immigration enforcement. Then when your legal rights are pissed all over everyone will ask what the big deal is maybe you'll realise why law enforcement is so important.

The point is there's a way to enact compassionate immigration control. Lax enforcement is not how to bring it about.

Keep the nation 80 to 85% white and reform voter laws so that only married men with families have the vote and I'm okay with non-white minorities.

Stop advocating for racemixing in the popular culture and I'll even tolerate the odd race mixer (pretty rare anyways)

End the welfare state and in the long run blacks and other under-performing minorities will eventually improve as only the intelligent succeed and breed.