I generally consider myself a libertarian, but recently I went ahead and read the Communist Manifesto, and

I generally consider myself a libertarian, but recently I went ahead and read the Communist Manifesto, and...

>1.) Abolition of property in land and application of all rents of land to public purposes.
>2.) A heavy progressive or graduated income tax.
>3.) Abolition of all rights of inheritance.
>4.) Confiscation of the property of all emigrants and rebels.
>5.) Centralization of credit in the banks of the state, by means of a national bank with state capital and an exclusive monopoly.
>6.) Centralization of the means of communication and transport in the hands of the state.
>7.) Extension of factories and instruments of production owned by the state; the bringing into cultivation of waste lands, and the improvement of the soil generally in accordance with a common plan.
>8.) Equal obligation of all to work. Establishment of industrial armies, especially for agriculture.
>9.) Combination of agriculture with manufacturing industries; gradual abolition of all the distinction between town and country by a more equable distribution of the populace over the country.
>10.) Free education for all children in public schools. Abolition of children's factory labor in its present form. Combination of education with industrial production, etc.

Hey, besides maybe point #5, this doesn't sound half-bad!
In any case, it's much better than the "NO MORE PRIVATE PROPERTY" bullshit strawman the corporate shills keep posting on Sup Forums.

Other urls found in this thread:

youtube.com/watch?v=uiYH66HznW0
twitter.com/SFWRedditImages

...

>jew
>Hey goyim communism isn't that bad and it's coming from me, the libertarian

Now move outside of israel,change your name,go to some gullible goyim at lefty pol and tell them how great their system is,they literally don't see your nose!!and they are truly jealous brainlet subhumans,how adequate of goyim!

I tried to read it but he just sounded too much like a whiny kike.

I actually agree with a lot of the complaints that marx had against communism. I just agree more with keynes how to fix those problems. (Actual keynes, not the bastardized kike form that it is now)

against capitalism*

>Flag

>Yes goyim
>take all the risk for me
>and I take all the benefits

GAZ

>keynes

2/10

> Doesn't understand that Keynes basically wrote the fascist economic policy

You know, during the cold war the commies at least tried to hide their motives. This is a shameful display.

sage in all fields

Are you legitimately retarded? Point 1 describes exactly the theft of private property.

Fucking slide thread SAGE.

But all of that sounds horrible.

>merely accepted financial doctrine while the world was busy opposing bolshevik demons
Nobody talked to mussolini about hard currencies because nobody was talking about them at all, and Hitler had a country in debt hell to save so he was forced to print money. You can build a proper central bank that doesn't melt down as well.

The OP is obviously trolling, but I DID read some communist writings recently (out of morbid curiosity, if nothing else) and was surprised to find out how little there is of everything bad associated with "communism".
Like Marx here is saying shit that I would generally agree with, especially points 1, 2, 3 and 4.

And shiiieeeeeet, Lenin was openly advocating for the use of private enterprise and Darwinian competition between firms/individuals as a way to incentive work and innovation. He was criticizing contemporary Capitalist societies for ABANDONING competition/private-enterprise in favor of big business monopolizing everything:
>Under *such* capitalism, competition means the incredibly brutal suppression of the enterprise, energy and bold initiative of the mass of the population, of its overwhelming majority, of ninety-nine out of every hundred toilers; it also means that competition is replaced by financial fraud, nepotism, servility on the upper rungs of the social ladder.

That shit blew my mind. If that is not applicable to the "crony capitalism" we live under today I don't know what is.
He was advocating for the state promoting private enterprise not as a sacrament end-goal in-and-of-itself, but as a societal tool to be used to direct labor and innovation for the benefit of all.
I don't know how much he actually acted upon any of that, but I DEFINITELY can get behind THAT.

Sounds like the US democratic party platform!

>Point 1 describes exactly the theft of private property
So?
Private ownership of land (or any other natural resource) is fucking bullshit anyway and there's literally no way you can justify it.

Announcing sage is against the rules, newfag. Go back to neofark, sage isn't a downvote.

They talked a lot of smack but the central pillar of their model was the centralization process. Competition would be nominally allowed so far as it could be defined, but without capital or property, the owners are the state and so they could and would intervene whenever the fancy struck them.

All of keynes writings were praised by the nazi party. Mosley's entire economic policy was based off of keynes writing almost verbatim.

Keynes was big on pulling the british lower class out of the gutter, that was his major concern. He was saying that communism and socialism was so appealing that he understood why people would reject capitalism. He wrote on how to add policies to capitalism to better benifit the average man.

Keynes was a die hard british nationalists. He actually hated that the brits sold out to america becuase he thought (rightly) that the brits would become more global and start to lose their culture.

I know all those things but I think he was wrong on the technical level, not because of his politics.

So the seven acres of timber land I bought to build a house on should be taken away from me? This is theft.

You are fine with the government simply taking things away from you that you paid good money for?

>jewish from israel
>shilling obviously
>pro communism
>idiot inccorect statements about Sup Forums
>supports removing ALL ownerships of any goods and rights to freedom
>supports punishing high achievers
>supports impossible and retarded concepts that only children believe in.
WHICH THREAD ARE YOU TRYING TO SLIDE SHILL? WHICH ONE IS THE IMPORTANT THREAD YOU WANT TO GET RID OF???????

>the owners are the state and so they could and would intervene whenever the fancy struck them
I see nothing wrong with this. Intervening to stop bad and unfair practices seems perfectly reasonable to me.

>Private ownership of land (or any other natural resource) is fucking bullshit anyway and there's literally no way you can justify it.
How do you justify owning your bed?

You misunderstand, they own and control everything. Nothing happens unless it's in a report, but they hoped people would be able to compete who better could follow their orders.

>You are fine with the government simply taking things away from you that you paid good money for?
He's a kike, so he's fine with the government taking things away from YOU, not him.

>Lenin was openly advocating for the use of private enterprise
Yeah, after he saw the results of his farmer killing program and seeing how the country is starving to death and dying
>yfw a communist realizes that his ideology doesn't work

You have "bought" (assuming you're not just LARPing like 99% of lolbritarians) something that you have no right to own, from someone who didn't have the right to own it either.
Land is the common possession of the nation, just like air and water.

I want to throttle you. That is all.

It's a physical object made by someone who put in time/effort to make. When I buy the bed, I pay for that time/effort.

nice bate

Marx was right. Lenin did nothing wrong.

This.

After they shipped off the good Ukrainian farmers and gave the land to all the worthless pieces of shit, they realized how bad they had fucked up.

"better go full-on crazy communism now!"

>supports removing ALL ownerships of any goods and rights to freedom
No. Only land or other natural resource. Learn some reading comprehension.

>supports punishing high achievers
No. Quite the opposite. Read the thread. The current "capitalist" system rewards nepotism, leech-like renting practices, under-achieving monopoly and usury.

>supports impossible and retarded concepts that only children believe in.
Nothing in is impossible.

>>>/leftypol/

>Abolition
>heavy progressive tax
>Abolition
>Confiscation
>Centralization
>Centralization
>owned by the state
>industrial armies (slaves)
>abolition
>combination of education and industrial production (slaves)

Yeah, those are some really nice action verbs there.. how could you go wrong?

Not larping. Also the land is out west. This land was given to the original owners because of military service. The government gave them the land. Therefore the government relinquished it's right to this land.

Also what makes you think that the government should own the land and not the person who takes care of the land?

>surprised to find out how little there is of everything bad associated with "communism"
>Lenin was openly advocating for the use of private enterprise and Darwinian competition between firms/individuals
>Like Marx here is saying shit that I would generally agree with, especially points 1, 2, 3 and 4.

stop trying to jew us, it won't work.

if anything, this displays the link between Judaism and communism.

>The OP is obviously trolling
You are the OP, we have IDs here you stupid kike.

The government didn't own the land, either. It's the property of the entire nation. A government only has claim to it insofar it represents the people, not like some Ancien Regime French king who fucking owns the entire country as his own personal estate .

newfag

You're full of shit. I own my land by right of conquest. If you don't think I should own it, then you are free to come and try and take it from me and I'll defend myself and my property with lethal force. It's totally natural, human behaviour.

>A government only has claim
So what are you doing to return parts of Jerusalem and the Golan Heights to the people who lived there?

Look jew, your claim to represent the people evaporated when the gulags were opened and everyone starved to death. That marx speaks to you from beyond the grave should concern you deeply.

Time and effort are not the determinant of rightful ownership. Homesteading is, and part of that has to do with being the first to access an unowned good.

If you put time and effort into carving a statue into your employer's marble block, does that make it yours? No, because he owned the block before you, so no amount of labor will transfer that title without his permission.

If you want another angle, go ahead and separate a farmer's field from the land beneath it.

Of course it doesnt sound bad to you, it was specifically created to subjugate all goyim to kikes just like Talmud commands and you know it.

So just for clarification, if any other member of my "nation" walks on to this land they can cut down the trees, dig holes, plug up the streams, whatever correct?

>when the gulags were opened and everyone starved to death
Well yeah, this is kinda the point of the OP. I was surprised by just how un-authoritarian or suppressible socialist/marxist/communist ideology was before Stalin came along.
I doubt the Soviet Union could even be called socialist by any stretch of that word, though.

>this doesn't sound half-bad!
literally kys famalam
>in all fields

Wrong. I own my land and anyone who comes and tries to take that land from me (or abuse it in some way) will die by my hand. Now it so happens that our society has established a system of laws and a police force such that I no longer have to take this responsibility on myself, but that is essentially where private property rights come from.

>If you put time and effort into carving a statue into your employer's marble block, does that make it yours?
Well, it fucking should.

Just as Universalist moralities/philosophies are considered a mask for hegemonic imperialism under many communist writers, an insight which I consider largely to be true, the call for public ownership over private ownership of land could be said the same of. There will always be leaders and followers in any group, and this instinctually forming dynamic is expressed informally in nature and formally in society in the relation between state and subject. Public ownership of land is merely a mask for the same old hegemonic imperialist relation between the leader and the followers, the state and the populace, and is a further means of the former amassing property at the expense of the latter.

That's because what you're reading is demonic black magic designed for intellectuals based on a long tradition, and the murderers who led the revolution immediately established their brutal regime. Things will get worse before they get better, they said, and then they got hell on earth.

youtube.com/watch?v=uiYH66HznW0

I think you forgot your meme flag Rabbi.

This.
I like this guy.

I have lived in communism, and each of your 10 points brings back memories and gives me goose bumps. Not the good kind of goose bumps.

Communism does not work. It is flawed on every level, and only people unable to accept the human nature believe in it.

But don't take my word for it. Pack and go to North Korea or Cuba and try to live there for at least a year.

You're a nigger

Oh, and I don't see why "rightful ownership" should even be a thing. In an ideal system, the money you have is representative of the amount of useful activity/labor/innovation you've contributed to society. You trade in that money for physical goods (in the process rewarding the makers of those goods for THEIR contribution). Those goods are now "yours" only by virtue of being representations of your own work, not because it's a God-given truth that private property should be a sacrosanct natural right.

typical lolbritarian LARPing

Get off my board kike REEEEEEE

post pic of jidf HQ for lulz

Ownership implies you bought something. What the fuck would you buy something for if it's not yours!?

6/10 I'm slightly rustled.

>I have lived in communism
No you haven't.

...

>not because it's a God-given truth that private property should be a sacrosanct natural right.
So if I take something from you, it's mine?

the ovens

You have not lived under communist. You have lived under a totalitarian state with a command economy and state ownership of the means of production. Not the same thing at all.

>Ownership implies you bought something
huh?
Can't you own something by... you know... making it?

>No you haven't.
Nigga is literally in Slovenia, a formerly communist shithole.

You forgot the meme flag schlomo. Better make a new thread.

Did you also use a time machine and did my past work instead of me?

>Abolition of inheritance.

No goyim, that treasure that's been in your family for generations belongs to EVERYONE.

Under communism *

>it isn't real communism!

It was not communist. It was as described.

I thought lolbritarians are all about the virtue of meritocracy?

Irrelevant, you've claimed private ownership is not a right. Why would it be wrong for me to just take from you?

Private property is considered a God-given right not because of some a priori divine mandate, but because the way property is treated always accords on a functional basis to private property. Even so-called communal property operates functionally as private property in the hands of the patriarch, the leader, the person whom other human capital are treated functionally as private property to.

Oh I see, that wasn't true communism...

You are denying reality if you think so.

Your deluded utopia killed millions of people, destroyed many once great countries and crippled their gene fund, and almost managed to destroy the planet itself.

I made the house I live in. I made the land out of previous swamp area. I bought all the materials to make it more than just a drainage area.

I spent close to 1.4 million dollars doing all of this. I own the land.

Not irrelevant, retard, use some reading compensation.
I just explain in that the things you "own" are only representations of the labor you've done. Perform more useful labor, be rewarded with more goods & services. By stealing something from someone else, you are enjoying something which you did not achieve by your own contribution to society. You are literally stealing the fruits of the other person's labor.
...Incidentally, wage work is a similar situation. The boss gets the enjoy the fruits of his worker's labor.

You're a dumb fat amerilard. Slovenia was under a totalitarian government with state owned means of production and a command economy. That's like making a critic of capitalism on the basis of Somalia. Somalia is pretty damn capitalist and liberal.

Sweden, Norway and other Nordic countries with soc democracy are closer to communism than was the USSR.

Call it what you like, it has all the 10 "great" ideas of the OP.

>By stealing something from someone else, you are enjoying something which you did not achieve by your own contribution to society. You are literally stealing the fruits of the other person's labor.
So you'd agree taxation is theft?

Muh Catholicism not true Xianity. Muh Protestantism not true Xianity. Muh Orthodoxy not true Xianity. Muh Southern Baptists not true Xianity. Muh bible not true Xianity.

Except there's no God

>Somalia is pretty damn capitalist and liberal.
Somalia is another failed Communist state Madir.

So if a nigger puts more time and effort into stealing your car than you did in buying it (which he will, because lifting even one finger is a monumental task for a nigger), it's his?

Marxist kikes like you get the rope first.

Please make Israel a communist nation, I 100% support that.

It was Slovakia, but close enough. It was a shithole and demented Marx's ideas has a lot to do with it.

>that wasn't true communism
It wasn't.
The Soviet Union had actually MORE practical inequality than the USA at the same time. I can only imagine how worse it's been in the shit-piss satellite countries.
It was a totalitarian state with a planned economy. But yeah, go ahead and shift the meaning of "communism" to just that. It'll win you the stupid internet argument, if nothing else.

The retarded swarms of palestinians would steam roll you oven dodgers.

I swear I meant Slovakia.

>But yeah, go ahead and shift the meaning of "communism"
It was a literal Communist state.

Remember that SAGE goes in the options field

Well, capitalism killed far more through structural violence. My grandparents lived in the former USSR, and they recall good memories. They said it went downhill after liberal reforms.