If Shirou's wants to become a hero of justice. Then why doesn't he become a fireman, doctor, or a Solicitor?

If Shirou's wants to become a hero of justice. Then why doesn't he become a fireman, doctor, or a Solicitor?

Other urls found in this thread:

youtube.com/watch?v=TyzV1SMGKw0
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gilles_de_Rais#Child_killer
twitter.com/NSFWRedditImage

Cuz magic and sheeet.

He wanted to be a lawyer but for some reason he decide that killing isis would be better

Because in modern society being a hero means killing women and children in middle east instead of helping them

Surrogator would have been fine too

Can swords put out fires? Can swords operate on people? Can swords attend to legal matters?

Only doctors save plenty of people everyday. Fireman spends their days hanging out with their crew members waiting for a house to burn down.

If he really wanted to save people, he'd shut up and study fucking medicine. He wanted to use his weakass magic and the Holy Grail War gave him the perfect excuse to do so.

More than saving people he wanted to be like Kerry. The motivation was weak as fuck.

So Shirou was never altruistic, but a narcissist, worshipping father con?

IF you want to be hero of justice and freedom you must go to middle east and rape isis, just like in the old days when they did crusades and shit

he becomes a fireman in taiga doujin

I still find it hilarious that the afterstory for him is literally "And then he went and fought terrorists in the middle east until he was hanged."

It's so fucking weird for a high-school anime protagonist kind of character. I can not stress enough how fucking weird but kind of cool that is.

His compulsion to save people is caused by him being implanted with avalon and warped into a sword, so he does probably lean toward the violent kind of heroism.

[Spoiler]Are you sure? I'm pretty sure Avalon is mostly responsible for his sword autism, not necessarily his 'muh hero' autism.

IIRC, wehn Kerry found him he made an expression showing pure happiness and content with the world. Shirou never learnt why and just assumed that's how it felt to be a hero, causing him to idolise heroism. When he mentioned it to Kerry, he would have assumed it's due to the fire but wouldn't have realised it's specific cause, and cause he felt that way himself at that age he greenlit the ideal (which might have also been an underestimation of Shirou's 'tism...).

tl;dr his 'heroics' are due to idolising Kerry as a hero and never realising that the ideal exists due to a complete lack of understanding of Kerry.[/spoiler]

Fug

The game and especially Rin stress the point that Shirou's lack of self-preservation is not normal even for a person with a past like his. Avalon has warped him to the point of overwriting his Origin.

His idolization of Kerry and his past are factors, but the main thing by far is the strong magical artifact that rebuilt his body at a young age and has been affecting it ever since.

f Shirou's wants to become a hero of justice. Then why doesn't he summon Siegfried or Karna?

I think it's because Avalon gives him a connection to Arturia that allows him to summon her. It's suggested that he shouldn't have enough mana to summon a servant in the first place so Avalon is basically doing most of the work in the summoning.

I hope A-1 gives us more quality screenshots in the future.

...

You can't summon servants arbitrarily, you need to have something connected to the hero. It's a small miracle that Rin managed to join the war without knowing that.

A Servant compatible with you gets picked if you don't have a catalyst. But yeah, it's generally better to have something specific so you don't get screwed over when the Servant compatible with you is a shitter.

You can summon without a Catalyst, you just get a Heroic Spirit that matches your attitude. The Catalyst just ensures you get a specific Servant. Rin knew all about this, but she couldn't get her hands on any important relics before it was time and decided "Fuck it, I'm clearly the best so the servant I summon is gonna be the best as well." And just did the thing.

So clearly, you are a fucking secondary.

Where did you read that? All summonings we've directly seen used a catalyst.

Rin got Archer because she had the pendant she got from her father, which was important to Archer because she saved him with it.

That's my point, all summonings we've seen used a catalyst and the thing about "you get a servant that is similar to you" was just a romantic notion she had, related to her ignorance of how the war works.

That WAS why Rin got Archer, since Archer's version of the Pendant was the catalyst. But that's still how the war works. Rin wasn't ignorant about the war at all.

Ryuunosuke didn't have a catalyst for Caster in F/Z.

Maybe he had takoyaki before summoning

Ryuunosuke proves the "servant similar to you" thing correct, because he didn't have a catalyst and got someone very much like himself.

Shirou doesn't know what he wants. He's just a stupid kid.

I always thought it was weird how he just acted like a normal high school student in the beginning. You'd think if he was actually serious about the "hero of justice" thing he'd be training real hard or learning martial arts or something.

he had a tasty kid ready for him

The kid wasn't in the circle.

Actually yeah, here's the scene:
youtube.com/watch?v=TyzV1SMGKw0

1. We see Ryuunosuke do the ritual
2. Then we see in the news that he has already done the ritual multiple times
3. This time the ritual succeeds
4. Because he had a kid this time?

ah, good point

Needing a catalyst doesn't make sense. You get chosen by the grail and get your command spells before you summon a servant. Does it only pick people with catalysts?

Because he didn't fuck up as much, presumably. I've never been under the impression that a catalyst is just "a situation or thing the servant would like." It's supposed to be an item actually related to the servant.

The ritual probably worked for any number of reasons. His magical energy being at it's strongest due to it taking place at a different time, it being closer to the grail war and thus the incomplete command seals on his hand being closer to completion, or him just getting the circle right on this time.

fair enough

How the fuck does a companion of Jeanne D'arc turn into a child murderer?

>Needing a catalyst doesn't make sense. You get chosen by the grail and get your command spells before you summon a servant. Does it only pick people with catalysts?
No, but it could well use a catalyst you didn't know you actually had, or it might use a catalyst you didn't even expect would work as a catalyst.

Shirou didn't know he had Avalon, but it worked as the catalyst for him, for example. Ditto for Rin and the pendant.

After seeing what happened to Jeanne he got pissed off at God or decided he doesn't exist or something and has been committing atrocities to get God to interfere for once.

He was summoned as Caster, you're aware of the story around that whole thing and him being a demon worshipper and shit?

Although he was found not guilty on modern re-examination, it was likely just a conspiracy of nobles who didn't like him falsifying evidence and similar.

What if your catalyst gets stolen, like when Waver stole Kayneth's?

I dunno, ask fucking history. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gilles_de_Rais#Child_killer

And the children thing isn't just something the guy vaguely likes, it's the thing he's most famous for. Arthur Excalibur, Heracles Troy (piece of wall), Gilles children.

But I have to concede him the point, because if we handwave it away as "well it could be a catalyst we don't know about" then there's pretty much no way to prove Rin's theory.

Then you summon a shittier servant that tries to NTR your waifu, like Kayneth did.

Lancer did nothing wrong

>demon worshipper
I only got a gist of his backstory from FGO and Zero but never heard of the occultist related stuff

Kayneth used a different catalyst to summon Diarmuid as Lancer after Waver stole the catalyst he was going to use.

Nothing Rin says about that shit implies it's her theory. She was entirely correct on literally everything else applying to the grail war during her prologue, why would she be wrong about this one specific thing when not only she, but her father studied for fucking years on this one event?

Except he was training his body and magic damn hard. He did archery as well, but he quit after too many chicks joined to lust over his dick. On top of that, he also cleans his place, works, keeps up with class and helps out in school.

Shirou is not lazing around.

My point is that the grail only choosing people with catalysts doesn't make sense. It could get stolen, you could lose it, etc. The sensible explanation is that Rin was correct and you don't have to have a catalyst, but most people that get chosen are capable of acquiring one.

>tries
The mole did all the work, user.

>He did archery as well, but he quit after too many chicks joined to lust over his dick.
Also because it wasn't a challenge. He shot a target, he hit a target. Over and over again.

The thing that allows all the twists in FSN is that very few people are in the know about the war. Zouken, the Einzbern elders, maybe Kotomine. Rin only has bits and pieces. Or do you think she knew how it works?

But there's no TWIST revolving around there being only summons with catalysts, and confirmed examples of their BEING summons with no catalysts.

There were things Rin didn't KNOW about the grail war, but none of her information was INCORRECT. There's a difference.

You were appealing to her being an expert, she is not. She's a dupe just like any mage that doesn't come from the three founding families. I'm not sure if she believes that the grail grants wishes, but if she does then that would be an example about a belief she has that's incorrect.

Her father never planned for her to participate. I don't know why Kotomine would mislead her about catalysts, maybe she made up that theory herself, maybe she wasn't misled and she's actually right, but she definitely isn't an authoritative source on the rules of the war.

She's still never proven wrong and Bluebeard was summoned without a catalyst. The point I'm making is that yes, summons can be performed without them.

Sure, the Bluebeard thing is the strongest argument in favor of optional catalysts. I was only disagreeing about the importance of Rin's claims, I think they are pretty shaky stuff given that she's the person who misleads us about the purpose of the war in the first place. It's still evidence but fairly weak.

Oh, I agree that Rin isn't some amazing wealth of knowledge about the grail, but on most of the basics she wasn't directly incorrect. So there's no reason to disbelieve her on stuff that was never contradicted, even when all the truths regarding the war are revealed.

Rin just knew what was "public" knowledge about the grail war. There isn't any reason to doubt her on something like how servants are summoned. There's no secret aspect of that.

>Can swords attend to legal matters?
Yes.

Watching Touken Ranbu, yes.

Then why doesn't Shirou become an attack helicopter and kill women and children in the middle east?

cuz he's retarded

he's the sharpest tool in the shed actually

>Except he was training his body
There's no indication of this, and even if there was, it definitely wasn't emphasized

>magic damn hard
Yeah he was repairing electronic appliances. Truly a hero of justice in the making

>He did archery as well, but he quit after too many chicks joined to lust over his dick
You'd think if he really cared about his ideal such trifling things wouldn't bother him

>he also cleans his place, works, keeps up with class and helps out in school
There is absolutely nothing abnormal in this, any dutiful school student would do all the above and he doesn't need to have an ideal of becoming a hero.

That's my point, Shirou's life is just a highschoolers, there's no indication of him doing anything out of the ordinary. It's all just in his head.

>159570872

No (you) for you, sir. Lurk more before trying to bait.

Because his Origin is Sword. All he's good for is melee combat.

Fuck off Saber. Everyone is a genius compared to your dumbass.

Did you read the VN? He almost kills himself training every night

Would you watch Apocrypha if it was about this instead?

>Yeah he was repairing electronic appliances. Truly a hero of justice in the making
with magic in the nasuverse unlocking even one spell by the time of your death is an achievement

yes

Congrats for missing the point.
We're told he is obsessive about being a hero, but it just doesn't look that way. He's a regular high school student in every way except for practicing magic at night.

He did push-ups and other such conditioning exercises in the dojo since childhood. Saber even comments that he trained his body well.

He was pushing himself from a young age to be more like Kiritsugu, far beyond what any normal student would be doing. Remember the high-jump incident?

>remember the high jump incident
Who doesn't

I bite my lip, feeling powerless.
Even after swearing to become like Kiritsugu, I can't do anything about something that happened so close by.
Even though I want to help someone, in the end, I don't even know what I can do.

That's why even though I'm inexperienced, I've done everything I can.
I don't know what kind of a person a superhero should be.
So I can only approach it by helping others within the limits of my abilities.

I have aimed straight for that goal for the past five years, but when things just go wrong like this, I do have doubts.
"…Geez, I don't get it, Father.
How can I become a superhero?"

He's perfectly aware of it. He does what he can (train his body excessively, practice the little reinforcement that he knows), but ultimately he's aware that he's pretty powerless. He's not really sure about his ideal of saving everyone either, he knows that a superhero can only save who they chose, he just think its not right that you can only save some people.

Why is prisma Shirou so much more competent?

He started with mind of steel instead of wasting a route getting there.

Kiritsugu gave him the full training crash course instead of hesitantly teaching him little bits and pieces that ended up with him making fake circuit out of his nerve every night for 5 years.

Kiritsugu was less idealized by Shirou so he didn't waste time with chuuni bullshit.

>Mikiya
>ultimately useless in battle
>Shiki
>oh shit nigger
>Shirou
>ultimately useless in battle

What happened when Nasu wrote Shiki?

Mind of Steel makes for a decent alternate ending but if you think it's anything but a bad end for Shirou himself you're quite mistaken.

Shirou doesn't deserve happiness.

My problem is that he sould actually be going out there doing heroics, you know, like an actual hero. What I would have been expecting him to do is what Archer seemingly ends up doing after high school - being a magical vigilante. Fight crime, save people from burning buildings, basic capeshit to put it simple. But for some reason Shirou seems more interested in finishing his education first before doing actual heroics - which contradicts what we're told about him.

He should be a lobbyist if anything

Shirou is a childish moron and it's hilarious how the stupid story treats his infantile ideas serious.

>he says as Spiky Shiro walks directly into his own suicide. To the point where Kuro, as the only other EMIYA in the house, needs to tell him to ease up
Miyu's happiness will be paved with Shiro's sacrifice. His decision is made. It's that conviction that makes Shiro strong.
In every route he fumbles around like a retard until he decides what justice is and who he's fighting for. In miyuverse he knew from day one what the stakes were, even saw his crushes reanimated corpse.

Meaning that in FSN he is well written character with flaws and doubts, while in Drei, as with everything else in that part, his character is literally irrelevant to doing cool poses while shitting out quotes.

Drei is fucking trash.

Shiro is determined but directionless until the Grail War. It's after developing through that event that he decides how to best channel his autism. Archer obviously decided to kill terrorists and be a vigilante. In other routes we see different endings. The common theme of each story is that Shiro finally places that thing he didn't know was missing during the war and realises what he wants to protect, how and where. Before then he just had this nagging urge. HGW makes it salient.

The event of Fate/Stay Night shaped him into the actual "hero" figure. At the start he's just your typical kid, he has a vague idea of what he wanted to do, but he has no idea on how to do it, so he just does the responsible thing of finishing his education, while holding down a part time job to not mooch off the Fujimura and helping people where he can, even if its just small things like fixing old electronics or cleaning the archery dojo.

Getting dragged into the Grail War gave him a purpose, even Kotomine commented on this. A hero needs a villain and something/someone to save.

>characters who are determined don't have flaws
>if he isn't confused about everything and weak as piss compared to other characters he's shit
Come on, man. Spiky's flaw is that he has already done his dash. He gave his life to get miyu her wish. He did it. It was over. He would either die or be imprisoned or whatever. He had resigned himself. Psychologically he was basically dead to the world. His service rendered.
Now Miyu's back but she doesn't need him anymore not only must he readjust to life in general and being happy rather than waiting to die but he needs to reassess where he actually fits in and what his purpose is. As the Kuro conversation pointed out, maybe it's time he gave up the sword. Perhaps that's not what Miyu needs. Still though like the sword loving aspergers sufferer that he is, he feels the need to fight and protect.
Being called to a battle but being needed at home. Gaining a reason to live but being resigned to death. These are the flaws and conflicts of Miyu-Shiro.

>he is well written character
as well written as a self-insert can be

he was raised by a fucking chuuni, so his thinking got skewered

...

Because he knew from the start that Kerry was a piece of shit, and had actual training in magecraft. If I remember correctly, he also planned on betraying Kerry to get Miyu free

that's hilarious

>he also planned on betraying Kerry to get Miyu free
He didn't plan that, in fact he'd plan to sacrifice Miyu even after Kiritsugu died. He'd never do it of course because he's too attached and fundamentally a big softie, and I think he realized this himself.

>knew Kerry was a piece of shit
He liked Kerry but he went gaga for Miyu and would have fucked anyone over for her. Remember, this is the girl that Julian says decides the fate of the world (which shiro knows she could if wished on) and he still tells his best friend to get fucked. If his best friend and the entire world can't stop him, how on earth can Kerry, especially when he's the active 'aggressor' to Miyu living a normal life.

That reads like something thirteen year old would write about his shitty OC. Seriously, reread that shit. There is nothing that can be called a realistic character in there.

That's the issue with Drei as a whole. Author just gave up and start throwing as much "cool" shit as humanly possible, completely ignoring the part where he was supposed to make a completing story. Which is why you had ten chapters battle ending in hype spread after hype spread.