Why does Sup Forums want to save civilisation so bad?

Here are some of the key problems with civilisation:
>highly unsustainable
>unnatural charade of bullshit
>makes us weak and weird
>enables centralised power and the abuse of masses
>makes us live an unnatural lifestyle - anyone can survive and reproduce, therefore the world gets overpopulated, so people end up not having kids as a solution

By living in any kind of civilisation where you are comfortable, you slowly become more degenerate, and the process continues through generations.
Sure, some generations may get a bit tougher, but on the grand scale it's always going down.

Also worth mentioning that working in a civilisation also seems empty to me.
Who would rather do a stupid 9-5 job instead of growing your own food and helping the survival of your family directly?

For real, why is Sup Forums so hot for civilisation?
I just don't see what's so good about it.

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Because if one people doesn't have a civilization, others who do will be free to invade and kill them.

>highly unsustainable
citation needed
>unnatural charade of bullshit
this is something personal for you. not really an argument
>makes us weak and weird
this is subjective talk.
>enables centralised power and the abuse of masses
the masses would had revolted by now if they didn't like it
>makes us live an unnatural lifestyle - anyone can survive and reproduce, therefore the world gets overpopulated, so people end up not having kids as a solution
city dwellers have less kids than those living in rural areas

>phoneposters

nope

I don't want THIS version of civilization that the kikes have been fucking with for the last six thousand years.
I'd prefer the one that was building pyramids for the fuck of it plus the technological advances we have now

This is true, but if the global civilisation collapses, we are back to the roots and no one will have a civilisation for some time.
Possibly for a very long time, but this depends on many things.

I didn't go to much detail because it's easy to understand, and the info is easily available.
I could type for hours, but who would read that?

SHILL HARDER FAGGOT

What personally bothers me about any civilisation is that some people get too much power.

Think about it, someone who is not stronger or smarter than you can have ridiculous amounts of power and if he wanted to, he could destroy you and your family.

Go live in the countryside, problem solved, fagass

>I could type for hours
type what, friend?
and to answer your last question, i did not know there was a consensus on pol that living in the city is great.
it's crowded and polluted.
>Who would rather do a stupid 9-5 job instead of growing your own food and helping the survival of your family directly?
not a whole lot of people. i agree most jobs are repetitive crap that over the years make you docile. it's what city dweller like to do instead of growing crops, i guess.

Civilisation is always expanding.
You could live in the countryside, but will the future generations be able to?
Civilisation is fucking up the nature so bad that it's kinda scary.

We try to replace everything with technology.
Nature is the best "technology".
The ways nature heals itself and the way it produces what we need for our survival, brilliant.

>>makes us weak and weird
>this is subjective talk.
Well, just look at the modern people and see the trends.

so we can move on to the next stage. If you want to be a retarded nigger that wants to be enslaved an annihilated that's your prerogative. the fact that civilization is unsustainable provides impetus. In the long run nothing is sustainable. life is always changing until that changes too. stupid nigger

Yes, everyone is stupid, except you.
We are so blessed to have you here on this board.

Yeah because being some retarded seep hearted is better then flying to the moon. Fuck civilisation.

you can make the case that on average the city dweller is weaker than the one living on a farm.
but you have bodybuilders, powerlifters, athletes in the city.
so in the rural area the population would have more or less the same power whereas in the city you'd have weaker and much more powerfull people.

He put it well: "Who would rather do a stupid 9-5 job instead of growing your own food and helping the survival of your family directly?"

I currently live in the city and my job is rather good, it even has flexible work hours (not 9-5) but I get deeply scared when I think of a possibility of some major crisis or collapse where I just couldn't afford / find anything to buy, or money would be worthless. I know it may sound like an unreasonable fear, but look at my country flag. We had this scenario in 1993. Look at your country flag. You had Ceausescu. Look at OP's flag. They had a war with my country. Our areas have seen political and economic instability first hand.
And we of all people should know that the only independance is to have enough to feed your family and to depend on the system as little as possible.

Furthermore, if you want to establish traditional gender roles, you should be realistic enough to realize that they only come naturally in times when civilisation was not on such a high level and majority of people live in the countryside and live off the land. Sure, gender roles can be eforced in a civilisation, yes, but then you need a bunch of regulations, rules, shaming tactics etc... I.e. they won't come naturally.
Look at it this way: if the most extreme liberal couple went to own a farm and grow their own food, they will naturally establish gender roles withing that lifestyle. Without even thinking about it. On the other hand, a city dwelling conservative needs to come up with a bunch of reasons why he is more suited for his paper pushing office job than his wife. Also the whole "suburban housewife" dream only works in a strong economy. The moment economy gets bad, majority of wives will need to go to work as well.

Sadly this does seem to be a valid argument. But the OP is not wrong either:

When the collapse happens, billions of people will die.
Sounds like a lot of fun, right?

Also, be honest,
You like civilisation because of porn and video games, you don't care about the other stuff.
You just pretend you do to glorify your ego.

I gave you the answer. if i could life a happy hunter gather life i would. its not possible. you do not provide a basis for your claims nor a principle to bring it about

>I get deeply scared when I think of a possibility of some major crisis or collapse where I just couldn't afford / find anything to buy, or money would be worthless.
then buy a property outside the city and work on it the weekend.

>When the collapse happens, billions of people will die.
this will happen irrespective of the actions we take

.lso the whole "suburban housewife" dream only works in a strong economy. The moment economy gets bad, majority of wives will need to go to work as well.
the idea of women not working is one the biggest memes. only historical illiterates would claim this

It is our right to rule the stars, therefore civilisation must persist until man rules the galaxy

Are you for real?

The moment shit goes south, as it did during the war, the first to be killed are the people in rural areas because of how isolated they are

How many villages were torched on both sides?

>When the collapse happens, billions of people will die.

Refer to my comment above

>Sure, gender roles can be eforced in a civilisation, yes, but then you need a bunch of regulations, rules, shaming tactics etc... I.e. they won't come naturally.
Exactly.
This is why the first world has become such a shitshow.
You can blame whoever you want, but the current state of the west is a direct result of civilisation becoming too advanced.

When people have everything easily, they become greedy shitheads.
These individuals can change, but just look around and you see how rarely it happens.

Because I'm not some dirty new age hippie peasant who thinks that being fucked in the ass raw by "mother nature" has some "higher purpose". I'm all for transhumanism and space colonization.

>When people have everything easily, they become greedy shitheads.
the issue is not atavisms like greed. thats a poor man's heuristic. the truth of the matter is that we are not designed for the societies we live, not designed for agricultural societies let alone one with cars and phones and guns and mass production

I think civilization is inherently good.
We would've needed just one or 2 more generations to have our civilization completely self-sufficient, including artificial wombs and completely optional work.

Just think of all the music that has not been written, all the art that still remains undone.
After what is being done currently, our countries will forever be a place of conflict between ethnicities and ideologies.
We are already easily controlled by the elites because we are being drowned in immigrants.

>Refer to my comment above
There is a difference between a war and an economic collapse.
If a collapse happens, people in urban areas will be starving.

what about the battle of Teutoburg forest?
an advanced civilization tried to invade and kill the natives and got btfo and never returned.

>inbf muh ambush, incompetent Varus

>including artificial wombs and completely optional work
You are the problem.
Luckily, nature will fix this.

>I'm all for transhumanism and space colonization.

To what end?

>Golly gee let me just starve to death and not raid the village next door

Sure

>this is subjective talk.
It's true actually

The grain-based food of the sedentary man is less healthy than the milk/meat/fruit/vegetable-based food of the nomadic man.

> (OP)
>>highly unsustainable
>citation needed

pic

> (OP)
>>makes us weak and weird
>this is subjective talk.
> (OP)
>>enables centralised power and the abuse of masses
>the masses would had revolted by now if they didn't like it

the masses are weak and pacified. domesticated pets aren't revolting either.

a panda in a zoo eats, sleeps and shits just the same as a wild one. it looks completely normal, just its hormones are demonstrably fucked.

>be Varg global dictator
>civilization is banned from Earth
>a comet that could be prevented if we had civilization hits the earth and human race is extinct
muh simpler life

an anomaly. most would be killed by new diseases

they can just be fed some paste from a tube and crackers.
i never said they'll eat steaks and drink 10 year old wine.
they wouldn't be living in mansions either.

Sure, these domesticated faggots will raid isolated villages, 100%.

They will stay put, waiting for help, like they are trained in the civilisation.
Once they start starving, it's too late.
Not to mention in a SHTF situation, villagers will be ready and have weapons.

archive.org/stream/IndustrialSocietyAndItsFuture-TheUnabombersManifesto/IndustrialSocietyAndItsFuture-theUnabombersManifesto_djvu.txt

>I am all for soylent and nintendo
What did he mean by this

A comet can't be prevented even now.

Civilisation IS the comet.

Let's not forget that a proper nuclear war would be worse than any comet.

>killed by new diseases
>Germanics from the same continent with the same diseases
of course a Sup Forumsnigger would be ignorant of one of the most famous battles in history.
god what have normies done to this board, i use to like coming here.

>t. /his/torian.

I can relate to that but I see a problem
Society can't sustain that many people when they grow their own food
And a society like ours allows professionalisation. What will you do in your Varg World when you get a brain tumor? There won't be a neurosurgeon to help you because there are no universities and hospitals. Only people who live in huts and are small farmers or hunters maybe also some primitive blacksmith
because nobody has time for anything else.
Thats why thirld world is so shitty. No jobs, high birth rate.
Here I could become hair stylist for dogs for a living. In Bangladesh that woldn't work. Degenerate as fuck but it shows how cooperating and professional our societies have become

>most famous battle in history
> t. from /his/

/leftychimps/ sure are stinky. go back to srs or w/e goon infested shithole from whence you came

>hur dur we don't like smart people here
>go away nerd

I understand what you're talking about.

There are downsides to the collapse for sure.
The main one is the lack of modern medicine.

However, that's just what it is.
The collapse is coming an might as well prepare for it.

>Society can't sustain that many people when they grow their own food
They'll die in the collapse.

>We try to replace everything with technology.
>Nature is the best "technology".

it's hilarious to try to watch people, even very smart ones, try to convince themselves that all we need to fix the real problems (overpopulation/overconsumption) in this world is more technology. when technology is the one and only source there every was, for all these problems.

the paris climate accords, renewable energy sources.. it's all meaningless. the man has and always will drain every drop of energy it can from the earth, expand and keep sucking it out and even larger amounts. it's not going to stop.

maybe there'll be one big single-event ecological disaster at some point and that'll trigger a paradigm shift (among the elite, not the masses) but probably not.

>I'm all for transhumanism and space colonization

This,we gotta fight the space niggers

To an extent yes saving this civilisation is pointless greece fell roman empire fell english empire fell chinese dynaties have fallen as well as japanese, mongolian so many powerful civilisations have fallen this one shall to and another shall take its place it is inevitable

Remember one thing, there is a limited amount of what can be sucked.

The only other option would be space colonisation, but that's not gonna happen because it would take too much time and resources, which we don't have right now.

You enjoy multiracialism and cultural homogenation?

You do have a point. I stand corrected on that issue. Villages are a more dangerous place to be in a war situation.

However when it comes to economic collapse (or even a crisis) they are a better option.

Btw, if it's true that drinking water is going to become a scarce resource in the future (I heard this theory multiple times), this too implies that a natural lifestyle is better.
Also, it's worth noting that civilisation is to blame for water become scarce.

That's what I intend to do. And I think more people should.

Stop projecting your fear of mortality.

>What will you do in your Varg World when you get a brain tumor?
Die.

>Villages are a more dangerous place to be in a war situation.
Not in a nuclear war, I'll tell you that.

It's the only way we're ever going to reach the stars and bang all the hot xenos ladies

Well I was referring to that other Croatian guy's comment - in a war like we had in the 90ies they are.
But you're right about a nuclear war scenario. So the question is - how many future wars are going to be like our war in the 90s anyway?

did i call you smart nigger?

Overpopulation is planned you retarded nigger. We use the oily jew to make food to stuff retarded chimps to make more dumb nigger babies. To date most technology we develop relates to externalities. The aim is change what it means to be human in a meaningful sense so retarded shit like this doesn't happen anymore, or rather does not need to happen.

this
/thread

>how many future wars are going to be like our war in the 90s anyway?
On a grand scale, not many.
But considering where we live, there may be another one or more.
As sad as it is, it may happen.
On the other hand, the new generations are domesticated just like westerners, so the good thing in that is that there's no way they're going to war.

In my opinion, the best solution would be a more advanced version of what Varg is doing.
He wants to go back to extremely simple stuff.
However, you can be self-sustainable with certain technologies.
After the collapse the world population will be greatly reduced.
This way we can build a semi-civilised world or something.

Whats with all the dumb ass "why do we have this" shit posts. Are you retarded?

What Varg doesn't realise is that without civilization his wife had a good probability of dying during childbirth and a number his kids would have had a large chance of being killed off or seriously crippled by common diseases that have long been forgotten.

The millennial generation cant even get their heads round the idea that "muh 6 gorillion" can easily be wiped out in a typhus epidemic from a breakdown of common sanitation and supplies during a war, and that was only 70 odd years ago.

Modern civilization will fall it's inevitable, but let's not romanticise or idealise the ensuing Dark Age. It will be brutal, people will die and life will be cheap, and that is what made your ancestors tough.

You are right, but since the collapse is coming, might as well find something to look forward in it, rather than bitch and be depressed.
Or even worse, deny that the collapse is coming and not prepare.

i know my man, i agree with everything you’ve been writing. we’re headed to doom.

Here's what I plan on doing:
>buying property somewhere relatively isolated
>growing a permaculture forrest there
>doing online business to make money
>raising a big family and teaching them important things
>learning about all kinds of survival things
When you do this, you can just hope for the best and see what happens.
What more could we do?

I agree.
In a way this is of the ways in which civilisation will end itself - with masses being too domesticated to fight the wars, civilisation will need a nuclear war, and that will mark the end of civilisation. Talk about poetic justice.

SAME!
We can profit from it in our region with low property prices in the villages, and working online for an amount of money that is small for the western European / USA based employer can ensure that we have a decent income for our economy (that would be below minimum wage in Germany for example).
However, when the economy of the western civilisation colapses, there will be no employers online either. We need to prepare for that as well.

good plan. you will feel great! i feel better the further i get from any kind of city life.

the bad side effect is you’ll start to look at consumerism and all the wasteful activities, all the urban degeneracy, with even more disgust.

>However, that's just what it is.
>The collapse is coming an might as well prepare for it.
how long is left you think?

I'd say around 50 years, but that's just my opinion.

hurr durr, what is this, 2011?

Well if it already disgusts you (and I assume it does), you will at least be far away from it.

And my fears about this plan (which I also have, so I'm not bashing it) is that people in the village often don't seem to be enlightened about the state they're in, and they admire the big cities in a way. So I am not sure how much they have of a pure natural essence within their minds, and how much they are wannabe city dwellers who are just degenerate in a lesser percentage (with a growth tendency).

Another fear is - what if my children grow up to rebel against that lifestyle? Of course I'll do my best to teach them not to, but I can't really run their lives when they're 20 or so.

I'm not talking about working for an online employer, I'm talking about starting your own business, my friend.

We need this money to prepare, but once we and our properties are ready, we don't need money anymore.

>what if my children grow up to rebel against that lifestyle?
Homeschool them and make sure you are a good example, a leader and also make sure they feel loved.

If there is enough time, you can start your own village/tribe consisting of your children's families.
When shit hits the fan you have a top-tier village working together, best scenario possible.

That's a good plan too, but whatever you plan to do online, it depends on the global economy. I am also in the online business so I kinda thought it through.
Dropshipping? Can't count on it if the people can't / won't pay for goods online, if suppliers close down their factories because it's not profitable any longer etc.
Adsense? Can't count on it if advertizers stop paying for ads because they are going out of business.
Programming / web developping services / SEO? There always needs to be an end customer willing to pay for your service, and they'll only do it if they stand to benefit from the client buying their product.

Of course if your business revolves around selling gardening equipment online, you will probably stay in business longer than if you provide SEO services for a website that sells chiwawa manicure sets :D

But you get my point.

And I agree with your second post too. I guess I just have a tendency to think decades up front and come up with worst case scenarios and think of ways to overcome them... If I didn't have this tendency, I guess I'd be supporting civilisation.

My opinion is that civilisation will last around 50 years more.
I think there will be multiple mini-crisis, but that's normal.

If that's the case, we have enough time to do our online business.

>Of course if your business revolves around selling gardening equipment online, you will probably stay in business longer than if you provide SEO services for a website that sells chiwawa manicure sets :D
Yeah, it would be a good idea to eventually shift to stuff that will be most needed pre-collapse, this way you can stay in the business the longest.

> I guess I just have a tendency to think decades up front and come up with worst case scenarios and think of ways to overcome them
Me too.
Some of the scenarios are extremely hard to overcome, but it probably won't be that hard.
How often does the worst case scenario happen?
I can't think of a single case in my life where the worst case I imagined happened.

Because civilisation means hentai and video games. That's why.