I'm only watching the English dub and reading the manga so I haven't gotten to Kale yet...

I'm only watching the English dub and reading the manga so I haven't gotten to Kale yet. Is this character as stupid as I think she is? Can Toyotaru fix it?

How long did it take you to find that pic for your thread?

Like 30 mins

>Is this character as stupid as I think she is?
Probably worse than what you seem to be expecting, actually.

>Can Toyotaru fix it?
If he fixed the power scaling by making it clear how strong she really is it would be a big help.
In the anime she goes from having her energy blast deflected like no big deal by her SS2 mentor in her introduction ep, to not being hurt at all but also not managing to hurt SS2 Goku either when they fight. Cue in the infamous SSB kamehameha she tanks before being blasted out by Geran and knocked out of her transformation (no injuries shown though). But then she is treated like she isn't a big deal, with Goku telling her to get stronger before they fight again and a few eps later him being all excited at the prospect of him and Hitto leaving each other for last so their match can be the decisive one, meanwhile she is literally a few meters away watching the action and nobody pays her any attention, not even Champa.

>Is this character as stupid as I think she is?
Depends. She's very meek and obsessed with Caulifla. By "very meek," I mean down to the point where just hearing her talk is sickening. By "obsessed," I mean that Caulifla talking to Cabba about transforming into Super Saiyan is enough to send her in a rage. She transforms into her "Berserker" or "Legendary"
form because she fears Caulifla has fallen for Cabba and will be taken away by him.
>Can Toyotaru fix it?
Maybe. He isn't the best writer, but his manga is a fair deal more consistent. The issue is mostly with Kale's characterization. If he can make it more palatable (as well as he relationship with the other U6 Saiyans) it'll be a lot more digestible.

I feel his writing gets worse when he actively tries to do something different rather than just going with it. It's cheap to just say that, I know, but the last arc was frankly a mess at several points of his own making and was a severe blow against him in the creative writing department. He quite honestly took all the bad of the arc and made some changes here and there, some of them ultimately making it worse. I will concede to the point many are making about his art in that he has drastically improved in form and technical showing, his grasp of choreography having drastically improved since the start. I just wish those improvements were better complimented by overall storytelling.

Also, a personal gripe, but I wish he would take the liberty to bulk up the U6 saiyans in his work. That's been my biggest issue with them design-wise since their introduction. They are far too thin, especially around the arms. These are space-fairing super warriors and they really need to start showing it. We've seen the girls bulk up through various transformations, so it's not as if they can't have muscle mass. You can make female saiyans without having them look like toothpicks.

She and Caulifla are basically knockoff versions of Bra from DragonBall Multiverse.

Just to summarize.

>They are far too thin, especially around the arms
Not sure who Kale's design even is, but Caulifla is Toriyama's and that has always been how he draws saiyan females (not that its an ancient thing or anything, and I actually really dislike Minus). Even the art style can only go so far into how much it is going to change these things.

This is very true. On the flip side, Toriyama's current artstyle has evolved significantly from is earlier days. Going further, he's not drawing it now. Toyo has the freedom to try different things that aren't outside the realm of possibility in the franchise. Slight bulk wouldn't hurt the designs. Any definition to their body mass would be nice. Keep in mind, Cabba is just as much a victim of noodle arms as the girls. I think it was a horrible choice to play the "small but strong" card this hard.

The similarities start and end with them being female super saiyans and Bra being an out of control special snowflake. Using Bra as a positive example of anything is a bad idea. She's one of the worst parts of a popular piece of powerlevel faggotry. Stop spamming DBM here and baiting responses because it's working and I hate you.

>you will never have a cute yandere legendary super saiyan lust after you
Why even live?

>Geran
>Hitto

Stop

>to not being hurt at all but also not managing to hurt SS2 Goku either when they fight
That doesn't convey one tenth of how shoddily written the whole sequence is. Goku is bodied around and Kale doesn't even flinch from his punches to her face, however despite her dominating the fight Goku is completely unfazed even while he is being rammed through the katchin ground or after pic related and just acts annoyed during their fight. He doesn't get tired or hurt or anything, in fact the next time he even shows any reaction is the next epiode when he Toppo atacks him from his backside and he complains about the ouchies from his justice blast or whatever it was.

That whole sequence was just fanservice to see Goku get jumped by a canon Broly, complete with incessant name using. Just swapped "Kakaroto!" for "Son Goku!".

>These are space-fairing super warriors and they really need to start showing it.

OP here. I may be wrong but a while ago I read that U6 Saiyans are skinny because they never had to resort to the level of savagery U7 Saiyans did. They still have their planet Salad while U7 Saiyans had to migrate to Vegeta.

Caulifla's older brother (and also Cabba's mentor) Renso is buff.

I agree with you 100%, user. I honestly wish one of the better Toriyama imitators was working on the Super manga. His art isn't the best, but it's improving. It's the writing that's the problem. Whenever there isn't something that's strictly coming from Toriyama's napkin notes, it tends to either be pretty good, or pretty bad. I'd prefer it be consistently the first one. He's good for little things, but not for actual storylines.

Man I really hate this character. The way she talks, like a nervous wreck. She also does seems really stupid and clueless.

Should have at least damaged his clothes or something, the episode she first goes SS she does something very similar to pic related with Cabba and knocks him out of SS1.

Well comparing Cabba to Goku isn't fair. Sure, we haven't seen him in many fights but I think it's safe to say that Goku has much more battle experience than Cabba. Especially fights where he's pushed to the limit.

>generic sub girl
>depressed all the time
>obsessed by her "onechan"
>tard strength from just about anything involving her
>"whoa, I can control my power now, I'll use it to protect onechan"
and most importantly
>not a shred of exposition about her to make us care and a total lack of the character growth several people from z were known for
I'd be shocked toyo could fix it considering how shit the manga was in the last arc.

>dub
>not sub which is literally the same experience aside from beerus' voice

Dragon Ball dub is the true way to watch Dragon Ball.