Why dont mangakas and novelists highlight the bad side of japanese society like european authors...

Why dont mangakas and novelists highlight the bad side of japanese society like european authors? Instead of japanese Dickens we get escapism anime #4923 in a alternative world.

Whats with the ignoring reality approach?

>wataru watari
>tanigawa nico

>only reads trash
>complains about escapism

They need to sell first and tell a story later.

Do you mean European-European or (((western)))?

Watamote gets a happy end though

His other work with the novelist is what I'm referring about.

Why do you care about the bad side of Japanese society? Do you know enough about it to recognise it when it's portrayed?

Because Japs don't want to read about how shitty Japan is.

The only way you can get away with that and still be successful is if you're already part of a successful series and have guaranteed sales. That's what Persona 5 did.

Have you ever read any Japanese literature besides light novels and manga?

This, read legit Japanese literature like the "Makioka sisters" or "tale of genji" and they are anything but glorification of Japan and Japanese culture.

Works that are critical to the real world exists, but what you usually see are the marketable entertainment focused works.
Politics is harder to sell than moe.

Go read all the manga from the 60s and 70s and say that again. Go follow that to the alt magazines that continue that tradition today and the authors.

This aint lit

Most isekai is them ditching japan for something better.
Even if it isn't surface level

Konosuba
rezero

No game no life ep 1 has a good amount on it.

You are literally one of those cancer.

Why would I want reality and drama? I have reality and drama in my actual life, thank you very much.

I remember when I was asking questions like this too, wanting a mature anime for a mature man like myself. I grew out of that phase quite a long time ago, thankfully.

I might be working a shitty job, thus an easy target of "hurr durr ur a neet ur opinion doesn't matter", but I know a guy who's a corporate manager at an international level and his favourite genre happens to be isekai. Apparently he has enough of reality in his real life too, who'd have thought.

Excuse me? I feel like half the manga I've read is about how depressing and oppressive adult life in Japan is. I'm assuming it's because most mangaka who aren't super successful (read: not making weekly battle manga garbage) have a pretty depressing life there.

Maybe you should read more before saying dumb shit like that.

You clearly don't read a lot of manga if that's what you think. There's even an entire genre dedicated to depressing realistic stories.

Now this makes me wonder if isekai audience is more diverse than I thought. Normally, you would think it's the NEET virgins of Japan who want escapism but what if office workers, people in shitty jobs or stressed out normies who happen to like it too? No wonder it's popular, it also happens to be not too niche for most people to pick up since it's literally a new fantasy life.

>Why dont mangakas and novelists highlight the bad side of japanese society like european authors?
Because they have enough misery as is, no need to put the thing everyone knows about into fiction meant to take your mind off of your garbage real life.

The majority audience is literally office workers, not otaku, mostly because there are more office worker wageslave drones than there are otaku.

Because that's fucking boring
Besides it's a million times easier to churn out some crappy edgy gritty and realistic shit, it doesn't take any imagination, nor creativity
There's a ton more creativity in your average isekai than in that simply from world building alone

Most seinen and even josei are critical as fuck, although there's been an optimistic trend lately.

It's well known that the main audience for otome games and anime is OLs also, female NEETs and awkward highschoolers come second and third.

>read escapist fiction
>complain about it being escapist

Holy shit, you're one dumb motherfucker. There's plenty of manga that criticize Japanese society. What's next, you think Americans don't know how to be critical towards American society in fictional works just because it doesn't seem that way in popcorn summer flicks?

Focus of politics and societal commentary is what killed western art.

Depends on what your goal is, really. Take Huxley and Orwell, they're both already financially stable men who wanted to deliver a message that people would actively read and entertain themselves with. They wouldn't write their books like that if they're betting their own financial asses on the line there, them being commercially successful is not their main purpose. Or Kafka, a good part of his books are advanced blogging about his father, but he really never depended on his novels to make a living.

Mangaka, on the other hand, often times are solely dependent on their work as an artist and therefore would be more inclined to put out content that are likely to sell. There exists some exceptions of course, but that wouldn't be the norm. You'd actively have to seek out works that are social commentaries in order to have that, you can't just pick up random shit from batoto and expect Huckleberry Finn.

>Works critical of society have less chance of being financial success
You base this on?

Problem with nips is that you aren't allowed to rock the boat. Europeans have more tolerance for individualism and dissent.

My ass, really. It just appears as if there's not as much societal commentaries that becomes popular compared to stuff like, say, Shin-chan or Mazinger. I might be entirely wrong though, there's probably some data floating around about the topic.

user, WTF.

France? You are allowed to try to rock the boat, so you don't actually rock it. Which means that opinions that society is poison is fine, so long it doesn't lead to dissent.
UK? Social segregation and banter is the norm, but "Rocking the boat". So your goal is to take a piss on society, but not rock the boat.
Germany? I have no idea, but it seems the idea is that you can't rock the boat, only encourage its stable pace.

Poland? And most of Slavland? The idea is that there is no boat, Soviets already sunk it, so your best bet is to either claim you know how the boat sunk(criticism against the State) or Criticsicm against how Soviet Union ruined the country.
Baltic states? Who knows
Spain and Portugal: Its like a passive aggressive version of France, except unspoken corruption.
Italy. I can't really describe it. On top level its really horrible, but on a commune level its fine.

Scandinavia? The general idea is that rocking the boat is fine, but its also less productive than striving to mention how great the Society is. Which leads to shit like Swedens passive aggressive media Policy, where a circle of denial has caused negative feedback.
Danish media is like Sweden, but with more hatred for what will cause friction. So what seems like Racism, is often preemptive reactions to avoid getting huge issues down the line.
Finland has a society thats partially segregated between the Fennoswedes, Finns and the few Lapp the nation has. Moral isnt that different from Sweden, with a few pre Soviet Russia morals mixed in.
Norway is like SwedenDenmark, but with flatter social classes and less friction.


Japan? Honestly, its not about Rocking The Boat: Japan is fine with that. Its more about acceptance of the social hierarchy, and including unspoken rights of superiority by position.
Which means the goal of the higher positions, is to shut down criticism, in order to avoid getting replaced.

Have you ever actually read a Japanese novel or are you specifically referring to LNs here?

>Finland has a society thats partially segregated between the Fennoswedes, Finns and the few Lapp the nation has. Moral isnt that different from Sweden, with a few pre Soviet Russia morals mixed in.
>pre soviet morals fixed in.
I wouldnt say that desu, presoviet russia goes a long way with many different morals.
>Segregation
I agree with lapland and others but not on fennoswedes. There are finns, fennoswedes and bättrefolk. For example every yacht in Vaasa is owned by a fennoswin but not every fennoswin owns a boat. Partial segregation only really happens at higher(filthy rich) income levels and not necessarily even then desu.

Why is there NTR in my Japanese escapism entertainment then?

>yurikuma arashi about how lesbians are treated as outcasts and monsters in society
>zankyou no terror features a girl abused by her mother
>one meme man about a guy who couldn't find a job
>chobits features a permanent part-timer who can't get through cram school, a husband who wouldn't get off the tech and dick his wife so she left him for a younger guy
>kino no tabi is basically the anime version of parables of kirkegaard
>points school and ass class show how the education system forces students to eat each other and be hyper-competitive
>hell, most isekai demonstrate the neet problem
>kaiji is a social dropout gambling addict
>paranoia agent
>psycho pass

>Isekais demonstrate the NEET problem
Opinion discarded

they do but nobody wants to read them. I wish we had more authors like Suehiro Maruo but generic trash sells better

Marche.jpg

I don't really get why you'd expect most people to be serious thinkers who care about stuff like that, the majority has enough nonsense to deal with as is, they don't need help to brood about how shitty their society and life is.

I guess what he is failing to understand, is that JAPAN loves to poke at how their social structure is a failure, if it contains bad eggs.
Its common in manga too, where they also love to draw rule lawyers versus honest good hearts

>implying they don't
>implying you have any fucking idea what Japanese novelists write besides random fanfiction-tier online shit
Also, real-world commentary is pretty much irrelevant to the quality of a story.

Watch more anime and read more manga.

If it's not an escapist fantasy it's a critique of Japanese society.

The fuck are you talking about?, pretty much every famous Japanese novelists (Actual novelists, no shitty LN authors) has dealt with the bad side of japan in their novels, and there fuckton of seinien and josei about how shitty japanese life is, is pretty much what Gekiga is all about.

There are several depictions of ijime (bullying), most notably in Koe no Katachi. Also the salaryman work enviroment is rarely shown in a positive light.

Even something like Alien Nine do a lot of work, to depict the kind of culture that "Face" produces. And one needs to read some amount of Girlshit and Slice of Life stuff to realize that everything non fucked up, is depicted somehow how it goes.
And "Face" is to keep your Face or Mask or Appearance clean, to produce the idea that everything is 100% okay, and is in perfect order.
I haven't seem any westernstuff even approach that kind of level of simple structural obedience, even if its less fucked up western stuff.

I think the concept of Face scares me, because ours is not at their level, we basically have it too. And democracy/management being less segregated from society, means we keep building up Face as a concept, a lot further than Western cultured used to have it.

'sup!

...

So OP is just a casual who needs to read more?

most of the media deconstructing western culture is made by a small ((( subset ))) of the population, which the Japanese don't have

go back to your concentration camp board

so what isekais have you guys been reading guys?

A lot of them do.
It's just that the escapism shit is more commercial and sells a lot of money, so they make more of it.

Apples and oranges, man. Asking general consumption manga and LN to be intellectual is like asking american comics to be intellectual. Sure, it can happen and has happened several times, but they mostly aim towards catering to the mainstream market plus a few niche markets.

As many anons already pointed at, you are better off reading proper literature, just like how you pointed at literature like dickens's books as example of wester production.

Maid Dragon had unironic criticism of Japanese society.

>Why dont mangakas and novelists highlight the bad side of japanese society like european authors?

A ton of them do this though. Like, a staggering amount

Work time? Mobbing? follow your family tradion? The delinquent chapter? The racism toward who is different?

STop reading translated shit and discover that there are lots of Political manga/literature out there in japan

>critcizing society is invented by Jews

Fuck off

>STop reading translated shit and discover that there are lots of Political manga/literature
this kind of media aten't exactly entry level japanese

Not him but OP is an idiot. Even very mainstream stuff highlights how shit society is.

Japan could never do something like Briefe in die chinesische Vergangenheit.

>Why dont mangakas and novelists highlight the bad side of japanese society like european authors?

(((european)))

Give me your best shot at explaining that shit, in 2000 characters.
Come on, do it do it do it
Gotta move it
Or at the least its genre

Sayounara Zetsubou Sensei?

Oh... for a momoent I expected this to be a Stravaganza thread.

You clearly have no fucking clue about any of the countries you wrote about and your entire post made no fucking sense.

Sometimes I wonder if the people that say that Japanese media isn't as politically charged as their western counterparts simply do not notice all the political shit in manga and anime because they just aren't familiar with happenings in Japan.

Nice phoneposting, fucking faggot.
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Jesus user, shut up you sound so silly.

I've read a google translated wikipedia article about this, not the user you are talking to.

>social criticism
>anime
It's an entire medium about forgoing society and escaping into your own personal desires. What do you think incest is?
In anime subculture, the rebellion is escape. It's not about changing the world, it's leaving it. This also fits in with the asian view of suicide, you see this kind of thing in china too.
Either you're out for 'yourself' and your desires, or you're a hero of justice who plays by the rules to the letter.
In the U.S, we tend to think of antiheroes in the same fashion, they are after their own desires but they also get to be somewhat on the side of the good of society as well. In Japan that pretty much means that you don't do anything that would go past a person's moral limits, unless it's a story like Slave Harem where we just pretend that everything is fine so we get the fantasy.

Do you want to hear about other Cultural values in Nipland?
They have respect for Hierarchy, but only as seniority/trainer/teacher, unless they are segregated. Seniority is actually a big concept, which also covers respect for your elders.
Which means that the most common criticism, is that Seniority might be wrong about stuff that isn't their field.

The quoted post covers Face.
Its the most obvious one, but also not very interesting in a horizontal society with parallel high classes.

The Asian form of commercialism is foreign to the West, because its not Influenced by Christianity, Islam or Jews. Or, at the least that was the case until they lost WW2. There is still a lot of influences left, and its mostly in intact shape.
For things even like Banking and Stocks, it IS different, even in a modern world with post WW2 USA influences.
Its reflected in fortune telling, investments, shopping, products, and more. And its hard to spot, because you might not have read Donald Comics as a kid, so you haven't read Economic stuff as children's level.

Focus/Self Improvement/Hobbies is another one that is hard to spot, but its there. The mindset is alien, but the presentation do not reveal that.
And often Criticism is hard to spot, because one is unfamiliar with the topic, so they can't spot the outlines of the presentation.

Because their audience are NEETs trying to escape from the fact that they were losers in highschool and even bigger losers after highschool, hoping only for a painless death while living on japanese autismbucks.

Basically /r9k/

When have they not?